childoftheking

But I have a guarantee, a promise that sinners who refuse to repent have. There is a big difference in my views compared to a sinner who finds no reason to accept Yeshua, let alone to think they need to repent.

Matthew 24: And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 5For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many. 6And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. 8All these are the beginning of sorrows. Yeshua claims these SIGNS that LEAD to Tribulation are the beginning of "Sorrows." He is calling the TRIBULATION a period of SORROWS, not a period of WRATH. NOWHERE does the word WRATH occur in chapter 24 describing Tribulation!!

You cannot ever claim a sinner and believer are experience the same thing. We see the sinners today not heeding warnings like Noah was proclaiming to unbelievers then. We see sinners today going about their merry way while believers are preparing for the worst. When you put BOTH VIEWS together, you get the complete picture TODAY, as it was with Noah.

Translations of tribulation Noun Frequency δοκιμασία trial, probation, ordeal, tribulation, proof, crucible Translations of wrath Noun Frequency οργή anger, wrath, rage, fury, ire, dander

If you ask any Messianic Jew if tribulation means WRATH they will laugh at you. That is a false presumption of a Christian who believes they are more special than the Jew. But you get this idea from your misinterpreted English Bible. It's like looking at 1 Corinthians 15: 51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. ...and believing this means Pre-Trib while forgetting verse 52 specifies this is talking about the "last trump." Paul even clarifies this in 1 Thess: 16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. This Trump in verse 17 is the LAST TRUMP in verse 52. And Yeshua clarifies when this happens in Matthew 24, at the end of Tribulation.

Translations of παράδεισος Noun Frequency paradise παράδεισος

Not if you understand what Yeshua means in the Hebrew (Yahweh's Salvation), which is translated into: the Son's work on Calvary is the Father's source for our Salvation. Either way, it gives us the Father and the Son through the Name of Yeshua. In John 14, Yeshua said, the works we see from Him are not His own, but the Father that dwells inside Him. So this once again ties Yeshua and the Father which Yeshua claimed Him and the Father are ONE. The Holy Spirit can actually be broken into Yeshua several ways: We know the Pharisees said Yeshua was casting out Demons by Demons. And Yeshua replied, by the Holy Spirit. We know Messiah means ANOINTED ONE. This means Yeshua embodied both the Father and Holy Spirit!! We also know that within Yeshua was the FULNESS of the GODHEAD = Yeshua + Father + Holy Spirit...just like the meaning of Messiah or Anointed One!! So, in that context of Yeshua being the Messiah, Anointed One, or Full of the Godhead, we have Father - Son - -Holy Spirit. I just gave a simpler version, because it was in Yeshua's Name, the Holy Spirit was sent to us!!

WRONG!! I just provided EVERY GREEK TEXT AND IT MEANS "S...K...Y".......SKY!!

Do you ever take words and study them by their original language? I've notice you did not do that in Daniel 70x(sevens (7)) for the Hebrew meaning. And clearly you are not doing that for Yeshua in the Greek or Aramaic concerning the difference between heaven - sky παράδεισος = heaven ουρανός = sky EVERY GREEK TEXT EVER WRITTEN USES THE WORD THAT MEANS "SKY!!" Greek Texts ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Nestle 1904 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Westcott and Hort 1881 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως τῶν ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Westcott and Hort / [NA27 and UBS4 variants] καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως τῶν ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: RP Byzantine Majority Text 2005 Καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων, ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Greek Orthodox Church καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσι τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Tischendorf 8th Edition καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Scrivener's Textus Receptus 1894 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσι τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων, ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Stephanus Textus Receptus 1550 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν Matthew 24:31 Greek Study Bible (Apostolic / Interlinear) καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶντεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως τῶν ἄκρων αὐτῶν. KJV with Strong's And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds fromone end of heaven to the other __ You should stop assuming your ENGLISH BIBLE is accurately translated. If you knew the Hebrew and Greek, you would have stopped this foolishness a long time ago. Which is another indicator that GOD DID NOT SPEAK TO YOU concerning Pre-Trib!!

I believe that you are genuine and 100% sincere in thinking that you heard from God. But I don't believe on the issue of Pre-Trib, that you did hear from God... knowing that God Himself made it clear in Matthew 24, what the chain of events will be, including the Elect will be in the Tribulation and gathered at the very end of it.

I love how you specify one word to make an argument over. 37But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. These verse are conclusive of how people were and acting before the flood came. And even though the Tribulation will be difficult for sinners, they won't know when it ends, why the sun darkens, the moon fails, the stars fall, and especially when Yeshua shall return. But the Elect do, they will know when Tribulation ends because the sun darkens, the moon fails, the stars fall and soon after Yeshua will return!!

