What Is Judging?

[Isaiah 6:8]

I personally think that many people get reproving, judging, criticizing and discernment mixed up. *Edit* So I wrote this to try to help clarify this as (Hopefully) a teaching tool *edit*

This is due in part to the English language. You we call it good “Judgment” when you actually have good discernment. You can give a very critical looking over in some situations which is a good thing, such as the engines on an airplane before takeoff. This again is more of a discernment thing then a judging thing or a criticizing thing. As for reproof I looked up its meaning, .the first one is. To criticize or correct, esp. gently: to reprove a pupil for making a mistake. Key word Gently.

Lets start when Jesus tells us to Judge.

John 7:22

Moses therefore gave you circumcision (not that it is from Moses, but from the fathers), and you circumcise a man on the Sabbath. 23 If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath, so that the law of Moses should not be broken, are you angry with Me because I made a man completely well on the Sabbath? 24 Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

This would appear that the Word was allowing judgment, but I would put forth it would be more discernment. Jesus Tells us how to rightly judge or discern.

Matthew 12:33 “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit. 34 Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart[g] brings forth good things, and an evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth evil things. 36 But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment. 37 For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

This comes after Jesus tells us not to judge.

Matthew 7:

[Isaiah 6:8]

I thought I already posted this! I guess I did only as reply not as an actual topic! oops!

[Guest LadyC]

i just woke up, or i'd probably look up the verses that someone else will post later. and i'm sure someone else will post them. the passage where God tells us we are to judge our brothers within the body of Christ, but that we are not to judge those who are unbelievers.

even in my just waking up state of mind though, i would look them up IF.... if they changed a single word of what you posted. but they don't. because the passage i'm talking about still is telling us to judge righteously, not self-righteously. according to God's word, not according to what we read into it.

i am totally with you, isaiah. i see a whole lot of that selfish, holier than thou judging on these boards.

and as much as i'd like to think "not me!", i may very well have been guilty a time or two. i hope if i have been, someone will tell me. and i don't mean about topics where i am judging by biblical standard (such as that i call homosexual activity to be a perversion of our sexuality... that's a common "quit judging" accusation. but that's God's judgment, not my own.) i mean the kind that is judging by my own personal opinions. if anyone sees me doing that, i do hope you'll take me aside quietly and say "hey, that's self-righteous".

but i don't believe i'll ever give anyone reason to do that.....

[EricH]

I personally think that many people get reproving, judging, criticizing and discernment mixed up.

This is due in part to the English language. You we call it good

[Isaiah 6:8]

I more said that it was the English language that had the issue, not the translation. People use the wrong definition of the word Judge, as they read it out of context, so they miss the proper usage of the word. Thank you for pointing this out!

So let me clarify...

Here are the definitions of the word Judge.

I got this http://www.merriam-webster.com

transitive verb

1 : to form an opinion about through careful weighing of evidence and testing of premises

2 : to sit in judgment on : try

3 : to determine or pronounce after inquiry and deliberation

4 : govern, rule —used of a Hebrew tribal leader

5 : to form an estimate or evaluation of; especially : to form a negative opinion about <shouldn't judge him because of his accent>

6 : to hold as an opinion : guess, think <I judge she knew what she was doing>

We tend to belive that we are called to do the third definition, that is the Lords Job. We are called to do the first one and quite often wind up doing the fifth one as Ruck pointed out, and that becomes condemnation!

Now to do the first definition

to form an opinion about through careful weighing of evidence and testing of premises.

We require discernment.

Again from the Meerriam-webster site

Main Entry: dis

[oldzimm]

If we see a fellow Christian falling and we know by the Word they are falling, then it is our duty as Christians to help them see they have stumbled. It is called accountability, the key is how you present your concern to them. Don't condemn them by yelling or pointing fingers. We all fall, so nobody is perfect and when I stumble according to the word, I would be grateful if somebody would hold me accountable, it would be easier to pick myself back up.

A good example of judging someone by opinions and not by the Word is the Church I attend. I love the Church and the members that attend there, I love going to this Church because it is so good for my spirit and they keep me accountable.

Now you might ask what is the problem then? One Sunday evening my wife and I were going to a get together with the pastor and his wife and others that were to be possible new members of the Church. That morning after the service my pastor called my wife and me to his office, he told me that he didn't want to blindside me that evening but I couldn't be a member of the Church because of an organization I belong to. I was in total disbelief, I couldn't believe they would think that way.

