BobTriez Posted October 6, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,478 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/23/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/11/1972 Share Posted October 6, 2004 Quote me where I said that bob. If you can, I'll give you a cookie. If not, then I think you're done. Now, do you have the integrity and fortitude to get back on the subject, or is this what I can expect from you? Ok...... First, even what is in the Bible could be false Bob. WE have to accept the fact that we could be wrong. Secondly, arrogant according to you Bob. You'd be wise to leave this discussion if you're only going to result to personal attacks, especially as a monitor. I want my cookie!!!!!! Look Joel, you said it, but it doesn't mattter ok ? I forgive you....actually it wasn't even an issue with me but I still forgive you. I'm cool & I'm leaving the discussion. Carry on though God bless, Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khristeeanos Posted October 6, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 109 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,278 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 29 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/07/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted October 6, 2004 http://www.rebuttals.cjb.net/ That is a website where you can find articles about Charles Stanley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnP Posted October 6, 2004 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 308 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/23/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/28/1950 Share Posted October 6, 2004 Called. I know that these threads tend to get heated so I have been avoiding posting anything. But you could serve to moderate your side, to pour oil onto troubled waters. I do not hesitate to correct a Calvinist when he goes too far. (Or anybody else now I think of it). If I am wrong and OSAS is true, well then we will all be together in heaven. All the children will be saved you are right in saying that. It is my belief as I have come to believe through scripture. BUT, what if OSAS is wrong? There will be alot of good people going to hell. There are good people? Sinless? No one is sinless therefore no one is good. There will be alot of good people going to hell. That is a very strange thing to say if you don't mind me saying so. Just think about it. Why take the chance? Now if I was the kind of Christian that got offended I would get offended at that. Take a chance? You judge me from a distance do you not? Just what would I be taking a chance over? The only chancy thing I do is trust that Jesus died for my sins. Only there am I out on a limb me dear. That is as far as I go in testifying about myself. Just because someone believes in OSAS does not mean they will go to hell. Please don't think I am saying that. Do not concern yourself Debbie, my assurance is beyond measure like our kin of the Reformation. There I go testifying about myself again. Ten's of thousands of our brothers and sisters were butchered for this and they passed it to me. I can take a few knocks. My parents are OSAS and I have friends that are. I know that they are going to heaven. My church is small, about twentyfive or so with as many kids. Many of the congregation have parents who are Calvinist and none of them are, their families put them off it! I've met some of their parents and can understand why in some. If any get the scriptures wrong then law rises it's head and life ends up, " ISA 28:10 For it is: Do and do, do and do, rule on rule, rule on rule; a little here, a little there." Instead of; "ISA 28:11 Very well then, with foreign lips and strange tongues God will speak to this people, ISA 28:12 to whom he said, "This is the resting place, let the weary rest"; and, "This is the place of repose"-- but they would not listen. And that is where I intend to stay and call people into God's rest from there, the Sabbath for those He calls. Peace. The rest to the weary. Instead of; ISA 28:13 So then, the word of the LORD to them will become: Do and do, do and do, rule on rule, rule on rule; a little here, a little there-- so that they will go and fall backward, be injured and snared and captured. My problem with OSAS is that alot of the time it gives people a false sense of security. I really fail to understand how trusting in Jesus can lead to a false sense of security. I don't trust in OSAS but in the One that said it. He died for my sins and will complete the work He started. That I trust, His word I trust. Alot of people walk the church aisle, say a prayer and are then told that they will never lose their salvation. So, they go do whatever they want. It just doesn't work that way. No it doesn't always. We must work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. We must perservere. We must be obedient. We must take up our cross. We must live holy and righteous lives. We must forsake all for Jesus. So then, the word of the LORD to them will become: Do and do, do and do, rule on rule, rule on rule; a little here, a little there-- so that they will go and fall backward, be injured and snared and captured. Because you do not believe Jesus died for your sins. If you believed Jesus died for your sins then what can you go to Hell for? Since Jesus did die for my sins what can God do, extract punishment twice for the same crime? You charge God with this? We do not give up our free will when we get saved. We cannot give up what does not exist. We can turn our back on Jesus. Look at Judas, he walked with Jesus and then he turned his back on Him. Look at Peter doing the same thing and getting away with it. But Judas' Father was not Peter's. Peter's Father loved him with an everlasting love like He loves us. How could our lover from the Song of Songs live without us. He loved me and gave Himself for me so that I could be with Him and He with me. Nothing gets in our way. Nothing can separate us. You have no say in it anyway. Your parents saved you. You turn your back anytime you want it is your parents that received the promise; They will live in the land I gave to my servant Jacob, the land where your fathers lived. They and their children and their children's children will live there forever, and David my servant will be their prince forever. Look at Adam and Eve, they were in a perfect enviroment and yet they CHOSE to disobey God and that resulted in death. You try to win a point but lose it because you say that you can do better than our Mother and Father, Adam and Eve, that you can do better in our enviroment than they could in their enviroment. That will be the day as they say. How does that work out? We are sinners they weren't. If you believe in OSAS and you are on fire for God and you are living in true repentance and you are obedient and have a relationship with the Father, then that is great...but too many times I see where OSAS leads to a complacent and weak Christian who eventually forsakes Christ to follow his/her own selfish desires. Thank you for your concern. I am not being sarcastic. (It might come over like that). And I have a concern for my brothers and sisters as well. That is why I am talking to you. It gives me the oppotunity to talk about Jesus and to meet many others. We should all be concerned about each other. To put others before ourselves. I am here to serve the faith of God's elect and to serve the knowledge that leads to Godliness. I believe only Calvinism can lead us out of captivity because I believe Calvinism reflects His glory and stands us on the Rock. It is scriptural and a found me out. He came for me and died for me and He says He is coming back for me and will be with me forever. Great. I believe Him. I am at the point in my walk with Christ that I know that I know that I know that I will never, ever turn my back on Jesus. My salvation is secure. There is nothing that can make me walk away from Him, not even the threat of death. So see...we can be secure in our salvation as long as we follow and obey Him. I love Him so much that I will do that. "...not even the threat of death." Peter said that be careful. I am sure about one thing. I am not sure about me. I put my trust in no man, especially myself. I know myself too well. This is all just my personal beliefs based on study of the scriptures and revelation from God. And I thank you very much for it. I think it a nice thing to do. You have also given me another oppotunity to teach my teach and for that I thank you. Philippians 3:9 and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ--the righteousness that comes from God and is by faith. I have jumped from the bridge, I have set my course, I have taken a leap and I have jumped into His arms. My prayer is that others come and do likewise. johnp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ovedya Posted October 6, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 375 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 11,400 Content Per Day: 1.44 Reputation: 125 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/30/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1971 Share Posted October 6, 2004 Just a suggestion, saints. How about we take a break from this for a while? I haven't had time to read this whole thread, but just from the last handful of replies it looks like it's getting a little too hot. Let me close it for a little while and read what's going on here. Not taking sides, mind you, I just want to see what's going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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