SHINY4UJESUS

thank you all for your feedback folks! I appreciate your constructive criticisms and encouragement both! Thank you for breaking the mold and cycle that seemed to be otherwise asserting itself. BTW KWIK, this was posted here because several "tenured " folks here added my failure to post significantly here as one excuse to belittle and present deceptive ideology as well as condemnation towards me. Since it seemed such an issue to them it seemed prudent to post here; simply to remove one occasion for stumbling from their path. Unfortunately it would seem that each time i do as they expect of me; there is just a new reason to bash and belittle. I think maybe ADMIN would be wise to consult these individuals and redirect them as to the proper type of attitudes and approaches. These things set a terrible example for newer members to follow. I think for a time I will simply stop posting or commenting at all. It is disheartening and disrespectful for lofty minded folks to perpetuate this condemning attitude and deceptive ideology; and apparently I am their preferred target...having been told several times i am "satan," speaking unbiblical doctrine and "putting myself on a pedestal." Rather than give them more fuel I will simply delete this acct and find a more Christian and biblical environment. God Bless.

Well brother you are free to twist the scripture to whatever purpose you wish. I do not wish to continue to promote deception and contention. Your perspectives are very opinion based rather than scriptural. It is written that thse things of the spirit are only discerned by those born of the Spirit. I was asked for sound scriptural evidence, which I provided. I would like to note that your continued intent here is to cause dissent, promote disunity, promote deception and continue to cast condemnation on both the Word of God and its minister. These things reflect the spirit of satan; not that of God. I will wash my hands of this matter and simply let God dictate what shall be done with one so iven to deception, hatred and condemnation; for the Word is clear on this.

no worries brother/sister( i need glasses, cant see profile pics so well...lol). I do not have issue with folks disagreeing with me anyhow, ur fine! I have issue only with those who would promote a single example used in only one context(and misapplied at that,) as infallible truth. The motivation I have is to promote a deeper and fuller understanding of God's will; and breaking the cycle of misappropriation of the scripture as a tool to force folks into following deceptive ideology. I do understand that this is not always intentional, but unintentional misleading can still have a huge detrimental effect to others. Then at some point that flawed view becomes almost like a "movement, " and is nearly impossible to combat. Since here; nearly every post has been quickly and harshly misjudged based on appearance. Then to complicate matters; folks would present arguement based on a very limited and partial view of a single scripture; missing the entire grand scope and critical principle. In the end, we are all human and prone to errors; myself included. All I can do is try to combat deception by instituting God's truth in its place. Lol..but it is an uphill battle at times.

well said man. i do appreciate your correction. Thank you for directing it in a biblical and principally sound manner