We went to the get together anyhow and we were handed literature on the beliefs of the Church. We went over the literature as a group and everything in the literature was backed up by the Word of God, that was until we got to the very last item and that was about the organization I belong to and there were no verses to back it up.They were judging the organization by hearsay.

We still attend this Church because I love them, I just can't be a member and that is okay. I'm still a member of Church, that Church is Christianity and Jesus leads the way.

[~candice~]

Matthew 7:3 And why do you look at the speck in your brother

[georgedrw81]

The word means to evaluate.

Blessings

[oldzimm]

The word means to evaluate.

Blessings

Maybe by Webster..................Nope not even by Webster. To a Christian the "Word" is God.

[Isaiah 6:8]

Matthew 7:3 And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the speck from your eye’; and look, a plank is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

...

Matthew 18:15 “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that ‘by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ 17 And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

...

I have seen a lot of selfishness on the boards in judging, and a lot of Holier then Thou Judging on the forums. This is what we are not to do. The attitude of a few persons I have seen, are consistent. They are consistently on the attack judging others with a holier then thou attitude, one that says “You are in the wrong because I would never do that!” not one of true loving a sinning brother, but a self righteous Pharisaical attitude. They also often jump to conclusions with little to no facts to back them up and start quoting scriptures with a tone that reminds me of the one the pharisees took. They are also very harsh and unloving in the way they put forth what they say, not loving or gently. They also then start to justify their attitude with "I am allowed to and called to judge!" They feel the need to defend their attitude! This is not Biblical or right.

OK, I'm going to take a slightly different viewpoint here.

All of us are tainted by sin, and every now and then, post with a judgmental attitude. None of us get to boast that we have maintained a perfect standard when it comes to our posts. We do need to recognise our own judgmental attitude [at times] and that plank in our own eye. I acknowledge that I have occasionally posted while tired or angry or frustrated and the grace of God has been missing.

When I fall, I expect to be called out on it. I have fallen in love with the discipline of the Lord [often through His saints] and by it I know that I am one of His children, loved, and not tossed aside. But I'd like that rebuke in private. Send a PM or an email. As pointed out in the scripture above, these issues need to be taken behind the scenes, one on one at first.

Often times, what appears to be judging, is just someone else's poorly expressed point of view. Generally speaking a PM asking for clarification is all that is required, and we musn't jump to the conclusion that someone is judging. We also shouldn't mistaken a passion for the topic, with judgmentalism towards those who disagree.

Perhaps, if we recognise "a lot of selfishness on the boards in judging, and a lot of Holier then Thou Judging on the forums" we should take those words of Matthew 18 to heart, and either approach the person one on one, or let it slide. Speaking in general about judgmental attitudes [as we are doing here] reveals a problem but I'm not sure it makes biblical steps towards the solution.

Izzy, it sounds like you have a few specific people in mind [i'm reading this: "The attitude of a few persons I have seen, are consistent."]. Have you thought about prayerfully approaching them one on one? If we aren't willing to go to them one-one-one, neither should we "tell it to the chuch". I realise you haven't outed anyone in particular...

I guess I just feel a bit awkward about this topic in general. A judgmental attitude within this body has been identified, but yet not approached from a biblical point of view. I can't quite put my finger on it or express what I mean the right way, but it just feels a bit off.

I agree Andy, I have been judgmental as well, in the past and this is also a reminder to myself to refrain form that attitude. I did try to make a point that I was not sinless in this. This topic was an reply I made, with some changes, on the subject of judgement. Now I wrote this thread originally about 3 months ago, and I do not remember why I added the last part but I do remember having a few people in mind honestly, I don't even remember who it was. (Was not you) I vaguely remember adding that last paragraph in frustration, and you know me well enough to pick up on that! I remember being attacked and judged on something I did not say, or someone took what I said, misquoted me and judged me on a misquote.

The reason I posted this as a topic, was not to be pointing out a Judgmental attitude on the board, (although it raises its head from time to time, and admittedly from myself at times!) But to have a Biblical basis on what right judging is, as a guide of sorts. I will edit that last paragraph a bit, as I know I added that much later out of frustration, and honestly just cut and paste that from a file I keep. I had a funny feeling that I needed to edit that, but I was on my way (Finally) to bed and did not get around to it! I agree if someone is being judgmental, best to pm them and clarify, then deal with them in a loving way.