Can every Believer be rich/blessed/favored/speak-in-tongues/be healed?

[NeedYouLord]

Much love to ya'll,

 

I agree most of the fussing is about what individuals do with their wealth...Whether they be a Pastor, Apostle, Teacher, Evangelist or Prophet...or any one of us that is In Christ...and the judgement whether they are doing good with it...I say God gave it to them...and He (God) is in control...Especially when our government not too long ago had the same thoughts (I saw it as coveting-I truly believe they wanted more of their money)...anyway...Most of everyone spoken of in this particular thread (Well known Pastors) were investigated and found not guilty of abusing any law etc. To the best of my knowledge anyway...My next question: With all the fussing about some of these well-known pastors so called perceived extravagances...Maybe they are walking in The Kingdom Right Here On Earth...Were you there right with them every second? Have you heard their conversations with God? All I know is they are in a much higher responsibility place and I will not sit in judgement...and how many times has it been looked up about how much they spend every month on the charges for being on television or how much they spend on everything else The Bible tells us to support and do...

 

I'm a real simple girl...God has given me everything I have...and it can be taken away-every bit of it-in one split second...and believe me-at one time in my life everything I owned would fit into a few boxes...I honor Him with my belongings...and I give-not perfectly-but I give...When I go sale-Watch out I might give away more than I sale...God just loves that!!! I'm starting to discern more and more the ones that actually are in need of it...That's what is so amazing...

 

As far as death and sickness...I guess that gets people more than anything else...We can see so clearly how all our wealth can go in an instant...Well so can our life and our health...That's why as many as can be told needs to know that God is Real and Everything He Did So That We Can Have Eternal Life With Him and Not Somewhere Else...All this petty stuff doesn't matter much to me...I want What God Wants On The Earth...While we still can that is...Death for me will be a celebration...I even go through times where I ask (Him) God to take me home...and He won't...So then I start Seeking and He Heals me Instead...

 

And I am not a believer of anything except God, The Father...God, The Son...God, The Holy Spirit...and Their Solution To Our Sin Problem...Jesus, His Word, and Him Crucified...and in Him and The Very Act of What He Did is Everything I need...Everything!!! Period...

 

In my opinion...The Best Thing That Could Ever Happen To me Did Happen...I rejected just about everything everyone said until that day...and God, Himself, Saved me...I went to His Word and What And Who God Wanted for me Came Into my Life For His Truth To Be Revealed To me...It's dangerous for me to believe in the doctrines of men...I wanted an experience that God was real and He, Himself, gave me the desire of my heart...

 

I laughed when I re-read my post above...Yeah-right...Hebrews 6:11 is the verse about God rewarding diligence...Hahaha...But what is so funny...If you go to that and keep reading it does explain some things about Abraham...so God turned it around for good...

 

Love ya'll In Him...

[Guest shiloh357]

My next question: With all the fussing about some of these well-known pastors so called perceived extravagances...Maybe they are walking in The Kingdom Right Here On Earth...

 

 

These are not percieved extravgances...  Million dollar mansions and fleets of private jets and private run-ways are not perceived extravagances.   Benny Hinn owns an $82,000 convertible, He stayed in the St James Motel in Montreal to the tune of $7,200 per night.  That is not a perceived extravagance. 

 

If a person earns their fortune they can spend it how they want.  If they started a business and it took off and made them a multi-millionaire, they are free to spend their hard earned cash as they see fit.  But when a person who claims to be spreading the Gospel is asking for others to support him with their hard earned money, they have a right to expect that the money is being spent on the Gospel and not on convertibles, gold-plated hot tubs and private jets.

 

They are walking in a kingdom, but they are not walking in God's Kingdom.  Kingdom living means laying treasure in heaven, not living in undeserved opulence while on earth.

[NeedYouLord]

Psalm 82:6-7

I said, "You are gods, And all of you are children of the Most High. But you shall die like men, And fall like one of the princes."

 

John 10:34-36

[34]Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, "You are gods" '? [35] "If He (Capital H) called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), [36] "do you say of Him (Capital H) whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming, 'because I said, 'I am the Son of God"?

