Christian Zionism

[Guest shiloh357]

We believe that all life is precious and Yeshua came for every person, wanting that none should perish. That perspective demands that the truth is supreme, though, and we aren't getting it from the anti-zionists (which is only another word for anti-semitic) who try to make police action of defending innocent civilians by Israel the moral equivalent of car bombs and suicide bombers from recognized terrorist organizations, like the PLO, Hamas, Hezbollah, or any of the various names used by these violent paramilitary groups

Being anti-zionist does not automatically make one anti-semitic. There are jews who are anti-zionist.

Here is but one example....there are plenty more if one cares to do the research.

http://www.jewsagain...onism/zanda.cfm

ZIONISM AND ANTI-SEMITISM

We implore and beseech our Jewish brethren to realize that the Zionists are not the saviors of the Jewish People and guarantors of their safety, but rather the instigators and original cause of Jewish suffering in the Holy Land and worldwide. The idea that Zionism and the State of “Israel” is the protector of Jews is probably the greatest hoax ever perpetrated on the Jewish People. Indeed, where else since 1945 have Jews been in such physical danger as in the Zionist state?!

Jews are enjoined by their religious laws to be loyal to the country of which they are citizens. Ever since the destruction of the holy Temple in Jerusalem and the exile of the Jewish People some two thousand years ago, we have been enjoined to be scrupulously loyal to the countries we reside in. One of the great biblical prophets, Jeremiah, in chapter 29 of his book proclaimed G-d's message to all the exiled; verse seven reads, "Seek out the welfare of the city to which I have exiled you and pray for it to the Almighty, for through its welfare will you have welfare." This has been a cornerstone of Jewish morality throughout our history to this very day.

Torah-true Jews wish to live in peace and harmony with their neighbors in every country among the community of nations, including in historic Palestine. They deplore acts and policies of violence carried out by those who, misusing the name of Israel our forefather, have substituted the ideal of chauvinist nationalism for the eternal values of the Torah, the eternal divinely bestowed inheritance of the Jewish people.

It has been the age-old intention of Zionism to intentionally stir up anti-Semitism anywhere possible, and even more commonly, to take advantage of any Jewish suffering anywhere in order to enhance its cause Indeed, hatred of Jews and Jewish suffering is the oxygen of the Zionist movement, and from the very beginning has been to deliberately incite hatred of the Jew and then, in feigned horror, use it to justify the existence of the Zionist state – this is, of course, Machiavellianism raised to the highest degree. Thus, the Zionists thrive on hatred and suffering of Jews, and seek to benefit thereby through keeping Jews in perpetual fear, causing them to ignore the true nature of Zionism, and instead to consider the Zionist state is their salvation.

Article continued at link.

Anti-Zionism is a global expression of anti-Semitism. Anti-Semitism is the denial of Jews equal rights within a given community. Anti-Zionism is the denial of Israel the right to participate as an equal member in the community of nations.

Zionism is a an ideal that had at its heart, the protection of the Jews from global persecution. The original vision was for the Jews to have their own homeland in which they could live in safety and from which they could defend their own well-being and rights as people to exist.

There are anti-Semitic Jews. Being Jewish doesn't mean one cannot be anti-Semitic. Anti-Semitism / Anti-Zionism is from the devil and is an irrational and spiritual / supernatural hatred of Jews. They are both rooted in Satan's hatred of Jews. Unfortunately, that hatred can also disguise itself in the trappings of Christian religiousity and even feign a concern about the human rights of the Palestinians.

The enemies of Zionism paint a characature of Zionists and Zionism as being anti-Arab and it simply isn't so. Here is what Zionism is:

• The National Liberation movement of the Jewish People.
  
• It is the modern expression of the ancient longing by the Jewish People to return to their land and live as a free people once again.
  
• It is the desire to secure a modern state for the Jewish nation.
  
• It is the conviction that the Jewish people have the right to live in freedom and security in its homeland.
  
• It is the determination to aid and encourage the return of any and all Jewish refugees of the Diaspora who wish to return home.
  
• It is the concern for the safety and security of that modern state, and the desire to see it strong enough to defend itself and the Jewish people as a whole from any present or future existential threat.
  

