Vickilynn Posted August 19, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 19, 2007 Shalom Kari, Meditate on these words from G-d: Ephesians 6: 10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil. 12Forwe do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. Colossians 3: 1 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 2 Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth. 3For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. James 4 7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Kari, the Word says to draw near to G-d first and submit to Him. That should be our focus, not the devil or his demons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larryt Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 52 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,230 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 124 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/22/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/03/1952 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Note: A Christian can never be possessed by a demon. When the Holy Spirit enters a person, a demon cannot simultaneously possess them. But a Christian can be oppressed by demons. I have found this to be UN true. We christians want to split hairs when it comes to the demonic realm. Christians can & DO have demons. It is not a matter of salvatio, deliverance is our BREAD and we have told Jesus "no thank you". Chrisitians NEED deliverance... they just refuse what has been paid for.. Wait a sec. The poster made a good point I think...If a Christian is indwelt with the Holy Spirit, why in the world would he share that space with a demon? Weren't we warned that if someone has demons driven from them, to then be filled with the Holy Ghost because they would come back with "seven others who were more wicked than the original spirit was?" Shalom Kari, YOU are correct, the Scriptures say that the person who is saved is indwelt by the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit will not give over to demons. Those who preach this stuff do not have Scriptural basis for their claims. The OP (the list you posted) is correct on that count, NO true Christian can be possessed by demons. Don't be fooled into thinking they can. a voice of sanity amid the garbage being spouted! It is obvious that neither one of you have ever cast any demons our of anyone. One thing the demons cannot stand is to be cast out of people. They will do anything and everything to keep this knowledge from the people of God. Only those that sought Jesus' help received deliverance from demons. Never do we see Jesus casting demons out of unbelievers(pharases, jewish leaders). The disciples were to cast our demons because freely they were to freely give that which they freely received. LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarletprayers Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 135 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,537 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 157 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/06/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/29/1956 Share Posted August 20, 2007 No its "obvious" for another reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 20, 2007 It is obvious that neither one of you have ever cast any demons our of anyone. One thing the demons cannot stand is to be cast out of people. They will do anything and everything to keep this knowledge from the people of God. Shalom Larry, Actually, you are quite wrong on all counts. It's not "obvious" because you wrongly assumed something that isn't true. I was in a Pentecostal church for years and have quite a bit of experience with "demon-chasers" and I thank G-d that He has shown me the truth that this is false doctrine. Christians CANNOT be possessed by demons, if they are filled with the Holy Spirit. Only those that sought Jesus' help received deliverance from demons. Never do we see Jesus casting demons out of unbelievers(pharases, jewish leaders). Wrong again. What we do NOT see is anyone in the NT who is a Believer having demons cast out of them. ALL of the demons that were cast out were from UNbelievers. Please, check your Bible. Show me ONE place where the demons were cast out from Believers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 20, 2007 Shalom, Please read the Scriptures in this article. They show clearly that Christians cannot be possessed (needing deliverance) from demons. We need no "exorcists." We need to draw need to G-d, submit to Him, put on the whole armor of G-d and resist the devil to fight off his attacks. We don't need demons cast out since they cannot indwell us. http://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/nbi/61.html Can A Christian Be Demon-Possessed? Though demons can enter and possess any unbeliever, they cannot enter into the body of those who belong to the Lord. There are a number of reasons why this is so. Greater Is He The Bible says that the one who indwells believers is greater than the one who is in the world. You are of God, my little children, and have overcome them: because greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world (1 John 4:4). Delivered Those who have trusted Christ have been delivered from the possibility of demonic possession. Paul wrote. in which you once lived, following the course of this world, following the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work among those who are disobedient (Ephesians 