Fair enough. As this was the first truly thorough and scripturally sound arguement I will provide significant scriptural basis for my position; thouh earlier I did offer various examles from scripture including entire passages as reference. 1) KJV 2 Peter 1:20-" 20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost." We cannot simply use a single interptretation or context when expounding scripture; as this limits God's truth to a much narrower and partial truth; thereby deception. There are generally three basic contexts to almost every scripture: literal context, figurative context, and legal context. By legal and figurative context; yes those lost in sin without the blood of Christ as propitiation for sin, are "sons/daughters of the devil." However, in the literal sense this is not the case; and if you read closely with the full idea of context you see that I admit in figurative/legal context the idea of demonic sonship. It is in literal context I allude to us still being children of God; which I will now expound upon. 2)Genesis 1:26-" Then God said, 'Let us, make man in our image, to be like ourselves...," Note that God did not say, "Let us make man in Satan's image," or "in the devil's image." As such we were always God's children in literal sense; though given the righteous and just nature of God we could not be so in figurative/legal sense after the fall; until Christ's blood freed us from the power and penalty of sin. 3) Genesis 3 through the entire Old Testament until the time of Christ: Though Israel was already under the curse of sin...for thousands of years; almost every single time the scriptures referred to Israel it was as God's children, God's chosen people, God's Holy nation. If the weight of sin removed us from the literal sense of being children of God; then why would it call Israel God's children hundreds, maybe thousands of times while they were yet without deliverance from Jesus? This was before Christ entirely; yet while in sin, while unrepentant, while constantly backsliding, God still referred to Israel as His children. 4) Luke 15:11-32(specifically v. 20)"So he returned home to his father. And while he was still a long distance away, his Father saw him coming. Moved with compassion, he ran to HIS SON, embraced him and kissed him." Note the word "while he was still a long way off," and the fact that he had not yet confessed his sin, or asked for forgiveness; yet the father still thought of him as HIS SON. This is symbolic brother. The son had not yet made it home, had not made confession of sin, had not asked for forgiveness; yet was still considered a son. The moral of the story is this: I did not judge the people posting, I judged the deceptive and limited perspective and misappropriation of God's Word. Many times did I admit that in the legal/figurative sense that without Christ a person is a "son/daughter of the devil," however this does not detract from the literal truth that all are literally God's children; though we have in a sense disowned God and become instead children of the enemy. The issue was not the principle; it was the idea that a single example of one scenario, taken out of context promoted deception rather than truth. We cannot simply accept one context and ignore the rest; we cannot simply use one example and promote that alone as infallible truth. The position I have been led by the Spirit and Word of God is verified and validated by passages and verses from Genesis through the Gospels; not merely the one specific example of Jesus referring to the Pharisees. Keep in mind He was using this as an illustration to break the misguided idea that legalism and condemnation were entitlement to God's 'children," tag. In the end, I am sorry if folks simply cannot see what the Spirit would show here; i can do little about that. I can however take a stand against the misconceptions that promote a limited and deceptive view of truth. Jesus said we cannot serve two masters: so if we are not promoting the Word of God, IN ENTIRETY as truth; then we are promoting deception. A half truth is still half fasle-therefore deception. If we are perpetuating these deceptions and half-truths, we are serving the other team. This does not mean a person is "bad, per se; I do not condemn the person, I condemn the lie. i get that these flawed and limited perspectives were not intentionally driven, but deception is still deception no matter what we choose to call it. May our Father in heaven grant us all an open mind, ready to receive His truth in full. May He shatter the age old and long instituted misconceptions that have been perpetuated. May it be God who is lorified, Jesus who is accepted as Lord and Savior..and our hearts that are directed in the proper manner. In Jesus blessed name I pray. AMEN!

EZRA..posts here do not qualify deception brother. Sure he may have been around this site longer; but that is not a license to promote deception. I would not be obedient to the Word of God nor of any of our calling in Christ if I chose one person's deception over the truth of God's word. Furthermore, tenure here does not automatically equivocate "rightly dividing the word of truth," The decades within salvation and extensive biblical training, in addition to spiritual leadership having confirmed competence and thorough deep understanding of scripture in my life then are of no import? You imply that given his tenure, my evidenced and confirmed training; in addition to the willingness to speak truth in the place of deception qualifies his contributions as without blemish? This is a very narrow and limited perspective brother. WE cannot afford to call deception admissable and truth of no regard brother. If any believer is presenting deception as truth and putting God's name on it,that quite literally is what Jesus referred to as "blind leaders of the blind," as they refused to accept and dispense truth; thereby leading others into deception. If a person does not enjoy the conviction that the Holy Spirit would bring upon them; i do not get how my speaking truth is the issue. It is in fact the Word of God stating where God stands, and judging those standing on the wrong side of it as wrong; not I. I respect everyone's right to have their own opinions and belief; but i cannot agree to align with the enemy's deception merely because man thinks I should. Again, I prefer to simply stay grounded in the truth contained in the Word of God IN ITS ENTIRETY; rather than use a singular example as a basis to promote deceptive doctrine. I do not agree with these deceptions pressed forth as God's truth, and all of us as believers are called to shine the light of truth in the place of deception; but I do not judge. It is one thing to make a descernment concerning a matter; which is what is being done...but its another thing entirely to condemn because of it. I leave to God to judge people; I can only judge the actions that are contrary to His word.