Yeshua told the Disciples in the Upper Room he would not drink of the vine until they were with him in Paradise. We know in Spirit when we die, we are with God immediately, but in BODY, that is not until the Second Advent which comes after the Tribulation ends. The marriage will take place then.

I completely agree, but Paul aligns with Yeshua, and not the other way around!! And Yeshua claims, at the END of Tribulation, He gathers His Elect from the 4 CORNERS...that is the entire Bride after the Tribulation Ends, and following the same pattern of Noah!!

Yeshua said, just as the days of Noah, so shall be the days of the coming of the Son of Man!! Whatever Noah went through, we are going through perilous times ourselves. To claim otherwise, is calling Yeshua a "liar."

I have no Brotherly love for the ((spirit)) deceiving you, I have Brotherly love for YOU!!

No, you are convinced the voice in your head was God. The scriptures I provide are factual and align with ALL SCRIPTURE pertaining to the end event.

No, I need to REBUKE YOU, is what I need to do. Your persistence that I am off and ((God told you something)) aligns with today's spirit of Jezebel!!

No, your view aligns only with Paul, not with Yeshua. And I provided 19 specific reasons, with scripture, to prove even Paul verified what Yeshua claimed in Matthew 24!!

No, I am saying, "God specified this Tribuation is much like that of when Noah went through the Tribulation, we know as the Flood." God never removed Noah, but made Noah go through it. If Noah, a great man of God, went through the Tribulation, so then are we, who are nowhere in comparison to Noah!!

I prayed and prayed and God kept revealing to me FALSE PROPHETS and FALSE TEACHINGS!! That is EXACTLY what Pre-Trib and the ones spreading it are!!

Yep, JUST LIKE THE DAYS OF NOAH... Did God remove Noah from the Earth during the flood (which was a Great Tribulation)? NO Noah went through the ENTIRE FLOOD PERIOD!! And the FINAL TRIBULATION IS JUST LIKE THE DAYS OF NOAH, right from the MOUTH of GOD HIMSELF!! WE ARE GOING THROUGH THE TRIBULATION!! This is how I know God did not tell anyone a thing about Pre-Trib, because it would not be just like NOAH'S TRIBULATION (which God made Noah go through)!!

