artsylady Posted March 28, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 171 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,813 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 28, 2008 really don't know what you are getting at. My own personal reasoning is that no one can know if there is a god. And yes, I think my reasoning is completely logical and in fact, correct. How can one possibly admit that their knowledge is so very limited but know that God does not exist? I find the very admission astonishing. Sure, I realize that I don't have all the answers but I don't give god the credit for everything I don't know. I've stated before that I don't believe in a "god of the gaps." We may not know the answers but why attribute the unknown to god? People didn't know that germs could make you sick. People didn't know of many things. Where would society be if no one ever tried to find out answers because "god did it?" How can I admit "knowledge is limited but know that god does not exist?" I didn't say that myself but I think that it is just as valid as admitting that knowledge is limited but KNOWING that god DOES exist. That admission is astonishing also. You don't have all of the answers, you're right. In fact, you don't even have most. None of us have most. But to say that you simply cannot possibly begin to think about filling in any of the huge gaps with the possibility of a god? It is very much like the Europeans who said that there was no land beyond what they could see. Your viewpoint is limited, you know it and you can't bring yourself to wonder about the possibilty of a creator? I asked about your previous Christian experience. Would you care to share more about it? In any case, Christians all over the world will give you many many reasons as to why we believe in the existance of God. The staunch atheist, rather than considering them as possibilities, will quickly renounce every one of them... they'll say "You count that as proof, I still count is as an 'unknown'. ...So what the atheist would still count as an unknown, the Christian will count as a known. While we may say we know, we also seem to have more 'knowns'. I don't in any way mean to sound arrogant. Christians are no better than anyone else. We've merely accepted the gift of salvation. The Bible says that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. Once you know God, many of the unknowns become quite apparant. Many mysteries are solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFP Posted March 28, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 25 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 732 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 91 Days Won: 2 Joined: 08/31/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/24/1969 Share Posted March 28, 2008 Blessed are the pure in heart...for they shall see God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsylady Posted March 29, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 171 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,813 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 29, 2008 Using the chrisitian god to fill in the gaps is only as reasonable as using the ancient gods, or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or an invisible pink unicorn to fill in the gaps. The flying spaghetti monster is an attempt to make the true God laughable when He is not. Heaven and hell are no laughing matter and you can compare God to the flying spaghetti monster but you do so at your own detriment. THe flying spaghetti monster has absolutely no proof, no basis, no creedence. The God of the Bible doesn't compare. Ask any Christian what God has done for them personally. Ask any apologist for the logical reasons of God's existance. No, science doesn't have all the answers--yet. It's an ongoing process. Science doesn't even have most of the answers and at our present place in history, with the farce of evolution, the answers they do have are as lame as fairy tales. Life's mysteries aren't going to be revealed overnight. To Christians, many of the mysteries are revealed though. But science sure has explained a lot of "mysteries" that bible believers could never have figured out if they relied solely on their ancient book, their faith, and their "belief." Christianity causes a very limited viewpoint, not atheism. Most atheists, agnostics, and unbelievers are open to new theories and ideas. How open do you think atheistic evolutionists are to intelligent design? That's how most of us came to disbelieve in the first place: We opened our mind to the possibility that what we'd been told all our lives (christianity) is maybe, just maybe, NOT accurate. Most I know turned from Christianity and willingly accepted anything but do to his or her own personal hurts or disappointments with God or Christians. A person of faith isn't going to start believing in evolution just because their teachers teach it or the media continues to preach it. There's usually something more, at least in those with whom I've known personally who turned away. Most often it was that God didn't intervene when he or she thought He should have - therefore He must not exist. Or they see hypocracy in Christians and use that as a reason to reject God. IF you were a Christian and turned away for other than personal reasons, I have to wonder, what would have convinced a Christian that GOd did not exist? What was the 'evidence' that told you He was not real? Maybe it's christians who are hard-hearted to believing in the possibility that they are wrong about their god and their beliefs. Hard hearted according to scripture is one who is against the belief in God, not a follower of God. I think someone mentioned pride, which I believe is part of it. Most Christians I know want others to know about Christ because we love people and love God and want to do his will. We aren't here rejecting the obvious and accepting a fairy tale due to pride. We know what we know because God is real and reveals Himself to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grungekid Posted March 29, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 660 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/01/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1990 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Using the chrisitian god to fill in the gaps is only as reasonable as using the ancient gods, or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or an invisible pink unicorn to fill in the gaps. No, science doesn't have all the answers--yet. It's an ongoing process. Life's mysteries aren't going to be revealed overnight. But science sure has explained a lot of "mysteries" that bible believers could never have figured out if they relied solely on their ancient book, their faith, and their "belief." Christianity causes a very limited viewpoint, not atheism. Most atheists, agnostics, and unbelievers are open to new theories and ideas. That's how most of us came to disbelieve in the first place: We opened our mind to the possibility that what we'd been told all our lives (christianity) is maybe, just maybe, NOT accurate. Maybe it's christians who are hard-hearted to believing in the possibility that they are wrong about their god and their beliefs. I figured you might say something like that. The problem with trying to make God seem imaginary by inventing creatures that are supposed to have similar characteristics is that God outdoes these synthesized dopplegangers because He cannot be given any physical traits, which makes His nature much more consistent with what He is supposed to be, and much more believable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog House Bill Posted March 29, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 244 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 9 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/05/2008 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/20/1959 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Dear Sister in Christ, Hard heartedness and disbelief come from the opinions and statements made by others. There are really and truely no actual original opinions or statments. they all come from some one else in history. you can go all the way back through history and find a previouse statement or comment on any subject. You will eventually find yourself at the begining of all thought and statement of truth or comment of mankind. and this source has no prior voice or being. That End is God, the creator of all things including thought. Satan came after God and started to distort what God had already determind as truth. God gave Mankind the freedom of choice, freewill, to decide which path we wish to take. The path to God leads to a soft, gentile, loving heart. But the path that Satan has made leads to Hardness, bitterness, hateful heart. Thank you Sister for the opportunity to look at our own hearts and its motivations. In Jesus' name and in His love, Bill C.11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grungekid Posted April 2, 2008 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 660 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/01/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1990 Share Posted April 2, 2008 Dear Sister in Christ, Hard heartedness and disbelief come from the opinions and statements made by others. There are really and truely no actual original opinions or statments. they all come from some one else in history. you can go all the way back through history and find a previouse statement or comment on any subject. You will eventually find yourself at the begining of all thought and statement of truth or comment of mankind. and this source has no prior voice or being. That End is God, the creator of all things including thought. Satan came after God and started to distort what God had already determind as truth. God gave Mankind the freedom of choice, freewill, to decide which path we wish to take. The path to God leads to a soft, gentile, loving heart. But the path that Satan has made leads to Hardness, bitterness, hateful heart. Thank you Sister for the opportunity to look at our own hearts and its motivations. In Jesus' name and in His love, Bill C.11 Who were you directing that towards? I think this is what artsylady was trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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