well said. that is my point exactly. all too often, especially on this site; many of the tenured members seem to lean on single verses as excuse to lean on deception, that they may instead judge quickly and harshly when others have the spiritual leadin to speak truth. Rather than face accountability and truth; many simply use the sword of truth to "force," others to believe the same flawed perspectives they do. Rashly judging by appearance; there is a general disregard of context, scriptural integrity and divine revelation. Truly in this age have we reverted to the pharisaic behavior and philosophies Christ repeatedly combatted in His time. For instance: when I pointed out that the prophets throughout the old testament also encountered such quick and harsh judgment based on the appearance and were mostly written off as though they were the enemy of God. in response, several tenured members asserted I was claiming to be a prophet. In complete disregard of the context of what was said; they passed condemnation, made accusation and put implication that simply wasn't there as opposed to simply grasping the illustrative purpose and context. This has been a consistent and tragic approach unfortunately by those who should be promoting truth and leading by example. The saddest part is that newer follks here will see that as license to follow such a pattern of bitterness and hateful condemnation rather than promoting a desire to di deeper, see the full context, and comprehend the full truth of a matter. Many are called but few are chosen for this reason specifically; as many would elevate self above others in an attempt to gain control and the image of authority. Let us simply be faithful and dedicated to being salt and light, holding judment til we have actually tried the spirit against the ruler of God's word IN ENTIRETY, and seeking to promote truth and grace in place of the hasty condemnation so casually thrust

Well I am sorry that your limited perspective and refusal to acknowledge truth are limiting your discernment here. Again I would prefer taking the entire Word of God into account and lean on God's wisdom regarding things rather than taking one specific instance and promoting it as God. If u dont wish to accept truth, that is your choice; but it nonetheless will remain true with or without man's consent. If I gave you a fresh apple and you preferred to believe it is a rotten orange, that is your decision. However, it will not change the fact that it is indeed still an apple. One must not take scripture as a singular item with one context and application; thereby limiting God and promoting deception rather than the fullness of truth. But its up to you to choose what you believe and on God to judge. Feel free to continue blindly leading the blind if you wish; I will continue teaching and promoting truth in its entirety rather than using single verses as levers to force a flawed perspective upon others.

thx for the support and encouragement. We are all human and equally prone to error, including myself. I cannot claim to "always be right," or even always present things ideally. For example: by expounding scripture truthfully and with full context I somehow managed to offend those who seek to mislead and deceive using single verses as leverae to promote their own wicked and deceptive agenda..lol. So since the enemy foud offense to truth I am now being moderated again. In the future I guess I should be careful when I am offending satan for apparently this is wrong to do...

Jesus said that we should not judge by outward appearance, so why is it that so many are quick to simply take words only at face value rather than seek to understand the context in which things are said? Does this not promote a deceptive and limited view of truth? Truly we should endeavor to grasp the intention. context, and entire scope before we make a judgment and put the stamp of God upon it; should we not? Let us move forward in a Spirit of truth, rather than obstruct those truths we simply do not wish to accept. Let us not take a single verse out of context and use it as a lever to promote our own agenda or deceptive tradition; for these things are not conducive to progressing the gospel, nor bringing souls to a saving knowledge of Christ. Remember, "ALL scripture is useful for teaching, preaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work." Not simply one verse on its own, but " ALL scripture,". "Study to show yourself approved unto God, a workman who needs not be ashamed; rightly dividing the Word of Truth." Not simply swinging the sword for the fences in disregard of context and application. Let us not be mere "hearers of the Word," who delude themselves; but let us seek the full truth that we may grow and develop the proper understanding as we pore through scripture; seeking His wisdom. Thx

lol..I just noticed that after his post he posted four quotes of harsh, hasty, and error-prone judgment. It is ironic given the nature of the conversation that each of these quotes given in such a manner would reflect the character of the enemy; since the Spirit of God would promote mercy, love, peace, grace, and truth...rather than an exposition of scripture granting a deceptive idea, harsh condemnation, general presumption, and the will to create contention. I will leave it to others to determine whether these types of behavior are in line with the movement of God...or reflect the nature of our enemy...but oh well. Wolves have ever worn sheeps garb and bashed believers faithfully bearing witness to light and love of Jesus. I suppose it should be no surprise these thins yet occur.

