~candice~ Posted June 21, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 955 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 11,318 Content Per Day: 1.89 Reputation: 448 Days Won: 33 Joined: 12/16/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 But I also don't think this inability should stop us from studying prophecy as part of His Word. Completely agree! However, I have come to believe we too often are asking the wrong questions and looking for the wrong things. That's all. I think we should have a multifaceted approach to studying prophecy. It's not just about piecing together a timeline (I know we have agreed upon this before ) but also to learn the nature of God, and to be able to recognise His hand at work in our current environment. All are important, IMO. I do want to know on a very practical level how to respond biblically to the middle east crisis, and how to defend my stance against those who do not believe in the Lord as I do. While we are on the subject of prophecy, check this out: Mat 22:34 But hearing that He had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees were gathered together. Mat 22:35 Then one of them, a lawyer, asked, tempting Him and saying, Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the Law? Mat 22:37 Jesus said to him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind. Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment. Mat 22:39 And the second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets. You know I've always glossed over this before. How are 'the prophets' summarised with those two commandments? I believe this kinda ties into what you are saying... care to elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted June 21, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted June 21, 2011 I think we should have a multifaceted approach to studying prophecy. It's not just about piecing together a timeline (I know we have agreed upon this before ) but also to learn the nature of God, and to be able to recognise His hand at work in our current environment. All are important, IMO. I do want to know on a very practical level how to respond biblically to the middle east crisis, and how to defend my stance against those who do not believe in the Lord as I do. Amen to that! As far as the 'in that day" - arguments can go either way for it all happening at once, or not...so that's why I tend to believe there's something else we should be looking for in that. Not sure yet what that is, though. You know I've always glossed over this before. How are 'the prophets' summarised with those two commandments? I believe this kinda ties into what you are saying... care to elaborate? The words of the prophets, although proclaiming the future, were more about calling the people back to God in the here and now rather than foretelling the future for satisfying our desire to know the future. Make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~candice~ Posted June 21, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 955 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 11,318 Content Per Day: 1.89 Reputation: 448 Days Won: 33 Joined: 12/16/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 The prophets were about forth-telling and fore-knowing. I get the forth-telling aspect, but the fore-knowing aspect and how it ties into Matt 22:40 I'm a bit shaky on. I see the over arching principle that loving God and others will put us in good steed regardless of the upcoming prophetic events, perhaps that is all it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizzdy Posted June 21, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 173 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,911 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 212 Days Won: 10 Joined: 03/21/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted June 21, 2011 I'm just wondering... IF a Palestinian state is recognised in september and fights for Jerusalem as a capital, could it be a fulfilment of this prophesy? Or are we not there yet? Zec 12:2 Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling to all the peoples all around, and it shall also be against Judah in the siege against Jerusalem. Zec 12:3 And in that day I will make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all peoples. All who lift it shall be slashed, and all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it. I do not understand why Judah would be at war against Jerusalem. "I will make Jerusalem a cup that will stagger the surrounding peoples. Even Judah will be caught up in the seize of Jerusalem. When that day comes, I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all peoples. All who try to life it will hurt themselves, and all the earth's nations will be massed against her." Thats from the CJB, I love this translation it shows sometimes clearer what is written, especially in the Hebrew. Jerusalem has been and is most definately now that heavey stone for all nations, just look at all the countries, leaders who have tried to solve the 'middle east' problem, that is the cup of trembling. Judah, is caught up in it all, they have been either willing to give up land for peace or stood staunchly for its rights, today we see the entire world, almost every single leader of every single country trying to 'fix' things and turning Israel out as the divider. Of course thats nothing new at all its been that way since those ancient Israelites came to claim the land given to them so long before. The phrase, 'in that day' usually refers to the end of the age the time of the great tribulation and then the day He comes again. God gives us all these sign posts, His set apart days etc., to know when things will be happening and to always be prepared, of course we can be prepared without knowing any prophecy yet if it wasn't important He would not have given us prophets to show us these things. shalom, Mizz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~candice~ Posted June 21, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 955 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 11,318 Content Per Day: 1.89 Reputation: 448 Days Won: 33 Joined: 12/16/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 Right Mizz, and let's not forget v1. 