2:2). The believers do not live any more under their authority. He has rescued us from the power of darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins (Colossians 1:13,14). Nothing In Common Believers have nothing in common with darkness or Satan. The Holy Spirit, and a demonic spirit, cannot co-exist in the same person. And what agreement has Christ with Belial? or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? (2 Corinthians 6:15). No Biblical Example Finally, there is no example in Scripture of a believer in Jesus Christ being demon-possessed. All cases of demonic possession were with those who were unbelievers. Passages In Support? Sometimes the following passages are cited as support of believers being possessed. Paul ordered the church of Corinth to deliver a believer over to Satan. to deliver such a one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus (1 Corinthians 5:5). There is no evidence that the person whom Paul delivered over to Satan became demon-possessed. Two Others The Bible speaks of two other individuals who were also delivered over to Satan. of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I delivered unto Satan, that they might be taught not to blaspheme (1 Timothy 1:20). As is the case with the believer in Corinth, there is no indication that either of these men were ever demon-possessed. People Taken Captive Another passage speaks of people being taken captive by the Devil. and they may recover themselves out of the snare of the Devil, having been taken captive by him unto his will (2 Timothy 2:26). The people under discussion in this context are not believers. Consequently there is no Scriptural support for the idea that Christians can become demon-possessed. What About Stories Of Believers And Demons? If this is the case, then what about the stories that circulate with respect to believers and demon-possession. Examples are provided of believers who exhibit symptoms of demon possession. When people give examples of believers being possessed, there are a number of questions that immediately arise, "Were these victims of demon possession really believers?" "Were they actually possessed with a demon, or is there another possible explanation for their behavior?" Since the Bible gives no support that a believer can be possessed by a demon, some other explanation must be in order. Permanent Indwelling Of Holy Spirit The issue is clear. It is not whether a professing Christian can be demon-possessed, but rather can a genuine, "born again" Christian become demon-possessed? The Bible teaches that those who have trusted Christ are permanently indwelt by the Holy Spirit. In Him you also, when you had heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and had believed in Him, were marked with the seal of the promised Holy Spirit; this is the pledge of our inheritance toward redemption as God's own people, to the praise of His glory (Ephesians 1:13,14). New Creation Believers are a new creation in Christ. So if anyone is in Christ, there is a new creation: everything old has passed away; see, everything has become new! (2 Corinthians 5:17). Body Temple Of Holy Spirit The body of the believer is now a temple of the Holy Spirit. Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which you have from God? and you are not your own (1 Corinthians 6:19). Cannot Separate The Believer From The Lord The Bible says that such evil powers cannot separate the believer from the love of God. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord (Romans 8:38,39). Specially mentioned are the angels and principalities - angelic orders. Not even they can separate the believer from the love of God. All of these things would make demon-possession an impossibility for the believer. Spiritual Balance Needed Satan and demons are defeated foes, yet they are still very active in this world, causing much harm. Though they cannot possess and control a believer, they can cause a number of problems. Summary The Scripture does not teach that a Christian can be possessed by a demon. The believer is "in Christ,"- one of His. Every example in the Bible of a person being demon-possessed concerns an unbeliever - there are no examples of believers being possessed. Furthermore, we must be careful not to rely on stories of believers and demon-possession - many other explanations are possible. The Christian, who is indwelt by the Holy Spirit, need not fear demon possession. Yet, demons do attack believers in various ways. Therefore, it would be wrong to say that they cannot have any affect on the Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larryt Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 52 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,230 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 124 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/22/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/03/1952 Share Posted August 20, 2007 It is obvious that neither one of you have ever cast any demons our of anyone. One thing the demons cannot stand is to be cast out of people. They will do anything and everything to keep this knowledge from the people of God. Shalom Larry, Actually, you are quite wrong on all counts. It's not "obvious" because you wrongly assumed something that isn't true. I was in a Pentecostal church for years and have quite a bit of experience with "demon-chasers" and I thank G-d that He has shown me the truth that this is false doctrine. Christians CANNOT be possessed by demons, if they are