There is nothing in Zionism that can be considered racist. Nothing in the ideology of Zionism denies freedom, equality, or prosperity to any other people. However, in 1975, the U.N. declared Zionism as a racist ideology. It had very little impact, but in the year 2000 in Durban South Africa, at the U.N. Conference on Racism, the nation of Israel was singled out as the most racist nation on the planet, and the declaration of Zionism = racism was renewed.

Zionism is not racism because the Zionists supported a free and independent Palestinian state. In 1947 when the U.N. voted to create Israel, it also voted to create an Arab state in Palestine next to Israel. The Zionists accepted and voted FOR the solution. The Arabs voted against it, and declared war. Again in 2000 Israeli offered the Palestinians their nation, and they declined. Arafat walked out of the negotiations and declared a second intifada. Each time the Zionists agreed to Arab demands, they were met with more Jewish bloodshed. Yet, many Jewish people in Israel still hold out hopes that a Palestinian state will emerge and that Jew and Arab can finally live in peace. Through the treatment of its Arab citizens, may Israel soon show the world that Zionism strives for a better future.

As for the article, it is put out by a relatively small Orthodox Jewish group (made up of about 5,000 worldwide) that is notorious for not only being anti-Zionist, but of actively supporting the creation of a Palestinian state and has repeatedly supported terrorist activity that has resulted in the deaths of innocent Jewish children and the elderly, the most vulnerable members of Jewish society who have nothing to do with Israeli governmental decisions or policies. These Orthodox Jews do NOT represent the mainstream Jewish opinions on the matter. They certainly do not represent most Israeli Jews. Those who support them are as guilty as terrorists, and those who publish and post their vile material only embolden and enable further acts of terrorism.

[Elcule]

Zionism is not racism because the Zionists supported a free and independent Palestinian state. In 1947 when the U.N. voted to create Israel, it also voted to create an Arab state in Palestine next to Israel. The Zionists accepted and voted FOR the solution. The Arabs voted against it, and declared war. Again in 2000 Israeli offered the Palestinians their nation, and they declined. Arafat walked out of the negotiations and declared a second intifada. Each time the Zionists agreed to Arab demands, they were met with more Jewish bloodshed. Yet, many Jewish people in Israel still hold out hopes that a Palestinian state will emerge and that Jew and Arab can finally live in peace. Through the treatment of its Arab citizens, may Israel soon show the world that Zionism strives for a better future.

I agree with you in that I think the majority of Israelis want peace but, at least for us who get non-Zionist filtered news, your government seems to be running a PR disaster if it is really trying to show the world that it "strives for a better future ... through the treatment of its Arab Citizens" and those other Arabs and Christians unfortunate to live in neighbouring countries.

[Guest yod]

I agree with you in that I think the majority of Israelis want peace but, at least for us who get non-Zionist filtered news, your government seems to be running a PR disaster if it is really trying to show the world that it "strives for a better future ... through the treatment of its Arab Citizens" and those other Arabs and Christians unfortunate to live in neighbouring countries.

Shiloh is an American, fyi.

The Israeli government bends over backwards, to the detriment of it's own safety, to be fair to all people within it's borders.

There are religious factions within the Israeli government who are not bound to that approach, however, and they can be violently opposed to christians and muslims, but that is not an official position of the government.

That said, the entire government of the PA & Hamas along with most of the Palestinian population is racist against Jews and overwhelmingly prejudiced against christians. This is widespread and condoned by their officials.

The so-called anti-zionists realize that they are supporting this and try to deflect by presenting their bigotry as "social justice". It's a rouse that anyone can see through, if they aren't already blinded by their own prejudice.

Israel is far from a perfect utopia at the moment, and I have personally experienced their treatment at the checkpoint. It was extremely unpleasant, yet I still place the blame on people who try to cross the borders with bombs strapped on themselves. Israel is protecting ALL people from this indiscriminate murder.

[Elcule]

I presumed she was American, hence the non-filtered news comment.

