Sevenseas

Well you have said the same thing over and over but it seems you are choosing to ignore other words that Jesus said. Words that you are most likely not comfortable with or you would say something about them. What you espouse, is not Biblical Christianity. *** Edited personal insults *** Excuse me !...... Now you are personally attacking me and wrongly judging me ... as a born again Christian...a child of God. YOU are way off topic ... the topic is about the finger... that you are pointing at and backbitting , Joel Olsteen ...Gods' servant as a Preacher ! You people need to get off of your negativity about this man, and the way he preaches. This is my opinion of Joel Olsteens Ministry. I am not in here to attack people ...no matter who they are. That would not be Christ like of me to do so. Sevenseas...........Name calling is Not Christian of you. O.K. ...I do have a few verses for you....at my signature of every post that I write... are verses that are positive ! Plus ..! I have one more to add... another positive from God Himself , which is ..Positive... so you cannot say that ...what I am saying is not ...biblical. Proverbs 4 : 20-21-22 20- My son, give attention to my words; Incline your ear to my sayings. 21-Do not let them depart from your eyes; Keep them in the midst of your heart; 22- For they are life to those who find them , And health to ALL their flesh. Gods' word is health and healing to ALL of your flesh.... now that is a positive verse ! The book of John...1:1-2 1- In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2- He was in the beginning with God. Oh , in the book of Revelations....19 : 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. Jesus is the Word of God ! That is a positive verse !!! God Bless you ...Sevenseas I did not call you names and you know that., You dislike the fact that I equated what Osteen teaches with liberal churches and emerging churches. You are crying wolf because you have no legitimate thing to say about the fact he ignores sin and you don't like having pointed out the fact that you cannot only preach pretty verses and then state that is the gospel. I am not your judge. The words you speak will judge you and the way you handle the word of God will judge you. Judging you is not my job but I have every right to state that Osteen is not preaching Jesus as He is represented in the gospels. I am not anyone's judge here, but you seem to be trying to do exactly that to me. Why is that? Another poster is saying this to you: Are you going to accuse them of personal attack also? I maintain that you are simply crying wolf . This thread is not about personalities and I am not going to let you try and make it that. As far as I am concerned, it is only about Osteen and the error of his preaching. If you state he is not a false teacher, then obviously I am going to disagree with you.

Well you have said the same thing over and over but it seems you are choosing to ignore other words that Jesus said. Words that you are most likely not comfortable with or you would say something about them. What you espouse, is not Biblical Christianity. *** removed personal insults. ***

Respectfully, you are the only one mentionning God and a baseball bat in the same sentence. Is there a reason for doing that? Why would you do that? God is Holy...that is far more than just being strict. You appear to believe you know what God wants 'His' pastors to preach on? Seriously? All of them? Actually, the Bible tells us that the beginning of wisdom IS THE FEAR OF GOD. But not for the reasons you appear to suggest, but rather because He is Holy and the only One that can throw both body and spirit into hell Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Matt 10:28 When an individual only talks about God's love and represents Him as some kind of uncle who just wants us to sit on his lap and burp us, they do God a great diservice. God hates sin...He does not tolerate it and to deny that, is to deny the gospel and the reason Jesus had to die. Sometimes people believe they are hearing from God when really they are listening to a deceivng spirit because they allowed false teaching to obliterate the truth of the Word of God. If a person does not accept the whole truth, then they are going to be mislead. Osteen is misleading thousands by misrepresenting the holiness of God and the death penalty for sin. A person can actually say they believe in Jesus, but the devil and the demons also believe and tremble. Joel does not preach the gospel as found in the Bible...he preaches another gospel and another Jesus Correct me if I am wrong, but you would not go to God if a person said something you don't like? That's what I get from what you wrote above

Exactly why Joel is NOT approved by God. Christians in third world countries would love to know that their belief is in vain and that Christians in America go to mega churches to be told that God wants them to be healthy, wealthy and not worry about a thing Unbelievable That is NOT what Osteen teaches or has ever taught. Attend a service and you will see multi-millionaires in fine clothes sitting next to people off the street who don't have two nickels to rub together. Unlike the Night of Hope events in stadiums and arenas, the services at Lakewood are always free and no one is compelled to contribute financially. ummm...I've both heard him speak and watched several interviews...I'm pretty sure there is only one Joel Osteen. Pass the collection plate please

