Christian Metal

[Ovedya]

Oh I have all right to say that.. It's blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.. I don't care if you agree with it or not.. Truth is turth, and facts are facts and there is no gray area in between. Maybe you should read your Bible a little more about this topic before you start to blasphemy as well.. Just a thought

And maybe you should recuse yourself from this subject altogether, since you obviously cannot discuss it rationally without condemning your brother to hell.

[Ovedya]

Not quite, though that's part of it. My point is that the majority of Christian music that we sing at church these days is highly influenced by the stylistic conventions of what we call "pop-music". As well as some Jazz influences, Blues, and perhaps a hint of punk-rock from time-to-time. I was merely attempting point out that with all the non-Christian influences of these styles of music, why is Heavy Metal considered somehow different to other styles? If you condemn Christian metal, you also must condemn Christian Pop, Christian Rock, Christian Jazz, and go back to the roots of four-part harmony (which even then if you go back far enough I would probably say has some form of root in pagan culture before the style was used in Churches).

Well since this subject was on "Christian Heavy Metal" I was only discussing that particular style. With regard to the other styles I pretty much feel the same way.

As for the lyrics you changed, I understand you were only trying to make a point, but I'd venture that none of them could be considered "Christian", since the first still deals with coveting, gives a sense of superiority of Christians over non-Christians. The second, unless it is only a line heralding the history of Israel, has no applicable meaning to us today, since manna no longer will fall from heaven. The final one, I'd have to ask why it was getting hot in the first place and what does heat have to do with reading the Bible?

I've both attended and watched on television many charismatic, Pentecostal and Southern Baptist meetings where the pastor would invariably prance about the stage dabbing his brow with a handkerchief saying something like, "Oh you don't know....I'm about to......oooh, it's getting hot in here......the fire is about to be set loose......etc, etc." Such phrases are actually very common in the charismatic sect. I'm not very good at changing lyrics, or writing lyrics, so I just came up with those words in order to show that changing lyrics to secular music, which is of worldly origin, doesn't necessarily turn it "Christian."

[Ovedya]

I would agree that we church "hop" looking for that church that suits our preference. I'll admit I have walked out of a church that the praise and worship left much to be desired. IMO God is life, He is my life and I need a church that has "life" in its music. I personally cannot sit in a music service that bores me to tears, I'm radical for God and I need praise that reflects that and I can enter into. How about you Ovedya, have you left a church because the music is too loud? We've all done it at one time or another. I see no resolution to this debate, to each his own. I don't believe God cares what the style of music is being played as long as He recieves all the glory and worship. God inhabits the praises of His people, and as long as I am worshipping in Spirit and in truth He's there. It doesn't matter what style of music we need to enter in just as long as we do. Be Blessed, your sister in Christ Stacey.

I cannot honestly say that I have ever "church hopped." After I was first regenerated I began attending the same Southern Baptist denomination that my wife had grown up in. At that time I felt that was where the Lord had called me. It was not always enjoyable, but I remained faithful to the Lord's calling. This was a predominantly African-American congregation, with a lot of "black culture" tied to it. Most times I really enjoyed the Lord, but there were some times I felt really out of place. But the Lord had placed me there so that's where I needed to be regardless of how comfortable I was. Eventually both my wife and I decided to leave there because we both experienced that we had grown past the level that that group was offering. We both felt like the Lord had dried up that well, so we moved on. It was not us, it was the Lord calling us away from that place. It was about a year and a half before the Lord called us into a another ministry, where we have been for the past 14 years. The means by which that happened was not at all the result of our seeking another denomination, it happened through meeting a brother on a college campus, joining a campus ministry, and then becoming a part of the ministry. There have been times - many times - where I was personally offended, uncomfortable, dry, spiritually dead and wanting, but I have to remain faithful to the Lord's calling until, or unless He calls me somewhere else. Believe me, if it had ever been about personal comfort or preference, I probably would still be out there and "church hopping" today.

You know, if the children of Israel had their preference, they would have gone back to the leeks and garlic of Egypt. But God called them out of that place, to be a sanctified people. It was only those that remained faithful to the vision of His calling that reached the good land. And all their experiences in the wilderness brought them there.