1 The [a]burden of the word of the LORD concerning Israel. Thus declares the LORD who (A)stretches out the heavens, (B)lays the foundation of the earth, and (C)forms the spirit of man within him, A lovely reminder, before reading of these events . Frames it just lovely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mizzdy Posted June 22, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 173 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,911 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 212 Days Won: 10 Joined: 03/21/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted June 22, 2011 I think we should have a multifaceted approach to studying prophecy. It's not just about piecing together a timeline (I know we have agreed upon this before ) but also to learn the nature of God, and to be able to recognise His hand at work in our current environment. All are important, IMO. I do want to know on a very practical level how to respond biblically to the middle east crisis, and how to defend my stance against those who do not believe in the Lord as I do. Amen to that! As far as the 'in that day" - arguments can go either way for it all happening at once, or not...so that's why I tend to believe there's something else we should be looking for in that. Not sure yet what that is, though. You know I've always glossed over this before. How are 'the prophets' summarised with those two commandments? I believe this kinda ties into what you are saying... care to elaborate? The words of the prophets, although proclaiming the future, were more about calling the people back to God in the here and now rather than foretelling the future for satisfying our desire to know the future. Make sense? I agree that the prophets were speaking to the people of the time, its history, yet within that are things that have not come to pass as well as pertaining to the generations that will be part of the end of the age. I see duality in prophecies. And your right its not about our desire but His desire that His called out ones study His whole word, if we do not we will not recognize the 'seasons, signs'. Some spend way too much trying to be correct about it all though. Candice things hang on the law and the prophets, at least in part in my thinking, in that the way we are to walk rightly before Him is layed out in His Torah and the prophets show the consequences of walking in both ways. The two go together, at least I think they do. shalom, Mizz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollinTHUNDER Posted June 23, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,986 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 433 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/23/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 23, 2011 However, I have come to believe we too often are asking the wrong questions and looking for the wrong things. I whole heartedly agree, nebula. The times we're in remind me of something the apostle Paul said: For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. (2 Tim.4:3-4) Many of our so-called prophecy experts are stringing things along and jumping to conclusions based off of mere assumptions. I had to untangle a lot of these in my book. I have not gone to seminary, but I have a strong hunch that many are being deceived in them. They all come out teaching the same misconceptions, it seems. I think they are teaching them what they should teach and keeping them inside the box. But as you pointed out, it seems we have a much better handle when we look from outside the box. This is where we are able to see a lot more possibilities, instead of looking for things to happen that never will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny balerio Posted July 4, 2011 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 57 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/04/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted July 4, 2011 Neb, very few people had the Holy Spirit upon them back then, we have Him dwelling within us now. The masses back then also probably couldn't sit and read and study scripture for themselves, and would hear it read once every 4 years (is that right?). We however are filled with His Spirit and have His Word to eat from. I'm not saying we would have gotten it perfect, but the situations are really hard to compare like that. Actually, that isn't what I asked. If you were now to take all of those Scriptures, based on what you are reading, would you have predicted what actually unfolded? It's one thing to put the pieces together after the effect and see how they fit - and even then it is still mind boggling. For example, Mary is a direct descendent of David, but not through the line of kings. Joseph, Jesus' adoptive father, is however a direct descendent of the line of kings, including the ones put under a curse to no longer have descendants on the throne. Who could have predicted this outcome? Yes, we do have Holy Spirit now, but this does not mean we all have full prophetic insight and revelation. Think about it - we can't even figure out an agreement on "the Rapture"! OK I see. It's an interesting question. The answer is no, I don't think we could write the script before it happened. But I also don't think this inability should stop us from studying prophecy as part of His Word. 2Co 3:13 And we are not like Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel could not steadfastly look to the end of the thing being done away. 2Co 3:14 (But their thoughts were blinded; for until the present the same veil remains on the reading of the old covenant, not taken away.) But this veil has been done away in Christ. 2Co 3:15 But until this day, when Moses is read, the veil is on their heart. 2Co 3:16 But whenever it turns to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away. 2Ti 2:15 Study earnestly to present yourself approved to God, a workman that does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of Truth. Rev 1:3 Blessed is the one who reads and hears the Words of this prophecy, and the ones keeping the things written in it, for the time is near. I'm just digging. Wondering whether all of Zech 12 is the one event or many, and how we can rightfully assess whether or not it has come to pass, a lot easier in hindsight I realise. x Dear Sister Candice You are like a sponge hungry for the Word of God...God bless you. The following link should give you a firm grasp of whats coming,..and it answers your question. http://prophecynewsstand.blogspot.com/2011/06/those-surrounding-israel-to-be-devoured.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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