Willa

Permit me to butt in. It speculate that while Jesus was with the disciples He protected them provided for them, comforted them, taught them, and guided them. He sent them out without a sword but as lambs among wolves. He did want them aware of the dangers and rejection that they would face.

But in the quoted pasages from Luke He was trying to warn them that the time was coming when He would die and not be with them to do all those things. They would be totally on their on for a time.

In fact, when He ascended He told them to await in Jeruselem until power came from on high. So they hid in fear and in obedience in the upper room till the Holy Spirit was poured out. He was and is the promised "another comforter" that Jesus said He would send. His Spirit would do for all of us what Jesus had done for the disciples who had walked with Him. We do have to listen to Him, obey, and depend on Him as the disciples had done while following Jesus in the Gospels.

So we today have the full armor of God and the Sword of the Spirit, God's Word. The disciples had Jesus to fight their spiritual battles for them. Between the time that He died and the time that the Holy Spirit was poured out they had no guidance or power to defend themselves at all. They were in grave danger. After the Spirit was poured out they received power, guidance, inspiration, protection, and all that Jesus was on earth to them. They had weapons of the Word, The Spirit, their testamonies and the Blood of Jesus as well as the rest of the armor of God.

By stating all of this I in no way am saying that the swords spoken about were not litteral. They were swords made of metal. Nor am I saying that Jesus has ever said that litteral weapons are never needed. He in fact told the Roman soldiers that were saved to stay in that trade. (He told all to serve God where we are. Bloom where we are planted). We fight spiritual battles with spiritual weapons formed against us. But sometimes we also must defend ourselves with physical weapons against physical attacks as I am sure the soldiers did. We need Christian soldiers in the armed forces, today as well.

I never advocate violence. But I am not in any way a pacifist, either. Nor am I trying to find a compromise among the opinions given by my friends in the above posts. Instead I am postulating another way to approach the subject.

P.S. I still don't understand authorized KJV and had to look up the verses in my NKJV. Not a new Christian, either. I was saved in the 50s. Blame it on my dyslexia if you must.

Peep, you have outdone yourself. Still crying. That is why we left ours with the vet for 5 days when we were dirt poor. It took 5 of them to pill that cat!

Dogs are easy. Hide it in a little dab of peanut butter to cover. Of course you have to give both dogs a dab of peanut butter. 5 minutes later they are still trying to get it off the roofs of their mouths.

Someone I know put a gob of peanut butter on the floor for his cat.He tried to cover it up.

We used to take our Boston Terriers everywhere with us. About 40 miles away there is a pulp mill that manufactures paper products. Out of its gigantic smoke stack billows the most fowl sulfur smelling stuff; when we drove by it Mugsy would turn around to sniff his own rear just to be sure it wasn't coming from him.

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Peep, you have outdone yourself. Still crying. That is why we left ours with the vet for 5 days when we were dirt poor. It took 5 of them to pill that cat!

Dogs are easy. Hide it in a little dab of peanut butter to cover. Of course you have to give both dogs a dab of peanut butter. 5 minutes later they are still trying to get it off the roofs of their mouths.

Half & half actually......there is the bubbly side of me and the 'I need some alone time now' side of me....my husband likes the bubbly side...but I warned him about the other side LOL...

I was terribly shy as a teenager and people thought I was stuck up when I was just trying to be invisible....I actually used to pray, asking God to help me get over it and He did!

Your testamony is also mine, exactly.

I used to be terrified to talk to anyone. Now they can't shut me up. But Hubby and I still enjoy going to our seperate corners of the house for a little time apart.

Jesus transformed me into a person who deeply cares about other people. That ugly selfish side still pops out, but those silver stakes really work on the blood sucking monster, especially when we hold up the cross. [ http://www.worthychristianforums.com/uploads/emoticons/default_mgcheerful.gif' alt=':mgcheerful:'>] In the transforming process a strange sense of humor also developed as a side effect.

Wanted to be a nurse, then a teacher, then a nurse. Taught nursing skills at a vo/tec center for high school Jrs. and Seniors for about 5 years and loved it Best of both worlds

A scientist.

Physical Anthropology was fascinating to me. I actually held a conversation on a professional level with the Chair of Physical Anthropology at ASU when I was 13......

Then Christ came, and the wisdom of the world was demonstrated to be such folly that I regrouped......

Some of us should form a Boston Terrier club on the hobbies, forum. Chloe loves them, and we have had Bostons since 1974 till 5 years ago when we were forced to downsize.

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I am so impressed with how Godly most of you are. I had no idea. What a blessing to know you on Worthy.

