GoldenEagle Posted February 22, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 22, 2013 Hello Golden, Yes, I take a global perspective on this. No, I don't particularly want to take money from one place and dump it somewhere else. I agree with both you and Neb that enterprise and trade are the way out and up for the developing world. One of the charities I support, Deki, does precisely the kind of educational and micro-finance work you allude to, and that is necessary to encourage budding entrepreneurs into a situation where they can work themselves and their families out of poverty and into dignity. And yes, I firmly believe that it is possible to eradicate absolute poverty not only in this life, but in our lifetimes. Hasn't Jesus done enough for us already? Must we expect Him to solve all our problems for us? I think the guy deserves a holiday. Let us create a world fit for Him to return to, and not shelve issues for Him to sort out when He does return. Best wishes, eco. Interesting. Yes we’re in agreement enterprise and trade are the way out/up for the developing world. My wife and I support a charity through Compassion International. This charity helps sponsor children around the world by providing education, food, shelter but most importantly teaches about Jesus through the Bible. Our little boy is from Haiti. Like I’ve said before the problem is a spiritual issue not simply a physical/economic issue. I don’t believe that it is possible to eradicate poverty in this life or in my lifetime. The only way it would happen is if everyone turned to Jesus Christ. Today I just see things progressing away from Christ and the Bible in cultures worldwide. I’ve seen the heart of man first-hand and it is corrupt, sinful, and selfish. Is Jesus not The Answer? Curious. God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ndRateMind Posted February 22, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 44 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/17/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) Compassion International looks great. Well done for finding it; well done for supporting it. Is Jesus not the answer? Well, that would take a book to answer. I can only say that each generation has it's challenge. In my country, our great-grandfathers had the Kaiser to beat. Our grand-fathers needed to destroy Nazism. Our fathers faced down communism, and united Europe. Our job is just to end poverty. Our children's mission, maybe, will be to reach for the stars. People need a cause that is bigger than their own self-interest to give context and meaning to their existence. If that is Jesus, that is fine. But I think however corrupt, sinful and selfish the heart of humanity may be, it also has a yearning for the Good, the Right, the True, the Noble, the Just, and the Moral. And I have enough faith in - and love for - humanity to think that social progress is not only possible, but inevitable. Lest you think I am side-tracking Jesus, I am not. He will forever stand as the symbol of perfect Love, and ultimate Sacrifice. And one does not even need to be a Christian to acknowledge that. Best wishes, eco Edited February 23, 2013 by ecoTramp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted February 22, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted February 22, 2013 I am sure he was. I just think that the Holy Spirit, when it guides us, does just that. But it does not replace us. Rather, it takes all that we know, all that we can, all that we are, and melds it into distilled wisdom. But what it does not do is anticipate the moral progress that new generations will make, and add that into the mix. Or so it seems to me. Love, eco. Is the Holy Spirit an "it" or a "Who" in your view? What moral progress are you referring to out of curiosity? Possible to give an example of the past and what you see as a possibility (or possibilities) in the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joi Posted February 22, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 506 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 1,922 Content Per Day: 0.41 Reputation: 173 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/12/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 22, 2013 Compassion International looks great. Well done for finding it; well done for supporting it. Is Jesus not the answer? Well, that would take a book to answer. I can only say that each generation has it's challenge. In my country, our great-grandfathers had the Kaiser to beat. Our grand-fathers needed to destroy Nazism. Our fathers faced down communism, and united Europe. Our job is just to end poverty. Our children's mission, maybe, will be to reach for the stars. People need a cause that is bigger than their own self-interest to give context and meaning to their existence. If that is Jesus, that is fine. But I think however corrupt, sinful and selfish the heart of humanity may be, it also has a yearning for the Good, the Right, the True, The Noble, the Just, and the Moral. And I have enough faith in - and love for - humanity to think that social progress is not only possible, but inevitable. Lest you think I am side-tracking Jesus, I am not. He will forever stand as the symbol of perfect Love, and ultimate Sacrifice. And one does not even need to be a Christian to acknowledge that. Best wishes, eco And yet you have not acknowledged Him as your Lord and Savior? