Does Science Prove God Exists?

[EricH]

I do not speak nor do I read ancient Hebrew but I have had Jewish teachers that do and I have been seated under Christian Teachers that do and the style of writing for the first chapter of Chapter one has been found consistent with the Egyptian and Hebrew influences Moses would have experienced.

I just thought it necessary to point out that many leading biblical scholars argue, from the Bible, that Moses cannot have been the author of any biblical texts. However, as this thread does not ask whether Moses wrote any part of scripture I will not peruse this line of thought at this time. A thread examining the issue might be worthwhile as so many here seem not to be aware of the details of this research.

The theory you are are articulating as called the documentary hypothesis or JEDP theory. It has been around for a while and is actually falling out of favor due to the inconsistencies and presuppositions required to hold it.

[EricH]

More than Evangelicals are moving away from it. Largely because in an attempt to read modern linguistic concepts back onto an ancient text, they destroy some of the linguistic characteristics that are native to ancient Hebrew ( like breaking up a chiasm midstream).

[th1bill]

But you will agree you did not come to that conclusion based on science. The thread asks if science proves that God exists. Your decision to come to God is faith based, not science based. Science did not prove the existence of God for you. Am I right?

Actually Marsh, you're almost right. As an atheist I embraced the Theory of the Big Bang and the Theory of Evolution. At the age of twenty articles were published the Evolution was no longer a theory but had become fact. I dug deeply into the evidence and found that it was conjecture based on a couple of bones that were quickly discredited.

Science is the investigation of known happenings or circumstances about us. Therefore a man or woman need not be a 10 year scholar of Oxford to do scientific work and investigate a phenomena they have witnessed. In Sept. of '66 i found my best friend blown into several pieces by a mortar in his chest and the next morning as I, an atheist, seeking something to kill or to curse, cursed the very God I did not serve and chose not to believe in. God spoke to me!

I spent the next 23+ years running from Him and at the same time investigating Him. I spent twenty-three years checkin or investigating God. I'm not a published o recognized scientist but I scientifically investigated and finally went to the Book of God and followed the directions there and proved God. Many Christian scientists have had a similar experience.

[EricH]

There are a couple of logical fallacies in your approach. One is appealing to the length of time a theory has been put forward. The other is finding people who used to disagree with the theory, but now buy into it. Neither demonstrates it to be true or false. The real issue is does the hypothesis stand up under scrutiny? The documentary hypothesis does not. When a hypothesis demands that different authors write half sentences across generations, and when the theory ends up destroying the original literary form.

I understand that the circles in which read agree with you. That does not surprise me. What you have yet to do is address the weaknesses pointed out by a large number of non- evangelical scholar.

[th1bill]

Finding your friend like that is certainly a terrible thing. The worst I've observed was of a young boy, perhaps four years old, being hit by a car at maybe 40 or 50 mi/hr. That image stayed with me for a very long time.

I don't understand, though, why you would curse a god you didn't believe in. You wouldn't, for example, think to curse Zeus in such a situation. So why curse God? It almost sounds as if part of you still believed, believed enough to have anger toward Him. Is that what you mean in saying God spoke to you. At that moment did you come to believe once again?

I can understand you concern here, it shook my very foundation from two directions at once when this happened to me. Like yourself I did not understand what had driven me to curse God and I did not find the answer for about twenty-five years. I found the answer in Romans !:20-23. I can not expect you to understand but in those verses the saved see that God has given every man innate knowledge of Himself at birth. I had read these verses before the Holy Spirit indwelt me and they did not say that to me.

One other thing. You say you chose not to worship or believe in God. Most atheists argue that it was never a matter of choice on their part, but rather found one day that they no longer believed. Even for myself it was never a matter of choosing not to believe, but rather quite literally realizing one day that the belief in God just wasn't there anymore.

I spent a number of years searching as well, but came up empty handed. Unlike you I only found in the Bible what I thought was evidence against God existing.

I'm sorry, I should have read further before giving the answer, it belonged here. Could or would you tell me the evidence you believe you found?

[stephobell1]

Amen!!!!

I love the way people are found/ and find God. Sometimes its just so weird, and unimaginable, but yet it still happens!!!

God is amazing at this stuff don't ya think!!!!.