I am in 100% agreement with the above. I never should have let myself become involved in an emotional diatribe against me. I know better and I am sorry I did that. Next time, I shall just report what I consider to be a personal attack., There is no room for ANY kind of human intervention in the business of life and death...THAT business is God's jurisdiction alone. I am sorry if I stressed anyone in my response, but I guess I was kind of shocked at comparing taking an animal's life because it suffers as compared to doing the same to a human being I don't have all the answers for sure...and I have some ongoing big questions for God...BUT, it is never right to play God at any time and just because people do, that does not mean it is right. Again, I apologize to anyone I have offended but at the same time, I strongly object to someone telling me to let God speak to my heart while they are twisting my words. That, is nothing but cheap manipulation and has no place in these forums IMO

Actually, that is pretty much the truth. When someone uses putting down a pet or any animal as an argument for ending the life of a human being they are absolutely dismissing anything scripture has to say. Abortion is pretty much accepted now, along with gay marriage and now folks want the right to help people kill themselves when the suffering is too great. or in their opinion too great I do not believe in leaving someone plugged to a machine to keep them alive...someone in a coma who is kept alive artifically needs to be let go. People getting jumping up and down upset over the euthansia do not really believe that God is actually in control....if God is soverign and omniscient and omnipresent as Christians declare, then why does a mere human being think they have the right to do God's job for Him? IMO, so many people call themselves Christian but do not even know the basics of what they purport to believe I don't think this is a grey area...like I said, please do pull the plug if a machine is the only thing keeping a heart beating....does anyone really think God does not see or know about suffering? I haven't seen an abortion thread with this much vitriole. Probably because abortion is now so common, it is used like birth control Guess what? Allow euthanasia and people who are too old or of a certain age will be put down along with deformed people or children with Down's syndrome No one has to agree with me. But the personal attacks are ridiculous...being told I am judging whether or not someone is saved is way beyond anything I wrote. I would rather be wrong than emotionally abusive to people who disagree with me. However, I don't think I am wrong. You don't have to think, whoever you may be, that you are wrong, but personal accusations seem to go hand in hand with a certain way of making decisions and I don't want any part of it. I have in no way, shape or form stated I am in agreement with Euthanasia. Where do you get that idea? I have not stated it as grey area. How have I attacked you personally? All I asked was that we address this topic in a civil manner. Where did I say that? I didn't say that. I was replying to your reasonable request for civil dialogue...have you read LadyC comments to me? I am so fed up with people going bananas because someone disagrees with them. I was trying to explain to you that I voiced my belief strongly because I think that Ladyc was very aggresively trying to say I attacked her while she was actually doing that very thing to me. It's ridiculous. I have read the entire thread...thus the reason for my comments being exceedingly few.... Can only pray that things ease up or that the thread is closed as it seems there is no real conversation taking place..... There is nothing edifying in this thread in my opinion.

Let God speak to my heart? Talk about manipulative Seriously? Don't use God to whack me over the head with. Unbelievable. No further comment from me to you.