filled with the Holy Spirit. Sorry to hear that. I wasn't involved with "demon chasers" We didn't chase them though I know what you are talking about for I have witnessed what you refer to. It is a big show put on by the demons to divert attention from the children's bread. We cast them out when they manifested and not until, and this was in a baptist church. We were only interested in helping people. I was one of those that needed help and got it. Jesus set me free from many demons. I have first hand knowledge. I was delivered from demonic oppression. You use the word "possessed" which is an unfortunate translation in the bible. The word as translated does not exist. The word is demonized and refers to the influence of the demonic in a person's life. It can be severe or minimal. It is true that demons cannot POSSESS a believer, but they can OPPRESS a believer, and the remedy is to be cast out in Jesus name. Only those that sought Jesus' help received deliverance from demons. Never do we see Jesus casting demons out of unbelievers(pharases, jewish leaders). Wrong again. What we do NOT see is anyone in the NT who is a Believer having demons cast out of them. ALL of the demons that were cast out were from UNbelievers. Please, check your Bible. Show me ONE place where the demons were cast out from Believers. It is very strange that the gaderene demoniac ran TOWARD Jesus and not away fleeing. If we are to cast them out of unbelievers why doesn't Jesus just cast them out of the "children of their father the devil" and set them free???????? Then they wouldn't end up in hell. It just doesn't make sense to cast them out of the unbeliever for if they don't get filled with the Holy Spirit the end is worst that the first. That is what Jesus says. LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larryt Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 52 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,230 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 124 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/22/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/03/1952 Share Posted August 20, 2007 There is no evidence that the person whom Paul delivered over to Satan became demon-possessed. Very intersesting you bring up Paul. Didn't he have a thorn IN THE FLESH, a messenger(angel) of Satan? Go figure. You can only freely give that which you have been freely given. LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarletprayers Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 135 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,537 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 157 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/06/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/29/1956 Share Posted August 20, 2007 It is obvious that neither one of you have ever cast any demons our of anyone. One thing the demons cannot stand is to be cast out of people. They will do anything and everything to keep this knowledge from the people of God. Only those that sought Jesus' help received deliverance from demons. Never do we see Jesus casting demons out of unbelievers(pharases, jewish leaders). The disciples were to cast our demons because freely they were to freely give that which they freely received. LT Wow thats totally opposite of what you said here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 20, 2007 There is no evidence that the person whom Paul delivered over to Satan became demon-possessed. Very intersesting you bring up Paul. Didn't he have a thorn IN THE FLESH, a messenger(angel) of Satan? Go figure. You can only freely give that which you have been freely given. LT Shalom LT, Let's rightly divide the Word of Truth. NO place does it say that Paul was possessed or needed deliverance. Satan can affect Christians, but he cannot indwell them. Paul did not seek deliverance or exorcism either, did he? NO! He sought Jesus. And Jesus said my grace is sufficient. If there was a demon that needed to be exorcised, it would have been, but as the Word shows, there was NO demon indwelling a Christian. You made my argument for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larryt Posted August 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 52 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,230 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 124 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/22/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/03/1952 Share Posted August 20, 2007 There is no evidence that the person whom Paul delivered over to Satan became demon-possessed. Very interesting you bring up Paul. Didn't he have a thorn IN THE FLESH, a messenger(angel) of Satan? Go figure. You can only freely give that which you have been freely given. LT Shalom LT, Let's rightly divide the Word of Truth. NO place does it say that Paul was possessed or needed deliverance. Satan can affect Christians, but he cannot indwell them. Paul did not seek deliverance or exorcism either, did he? NO! He sought Jesus. And Jesus said my grace is sufficient. If there was a demon that needed to be exorcised, it would have been, but as the Word shows, there was demon indwelling a Christian. You made my argument for me. but as the Word shows, there was demon indwelling a Christian. You made my argument for me. It seems you made my argument for me. And Paul did beseech the Lord 3 time but God allowed it the His grace would be shown to be sufficient. LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts