Sir Gareth Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 540 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/11/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1980 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? He only died for 3 days and knew that He would be resurrected. Yes it was a horrible way to die but no more so than the deaths of billions of others who died permanently. I don't understand why Christians keep making this out to be some big sacrifice. The whole propsition that His being killed somehow absolves us of blame for our actions is also absurd. I don't see scapegoating to be either just or moral, that it would be used by an allegedly absolutely just and absolutely moral God is ludicrous. The great sacrafice wasn't just his death, it was the fact that Jesus Christ, who from the begining had been one with God, suddenly severed his connection to the Father, He was totally cut off from the divine power of God and went into the depths of hell to leave sin in the grave. And even knowing you'll come back does not make a sacrafice easier. When a husband has to leave his wife and kids behind on business trips it doesn't make it any easier to say goodbye because he knows he'll be back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 22, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? He only died for 3 days and knew that He would be resurrected. Yes it was a horrible way to die but no more so than the deaths of billions of others who died permanently. I don't understand why Christians keep making this out to be some big sacrifice. The whole propsition that His being killed somehow absolves us of blame for our actions is also absurd. I don't see scapegoating to be either just or moral, that it would be used by an allegedly absolutely just and absolutely moral God is ludicrous. Your denial is blasphemy N.C. I pray that you will come to the Truth before you stand before Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbleseeker Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 519 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/11/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/28/1980 Share Posted October 22, 2009 I wouldnt want to stone you. My only want is for you to come to the knowledge of Jesus Christ in your life. Jesus died as many thousand others at that time at th hands of the Romans he was hung beside two other common criminals. His sacrifice was not just about the physical death of his body, but about the sin that he bore to cleanse mankind, and make all who believe on him sons of God. Now as far as Jesus taking are sins, and how that all worked is a mystery, yet one needs faith to be a Christian. You will never understand how Christians are by questioning everything and trying to figure it out. It is only when you let go and just believe that light will be given to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Durnan Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,782 Content Per Day: 0.36 Reputation: 49 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/14/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted October 22, 2009 I have zero against frogs, decided or undecided! I also possess everlasting life right now in that I have passed from death to life in Christ Jesus. I used to be in the Kingdom of Darkness but now reside in the Kingdom of Light! AMEN & AMEN! John 3:16 & John 5:24 are so beautiful words! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Elly Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 415 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 15 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/31/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/02/1945 Share Posted October 22, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? I never asked him to. Just because someone does something for someone else (without asking them beforehand) doesn't mean they owe that person anything. Well, at least you are being honest about your feelings in a way I can understand. God is a gentleman, he will not force anything on you. None of us need to defend God, though maybe we have many times in previous posts. God is all powerful, he is perfectly capable of defending himself. No, I am going to take myself out of the way and let God be God. Just because you don't believe, doesn't mean it isn't so. PS You didn't ask your parents to be born did you? Should you have asked beforehand? No, you are very glad you are alive and normally people appreciate being taken care of. So you "owe" them thankfulness that you are here. That kind of kicks a hole in your logic a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Gareth Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 540 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/11/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1980 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? He only died for 3 days and knew that He would be resurrected. Yes it was a horrible way to die but no more so than the deaths of billions of others who died permanently. I don't understand why Christians keep making this out to be some big sacrifice. The whole propsition that His being killed somehow absolves us of blame for our actions is also absurd. I don't see scapegoating to be either just or moral, that it would be used by an allegedly absolutely just and absolutely moral God is ludicrous. Your denial is blasphemy N.C. I pray that you will come to the Truth before you stand before Him. Is it really blasphemy? Would you like to stone me? Until you can treat others respectfully, I am done with you. Casting pearls before swine is not a hobby i like to partake in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Gareth Posted October 22, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 540 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/11/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1980 Author Share Posted October 22, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? He only died for 3 days and knew that He would be resurrected. Yes it was a horrible way to die but no more so than the deaths of billions of others who died permanently. I don't understand why Christians keep making this out to be some big sacrifice. The whole propsition that His being killed somehow absolves us of blame for our actions is also absurd. I don't see scapegoating to be either just or moral, that it would be used by an allegedly absolutely just and absolutely moral God is ludicrous. Your denial is blasphemy N.C. I pray that you will come to the Truth before you stand before Him. Is it really blasphemy? Would you like to stone me? Until you can treat others respectfully, I am done with you. Casting pearls before swine is not a hobby i like to partake in. It was a joke. Besides, the Bible clearly states that all those who work on the Sabbath should be put to death. Are you going to kill millions of Americans? No. So its hard to take blasphemy seriously as well. We are no longer held to the law if we have taken the free gift of salvation offered by Jesus Christ. The sabbath was made for man and not man for the sabbath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted October 31, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2009 PS You didn't ask your parents to be born did you? Should you have asked beforehand? No, you are very glad you are alive and normally people appreciate being taken care of. So you "owe" them thankfulness that you are here. That kind of kicks a hole in your logic a bit. Birth is natural and has nothing to do with this. And parents are connected to us either genetically or environmentally. I didn't know Jesus. Maybe I would not have even liked the guy if I lived back then. For that reason, just because he died (and he had to die) for sins of others, doesn't mean I should be grateful. Especially if it doesn't affect me now. It IS going to affect you, Christopher. I pray that you accept Jesus' gift at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted October 31, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2009 How can we not love him since he gave his lives for us? He only died for 3 days and knew that He would be resurrected. Yes it was a horrible way to die but no more so than the deaths of billions of others who died permanently. I don't understand why Christians keep making this out to be some big sacrifice. The whole propsition that His being killed somehow absolves us of blame for our actions is also absurd. I don't see scapegoating to be either just or moral, that it would be used by an allegedly absolutely just and absolutely moral God is ludicrous. Your denial is blasphemy N.C. I pray that you will come to the Truth before you stand before Him. Is it really blasphemy? Would you like to stone me? No, of course not. Stoning is only carried out by muslims in this day and age. You don't have to answer to any mortal for blasphemy, N.C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UndecidedFrog Posted October 31, 2009 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 2 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,063 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 15 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/02/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2009 (edited) DISCLAIMER: I am not a christian. My opinions are my own. You do not have to accept them if you dislike them. Dear MorningGlory, You said: Stoning is only carried out by muslims in this day and age. That is true if you limit your description to actual rock throwing. However, right here in the USA, we do have some recent examples of some pretty barbaric punishment meted out by some people. President Obama recently signed into law the Hate Crimes Prevention Act, officially named for Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. From Wiki: The Act is named after two victims of bias-motivated crimes in the United States, Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Matthew Shepard was a student who was tortured and murdered in 1998 near Laramie, Wyoming because he was perceived to be gay. His killers were not charged under hate crime laws because, at the time, the hate crime law in Wyoming did not recognize gay people as a suspect class. James Byrd, Jr. was an African-American man who was tied to a truck by two known white supremacists, dragged from it, and decapitated in Jasper, Texas in 1998. Similarly, there was no hate crimes law in Texas at the time. The murders and subsequent trials brought national and international attention to the desire to amend U.S. hate crime legislation at both the state and federal levels. This law will hopefully deter some people from perpetrating hate crimes against perceived homosexuals, even though the christian bible claims homosexuality is an abomination. Regards, UF Edited October 31, 2009 by UndecidedFrog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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