I appreciate your feedback brother; but I suppose we will simply have to agree to disagree on this matter. There are two different contexts to look at here, and if you insist on looking only at one context that is fine; that is your prerogative. I however, would prefer looking at the scriptures in whole as truth rather than focusing on a limited portion and presenting that as truth. I hope and pray that you will continue to have a fervor for God and His truth; I pray that Father would continue to bless you with a desire to search and expound scriptures as given the opportunity; and I pray to thank God for your willingness to offer feedback in boldness. May you have a blessed and abundant day with Christ ever as the author and perfector of salvation! In Jesus' ever-blessed and holy name I pray, AMEN!

Well Jesus said "they are sons of the devil," and "you are not sons of God but of satan," and folks I think are referring to this concept. However, we must take into account who he was speaking to, why he was saying what he was saying, and what was meant. He was implying that their actions reflected that they were "sons of the devil," not saying they literally were. Although I must clarify here: Due to God's righteous and just nature, there is truth to the idea that the lost are not children of God. But this is in the "legal," sense..nt literal sense. For example, if I have a child and give that child for adoption; I am no longer legally its father, but that will not change the ultimate truth that I am still the child's true father regardless what legality says. The lost are like God's children "put up for adoption," (though he would not do that himself of course.) While lost and in sin, legally we are not His children; but it does not take away from the fact He is our creator and Father at its most literal sense

Thanks for your feedbck n support Golden. 1) Yes, I now know that partitioning these excerpts from my book will make them more "digestable," but I see little benefit to editing into multiple sections at this point..I will just put that idea into practice moving forward. I think most who are mature enough to fully grasp this lesson will grudgingly deal with the length of it as they so far have..lol. (btw thx all for your patience) 2) I do agree with your assessment regarding God's children being used as a term in general, however not so much in the larger scope, and here is why brother. While WE are not His children in the "legal," sense until salvation, mankind was created originally as His children; we have simply strayed due to the nature of sin. Thus, while we may not be "children," for the moment in the spiritual/legal sense we still are in the functional sense; whether we accept it or not. Sure we are "lost," children until we are "found," in Christ, but in God's eyes we are still His children. The scriptural basis I have for this concept is the entire chapter 15 in LUKE; specifically the parable of the prodigal son. This parable illustrates how we were all children of God; but that we wandered away, and basically disowned our heirship, thus being self/sin-imposed to alienation. Yet when the son, having fallen away; was still a long way off, the father ran out to meet him. He immediately wrapped him in embrace, put his robe and best ring on the son, and began to prepare a celebration," for this SON who was lost was now returned to him." This quite literally makes it clear that the Father thinks of us no less as His children; though for justice and righteousness He must approach it this way until we do turn back to Him. Keep in mind, the father in this parable did not wait for an apology, nor admission of fault, but ran out to whom he saw as his son. This is also a key example of the benefit of deep prayerful and meditative study of scriptures; for there is a wealth of revelation tucked in between the lines; and you really have to dig deep to see this concept with clarity. That all being said I appreciate your redirection and corection; it does sharpen my iron when I must revisit things and ensure the biblical accuracy and context. Thanks n God Bless!

Thanks Brother! Just doin the little things i can, no more than my basic duty as a servant. your words are an encouragement and i am grateful

I nearly literally burst out laughing...well said mark! I've a feeling some may soon think the same of me as well. I suppose that is to be expected though given this site has some of the old traditional folks and newer generation, some who may be of the more stoic southern baptist and some of the more extroverted pentecostals. Mind you I have no issue at all with either denomination, just that some of one denomination may find it difficult to break free of the denominationl ideology and simply don't agree with other approaches or philosophies. I've encountered those who belive anything other than good old hymns and organ music is "satanic" music; while others prefer more uptempo contemporary worship as with larger praise teams; guitars, drums etc. Oh well, given time perhaps we can all break free of the traditions we are used to and simply see the Word of God as it is rather than let politics dictate our beliefs.