I am aware of the psychotic nature of both the PA and Hamas governments but I think people have been drawn to them in many cases by perceived injustices caused by Israel. An extremist government does not get elected in a state that's doing well. My point however did not concern Hamas or the PA as I don't think saying "oh but they're doing worse stuff than us" will get anyone anywhere, placing blame is pointless. Each side can surely look and think, 'how can we improve this situation' rather than spouting hate.

Obviously it's a situation I have not experienced and I can imagine the rage that must flow through a country when hearing of fresh attacks on its citizens but my opinion is that counterracting violence with violence rarely works. Actions such as moving out of the Golan Heights, not bombing Beirut and not raiding aid convoys to the Gaza strip, though perhaps heightening the sense of tension on the Conservative right at the outset, would do a lot to alleiviate things in the long run.

[Guest shiloh357]

Zionism is not racism because the Zionists supported a free and independent Palestinian state. In 1947 when the U.N. voted to create Israel, it also voted to create an Arab state in Palestine next to Israel. The Zionists accepted and voted FOR the solution. The Arabs voted against it, and declared war. Again in 2000 Israeli offered the Palestinians their nation, and they declined. Arafat walked out of the negotiations and declared a second intifada. Each time the Zionists agreed to Arab demands, they were met with more Jewish bloodshed. Yet, many Jewish people in Israel still hold out hopes that a Palestinian state will emerge and that Jew and Arab can finally live in peace. Through the treatment of its Arab citizens, may Israel soon show the world that Zionism strives for a better future.

I agree with you in that I think the majority of Israelis want peace but, at least for us who get non-Zionist filtered news, your government seems to be running a PR disaster if it is really trying to show the world that it "strives for a better future ... through the treatment of its Arab Citizens" and those other Arabs and Christians unfortunate to live in neighbouring countries.

Israel is far kinder to the Arabs than their own Arab bretheren, particularly where the Palestinians are concerned. In fact, when Bethlehem was under Muslim control, Arabs particularly Christians, fled to live in Jerusalem and environs.

I will freely admit that Israel is not perfect. Israel stil has issues regarding the treatment of Palestinians.

The United States has been an independent nation for 236 years. Even after the civil rights movement of the 60’s, we still struggle with discrimination and civil rights issues in this country. We still have a long way to go regarding our treatment of minorities in our country, and in various spheres of our society. If we have not yet figured everything out in the span of time that we have been a nation, why should come as any surprise that Israel has not solved all of its problems in 64 years?

Yet, Israel has done a lot for the Palestinians that most countries would not do. Palestinian Arabs enjoy free Israeli health care, welfare and social security benefits. Israel has continued to provide immense amounts of humanitarian aid to the Palestinians languishing under Hamas governed Gaza. Israel, during their last battle in Gaza, allowed injured Gazans into Israeli hospitals, because Hamas was refusing to allow medicine and medical attention to be given to their own people. Instead they sold the medical aid for more money to purchanse weapons.

Israel once built a school for blind children in Gaza. Yasir Arafat closed it down and turned into an armory and weapons depot. Israel has gone into Arab towns and villages and provided them with modern sewers systems so that they didn't have to throw their bodily waste into a ditch that ran down the middle of the street. They have built schools for the Palestinians and provided medicine that has increased the average life span of Palestinians and has prevented their children from dying of curable childhood diseases. When the palestiains were under Jordanian and Egyptian rule, they were brutalized.

Even now the Arab/Muslim community views the Palestinians as political pawns, as tools they can use to smear Israel in the arena of public opinion. Israel protects the freedom of speech of Muslims, even Imams who scream for Israel's destruction in mosques that sit on Israeli soil. They protect the freedom of religion of Muslims, and Muslim holy sites, while Muslims continue to descrate Jewish sites, such as the tomb of the Patriarchs in Hebron. Israel has always provided humanitarian aid to their Muslim enemies in other countries, and was ususally the first. Israel provided far more aid to the Muslim victims of the Tsunami in 2004 than did the Arabs.

Here is a great place to read about how Israel is making the world a better place for Arabs and other peoples as well>>> Beyond Images Website

[Elcule]

Interesting, I shall explore the website, though producing it has hardly alliviated my concerns of the zionist-tinted specs being on.