[Ovedya]

Hi Ovedya, I have one question for you - what music is acceptable to sing to the Lord?

Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, according to Eph. 5:9

[ParanoidAndroid]

Hi Ovedya, I have one question for you - what music is acceptable to sing to the Lord?

Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, according to Eph. 5:9

Thanks Ovedya. But what I mean is - what style is acceptable? Take the following song, for example - HERE. You can click the "Play" button below the lyrics for the song. This is stylistically typical pop-music. Would you think this is an unacceptable song for Christians to listen to? Why or why not? Edited June 13, 2008 by ParanoidAndroid

[ParanoidAndroid]

Or, Ovedya, choose any of the songs from this - choose your playlist from any of the following links -

We are his people

No Other Name

Put a New Song in my Heart

Resurrection

All are legal playlists put out by the composers, so there are no copyright issues to worry about. Do you think these songs are appropriate for Christians?

Edited June 13, 2008 by ParanoidAndroid

[stacey c]

The Devil stole Heavy Metal?

Yes he has.

Heavy Metal was never rooted in the Gospel, so the devil could not have stolen it. It was his to begin with.

Do an internet search on "The origin of Metal Music".

My question to this would be what music is rooted in the gospel? Most forms of music (I'd go as far as to say ALL forms of music), you will find, go back to a secular base.

Exactly.

So to say that the devil stole "Heavy Metal" is a bit of a stretch.

I may be condemned here but I really don't listen to christian music. If it's on the radio, sure I'll listen, but I don't seek it out.

I don't like Metal music. Some of it's ok, but most of it is just noise. Anybody can bang on a guitar and scream into a mic, but it takes real talent to make those instruments sing all on their own and a good portion of metal doesn't do that.

I don't condemn people who listen to it. It's their thing....just like what I listen to is my thing.

But to say that heavy metal belonged to God before it belonged to satan, well....I would have to disagree.

All you have to do is look at the fathers of heavy metal to see that God wasn't there in the beginning.

I will clarify my statement about the devil stealing heavy metal since you seem to be gnawing at the bit about that one. I humbly apologize for not stating it clearer as I usually take for granted that people know what I mean without being very detailed. I as referring to music in general. God gave us the talent, not me personally I couldn't carry a tune if you put it in a bucket for me, to create music to worship and glorify Him with. Over all these years styles and genres have cheanged and satan has influenced music to the point of what it is today. But God can still use our talents and taste to glorify Him. If even one soul would be won by metal music over old fashioned hymnals God is glorified. It's not the style of music it's the heart of the worshipper that counts.

[stacey c]

I would agree that we church "hop" looking for that church that suits our preference. I'll admit I have walked out of a church that the praise and worship left much to be desired. IMO God is life, He is my life and I need a church that has "life" in its music. I personally cannot sit in a music service that bores me to tears, I'm radical for God and I need praise that reflects that and I can enter into. How about you Ovedya, have you left a church because the music is too loud? We've all done it at one time or another. I see no resolution to this debate, to each his own. I don't believe God cares what the style of music is being played as long as He recieves all the glory and worship. God inhabits the praises of His people, and as long as I am worshipping in Spirit and in truth He's there. It doesn't matter what style of music we need to enter in just as long as we do. Be Blessed, your sister in Christ Stacey.

I cannot honestly say that I have ever "church hopped." After I was first regenerated I began attending the same Southern Baptist denomination that my wife had grown up in. At that time I felt that was where the Lord had called me. It was not always enjoyable, but I remained faithful to the Lord's calling. This was a predominantly African-American congregation, with a lot of "black culture" tied to it. Most times I really enjoyed the Lord, but there were some times I felt really out of place. But the Lord had placed me there so that's where I needed to be regardless of how comfortable I was. Eventually both my wife and I decided to leave there because we both experienced that we had grown past the level that that group was offering. We both felt like the Lord had dried up that well, so we moved on. It was not us, it was the Lord calling us away from that place. It was about a year and a half before the Lord called us into a another ministry, where we have been for the past 14 years. The means by which that happened was not at all the result of our seeking another denomination, it happened through meeting a brother on a college campus, joining a campus ministry, and then becoming a part of the ministry. There have been times - many times - where I was personally offended, uncomfortable, dry, spiritually dead and wanting, but I have to remain faithful to the Lord's calling until, or unless He calls me somewhere else. Believe me, if it had ever been about personal comfort or preference, I probably would still be out there and "church hopping" today.