19 Proofs we are Living in the End Time We are asked quite often why we believe in a post-tribulation rapture. The 19 points below explain our position. Matthew 24:29-31 clearly says that the rapture happens after the Great Tribulation. Some will say that “the elect” in this passage applies to the Jews, but there is no scriptural proof of this. Furthermore, a study of the word elect or election in the New Testament reveals that every time the word is used, it refers to the church, not to the Jews. The most poignant case is Romans 11:7. Even in Matthew 24, Jesus uses the word elect (verses 22 and 24) to refer to the church, not the unbelieving Jewish people. Further support of verse 31 as the rapture of the church are the verses that follow it, which describe, among other things, two being in the field – one is taken, the other left. This is the rapture. II Thessalonians 2:1-4 clearly says that the Antichrist will be revealed before the rapture. Verse 6 clearly says that what is holding back the revelation of the Antichrist is that it’s not time yet. Revelation 20:4-6 says that saints who were killed during the mark of the beast period – the Great Tribulation – would be part of the “first” resurrection. This conflicts with the pre-tribulation rapture theory, which states that the first resurrection happens before the mark of the beast. The pre-tribulation rapture theory converts the resurrection in Revelation 20:4-6 into the “second” resurrection, while John takes great pains to tell us that it’s the first. In an attempt to avoid scripture breakdown, those who hold to a pre-tribulation rapture have said in the past, “There have been many first resurrections.” This of course is absurd and wholly unnecessary. Also, it has been said that a rapture and a resurrection are not the same. But the rapture is when the dead in Christ rise. This is the very definition of resurrection. Matthew 13’s parable of the wheat and the tares (verses 24-30 and 36-43) describes the harvest of the wicked and good as one simultaneous event, not two events separated by seven years. Those who say it does allow for a seven year gap cannot explain away verse 30, which says, “Gather ye together first the tares (the wicked).” According to Jesus, the wheat is not harvested before the tares. I Thessalonians 4:15-18 talks about the rapture of those who are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord. The Greek word for remain is “perileipo.” According to Strong’s, it can also be translated as “survive.” This is not surprising, because the word “peril” is at the root of “perileipo.” Remain means “remain as in surviving the peril.” This does not seem to support a pre-tribulation rapture theory. In Revelation 13:7, the Antichrist makes war against saints who are from all kindreds, tongues, and nations. That does not describe Jews-only. I Corinthians 15:51-54 speaks of the last trump. Revelation 11:15-19 speaks of the last trump. The description of what happens at the last trump in each of these passages is the same. Every prophecy student would agree that the rapture is when the Lord comes as a thief. Many warnings are given of this in the New Testament, among them Matthew 24:42-43, I Thessalonians 5:2, and II Peter 3:10. One such warning is given in Revelation 16:15. It’s the final, last minute warning: “Behold, I come as a thief.” But notice the context. The following verse is the Battle of Armageddon – the 7th Vial. Why would God be issuing a warning that He will be coming as a thief right up until Armageddon, if He came as a thief seven years prior to this? The answer is, of course, He wouldn’t. It has been theorized that when the Lord comes as a thief in the night, this speaks of a Secret Coming. I Thessalonians 5:1-8 clearly teaches, however, that the church will know when He is coming. The Church will not be taken by surprise. Only the unsaved will be taken by surprise. It is hard to understand where the Secret Coming theory was even conceived. It has been commonly taught that the Great Tribulation is the Wrath of God. The Bible teaches the opposite. When the Great Tribulation ends, this is when the God’s Wrath begins. Proof: One of the events that takes place during the Wrath of God is that the sun, moon, and stars will go dark. It is described in the 6th Seal – Revelation 6:12-17. It specifically calls it the Wrath of God. The sun, moon, and stars going dark is also spoken of by Jesus in Matthew 24:29, only Jesus gives us the timing. He says that it occurs after the Great Tribulation. According to Jesus, the Wrath of God is not the Great Tribulation, but rather, the Wrath of God occurs after the Great Tribulation. To operate under the wrong assumption that God’s Wrath is the Tribulation results in nothing but confusion. Revelation 12:7-17 describes the events of the Great Tribulation. This can be proven by comparing it with all other passages in the Bible that speak of a three and one-half year period of time (1,260 days, 42 months, “time, times, and half a time”). Verse 12 calls the Great Tribulation the time of Satan’s Wrath. After all, God does not persecute His own people. Satan does. I Thessalonians 5:9 teaches that God’s people are not appointed unto God’s Wrath. The post-tribulation rapture teaching agrees with this. As stated above, the Great Tribulation is not God’s Wrath. It is Satan’s Wrath. History records that 11 of the 12 apostles were martyred. Saints today are not immune from the trials, temptations, and persecutions of Satan. It has been said that God wouldn’t beat up His bride before marrying her. That is certainly true. He wouldn’t. But Satan would. The pre-tribulation rapture theory states that there is one Second Coming, but that it happens in two phases. (We find this premise to be a stretch.) It is said that the first phase is for His church. It’s the rapture, also called the Secret Coming. The second phase is Matthew 24:31’s gathering of the Jews, which they call the Glorious Appearing. It occurs at the end of the final seven years. There are some scriptures which are in conflict with this theory. Here are two: Titus 2:11-13 instructs the church to live righteously in this present world right up until, not the Secret Coming, but the Glorious Appearing. I Peter 1:5-7 teaches that trials and temptations will continue for the church all the way up until, not the Secret Coming, but the Glorious Appearing. In order to know the timing of the rapture, you must of course understand how the book of Revelation is structured. The pre-tribulation rapture theory is based on the assumption that Revelation was written in a chronological sequence. This means, it is assumed that the events of the endtime are recorded in Revelation in the order they will happen: First the Seals, then the Trumpets, and then the Vials. If it can be proven, however, that Revelation was not written in chronological order, then the house of cards falls. And it does. A simple comparison between the 7th Trumpet (Chapter 11) and 7th Vial (Chapter 16) reveals that they are the same, singular event. Add to this comparison the 6th Seal (Chapter 6), Ezekiel 38:18-22, and Matthew 24:29 and we find that all five of these passages describe the exact same event. The 6th Seal, 7th Trumpet, and 7th Vial is one event that is described in Chapter 6, again in Chapter 11, and again in 16. Obviously, Revelation is not in the assumed chronological sequence. This is one of several proofs that Revelation is not sequential from front to back. And with this understanding, the underlying assumption upon which the pre-tribulation rapture is based collapses. It has been commonly accepted that in order for the Antichrist to rise to power, the Holy Ghost must be removed from the earth. The basis for this conclusion is II Thessalonians 2:7. There are a few problems with the theory. First and foremost, we already demonstrated above that the first 4 verses of this same chapter mandate the revelation of the Antichrist before the rapture, not after. Paul would not reverse his position so radically three verses later. Second, it is assumed that the “he” in verse 7 is the Holy Ghost, but there is no proof whatsoever for this. And finally, if there is no Holy Ghost on earth during the Great Tribulation, then what power is being used by the Two Witnesses to perform all of their miracles. Revelation 13:5-7 and other passages describe people on earth during the Tribulation who are born again. How can a person be born again without the Holy Ghost? The pre-tribulation rapture theory states that those who are left behind will have a second chance at salvation. The parable of the ten virgins (Matthew 25:1-13) teaches that He comes once and there is no second chance to make the rapture. Some have taught a mid-tribulation rapture. However, this position is impossible since it assumes that the Tribulation lasts for seven years. Yet, there is not one scripture in the entire Bible that describes a seven-year tribulation. Every description of the Tribulation in the Bible teaches that it lasts for three and one-half years. Daniel 7:25, 12:1-7, Revelation 11:3-12, 12:6, 12:7-12, 12:13-17, and 13:5-7. The misunderstanding about a seven-year tribulation comes from Daniel 9:27, which speaks of a covenant that will be confirmed for seven years. This verse teaches that the abomination of desolation will occur halfway through the seven-year period. Jesus said that the abomination of desolation would mark the beginning of the great tribulation (Matthew 24:15-21). From this we know that the great tribulation only lasts for three and one-half years. Many have taught that the rapture is described in Revelation 4:1. John is told to “Come up hither, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter.” This passage has nothing to do with the rapture. It simply means what it says: “I will show you things that must be hereafter.” This is simply the point in John’s writings when he begins recording the events of the future. In Revelation 1:19, John is told to write three things: “Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter.” Chapters 1-3 contain “…the things thou hast seen, and the things which are.” Chapter 4, verse 1 simply moves into “… the things which shall be hereafter.” Revelation 3:10 is cited by some as proof of a pre-tribulation rapture. The passage says: “Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.” Some contend that as God protected the church of Philadelphia from temptations that would come upon the world, so shall He protect us from the Great Tribulation. This passage was simply a message to the Philadelphian church that John had oversight of after he was released from the exile on the Isle of Patmos. A similar message was written to the church of Smyrna in Revelation 2:10: “…the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days…” Does this mean that the great tribulation will only last ten days? Of course not. Again, this is a message to one of the seven churches of Asia Minor, which John would overseer after his release from exile. Matthew 24:37, “But as the days of Noah were so shall the coming of the Son of man be,” is offered as proof of a pre-tribulation rapture by some. It is explained that God helped His chosen escape the great tribulation of the flood, and so likewise shall He rapture His church from the coming tribulation. However, it should be noticed that God protected Noah through the flood. He did not bring Noah into heaven to avoid the flood. Furthermore, the coming of the Son of man to which the days of Noah were being compared was the coming just described in verses 29-31, which the passage specifically says will take place immediately after the tribulation.