[Guest shiloh357]

Yod and Shiloh,

What are your opinions on Israel's denial of Right of Return for Messianic Jews? I know that since 2008 Israel does allow ROR for Christians with Jewish fathers. However, Israel still does not allow Messianic Jews (who have Jewish mothers) due to their law which states that Jews who convert to other religions no longer have ROR.

I in no way wish to start a debate and do not plan on replying to your opinions. I simply wish to have your opinions.

Thanks

I don't support Israel's position or actions on that matter at all. It is one of the things I have a real problem with concerning Israel. I also don't like it that Christians organizations who claim to support Israel ignnre the brothers and sisters in the the Land. But that doesn't mean that I should change my position on what Scripture says about restoration of Israel that is still in progress and begun over 100 years ago.

Christians are persecuted to the point of death in countries all over the world. Israel simply deports you if you witness to Jewish people. In other coutries such an act costs you your life. So even in this matter, Israel is far, far more gracious to Christians than their neighbors would be. Israel isn't murdering Messianic Jews. The Israeli government does not have a policy of genocide for Jewish believers. Try being a Jewish believer in Egypt or even in Gaza. Try being a Jewish believer in any Muslim country or even a nonMuslim country that isn't friendly to beleivers. Israel's actions in this matter are far more in keeping with sanity and human rights.

My support for Israel is not unconditional. But my love for israel is. I can love Israel without condoning everything Israel does. I would also point out that it was Christianity that created the problem in the first place. 1,700 years of telling the Jews that the church was the new Israel and that God was done with them and 1,700 years of violent persecution to remind them that God was done with them has more to do with this than most Christians have guts to admit. The Jews are far kinder to proseltyzing Christians than the Christians were to Jews throughout history who simply wanted to be Jews and left alone to live in peace.

[Guest shiloh357]

I presumed she was American, hence the non-filtered news comment.

I am aware of the psychotic nature of both the PA and Hamas governments but I think people have been drawn to them in many cases by perceived injustices caused by Israel. An extremist government does not get elected in a state that's doing well. My point however did not concern Hamas or the PA as I don't think saying "oh but they're doing worse stuff than us" will get anyone anywhere, placing blame is pointless. Each side can surely look and think, 'how can we improve this situation' rather than spouting hate.

Obviously it's a situation I have not experienced and I can imagine the rage that must flow through a country when hearing of fresh attacks on its citizens but my opinion is that counterracting violence with violence rarely works. Actions such as moving out of the Golan Heights, not bombing Beirut and not raiding aid convoys to the Gaza strip, though perhaps heightening the sense of tension on the Conservative right at the outset, would do a lot to alleiviate things in the long run.

The problem is that Israel isn't countering violence with violence. Israel doesn't send out suicide bombers to kill Palestinians. Israeli snipers do not hide out behind bushes to kill Palestinian school children. Israel isn't launching rockets and mortar fire on a daily basis to kill Palestinians in Gaza or the West Bank. Israel left Gaza in 2005 and for nearly three years, the Palestinian response was increase mortar and rocket fire. In fact, Israel's disengagement from Gaza result in terror attacks on Israel to increase by 500% by the end of 2008. It took Israel nearlly three years to respond to the violence being perpretrated by the Palestinians.

Historically, terrorism increases whenever Israel shows perceived "weakness" by willing to sit down at the negotiating table. Hamas, Hezbullah, Fatah, et al. misinterpret Israel's willingness to negotiate as a sign that Israel is weakened and that terrorism works. They viewed the 1993 Oslo Accords as a sign that terrorism is an effective tool to get what they want. Every time Israel makes a concession, the result is more bloodshed, and somehow Israel get blamed if they attempt to defend themselves against terrorist activity. When Israel takes action in self defense, the world community wants to paint their actions as a tit-for-tat cycle of violence. But when the timeline is examined, we find Israel reacting to violence with far more restraint than any other nation would if it were facing similar threats. So it isn't case of returning violence for violence. It is a case of genuine attempts at negotiating peace being answered by increased Muslim terrorism and bloodshed on Israel's streets and Israel responding with the same legitmate defensive countermeasures that are employed by other nations in self defense. For some reason, Israel's self-defense is constantly delegitimized by trying paint self-defense as equal to terrorism. Funny how that equivication only applies to Israel.

