before time

I would like to zero in on my question and some scenarios, a few off many more. Did God create the physical universe to give His only begotten Son siblings; this is the main explanation of creation. It was not created, the universe, for mankind to live in a sort of paradise void of death. However the earth goes on forever with procreation. The earth is only a bus stop, preparation, to heavenly life into God’s household. Man was made to die eventually of old age. So the only death Adam experienced in the Garden was spiritual death, separation from God. God was not surprised when Adam ate the forbidden fruit; He knows the beginning to the end and what takes place in-between. Adam's sin was a product of his free will in the same way we have a free will to serve God or not. The Son’s of God share the same glory Christ had prior to visiting the earth. “And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began” John 17:5 “all whose names have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world” Revelation 13:8

Hi Tinky How does this fit into the scenario, does God give us the dignity to worship Him on our own? Can a sinner worship God without Him demanding us to do so? How would that be worship if we only worship Him because He demands it? I don’t understand# John 4:23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks# #The true worshippers# All who truly and sincerely worship God# They who do it with the heart, and not merely in form# Barnes' Worship NT:4352 >proskune/ #pros-koo-neh'-o#; from NT:4314 and a probable derivative of NT:2965 #meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand#; to fawn or crouch to, i#e# #literally or figuratively# prostrate oneself in homage #do reverence to, adore# KJV - worship. Strong's

Hi Tinky How does this fit into the scenario, does God give us the dignity to worship Him on our own? Can a sinner worship God without Him demanding us to do so? How would that be worship if we only worship Him because He demands it? I don’t understand. John 4:23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. [The true worshippers] All who truly and sincerely worship God. They who do it with the heart, and not merely in form. Barnes' Worship NT:4352 >proskune/ (pros-koo-neh'-o); from NT:4314 and a probable derivative of NT:2965 (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand); to fawn or crouch to, i.e. (literally or figuratively) prostrate oneself in homage (do reverence to, adore) KJV - worship. Strong's

~ Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11 ~ ~ I will say to the north, Give up; and to the south, Keep not back: bring my sons from far, and my daughters from the ends of the earth; Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him. Isaiah 43:6-7 In other words why create a physcial universe to add to a heavenly family; Is that your question The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual . 1 Corinthians 15:46

I have nothing against creation Onelight, creation brought me into existence. The part I'm not comfortable with is did God create the physical universe to receive worship. That seems to be a human want. With that said there is no question God deserves worship from His creation; the Children of God. My point is did our Father in heaven created the physical universe to add to his heavenly family; the Royal Family of God. That is the Heavenly househeold of the Father and His Son the Lord Jesus.

Can you explain what concept you are uncomfortable with? The whole concept of creation?? Sorry, but you lost me here.

Scripturally speaking it is my opinion God wanted to expand his intimate family consisting of the Father and His Son Jesus. Angels not included since they were created and not born of God. They were, the angels, not procreated as the human family which share the blood of our father Adam. I consider this because of the physical creation children are born everyday into which I would call the Royal Family of God. God's purpose was to give His Son siblings, and by doing so bringing many sons to glory. Here are some scriptures for my reasoning I consider the following scriptures is more than just brotherhood And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. 29 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified. Romans 8:28 In bringing many sons to glory, it was fitting that God, for whom and through whom everything exists, should make the author of their salvation perfect through suffering. Hebrews 2:10 13 And again, "I will put my trust in him." And again he says, "Here am I, and the children God has given me." Hebrews 2:13 Has anyone ever heard of this theology, the net for me has not provided the name?

I think the question of all questions is why did God create the physical universe; and why are we here. Can we in someway find a scriptural answer to this, what I consider to be, an interesting inquiry? The answer I get is this; it gives the Lord glory and it’s also for His good pleasure. And to have a people worship Him! All this goes without saying for God deserves our love and worship; but did he construct existence as we know it to receive these things mentioned. Did He send His Son to die for this? He knows the beginning to the end and what is in-between. Mans sin, atonement etc. I myself feel uncomfortable with the concept. It seems to me to be humanity’s wish and adventure.

My first post I have four more to go. I can see from this forum we are in the millennium reign, spiritual restoration, or else the subject matter will be sports etc.