Thank you folks for the advice. I apprecite the guidance as I learn the site and what works best for people. I will try to keep this in mind.

yes I do apologize miss muffet. These are chapters from a resource book soon to be published for our ministry, so i get that they are quite lengthy for the normal post. I just find it prudent to cover all the angles and relate all the relevant scriptures when I tackle something this controversial. It seems wiser than simply posting a hasty and generic statement without adequate scriptural representation

Well likewise Bonnie! This is twice in a short time your words have been an encouragement aand inspiration to me; thank you so much for your support! BTW...I visited Louisiana a time or two..spent a new years just off the french quarter in N.Orleans.. great time...lol..til i had to hitchike back home! haha. alls well that ends well tho..Jesus is always in your corner and so are we! God Bless You!

Well said HMBLD, I agree completely with your sentiments. While I do point out this issue, I would like to clarify that the large majority of the interactions here are indeed very helpful, very loving, and very well based in scripture. This is not an "across the board accusation," but a simple redirection for those to whom it applies. Very true also that each time it is an opportunity to teach, redirect and institute truth and scriptural basis; that we all may learn at least a different perspective even if we do not entirely agree with what is said specifically. I do apologize if any feel that some of my posts are "preachy," as the last thing I want is for folks to feel I am just on a pedestal doling out judgment; that would be contrary to the purpose of being salt and light. I may be quick to educate, but I am also humble enough to admit when I am wrong, and I appreciate the intent of those willing to offer correction; even when I may not agree with the post. Finally, Praise the Lord Almighty for your correction Hmbld! you have spoken well in stating that you try to concentrate on the good; perhaps I need to work on focusing less on "fixing errors," and more on encouraging the good that is being done for the kingdom.Thanks n God Bless!

I do apologize for that Ayin Jade; folks have had issues opening the documents when i post, so I have taken to the archaic "copy/paste" method. Thus the formatting is not always transferred properly. Plus I use laptop...for those using smaller devices I can see how it may be more difficult. I am grateful that you point this out though; as on my screen there is none of the merging you speak of; but now that I know it may be an issue I will try to adjust to make things easier to read. Thanks

One of the great tragedies in modern day America is that society and legality have severely limited a parent's freedom to reasonably discipline our children. Some states do not allow "spanking," while others do. Some states do not allow giving a child a "time-out," even speaking to them in a stern manner can constitute verbal and child abuse in some states. Grounding a child to their room is considered child abuse in some cases. If a child refuses to eat, a parent can neither "force, " the child to eat, nor allow them not to eat...a bit of "catch 22," is it not? As such, society has contributed to the moral decay of the world by simply giving the child the power within the family dynamic. If a child or another does not agree with the punishment, the parent can be in danger; and especially savvy children quickly learn how to manipulate this system to their own benefit. Praise God for the intelligence of these children,lol; but shame on society and the justice system for causing this issue. Regardless what society says..these folks are correct-the bible clearly states that reasonable physical discipline is not only allowed but is promoted; that the child's welfare and furute potential for success within society may benefit. The only thing I would advise: rather than simply spanking, or doling out other reasonable discipline; let it be followed with a period of explanation. We as parents have a duty not simply to discipline, but to educate our children not only that it is wrong; but why its wrong, and what impact it can have if allowed to continue unchecked. I think some of us neglect this second part more than we probably should. Let us keep this in mind when we discipline, so that our children have a fuller understanding of the critical nature of proper behavior.