Historically, Israel has been subjected to six wars, none of which Israel started. In fact, the wars of 1948, 1956, 1967, and 1973 were Arab instigated wars in an attempt to annihilate Israel. Israel was in a defensive posture each time. In 1982, and 2006, and 2008, Israel was forced to respond to threats to their own people who were being constantly bombarded by rocket and mortar fire from the Palestinians. Again, Israel was in a defensive position. Israel has never sought to mistreat, disenfranchize, brutalize or bring harm to the Palestinians. The Palestinians' problems are generally self-inflicted as they continue to force Israel into having to utilize military force to combat Palestinian terrorism.

Hence, for anyone to compare Israel's self-defense as being akin to the Hatfields and McCoys is an anti-Semitic comparison because it assumes that Israel's self-defense is morally equivalent to terrorism. It's like comparing the arsonist with the firefighter.

The problem with your postion is that it assumes that the Palestinians are interested in "improving the situation." They are not. They are interested in one thing and that is the removal of the Jewish state. Their agenda is to replace Israel with a wholly Palestinian state and to eradicate the Jews from the Middle East and eventually from the world. That is their stated aim and they have already created the maps to prove it. >>> Palestinian Maps Omitting Israel

I have been studying this conflict for almost 20 years and have a very firm grasp on the dynamics that are in play. The Arabs have NEVER been interested in peace, only the destruction Israel, plain and simple. They posture themselves as peacemakers for the benefit of western cameras, but laugh at the gullibility of west behind the curtains. Israel isn't perfect, but nothing Israel has done warrants the irrational hatred the the 1,5 billion member Muslim world holds for Israel.

[Guest shiloh357]

Why I Am A Christian Zionist

by Shiloh357

Christian Zionism is rooted in the Bible, which declares God’s eternal covenant with the Jewish people. Our assertion that the Jewish people have a biblical right to their historic homeland generates no small controversy, and this is due in part to both a misunderstanding of what the Bible teaches regarding the future of Israel from a prophetic standpoint, as well as a lack of understanding regarding the history and dynamics of the current conflict. As a result Christian Zionism, itself has been mischaracterized. The purpose of this paper is to clarify what Christian Zionism is and what it is not, and why I believe it to be both biblically and intellectually sound.

What is Christian Zionism?

First, Christian Zionism needs to be defined and to do that Zionism itself must be defined. Zionism is:

• The National Liberation movement of the Jewish People.
  
• It is the modern expression of the ancient longing by the Jewish People to return to their land and live as a free people once again.
  
• It is the desire to secure a modern state for the Jewish nation.
  
• It is the conviction that the Jewish people have the right to live in freedom and security in its homeland.
  
• It is the determination to aid and encourage the return of any and all Jewish refugees of the Diaspora who wish to return home.
  
• It is the concern for the safety and security of that modern state, and the desire to see it strong enough to defend itself and the Jewish people as a whole from any present or future existential threat.
  
  Zionism, despite every attempt by Israel’s enemies to say otherwise, is not anti-Arab, or “anti” anything else. The above definition of Zionism could apply, in principle, to the wishes and desires of any other people to life in freedom, security, prosperity in their own nation, free from persecution or any other threat. Christians who support Israel are supporting the above. I am a Christian. I am also a Zionist. A Christian Zionist is one who believes that the above-captioned desire of the Jewish people to return to their Land and the right of the Jewish people to return to their Land is ultimately based on the promises made by God to the Jewish people. We believe those promises to be irrevocable, unconditional and firmly rooted in the eternal covenant made by God to Abraham (Gen. 17: 8,9). That is the basis of Christian Zionism.
  
  What Christian Zionism Is Not
  
  To be clear, Christian Zionism is not anti-Arab. We do not hate the Arab people. We simiply stand against any ideology that sets itself against the biblical right of the Jewish people to live in their homeland. Christian Zionism is not a geo-political movement. It is not enough for us who love Israel to simply support Israel from a political basis; rather we affirm that Israel’s chief claim to the Land is a Divine promise made by God to Abraham and His descendents through Isaac and Jacob by means of an eternal covenant.
  