Actually, that is pretty much the truth. When someone uses putting down a pet or any animal as an argument for ending the life of a human being they are absolutely dismissing anything scripture has to say. Abortion is pretty much accepted now, along with gay marriage and now folks want the right to help people kill themselves when the suffering is too great. or in their opinion too great I do not believe in leaving someone plugged to a machine to keep them alive...someone in a coma who is kept alive artifically needs to be let go. People getting jumping up and down upset over the euthansia do not really believe that God is actually in control....if God is soverign and omniscient and omnipresent as Christians declare, then why does a mere human being think they have the right to do God's job for Him? IMO, so many people call themselves Christian but do not even know the basics of what they purport to believe I don't think this is a grey area...like I said, please do pull the plug if a machine is the only thing keeping a heart beating....does anyone really think God does not see or know about suffering? I haven't seen an abortion thread with this much vitriole. Probably because abortion is now so common, it is used like birth control Guess what? Allow euthanasia and people who are too old or of a certain age will be put down along with deformed people or children with Down's syndrome No one has to agree with me. But the personal attacks are ridiculous...being told I am judging whether or not someone is saved is way beyond anything I wrote. I would rather be wrong than emotionally abusive to people who disagree with me. However, I don't think I am wrong. You don't have to think, whoever you may be, that you are wrong, but personal accusations seem to go hand in hand with a certain way of making decisions and I don't want any part of it. I have in no way, shape or form stated I am in agreement with Euthanasia. Where do you get that idea? I have not stated it as grey area. How have I attacked you personally? All I asked was that we address this topic in a civil manner. Where did I say that? I didn't say that. I was replying to your reasonable request for civil dialogue...have you read LadyC comments to me? I am so fed up with people going bananas because someone disagrees with them. I was trying to explain to you that I voiced my belief strongly because I think that Ladyc was very aggresively trying to say I attacked her while she was actually doing that very thing to me. It's ridiculous.

What I think is going on here is that people basically know it is wrong to take a life...even their own...but they get very upset if someone points out that it is not the desire of God either. Where have people been taught it is ok to take your own life or the life of someone who asks you to help them commit suicide? Is that what is being taught in churches nowdays or is that the humanistic and ungodly reasoning of people who no longer seem to fear God? We are to fear God...not death, not people and not opinions. The vitriole from LadyC and the personal attack aimed at me from that person would not be allowed on many Christian boards and frankly I don't know why it is allowed on this one.

Then Jesus said to his disciples, "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. Matt.16:24 That's pretty blatant too. A complete disregard for the fact that Jesus died for our sins and preaching a gospel to scratch tickling ears is pretty blatant too. Accusation is rampant among the social gospel and the mega churches and the emerging church. They do not want to hear the truth They prefer lies and coddling of sin and do not judge even if it means the person goes to hell because no one corrects them. Jesus also said this:For I have come to turn "'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law-- Matt 10:35 and this: "I have come to bring fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled! Luke 12:49 How do you interpret that? How do you 'examine' those words of Jesus?

Well, when euthanasia becomes legal, you can always have me...ahem...put down There has been nothing calm or adult in your response to me. I strongly disagree with what you state and your response is to accuse me. Nice. I am not responding to you further.

That is probably a good idea.

Love Song Exactly why Joel is NOT approved by God. Christians in third world countries would love to know that their belief is in vain and that Christians in America go to mega churches to be told that God wants them to be healthy, wealthy and not worry about a thing Unbelievable

believeinhim Joel Osteen is a false teacher. Period. He does not preach repentance and he believes there are many ways to heaven. That, is not what a Christian believes. Joel Osteen is one of the reasons the church in America is in the backslidden state it is in Not every church obviously, but generally speaking People who tell others not to judge do not understand that God meant do no judge the heart. We absolutely must judge if what they teach is correct according to scripture or not

Actually, that is pretty much the truth. When someone uses putting down a pet or any animal as an argument for ending the life of a human being they are absolutely dismissing anything scripture has to say. Abortion is pretty much accepted now, along with gay marriage and now folks want the right to help people kill themselves when the suffering is too great. or in their opinion too great I do not believe in leaving someone plugged to a machine to keep them alive...someone in a coma who is kept alive artifically needs to be let go. People getting jumping up and down upset over the euthansia do not really believe that God is actually in control....if God is soverign and omniscient and omnipresent as Christians declare, then why does a mere human being think they have the right to do God's job for Him? IMO, so many people call themselves Christian but do not even know the basics of what they purport to believe I don't think this is a grey area...like I said, please do pull the plug if a machine is the only thing keeping a heart beating....does anyone really think God does not see or know about suffering? I haven't seen an abortion thread with this much vitriole. Probably because abortion is now so common, it is used like birth control Guess what? Allow euthanasia and people who are too old or of a certain age will be put down along with deformed people or children with Down's syndrome No one has to agree with me. But the personal attacks are ridiculous...being told I am judging whether or not someone is saved is way beyond anything I wrote. I would rather be wrong than emotionally abusive to people who disagree with me. However, I don't think I am wrong. You don't have to think, whoever you may be, that you are wrong, but personal accusations seem to go hand in hand with a certain way of making decisions and I don't want any part of it.