Ok, so since joining this site; I have found a tragically consistent pattern among some that is disturbing. On my own posts as well as nearly every other post, there is always one or two "would be," preachers blindly quotinq a solitary verse as their basis for quick, harsh, and predominantly false condemnation or criticism. That being said, I have a few questions...lol... I do expect the usual dose of complete misinterpretation of context and application; yet I am eager to see what kind of response this gets in all. I pray this is not the case and that I am wrong. I would much prefer to be in error here than correct in discerning the trend. 1) What good does it do to promote this spirit of contention, condemnation, and deception when we are called to edify? 2) What good does it do if we blindly use a single verse out of context to promote an agenda or position; or to disqualify a truth we simply do not want to face? 3) Should we not use the proper context, take the passages as a whole, and ensure our claims are backed by other passages/scriptures in order to display the full truth rather than merely the "angle," of truth we wish to promote? 4) Why do we focus on symantics, presentation, and a person's tenure more than the principle and actual intent? 5) Are we not called to value the grace given by the blood of Christ; love and mercy over the desire to find fault and cast judgment over mercy? *These are meant as questions for reflection, that we do well to keep in mind before we post/answer. It is no matter to me whether folks concur with the principles I expound upon; which are backed by true context and several parallel scriptures mind you. What troubles me is the tendency to contribute to and/or promote contention, rather than simply edifying and correcting in a spirit of love; not an air of superiority and condemnation. I am quite aware that I make my own mistakes; and at times miss the mark in my passion for Jesus. I admit that I do not always have as full an understanding as I would like; and as such, am equally prone to have some errors-(see YOWM being correct as I was in error thinking it was Nehemiah marching around the walls of Jeruslem; when Nehemiah was tasked with rebuilding Jerusalem while Joshua marched the walls of Jericho..lol.) The morals of the story: A) We should be less hasty to judge the surface and look deeper to the intent. B) We, (myself included,) should be sure we are not using a single verse out of context and whether consciously or unconsciously promote deceptive doctrine. C) Our purpose should be to edify, to shine a light of love and grace, rather than contention and disunity. D) When offering correction, let us remember that none of us are perfect, that we all equally received unmerited favor in Christ; and since we received mercy instead of the righteous judgment of God..perhaps that is what we should reflect. Thanks n God Bless!

Agreed EZRA. I do nt condone nor excuse sin; and I do understand and concur with the principle that we must truly repent,(ie turn completely from the sin) I do wish to clarify however: near the end, at the part where I say " I do not expect that you immediately turn from the sin completely," (ie without some struggle and backsliding; I did not intend to give the impression that its "OK," to ignore this critical element. I just know from my own experience, and from Romans 7:1-22 among other passages, there is a difference between conscious/intentional sin, and moments of weakness that cause a relapse; upon which one may have immediate conviction for doing so and confess the repeat, wishing to be rid of the "thorn in the side." As believers we have by and large completely ignored this concept and tend to view such a thing as "unrepentant sin," which is not the case. Paul was at the height of his spiritual maturity, near the end of his earthly life when he authored that particular passage; and yet he admitted he STILL struggled with the same sin/sins that he always had, doing those things he did not want to do. In this very specific and rare situation, it is not unrepentant sin but, as he said; simply the nature of the flesh to do what is contrary to the Spirit, will and Word of God. In this matter the heart's intention is far more critical than the behavior; as Paul illustrated that his heart was directed towards God and willing to be rid of the sin, knowing it ws sin. We do well when we expound biblical principles not to lean on just one passage or verse to promote an idea that this alone is "truth," but take into acount all aspects of the situation and parallel verses/passages inorder to have a more complete understanding. Peter was another good example; though given favor by Christ and admitted into the circle, he kept having moments of sin and misbehavior in his passion to do what he believed was right in God's sight. David was also a good example from the old testament, having backslidden quite severely when he had Uriah murdered in order to lay with the man's wife. While he did receive a great deal of discipline from God,(along with his descendants,) for this; keep in perspective God did not remove His promise, nor did He remove him from the throne. In all three cases, Paul, Peter, and David; their sins were not permitted to remove or prevent the movement of God in their lives, nor did it disqualify them from what God had promised- all because of the state of their heart. In spite of their return to sin, they all had a sincere love and passion for God, and utterly despised the sin in their lives. This all being said, let us not excuse sin, let us not disregard repentance, but let let us also remember what God has written and Jesus has proclaimed: "It is not the outside of the cup that matters; but what is on the inside." Jesus DID say this during an exposition on state of the heart...lol. God Bless!

LOL...then I put CS...classic. Prime example of the imperfection of humanity, haha. CH quote was what I referred to.