  As Christian Zionists, we do not support unconditionally every policy, decision, or action by the Israeli government. While we love Israel unconditionally, unconditional love must not be confused with unconditional support. That is, perhaps, one of the biggest misunderstandings about what it means to support Israel.
  
  Furthermore, Christian Zionists typically do not believe that our support of Israel is based on a misguided belief that we are in any way hastening the second coming of Christ. God has already set in his time, when the second coming can occur and there is nothing any one can do to either delay or hasten that event. Our support for Israel, generally speaking, has no ulterior motive such as the second coming or any type of apocalyptic fantasy as the basis for our support of Israel against terrorism. While I am sure that there are individuals that can be found who do have such ulterior motives, they do not represent true Christian Zionism and should not be used as the standard by which this movement is measured.
  
  God is a Zionist
  
  I am a Zionist because God is a Zionist. Zionism is biblical. That may sound strange to some, but Israel is God’s nation and as long as this earth exists (Jer. 31: 35-36). God makes a promise which is found three times in the Bible, and is given directly to Abraham and his descendents:
  
  Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will show thee: And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. (Genesis 12:1-3)
  
  This promise regarding blessing and cursing is reiterated twice more in Gen. 27:29 and Num. 24:9. The promise is made to Abraham, to Jacob and finally pronounced upon all the children of Israel. To date, God has never rescinded this promise.
  
  God loves Israel with an unconditional love, and Christian Zionists, we seek to emulate that love for Israel:
  
  For thou art a holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people: But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt. Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations; And repayeth them that hate him to their face, to destroy them: he will not be slack to him that hateth him, he will repay him to his face.
  (Deuteronomy 7:6-10)
  
  That love is not only unconditional but is also perpetual. Notice what God says about Israel in the prophetic future:
  
  And the word of the LORD of hosts came, saying, "Thus says the LORD of hosts: I am jealous for Zion with great jealousy, and I am jealous for her with great wrath. Thus says the LORD: I have returned to Zion and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem, and Jerusalem shall be called the faithful city, and the mountain of the LORD of hosts, the holy mountain. (Zechariah 8:1-3, ESV)
  
  I like the way the Good News Bible says it:
  
  The LORD Almighty gave this message to Zechariah: "I have longed to help Jerusalem because of my deep love for her people, a love which has made me angry with her enemies. I will return to Jerusalem, my holy city, and live there. It will be known as the faithful city, and the hill of the LORD Almighty will be called the sacred hill.
  (Zechariah 8:1-3)
  
  The word used “jealous” can also be properly rendered as “zealous.” God is has an intense jealousy over Israel. It is akin to the jealousy that a man or woman has for their spouse, which is inflamed if there is a feeling that the relationship might be threatened.
  
  When God says He is jealous for Zion, He is speaking of a passion and singular exclusive love one would have for their spouse. He loves Israel to the point that He is willing to fight for her against anyone foolish enough to want to do her harm.
  
  For thus said the LORD of hosts, after his glory sent me to the nations who plundered you, for he who touches you touches the apple of his eye:
  (Zechariah 2:8)
  
  There are two possible and valid ways of understanding the latter portion of this verse, namely the part that says, "he who touches you touches the apple of his eye."
  
  First is theis the most common understanding that he touches Israel touches the apple of God's eye. The "apple" is the very center and the most sensitive part of the eye. The implication is that God is very sensitive and protective of Israel and to come against Israel is to set ones' self at enmity with God and God, by virtue of the Abrahamic Covenant is bound to defend Israel to the death. To "touch" Israel in a violent manner is incur the wrath of God. One must needs be careful how he "touches" Israel. God uses very interesting imagery when He wants us to understand His love and passion for Israel. For example:
  
  And I will be to her a wall of fire all around, declares the LORD, and I will be the glory in her midst.'"
  (Zechariah 2:5)
  
  The second understanding of Zechariah 2:8 and just as valid is that he who touches Israel, touches the apple of his own eye. In other words, those who seek Israel's demise are only ensuring their own demise. No man, no nation, can break God's covenant with Israel. They can only succeed in breaking themselves against it, to their own destruction. So to "touch" Israel in the sense of cursing Israel, is to bring ones's self under God's curse. That is a place you don't want to be. So, either way you understand Zech. 2:8, to "touch" Israel in the sense of cursing Israel is to bring a curse and destruction upon yourself. It is possible that there is an intended "double" understanding intended by God in that verse.
  