One thing barely touched on was the effect divorse has on children.. You mentioned this several times, wingnut. And others have also. My dad was a social worker who tried to protect kids who were the product of divorse and also of abuse of all kinds. Parental sexual abuse is a given. But "shaken child syndrome", fetal alcohol syndrome, and illegal drugs given to children on purpose to addict them,,,not to mention prostituting their own children,,using them for pornography, the list goes on. We have to assume that no parent that does these things is a Christian. You shall know them by their fruit. No one who continues in habitual sin of this nature is a ginuine Christian.. 1 John makes this evident. But I have to believe that the Christian spouse has the responsibility to protect the children and not remain married to the abuser..

Most people who commit most of these crimes in the Old Testamant were to be put to death along with the victim, which is a little hard for me to understand.

Today there are many good reason for a woman to leave her husband that are not entirely scriptural. Of course if an unbeliever choses to not live with a spouse, they are free to go. 1 Cor. 7:15 indicates that the believer is not under bondage (of marriage vows) in such a case and is free to remarry. At least that is my interpretation.

But nothing is said about a spouse with an unbeliever who wants to remain with the believer, except to say that we are to remain marriied to the unbeliever if they don't want to leave. Yet I personally know of such people committing atrocities toward the children. Often it is the male who is abusive in such a case and the wife refuses to leave her spouse to protect her children. Once it

was a wife who abused the kids badly and the husband refused to leave and protect them until he was ordered to do so by a judge.. She was committed to a mental institution and a restraining order was applied. Last I heard she was out and sleeping on the streets of Seattle.

Extreme abuse of a spouse that poses a threat to life should be another one.. If there is a history of extreme abuse recorded in hospital emergency rooms and extensive scriptural christian marriage counseling fails, it would seem to me that Christ would not fault the battered for leaving. Of course that is just me. But He also faulted the pharases for not allowing a donkey to be pulled out of the ditch on the sabboath. Jesus did not focus on the letter of the law but the intent of it and upon doing the thing that is merciful. He reminded them of David eating of the sacrefices when in extreme need.

Divorse does destroy families and all involved are damaged goods. All go through grief and loss. All have nightmare memories of the events leading up to it and have had to deal with the lonliness afterwards.. All have had to forgive and love to move on with their lives. But not all remain damaged goods. Many live to watch God use it for good.

He who is forgiven much, loves much.

He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the Lord requires of you but to do justice, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God? Micah 6:8 NASV

If we should ever come into a large sum of money I would pray long and hard asking for strength to not allow the enemy to use it to lead us or our kids & their families astray. I would ask God how he wants it distributed, and ask Him to make us trustworthy stewards. We have never bought a lottery ticket either.

He is Risen! (He is risen indeed!) I always think of this as Passover, since that is what Jesus was celebrating when He instituted The Lord's Supper using one of the cups in the Sader as the cup of rememberance. We will drink the last cup with Him at the Marriage Feast of the Lamb. Cool.

Today we remember how he triumphed over death and can shout with believers around the world, "O death, where is your victory, O grave, where is your sting?". 1 Cor. 15:55. Christ the Lord is risen today! Hallelulia!

Velly intellesting. I am not sure that I agree with his conclusions entirely. Most of us achieve the same effect by conversational prayer with our Creator. No exercise. Not really a ritual or even meditation. No one else is around.

It is not satisfying to just talk to ourselves. I talk to myself just to remember what I was thinking about. It gives me no satisfaction except to avoid the frustration of trying to remember what I was about to do. But talking to God is quite satisfying. And hearing God's voice in our hearts is down right exhillerating.

The author should put that in his pipe and smoke it!. humm. I think that old saying has taken on a new meaning in the last 70 years. Perhaps what he's been smoking has instead come between him and God and he instead needs to repent of whatever he's been smoking. Just a thought.

SOS probably should mean save our souls. I always heard it meant save our ship.

Love it. Now to find out how to cut and paste the address so I can send it to my friends from my pad.

A lot of people really condemn jonah and thomas, But these 2 were a great witness in my life when I was first saved.. I was a doubting Thomas and his witness helped me to believe. He doubted, put his hand in Jesus side and fell on his face confessing Jesus as his Lord and his God.

I wanted God to use me and He sent me to the hardest people for me to love.

I tried to

run when God asked me to witness to them, but God brought me back to it. So I did it with a bad attitude but at least I did it. No reward. I just sat under the shade of that weed and felt sorry for myself, pouting until even the weed died.

Next time I decided I didn't want to die in the wilderness with bad attitudes and complaining. It is easier to do it Gods way than to be miserable. It was a pretty selfish reason for obeying, but a slight improvement. God chastens those he loves, and the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.