I have a big family and if any member disappeared we would know it immediately. But you believe in Pre-trib so you are making excuses like those left behind will not notice billion people have disappeared for no reason and cannot be found. Even though they do not believe in God, these sinners are scientists, mathematicians, teachers, etc...it's not like they won't notice a billion people gone when many its their job to study people. Common sense goes a long way in thinking here, we should put it to good use. I get it, no one wants to go through the trib, but Yeshua claims we will, and Revelation claims it will be a great multitude...like the billions who would go Pre-Trib if God said Pre-Trib, but He DOES NOT!!

Some will say, that is mean of God!! I was predestined before I was ever born to be born into a family of believers that eventually I would also believe. The same can be said for sinners who end up in the Lake of Fire, they were predestined to deny and not accept God. Therefore, in final Tribulation, God is not providing the biggest CLUE by removing millions and billions of believers for sinners to reject the Mark from word go!!

Also, another point I wanted separate on its own: I was impressed by God a few years ago to see things like I do. My Grandfather and Father preached PRE-TRIB and I was raised PRE-TRIB. But I was impressed that Tribulation means trial or test. And this Tribulation is the final test for those unsaved. What I was impressed about: If God pulls out 2 billion people tomorrow to kick off the Tribulation, the majority left will have some family member they remember as a believer and will get beheaded. Revelations 20 makes it clear only a small group, not a great multitude will be beheaded. Therefore, I do not believe God is going to give the last day sinners any clues like yanking 2 Billion people from the face of the Earth just by vanishing. This is why I know it is POST-TRIB!! These sinners have had a lifetime of being introduced to God and denying Him. God therefore is not giving them clues by yanking us before the Tribulation. Revelations and Paul specifies there will be a GREAT DELUSION in the end days. And yanking 2 billion people or those who belong to churches would not be part of a GREAT DELUSION, it would be a key sign for unbelievers. And this IS NOT WHAT GOD IS GOING TO DO, GIVE THE LAST DAY SINNERS ANY CLUES!!