  God’s Prophetic Promises
  
  I am a Christian Zionist because I believe in God’s prophetic promises for Israel. The Bible teaches in many places both old and New Testament that Israel will be exiled scattered and regathered in the last days, to her land. I am not going to write out all of the prophecies, but Israel’s end time restoration to the Land is ubiquitous throughout the entire word of God. Here are some examples:
  
  The Jewish People will always be God’s People; Jer. 31:35-37
  
  God Promises the Jewish People’s return to the land (Jer. 30:3 Isa. 43:5-7; Eze 36: 24; Eze. 37:11-14)
  
  God’s promise to reunite all twelve tribes of Jacob/Israel (Jer. 3:18; Eze. 37:15-23; Hos. 1:10-11)
  
  The Lord promises both a physical and spiritual restoration of Israel (Jer. 31:31-34 Is. 40:1-2; Eze. 36:24-28 Zec. 12:10 Amos 9:14-15)
  
  One passage worth singling out is the passage in Amos 9:
  
  And I will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and drink the wine thereof; they shall also make gardens, and eat the fruit of them. And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God. (Amos 9:14-15)
  
  This was never true of Israel either preexile or post Babylonian exile. It is true of Israel today. Israel, currently has the 4^th most powerful military in the world behind the US, Russia and China. Israel cannot be uprooted and multiple wars have been fought to bring about the collapse of Israel, to no avail. In spite of the attempts of Israel’s enemies to destroy Israel, Israel has not only continued to survive, but has gone on to outstrip her enemies in every field of endeavor, and has only gotten stronger and more prosperous in the face of threats of annihilation. As I previously indicated, you cannot break God’s eternal covenant with Israel. All you can do is break yourself against it.
  
  The promises of God for Israel’s restoration are being fulfilled in our day, and as such continue to highlight the integrity of God’s word. God keeps His promises and Israel is a showcase of the faithfulness of God. God’s faithfulness to His word demonstrates that all of God’s promises can be trusted and that He will do exactly as He promised.
  
  It is impossible to explain the existence of modern Israel apart from the hand of God. Israel did not have the military hardware or the numbers to defeat the Arab/Muslim onslaught of 1948; in fact, most countries were rooting for the other side. The Arab world with the assistance and training of the British Empire could not destroy the fledging nation. In fact, all three of Israel’s major wars (1948, 1967, and 1973) are not even studied by the Generals of WestPoint, where all wars of antiquity and modern times are studied. Yet, these three wars fought and won by Israel are not studied. Why? Because their outcome cannot be explained militarily. There is no reason, from a tactical, militaristic standpoint, why Israel should have won. Israel should not have, from a military point of view, been able to exist 24 hours after declaring nationhood. The military experts in the US had predicted defeat for Israel in ’48, ’67 and ’73. Israel’s existence defies the odds, and defies reality. It would have been enough of miracle for Israel to merely survive, but Israel has gone on to bless the world in every scientific and technological field of endeavor. God has and is keeping His promises Israel. It behooves us as Christians to recognize God’s promises to Israel and to align our thinking with God’s thinking on this matter.
  
  Israel’s Restoration in The New Testament
  
  
  The New Testament is not at all in contradiction with a literal understanding of Israel’s end time restoration. I am not gong to list every place where the New Testament affirms a literal and final restoration of Israel, but I will hit on just two or three places given in the New Testament that show us that the saints of in the New Testament understood the literal restoration of Israel and were at no time corrected by God in their understanding.
  
  And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favor with God. And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: And he shall reign over the house of Jacob forever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.
  (Luke 1:30-33)
  
  Notice 5 promises made to Mary concerning Jesus:
  • He shall be great.
    