You need to calm down. I think this must be a very emotional subject for you. I base my conclusion on scripture, not what the rest of the world dictates and you think I have alot of nerve? YOU are the one passing judgement...your comments to me are way out of line and not even true. Where on earth do you even begin to get the idea I have judged you as to whether or not you are a Christian? Is it possible for you to be objective? I don't even know you so how would I be able to judge you? I am so awfully tired of folks claiming they are being judged when someone has a different point of view. Put on your big girl pants and stick to the subject at hand which is not judgement of anyone here, but what the thread is about.

So you wish to be thought of as just another animal then? Well, alot of people think we are just animals, but a Christian certainly knows better Actually, I have not talked...what I wrote, appears to be quite taken out of context by you Oh boo hoo. I am an animal lover and have had dogs and other pets practically my entire life. I don't get them confused with people though. And neither does God. Animals are not people. Do you love people enough to pray for them or do you just want to put them down if they are in pain and old? If they are not saved, what, just put them down? Maybe that is God's way of having them turn to Him...you do not have the right to kill a human being. Only God has the right to take a life. THOU SHALT NOT MURDER. There is no gray area there. Animals are not people...Using animals is a ridiculous example. Shall we also neuter people if we think they already have enough children or perhaps we don't think they should reproduce because they are an inferior example of a human being? Where do we draw the line? Honestly.... Again, you believe that animals and humans have the same value? Jesus did not die for our pet dogs. We have more value than an animal. People who think that they have the right to end the life of another are deceived. Gee I wonder where that argument comes from? THE BIBLE MAYBE??? THOU SHALT NOT MURDER. Taking a life (that also refers to the unborn) is murder. YOU do NOT have the right to do that. There is no truth to your belief that God has given people the right to take a life. That is garbage. It is a dire lack of knowledge of scripture that would lead a person to the conclusion people can play God and end life when they want to. That kind of thinking, will lead to people in wheel chairs and people past their prime being put down too when society no longer believes that human life is sacred. God gave His Son to die for us....it is not human to kill...it is wrong and the doctrine of devils. You just might kill someone that would have accepted Jesus if they had lived another week or so.

Well, that's the problem. Osteen IS ANOTHER MAN'S servant because he certainly isn't God's. I've never put my mouth on him tho... Frankly, everyone responding who realizes that Osteen is NOT preaching Christ crucified ...the power of God for salvation... IS following the Word. Osteen is a false prophet preaching peace peace when there is no peace. In an interview some days back, he said...to ALL Americans...God is on YOUR side. Yes, apostate America...God is on YOUR side! Rejoice in your adulteries and your harlotry and your mocking ....yeah...good ole Osteen, eh? Why the vitriole? Are YOU the judge? If you actually believe that Mormonism may be the purest form of Christianity, you do not have an actual grasp on what Scripture teaches. I can see you believe strongly....in something...and I've read quite a few of your posts...and frankly, I am not really sure what all you believe at this point. I can tell you though, that whatever it is, is not what I would care to partake of Have that all figured out do you? What actually happens, is that Joel NEVER preaches the truth and everyone goes to hell unless they have an encounter with the real Lord Jesus...not the candy coated smiling beatific and dimpled la la la Jesus the girl that Osteen wants us to hold hands with and sing I love you and God loves you and there is no such thing as sin...we just have bad habits....la la la... I wonder how hard Osteen had to look to find something positive...he's just like them.They do not believe in Jesus as the Incarnate Son of God...honestly...where do you get this? I don't think you know anything about Mormons or what they believe... Actually, the devil tells them every day they are just fine. FYI, although they (Mormons) have gone to some length to make nice, what the elders have actually taught and believe, is the blasphemy that Jesus was married to Mary, Martha and the other Mary and that God was once a man and now lives in heaven practicing polygamy. Is that what you believe? Do you believe we should just chuckle like Joel and look the other way? What about exposing lies? If Jesus is your Savior, you think it is OK to represent Him that way? I certainly don't. Jesus is not a man and he was not a polygamist or a sinner. You are taking scripture out of context...what you are quoting has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with judging righteously...which scripture does tell us to do. Believer's should not be tossed around by every wind of doctrine and certainly not lies and false teaching. I guess that Jesus Himself would not be good to go in your eyes then if the above is how you judge. Oh...FYI...Joel has a busload of lawyers to deal with ...cough cough cough...'attacks'...he does not need God to help him out at all How is it you think you can tell everyone here to zip it? Quite a big imagination there