Revolutionist 90, Personally, I would keep quiet as much as possible. You will be ganged up on the way the scribes and pharasees were looking to trip up Jesus.

When The woman caught in adultry was brought to him, he didn't say a thing except " he who is without sin among you, let him cast the first stone." I frequently pray and ask God to give me wisdom as to how to answer the mormons, for instance, who come to the door. Sometimes my prayer is a quick "Lord, give me the words--". He does. It is cool to watch Him work.

Just ask Him to help you to stay strong and read His word daily. Ask Him to fill you anew with His Holy Spirit each day. Jesus said he has sent us out as sheep among wolves. But He is our Shepherd. He will be with us and will never leave us or forsake us. Love those who persecute you and pray for those who spitefully use you. Be ready to step in and be a friend when they need one the most. God loves and died for gays, too. What many of them don't understand is that he desires all men to come to repentance. Gays must acknowledge their sin and repent--turn away from sin and look to Jesus as their Savior and Lord. Sin is not OK and none of us is without sin. Gays tend to want us to think that God condones their lifestyle because He loves them. Sad.

Overcome evil with good. Greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world. To me that means that since Christ lives in me, His love in me is greater than all the hatred in the world.

The only way I can advise you to survive where you are is to do what the Bible tells us to do. I do and have practiced what I preach, and I have also fallen on my face many times because I have failed. You are not in an easy place. Just don't beat yourself up if you fail. God doesn't. He forgives and forgets when you confess your sin, and promises to cleanse you from all unrighteousness.

Jesus' sense of humor often does not translate well. Our customs differ from Jewish life in His day and our sense of humor differ's slightly do to culture. And then there is the greek/aramaic thing vs english. Our pastor frequently points out humor in the Gospels that escapes me until it is explained.

Since we have had a long marriage, (50 years) I would like maybe to rearrange this a little.

1. put God first in your life. Priorities is a big thing. When our relationship with Him is good, other things fall into place easier. This is one time that "to know Him is to love Him" is a good addage. The better we know God by obeying Him and seeing Him revealed in His Word, the more we grow to love Him.

2. Pray together aloud every day. Husbands should lead in this. Pray for each other, family, friends. All I can pray for our country is "God have mercy on us, a sinful nation with sinful leaders and judges." But we are to pray for those in authority over us, and Paul was talking about governments that persecuted Christians. Back to marriage.

3. forgive. Forgive each other. Confess what you did or even may have done worng, but most of all confess and ask for forgiveness for your bad attitude. Forgive anyone else who has wronged you. If you don't it will grow into bitterness and detroy your marriage as well. Bitterness contaminates your family and your life.

4. Never try to change your spouse. That is God's job and He doesn't want us telling Him how to do it. He wants us to accept him/her as they are and looke at them through rose colored glasses. God sees them thru blood covered glasses--the Blood of Jesus covers their sins. We need to see the good in them and ignore the other stuff, trusting Him to take care of it. Meantime we work on our own attitude adjustment and get the logs out of our own eyes.

5. differences. enjoy each others differences. Appreciate them. Respect them. Use them. A preacher one said that if you compliment each other, between the 2 of you your kids get one good parent. Hubby is very good at remembering details. I'm not. So that is what I need him for. We have loads of stuff in common. We avoid crowds and love the mountains and lonely beaches. We avoid large cities and Vegus or New York like the plague. Soo our hobby is bird watching. Years ago he loved aircraft, jets helicopters. Instead of going to art museum that I prefer, I enjoyed watching him and our sons find treasures in army/navy stores. Eventually he found that hummingbirds were better than helicopters and falcons were as fascinating as jets. So now we are birdwatchers in out of the way places. It is something we both enjoy. But I don't regret watching they guys build model planes, going to air shows or holding the tape recorder under the flight path of the jet as it took off. It is one of the differences I treasure.

So that included doing things that make your spouse happy, whether it be sex or, oh oh. I said the s word didn't I. Yes, Christians don't find their fulfillment in each other. We find our fulfillment in God. So we seek to bring pleasure to each other. Therefore we give a lot of pleasure to our spouse and end up getting even more in return. And the best part is that God made us to be that way. God said it is good. Satan is corrupting both marriage relationships and sexual relationshiips, and it is time we put a stop to it!

6. Keep going to Christian marriage conferences. You are never too old to learn something new.

7. Speak up. First I had to learn to keep my mouth shut and respect my hubby's leadership. Then God told me to start being his helpmeat and speak up. Hubby now smiles at me and says "honey, we are a team".

8. eliminating debt took a lot of stress off our marriage. But we started giving before we got out of debt. We gave to the poor as well as to our church, as God has moved us. He has taken care of our needs, but often by modifying what we think we need.

