FighterforJC

It is certainly not God's intention for us to be so busy parsing out what might happen at the end of time that we have neither the energy or the courage to spread the gospel. Let me ask this: if our position on eschatology doesn't determine our eternal destination, why is it "huge and important?" The short answer is, it is not. I submit that endlessly debating eschatology is in part an avoidance behavior that wastes time, God's time. Only one thing determines our eternal destination. Does that mean that everything else is not important? I think our Lord's return IS huge and important. The book of Revelation promises a reward for those who learn and understand the book. I doubt that it wastes "God's time." I don't think that spreading the Gospel and trying to understand the end times are mutually exclusive.

I posted this last year I think, it's probably buried somewhere, but to those who haven't read: There are several ways for a happy marriage to go bad. Adultery is probably as bad as it gets, but there are other pitfalls that might not necessarily lead to infidelity but could be just as detrimental to your marriage. I'm talking about that snake who wants to slither his way into your marriage, not with an adulterous heart but with the intent of becoming the authority who will ultimately call the shots in your marriage. While I'm sure both man and woman could be capable of such a thing, we'll focus on the male version of this particular snake. You know the type. This guy is not in a committed relationship of his own or is in a bad one, and gets his thrills and purpose in life by meddling in other people's business. This is the guy who spends his time desperately trying to detect any sign of weakness in your marriage, and then formulates his plan of attack around that weakness. His method revolves around trying to get the couple to disagree on anything, regardless of how insignificant that thing may be; a favorite color, favorite fast food, anything at all. Once he successfully incites a disagreement between the two, then he can move on to the next step. He will dilligently look for a private moment with the woman either in a phone conversation or even during the precious seconds that the husband walks out of the living room to go to the bathroom. A few moments is all he would need to inject his poison. It will be subtle and could be disguised as a simple question of how things are going in general. How the wife answers that question could be very crucial. Once any negative comment about life in general comes out of that woman's lips, she has entered into a binding contract with this guy that makes him officially a confidant of some capacity, which is 99% of his goal. This man will elevate himself as the one who has the answers. He will do everything in his power to develop his relationship with the wife and make her answer to HIM, not her husband. He wants to be in the position of authority, who the husband will be held accountable by. Here are some simple and very basic practices that can go a long way in protecting your marriage from such a person. 1) ACT AS A SINGLE UNIT- Do not fall into the trap of disagreeing in front of this devil, no matter how insignificant the disagreement is. Even if you have to LIE, you MUST stand your ground and not give this weasel a foothold on anything. Disagree with your spouse some other time, in private. 2) NEVER FORM ANY TYPE OF BOND WITH THIS MAN- This man will do anything to form a common bond with the wife, even if that common bond benefits the husband on the surface (plan a birthday party for him). Once that bond is formed, he would've accomplished his evil intentions. 3) DO NOT GRANT THIS MAN PRIVATE TIME- When he tries to speak in a low tone as to keep the conversation private, particularly for those brief moments where the husband has to leave the room, answer in a LOUD voice, even repeating his question or comment out loud if necessary, making it clear that you have no interest whatsoever in entering into any form of intimacy or personal relationship with him. Do not take or return his phone calls. A man has no business calling another man's wife unless the husband has given this man permission. 4) COMPLETELY SEVER ANY TIES WITH THIS MAN- Regardless of what you might've shared in the past or what help this man has been. By becoming a weasel, this man has negated every good thing he has ever done for you. Your marriage is the first priority and anything that undermines it should be cut off permanently.

Why? I never intended for this thread to turn into a debate, but to answer your question, my small brain understands the pre-trib view and IMHO is consistent with God's character as revealed to us in the Bible.

Personally, I'm a pre-trib rapture kind of guy. I know that there are scholars 1000 times smarter than me who hold differing views and can present the most convincing arguments based on Scripture. But one thing I do notice is that each view has its own spirit, perhaps it is one way to discern what view is correct. Mainly I've noticed that post-trib is a stand of arrogance, usually looking down on those who are pre-tribbers. They view pre-tribbers as not only unintelligent, but that they are looking for the "easy way out," unlike the post tribbers who are ready to roll up their sleeves, take it on the chin and fight in the trenches. They tend to accuse pre-tribbers of being daydreamers who are just "wasting time" and are being lazy.

It just makes me wonder, I know that one's stand on the end times does not determine one's eternal destination. But why is the church so divided when it comes to eschatology? I can understand how one denomination will differ from another when it comes to things like what type of worship music should be played or how one should dress up for Sunday, but why are we so divided regarding something as huge and important as eschatology? Is it God's intention? Aren't we all led by the same Spirit?

Wrong. The crime you all complain about is 'adultery'. Adultery is NOt committed where the former spouse was put away for fornication. So you are in error. Uhm, no. YOU are in error, thank you. You obviously are a liberal/feminist, but it's okay, to each his own, I suppose. YOU are the moral center. Have a nice day!

I'm a guy, I COMPLETELY agree with you. Of course, I see myself as an exception. Doesn't that lead you to believe that there are others out there like you? Seriously...you're not the only exception. Captain Obvious, I said I see myself as AN exception, not THE exception. You're welcome.