[NeedYouLord]

Shiloh,

Much love and I respect your knowledge and even your name...but if we don't have the books right in front of us...we do not know the absolute Truth of Benny Hinn's finances...And I for one, couldn't handle the responsibility he has to God, Himself...

 

Also I do not know if he has a separate business...Do you? All I know is I've seen the media try to tear him to shreds...I've seen things come out that I didn't even know was going on...

 

It is not in my best interest, or anyone else's, in my opinion...To have such intolerance, unforgiveness...

 

There will be tribulations...Our Jesus says...the poor will be with you forever...Have I sold my car to give to the poor? Have you? anyway...Some more scriptures are coming up...I have them...later though...I'm being summoned...

[Guest ninhao]

Psalm 82:6-7

I said, "You are gods, And all of you are children of the Most High. But you shall die like men, And fall like one of the princes."

 

John 10:34-36

[34]Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, "You are gods" '? [35] "If He (Capital H) called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), [36] "do you say of Him (Capital H) whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming, 'because I said, 'I am the Son of God"?

 

Nello NeedYouLord,

 

These passages are often used incorrectly to suggest believers are divine. It actually means that the judges over Israel were in the position of delegation from God to rule. Notice it also says how these "gods" are mere mortals who are also accountable for their actions.

 

Psa 82:5-7  "The 'gods' know nothing, they understand nothing. They walk about in darkness; all the foundations of the earth are shaken.  (6)  "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'  (7)  But you will die like mere mortals; you will fall like every other ruler."

 

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh,

Much love and I respect your knowledge and even your name...but if we don't have the books right in front of us...we do not know the absolute Truth of Benny Hinn's finances...And I for one, couldn't handle the responsibility he has to God, Himself...

 

Also I do not know if he has a separate business...Do you? All I know is I've seen the media try to tear him to shreds...I've seen things come out that I didn't even know was going on...

 

It is not in my best interest, or anyone else's, in my opinion...To have such intolerance, unforgiveness...

 

There will be tribulations...Our Jesus says...the poor will be with you forever...Have I sold my car to give to the poor? Have you? anyway...Some more scriptures are coming up...I have them...later though...I'm being summoned...

They don't make any secret as to how they spend the money donated to them.  They are proud, they think they are entitled to live big and rich and in such extravagence.   I am not saying anything about them that they don't readily acknowledge.  So I don't have to have their records in front of me.

 

I am not being intolerant. I don't even see how that applies.  But I am being honest about the fact that their extravagence is unbiblical and really casts a dark shadow on the preaching of the Gospel.

 

Psalm 82:6-7

I said, "You are gods, And all of you are children of the Most High. But you shall die like men, And fall like one of the princes."

 

John 10:34-36

[34]Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, "You are gods" '? [35] "If He (Capital H) called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), [36] "do you say of Him (Capital H) whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming, 'because I said, 'I am the Son of God"?

 

This is not claiming that human beings are little gods or little deities.   In the original Hebrew of Ps. 82 the word for "gods" is elohim.   The word elohim is used a variety ways and is often used to refer to false gods, angels and human magistrates/judges or rulers.   When it is used in Psalm 82:6-7 it is referencing human magistrates or rulers and calls for them to act justly.

 

Jesus uses that verse to show that His claim to be the Son of God is not blasphemous because even in the Psalms, the same term, elohim, is applied to human beings.

 

The first sin committed in the Bible in Genesis 3:5 was based on this lie of godhood.   Satan's selling point to Eve was that if she ate of the fruit God said not to eat of that she and Adam would "be as gods".  The Hebrew verb in Gen. 3:5 signifies becoming something else, a transforming event.  So if she and Adam were already gods, there would have been no point to the temptation.  

 

These preachers who teach that we are little gods are servants of the devil.  They teach lies straight from hell and they are deceiving many.

[Sevenseas]

Shiloh,

Much love and I respect your knowledge and even your name...but if we don't have the books right in front of us...we do not know the absolute Truth of Benny Hinn's finances...And I for one, couldn't handle the responsibility he has to God, Himself...