Oh, I get so excited we I read and hear about people being saved and coming in the family of Christ, and hearing that he found Christ through science, it is just so amazing.

PRAISE THE LORD

[th1bill]

I don't understand, though, why you would curse a god you didn't believe in. You wouldn't, for example, think to curse Zeus in such a situation. So why curse God?

I can understand you concern here, it shook my very foundation from two directions at once when this happened to me. Like yourself I did not understand what had driven me to curse God and I did not find the answer for about twenty-five years. I found the answer in Romans !:20-23. I can not expect you to understand but in those verses the saved see that God has given every man innate knowledge of Himself at birth. I had read these verses before the Holy Spirit indwelt me and they did not say that to me.

I have been directed before to this passage in Romans. I have always found it wanting. Verse 23 says it all. It is referring to those who worship gods in human or animal form. Jews, remember did not worship images, not even of God. This may be telling us to not make images even of Christ, as many Christians like to do. Verse 20 is not accurate. God is not clearly seen; this has been the whole problem, especially with atheists in the modern world. Science explains so much about the natural world that God becomes invisible. God truly is visible only to those who believe, so it is not surprising that this passage did not mean anything till after you became a believer.

I still question why you would have cursed God. How can you become angry with something that does not exist? It seems to me only someone who believes would do that. As I said, you would never have thought to curse Zeus. Could God have meant something to you, even though you were unaware of it?

Could or would you tell me the evidence you believe you found?

It wasn't so much that I found evidence in the Bible that God didn't exist as I found reasons for thinking the accounts of God could not be real. I think especially there was a conflict between my Christian view of God as a Being of love, and the violence and killing and cruel punishments throughout the Old Testament. God, in the OT, really does promote killing, slavery, and barbaric punishments. These things are not complementary of a god of love. It got me thinking that these actions were probably common place in cultures of that era, and that God was likely presented as supporting the actions that the people who worshiped Him believed in. I came to see God as being used as the justification for all that violence. The OT gave me a lot to think about.

As a teacher of the Gospel, what I see is that you just missed the boat. God, like the man created in His image is a multi-faceted being and while it is true that God is love, He is also judgment and there is wrath fr the unjust. The thing that folks have such a problem coming to grips with is that the Bible is what we term the Old Testament. Then we have the four gospel accounts of the Christ followed by the best commentary on the life application of the Bible ever written. Taking the New Testament and uncoupling it from the Old is tantamount to uncoupling the caboose from the train and loading it full of passengers for Chicago, they ain't never gonna leave Texas.

[Guest]

I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. Isaiah 42:8

>>>>>()<<<<<

.....So, no, science does not prove God, but neither does it extinguish Him;

Thank You For A Well Throughout Reply

And Truth To Tell, Jesus Never Needed Science To Reveal Himself

Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool. Isaiah 1:18

That's Why So Many Of Our Elders Were So Wise

For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:

And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:

Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me. Job 19:25-27

>>>>>*(<<<<<

and, I would like to point out, neither does evolution disprove God.

Yes Indeed And Despite Their Best Efforts The Priesthood Of The Evolutionary Mythos Has Yet To Disprove Science

O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called: 1 Timothy 6:20

And True Science Does Not Take Away From The Creation

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Romans 1:20

Nor Does It Offer Redemption

Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot: 1 Peter 1:18-19

From Sin

Of sin, because they believe not on me; John 16:9

>>>>>()<<<<<

Best Regards, Joe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

[fillmyheart]

Does Science Prove God Exists?

"I became a Christian at roughly the age of 13 or 14 and joined the First Baptist Church in Alabama," and at age 16, he became an atheist. "I decided that there was a real problem with this God stuff, that there was no convincing argument available to prove the existence of God."

Years later, the physicist came to believe again after discovering what he says is rock solid, scientific proof that God exists. "I follow science; it's always what I've done throughout my entire life."

Two comments on this:

1) The Expanding Universe Theory is only a theory; it cannot be verified.

2) If you believe in God (as I do), there's no need to "prove" that God exists. If God exists in your heart, who can tell you otherwise?

[fillmyheart]

God is not sometime we joke or make fun of he is marcyful,peaceful,loving father but remember one thing he is the God of war and well wait till the right time to judge.