You are arguing from perhaps experience and know of people with "amazing gifts and ministry." but you cannot contend with the teaching of Scriptures that divorce is wrong, God said "I HATE divorce," and Paul made it clear that a person who re-marries while their ex spouse is still living, is in adultery. Your story proves NOTHING. TBN is filled with heretics, and yet those people are "blessed" with riches and prosperity, and they definitely display "amazing gifts" as well. Heck there are drug dealers and pimps that are "blessed," I suppose that proves biblical teaching to be wrong about fornication and drug use. YOU are so unbelievable! you are obviously ignoring the rest of my posts, especially what Christ said, what is it like to contradict Christ? Matthew 19 v9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultry. It's okay, I'm sure the god you created in your own image fully agrees with you!

You are arguing from perhaps experience and know of people with "amazing gifts and ministry." but you cannot contend with the teaching of Scriptures that divorce is wrong, God said "I HATE divorce," and Paul made it clear that a person who re-marries while their ex spouse is still living, is in adultery. Your story proves NOTHING. TBN is filled with heretics, and yet those people are "blessed" with riches and prosperity, and they definitely display "amazing gifts" as well. Heck there are drug dealers and pimps that are "blessed," I suppose that proves biblical teaching to be wrong about fornication and drug use.

I realize that you did not say that. What I am saying is that threads like this encourage a stereotype to exist. The stereotype that Christians who have been divorced/remarried are second-class Christians, won't go to heaven, can't be used in the ministry and are supposed to be burdened with guilt and shame for the rest of their lives. That is what a thread like this engenders. What comes out of it, comes out of it. But this is a real issue in the church and needs to be addressed somewhere. For every divorcee whose feelings get hurt by these kinds of posts, there is another who will learn from them and not take the same path.

Then how are we supposed to interpret this little gem: How is a statement like this edifying to anyone? Not to mention that it's patently false. But we are asked to be civil and respectful in our replies at the same time. It's really hard to be civil and respectful when someone wants to knock your slats out. I don't advocate divorce. It's painful, horrible, and it hurts everyone involved, no matter what the circumstances. But those of us who have been divorced do not have a scarlet letter branded on our forheads. Hey I didn't type that one. No, divorcees should not be branded with the scarlet letter, but they should be branded, period. Just Kidding.

If you're single, the solution will be to find a mate, unless you're not interested. Even Adam experienced loneliness, despite the fact that he had direct access to God.

I'm not calling you a hypocrite. I'm saying, as I have always said, that all of us have not-so-pretty things in our lives that we don't want to see the light of day, but there are people who want to post threads like this one in the guise of 'education' when what they are really doing is pointing a finger, judging, and trying to feel better about themselves in the process. It is very easy to draw a line in the sand, and say "God hates divorce. Don't do it." when you have never been divorced. It is easy to say "hang in there" when you have never been abused by a spouse, or had one try to kill you. The main problem is this: Those of us who have been divorced and re-married get a little tire of constantly being told that we have some kind of taint on us that just won't wash off no matter what we do. We are supposed to walk around with our heads hung down in shame because we can just never again quite measure up to those who have never been divorced. I hate to burst their bubble, but that is a bogus belief. Sin is sin and everyone has some in their life. One may lie, the other may be divorced. Doesn't matter, sin is sin, and we all fall short. So I don't hang my head in shame, and I never will. I don't think anyone's telling the divorcees/remarry-ers on these boards to hang their heads low and walk in shame. What's done is done, but to advocate it is something else. Going back to the original topic... Is divorce permissible? Sometimes. Is it okay for the divorced to remarry? After the ex spouse is dead. What about those who have already remarried while their ex is still alive? That's between them and God, there's forgiveness, of course.

adultry is the only one mentioned in scripture. i'll leave the debate over what constitutes adultry to someone else. my understanding of scripture is that adultry is sexual infidelity. that being said, i will readily admit that if i were being beaten on a regular basis and felt my life was in danger, i'd run for my life and let God deal with me later, right or wrong. I agree with you 100%. But still, you can't remarry until the guy's dead. mmmm, i'm not denying that you shouldn't remarry. but can't? that implies that a christian who commits the sin of an unbiblical divorce is not capable of repenting and being FORGIVEN until the spouse is dead. you sure you want to go there? note: i am NOT saying, in any way, shape, or form, that a christian should ever commit a sin with the "i'll be forgiven' escape clause in the back of their mind. i accepted Christ as my saviour at the ripe old age of 7. i wasn't living my life for him at the time of my first marriage or its subsequent divorce, but i WAS a christian. thank God my relationship with Christ has been restored, and i am no longer under the bondage of my past sins. You "can" do whatever you please. But yes, it very much sounds like you're carrying the "I'll be forgiven escape clause." Which is a good testimony of our sick and twisted and depraved heart condition, even as Christians. We all need a savior. well since you're making such a bold assumption, it sounds as though you're referring to me as having a sick, twisted, and depraved heart condition. you're wrong. i never used the 'i'll be forgiven' escape clause, and it should never be anyone's mentality. i spent the following ten years after my divorce drawing close to God and allowing HIM to be my husband. HE saw fit to bring mark into my life for the purpose of marriage.... and had it been up to my standards, i'd have never chosen mark for myself. No really, I'm just making a general statement. Not calling you anything. Everything hapens as ordained by God from before the foundations of the world, including wrong or sinful acts. Heck, God allowed the murder of His own Son, and the best thing came out of it. I don't doubt at all that God had a wonderful purpose that worked through your initial disobedience.