9. listening also requires me to keep my mouth shut. Watch body language. Know when to listen and when to speak. This is a bugger for me. Still learning.

10. keep it fresh? Hubby is impromptu personified.

Do you think the word "widow" can also describe a man who has left his wife?The Bible also talks about orphans.What about a man who has left his wife and children.Maybe they could be considered as widows and orphans.

Bopeep, I think that this verse refers only to elderly women and abandoned children. It sounds like everyone had to pull their own weight, also.. Men who have deserted their wives and children should seek employment of some nature to proved for themselves as well as their families.

Men who are over 60 and are physically or mentally

unable to work and provide for themselves should be supported by those in his close family who can.

My dad's father died in a diptheria epidemic that killed a son and his wife's sister as well. His uncles and an aunt providid housing on the ranch. It was shelter: a sod house. They worked hard for their keep. All Jesus promises to provide are the basic of food and clothing. Sisters made the kids clothes by hand, often out of flour sacks. They ate from their gardens, the milk cow and the yearling that they raised and butchered. He also tells of eating rattlesnake and living in a cave with his grandpa while trying to file on a homestead. His mother's father was still able boded and worked for his dads brothers and sisters also. That is how the church expected society to operate.

That is how our church provides for those who are able to work, also. They are invited to glean from their fields or fruit trees. Vegetables and fruit are also placed in the church kitchen for people in need to help themselves who are disabled. Canned goods are also provided by those who are able to give. No money is given unles they pay a utility directly when bill is presented that is threatening to turn off water and electricity.

V 16 refers to real elderly widows having no extended family that will support them, And lays out the boundaries that their families should support each other. Having no families to help them,, abandoned Elderly widows and orphans should have bare necessities such as food provided by the local church. No one was to be a burden to the church but people were to help out as they were able. Janitor work, child care, prayer, caring for the sick and imprisoned.

Before public assistance this is how families operated. Now we have a society that expects to be given everything.

A woman with children who is abandoned is not an elderly great grandmother with out any living family.

In fact, younger women with children are told to remarry in 1 tim 5:11-15 (widows are unlikely to include those who are abandoned by an unbelieving husband in this portion because both are likely to have believers in their familie who are able to help them out. Even if it is to babysit while mom works or to turn the garage into temporary shelter for them.

Also: Thank you Dennis for your reply. I should have checked some expository commentaries, but you have answerred my question to my satisfaction. I much appreciate your insight.

These verses speak of older widows in the churches who are:

True widows, left alone;

Trust in God;

Women of prayer, is a "prayer warrior" cuntinuing in prayers and supplications day and night;

Over 60 years old;

The wife of one man;

Reported for good works:

raised children,

lodged strangers,

washed the saints feet,

Relieved the afflicted,

Diligently followed every good work.

Verse 9 also starts by saying "don't let a widow under 60 years old be taken into THE NUMBER..

The pastor teaching the series thought that this meant that these widows were being supported by the churches. I would like your comments and ideas.

I also thought of Paul recommending that Phoebe be received by the church and commented on what a help she had been to him personally as well as to others. The word diakonos (deacon) is used of her here. Rom. 16:1-2 I wonder if she is one of the widows over 60 who are in the "number" mentioned in 1 Tim. 5:9. Perhaps there is no connection at all since deacons were said to be unpaid in Vine's Expository Dictionary and Acts 6:1 tells of the widows being supported by the church through daily distribution (of food?).

I would appreciate andy ideas and imput.

Deciner--I am not a widow and would not qualify for such support. I have never lodged a stranger, either.

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New leather, brewing coffee and, of course, world peace. I borrowed the latter from a famous FBI agent.

All day music....phil keaggy plus his awesome video PHILLY, LIVE. Peter and the Wolf by Prokofiev, and Lt Kiev Suite; Anton Kodaly; , King,s X : Music over my Head , Gretchen Goes to Nebraska and Out of the Silent Planet,

Being a best friend is a big part of it, too. Forgiving. Being there for them no matter what. Being what they need, not what i need

Story reminds me of the Latino great grandma watching her small children at a dollar store we visited. At the check stand I discovered that the $300. we had just withdrawn from the bank, a month of food and household expenses, was no longer in my purse. I paniced and told the lady at the check stand that I could not pay for our purchase because my money was missing. She asked the amount and produced the cash when I told her. She said that the old lady had brought it to her. I told her that I wanted to give them a reward, but both the cashier and the elderly lady (who was very poor) refused. I was so blessed and thankful to God for watching over us. And I have prayed for both of them each time I think of them.

Those dogs are sooo well trained. Remember the time that a cat was let loose at the Westminister Dog Show? Pandamonium of well trained show dogs.