  • He shall be called the Son of the Highest.
    
  • He shall be given the throne of David.
    
  • He shall reign over the house of Jacob forever.
    
  • His Kingdom will have no end.
    

  Two of the promises are already true and have come to pass, namely that He is called great and the Son of God. The throne of David is an earthly throne. It is always connected to earth and is never referred to as being in heaven. So Jesus is not currently sitting on the throne of David. Secondly, when Jesus is sitting on the throne He will be ruling over the house of Jacob. Jacob is Israel. God, in the Scriptures, uses the terms “Jacob” and “Israel” interchangeably. Jacob is representative of the twelve tribes of Israel and always refers to the physical descendents of Abraham through Isaac and Jacob. Jesus is not currently reigning on the throne of David over the house of Jacob, so this is, even for us still in the future. Finally it says that this kingdom where Jesus will be reigning over the house of Jacob on David’s throne will be eternal, without end. All of these promises is meant to be understood literally. There is nothing in this that is meant to be understood metaphorically. Furthermore, in Mary’s response we see nothing but a literal understanding of what the angel promised concerning Jesus.

  Another passage worth examining is the prophecy of Zechariah, the father of John the Baptist:

  And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying, Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people, And hath raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began: That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us; To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant; The oath which he swore to our father Abraham, That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear, In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life. (Luke 1:67-75)

  Zechariah first refers to the horn of salvation spoken of by the prophets. He is referring to 2 Sam 22:3, Ps. 18:2 and Ezekiel 29: 21. It is God Himself, who is the horn of salvation. Therefore, it is clearly Jesus being referred to in this passage. Furthermore Zechariah under the unction of the Holy Spirit prophesies that this horn of salvation is raised up in the house of David so that “we” (the children of Israel) should be saved from their enemies and from the hand of them that hate “us.” Zechariah then connects this final deliverance (which has yet to come) with the covenant that God made to Abraham. Zechariah is clearly looking into the future of Israel; not something that had already happened, but something yet to happen. Even in our day, this passage has not come to complete fulfillment where Israel is concerned. Israel has not been completely delivered from those who hate her, as history readily attests, but this will happen which is why a literal restoration of Israel is pictured in this passage.

  Finally, notice what is said in Acts chapter one:

  When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. (Acts 1:6-7)

  It is clear that the apostles having been raised as Jews understood the Scriptures to indicate a literal restoration of Israel, particular a restoration of the Kingdom to Israel. They asked Jesus if He was, going to take on the role of Messiah and fulfill that restoration, and Jesus was response was “it is not for you to know the times or the seasons…” Jesus’ answer was not, “No.” Jesus made no attempt to correct their understanding of His role as Messiah or of the prophetic future of the nation of Israel.

  I could go on about how the New Testament confirms a literal restoration of Israel, but those three examples are sufficient for my purpose here.

  I am a Christian Zionist, because the Bible confirms God’s end time prophetic role of Israel in the earth, because God’s promises for Israel demonstrate His faithfulness and thus, show us that God can be trusted to keep his promises to us. I am a Christian Zionist because God is a Zionist, and the Bible declares that Israel’s enemies are God’s enemies. In the end, the world will see that there is a God in Israel and that Lord fights for Israel.

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh, I probably agree with what you are saying much more than you will ever know.

However, writing things like this are not helpful....

Hence, for anyone to compare Israel's self-defense as being akin to the Hatfields and McCoys is an anti-Semitic comparison because it assumes that Israel's self-defense is morally equivalent to terrorism.

My whole point is that violence begets violence. I certainly do not believe that self-defense is morally equivalent to terrorism. Nothing I said was meant to be nor was anti-semitic.

In the context of what your comment was responding to, I am completely accurate. Elclude was referring to the violence producing more violence as a description of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. You highlighted those words in Elclude's comments on the conflict and applied them to the Hatfields and McCoys. It was clear case of comparing the two conflicts which have absolutely NO points of comparison or equivication. Your words in the context of Elcludes post was VERY anti-Semitic in every sense of the word. It is a common anti-Semitic tactic to try to smear Israel by making the conflict appear as a violence-begats-violence type of situation.