You know, if the children of Israel had their preference, they would have gone back to the leeks and garlic of Egypt. But God called them out of that place, to be a sanctified people. It was only those that remained faithful to the vision of His calling that reached the good land. And all their experiences in the wilderness brought them there.

Well Ovedya, God has been very faithful to you with the churches you have attended. I was with my last church for 18 years, so I know all about staying where God has placed you no matter whether you felt like staying or not, God has just recently called me out of that church and into another. Just to give you a little history so you know where I'm coming from, I was raised pentecostal since I was 6 yrs. old needless to say I'm accoustumed to rowdy church. But I have visited many other churches and denomonations over the years.And at the times I visted other pentecostal churches they were so boring or the Word preached was so weak and babyish I couldn't recieve there. IMO God wants us in churches where we can recieve otherwise we become just another pew warmer. But just so you know, I need a church with rowdy praise, deep worship, and meaty word, and of course love for the brethern. My kind of church maybe not every one's ideal church but God will be glorified in what ever kind of church we need to enter in and grow.

[Iryssa]

Hi Ovedya, I have one question for you - what music is acceptable to sing to the Lord?

Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, according to Eph. 5:9

Those do not limit you as to genre. Those Christian Metal songs are absolutely "spiritual songs." No, it's not talking about the "negro spiritual" genre or something like that, it's talking about songs that feed your spirit, that draw your spirit closer to God. Just because you personally don't feel particularly drawn to God by Christian Metal doesn't mean someone else wouldn't be. I know a lot of people who don't like hymns (though I always wonder if they weren't played by an out-of-tune piano or an organ whether they would change their minds, but that's a whole other pet peeve I have).

At one time the hymns you sing were new and modern, too...I'm sure there was some Puritan out there who said "no! You can't sing that kind of song in church!" back then too. We're not limited to songs that are in the hymnal. Don't get me wrong, I love hymns, but to say that's the only genre of music we're supposed to listen to is ridiculous. Might as well call the Christian music industry and tell them to stop creating new things! Cancel the Dove Awards, everyone!

"Rise up, so you can take a stand against the schemes of evil

Courage, be strong in the Lord and in His mighty power

Struggle, not of flesh and blood but against dark forces"

Those are lyrics from the Christian Metal band "Believer," from a song called "Unite."

[Ovedya]

Hi Ovedya, I have one question for you - what music is acceptable to sing to the Lord?

Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, according to Eph. 5:9

Those do not limit you as to genre. Those Christian Metal songs are absolutely "spiritual songs." No, it's not talking about the "negro spiritual" genre or something like that, it's talking about songs that feed your spirit, that draw your spirit closer to God. Just because you personally don't feel particularly drawn to God by Christian Metal doesn't mean someone else wouldn't be. I know a lot of people who don't like hymns (though I always wonder if they weren't played by an out-of-tune piano or an organ whether they would change their minds, but that's a whole other pet peeve I have).

At one time the hymns you sing were new and modern, too...I'm sure there was some Puritan out there who said "no! You can't sing that kind of song in church!" back then too. We're not limited to songs that are in the hymnal. Don't get me wrong, I love hymns, but to say that's the only genre of music we're supposed to listen to is ridiculous. Might as well call the Christian music industry and tell them to stop creating new things! Cancel the Dove Awards, everyone!

"Rise up, so you can take a stand against the schemes of evil

Courage, be strong in the Lord and in His mighty power

Struggle, not of flesh and blood but against dark forces"

Those are lyrics from the Christian Metal band "Believer," from a song called "Unite."

Ironic that what you are describing are genres of music. Genres of music are man invented, just as the denominations are man invented. There really is not difference, their source is the same. A spiritual song is a spiritual song and a psalm is a psalm. We only define them in terms of genre, culture, denomination, etc. etc.

Dove awards? Seems pretty petty strange to me...