No, we don't shoot horses. I'm aware that is a movie title. Actually, Obama wants us to eat them...I'll pass You think there is compassion for animals? I guess you have not seen the millions of photos of dogs and other animals deliberately starved, tortured, and neglected. If you wish to make a case for 'the low ground' as you put it, perhaps you should not use animals as an example. Most animals that are put down would rather live. There are too many dogs and cats because people are irresponsible and do not neuter their pets. Animlas that are slaughtered for consumption are often suffering greatly and in terrible fear before the 'merciful' release of death Of course you are free to decide your own demise but that is not God's desire for people. I dont believe animals have reasoning which they would need in order to look at a situation and be afraid of what they think is going to happen. uhhhhhh...ok...........

No, we don't shoot horses. I'm aware that is a movie title. Actually, Obama wants us to eat them...I'll pass You think there is compassion for animals? I guess you have not seen the millions of photos of dogs and other animals deliberately starved, tortured, and neglected. If you wish to make a case for 'the low ground' as you put it, perhaps you should not use animals as an example. Most animals that are put down would rather live. There are too many dogs and cats because people are irresponsible and do not neuter their pets. Animlas that are slaughtered for consumption are often suffering greatly and in terrible fear before the 'merciful' release of death Of course you are free to decide your own demise but that is not God's desire for people.

I Tim.5:22.......I have heard and read diff meanings or interpretations..... Lay hands suddenly on no man - Some have understood this of laying on hands to heal the sick (Koppe); others of the laying on of hands to absolve penitents, but the obvious meaning is to refer it to ordination. It was usual to lay the hands on the heads of those who were ordained to a sacred office, or appointed to perform an important duty; notes, 1 Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure. (NIV) Do not lay hands upon anyone too hastily and thereby share responsibility for the sins of others; keep yourself free from sin. (NAS) Lay hands hastily on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep yourself pure. (KJ) and the following (not the best translation but including as they are saying something a little diff) Never be in a hurry about appointing a church leader. Do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure. (New Living Tran) Do not ordain anyone hastily. Do not participate in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure. International Standard Version) Question: What is the real intent of these instructions to Timothy and can we interpret this in more than one way? Just wondering how others 'see' this verse and if you credit more than one meaning to it?

Thine imagination runneth over...............

You touched my heart with this one. My grandmother had Alzheimer's and it was just so awful. She was a Christian and very lovely lady... always kind, generous and fair. She passed away some years ago, and is released from that awful thing. I think it is beautiful that your mom started singing a hymn that seemed to connect with the events of the day. Your dad sounds like a true husband who loves his wife God bless and keep you and your family and I will pray also.

LOL! Why do you tell me lighten up? Aren't YOU assuming something by telling me that? We can all assume that people who post flippantly to others (not meaning you here, but reffering to the OP) have a chip on their shoulders, BUT, I can assure you, having dealt with the problem in real life (not just words in a forum) that is NOT always the case...some people have some very bad teaching under the belt and are AFRIAD, yes, that is right, AFRAID, of changing because it will stir up their very comfortable little world. Actually, there are numerous reasons why a person might respond the way we have discussed in this thread. I have a head on my shoulders. I understood what you were doing. But, do you realize that some people actually DO think exactly what you posted? I won't respond to anymore 'corrections' of what I post...but will be glad to discuss anything this thread is about. Thanks

So if someone asks you an historical question to better understand a text you say "Jesus" ? Sorry, I guess I understand what you are prob saying here, but....uh uh...we are supposed to study the scriptures in part to give others an answer for the hope we have IN Jesus...scripture tells us to do so...