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joi Posted February 22, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 506 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 1,922 Content Per Day: 0.41 Reputation: 173 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/12/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 22, 2013 Hello Golden, Yes, I take a global perspective on this. No, I don't particularly want to take money from one place and dump it somewhere else. I agree with both you and Neb that enterprise and trade are the way out and up for the developing world. One of the charities I support, Deki, does precisely the kind of educational and micro-finance work you allude to, and that is necessary to encourage budding entrepreneurs into a situation where they can work themselves and their families out of poverty and into dignity. And yes, I firmly believe that it is possible to eradicate absolute poverty not only in this life, but in our lifetimes. Hasn't Jesus done enough for us already? Must we expect Him to solve all our problems for us? I think the guy deserves a holiday. Let us create a world fit for Him to return to, and not shelve issues for Him to sort out when He does return. Best wishes, eco. This thought is as ancient as Lucifer. If we could do it, we would not need a Savior! May I suggest Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; [Matt.6:33] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ndRateMind Posted February 23, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 44 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/17/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hasn't Jesus done enough for us already? Must we expect Him to solve all our problems for us? I think the guy deserves a holiday. Let us create a world fit for Him to return to, and not shelve issues for Him to sort out when He does return. Best wishes, eco. This thought is as ancient as Lucifer. If we could do it, we would not need a Savior! May I suggest Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; [Matt.6:33] But we have a saviour, so we can do it. We don't have to wait for Him to come again, just get on with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joi Posted February 23, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 506 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 1,922 Content Per Day: 0.41 Reputation: 173 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/12/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted February 23, 2013 Who has a savior? Do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayyycuuup Posted February 24, 2013 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,384 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 155 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1996 Share Posted February 24, 2013 Hasn't Jesus done enough for us already? Must we expect Him to solve all our problems for us? I think the guy deserves a holiday. Let us create a world fit for Him to return to, and not shelve issues for Him to sort out when He does return. Best wishes, eco. This thought is as ancient as Lucifer. If we could do it, we would not need a Savior! May I suggest Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; [Matt.6:33] But we have a saviour, so we can do it. We don't have to wait for Him to come again, just get on with it. Perfection is not something that can be obtained on this earth until the return of Christ, and in that instance, not only are things going to get worse, but there will be nothing we can do, or make of it- whether it be to prevent it or enable for it to happen. First the world has to repent and turn from it's evil ways- for God to heal the land (Acts 3:19) I do understand the strive to "better" this planet- but the change starts with Jesus- He should be the priority, this earth will pass away, but our souls have a place that carries on to. Evangelism is a must! God bless you Love to you in Him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ndRateMind Posted February 24, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 44 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/17/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 24, 2013 Hasn't Jesus done enough for us already? Must we expect Him to solve all our problems for us? I think the guy deserves a holiday. Let us create a world fit for Him to return to, and not shelve issues for Him to sort out when He does return. Best wishes, eco. This thought is as ancient as Lucifer. If we could do it, we would not need a Savior! May I suggest Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; [Matt.6:33] But we have a saviour, so we can do it. We don't have to wait for Him to come again, just get on with it. Perfection is not something that can be obtained on this earth until the return of Christ... No one is asking for perfection. Just that people don't die of hunger, or preventable disease. ...and in that instance, not only are things going to get worse, but there will be nothing we can do, or make of it- whether it be to prevent it or enable for it to happen... And this is a counsel of despair. I cannot think that this is the spirit of the faith. You may think that there is nothing to be done, and that God will reward the faithful despite their inaction, but I think you are taking an unnecessary risk. cheers, eco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted February 24, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.94 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted February 24, 2013 But we have a saviour, so we can do it. We don't have to wait for Him to come again, just get on with it. So, what you are saying is mankind is it's own savior, and we don't need Jesus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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