 

Also I do not know if he has a separate business...Do you? All I know is I've seen the media try to tear him to shreds...I've seen things come out that I didn't even know was going on...

 

It is not in my best interest, or anyone else's, in my opinion...To have such intolerance, unforgiveness...

 

There will be tribulations...Our Jesus says...the poor will be with you forever...Have I sold my car to give to the poor? Have you? anyway...Some more scriptures are coming up...I have them...later though...I'm being summoned...

 

There is no excuse for not being aware of the teaching of Mr. Hinn.  The internet is quite full of videos of his teaching and meetings...and yes, it is the real Mr. Hinn and there has been more than once documentary done on him.  

 

Did you know that Mr Hinn has more then once cursed other Christians who disagree with him? In Mr Hinn's own words:

"Yes Lord I'll do it! I place a curse on every man and every woman that will stretch his hand against this anointing. I curse that man who dares to speak a word against this ministry."

 

Not only is he cursing people but it sounds as though he is stating that God told him to do so.  Notice that the ministry is what Hinn is defending.  How own ministry.

 

Is that found in scripture?  Does God tell us to curse those who oppose us or to pray for our enemies and those who despitefully use us?

 

The Bible teaches: "Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse." (Romans 12:14).

 

This is old news though.  No one is ripping him apart.  There are bigger, newer and more startling self appointed evangelists, prophets and others who get rich of the gospel popping up all the time.

 

At any rate, false teaching will be answered for one day and you have to wonder who the people are that Jesus was referring to when He said that He would send some away even though they did miracles in His name.  

 

Yet, they never really knew Him.

 

Sobering thought.

 

We are not supposed to make idols and superstars out of human beings.  I would hope that the Body of Christ would have seen enough of the fall of these 'super' Christians caught in sin of all kinds, to stop idolizing so many of them.

 

[TheCurseOfTheRodain]

 Another way of saying this is that it makes men as Gods.

 

Jesus mentioned men being as gods...as what God referred to them as...

Shiloh, in Genesis 1 Elohim is the name God uses for Himself...it is human interpretation (unbelief really) that tries to say Elohim means anything but God - it's always a direct reference to God, but yet, you will gainsay this.

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheCurseOfTheRodain

[Guest shiloh357]

 

 Another way of saying this is that it makes men as Gods.

 

Jesus mentioned men being as gods...as what God referred to them as...

 

Rodain,

 

Read Post #106.   Jesus was not claiming men are Gods.  He was defending His own Divinity in John 10.  The irony is that you deny Jesus' deity but use Jesus words to claim that mere men are gods (deity) and you do it with a passage that is actually defending Jesus' deity.    That shows how deluded  and heretical the Word of Faith teachings are.

[TheCurseOfTheRodain]

 

My next question: With all the fussing about some of these well-known pastors so called perceived extravagances...Maybe they are walking in The Kingdom Right Here On Earth...

 

 

These are not percieved extravgances...  Million dollar mansions and fleets of private jets and private run-ways are not perceived extravagances.   Benny Hinn owns an $82,000 convertible, He stayed in the St James Motel in Montreal to the tune of $7,200 per night.  That is not a perceived extravagance. 

 

If a person earns their fortune they can spend it how they want.  If they started a business and it took off and made them a multi-millionaire, they are free to spend their hard earned cash as they see fit.  But when a person who claims to be spreading the Gospel is asking for others to support him with their hard earned money, they have a right to expect that the money is being spent on the Gospel and not on convertibles, gold-plated hot tubs and private jets.

 

They are walking in a kingdom, but they are not walking in God's Kingdom.  Kingdom living means laying treasure in heaven, not living in undeserved opulence while on earth.

 

Haven't you ever noticed that the health of those who oppose and gainsay the message of God's prosperity seems to fail quite often? They sit back and rail with their opinions against how a preacher is led to use the money of the ministry or their own personal money, yet they have no Scriptural authority to do so. Some will say, well I don't think they ought to a have a jet, but they didn't ask you. Others will say I don't believe in that prosperity junk, then be poor. You will never have what you preach against. So if you're saying you don't believe in prosperity/tongues/healing, don't worry, you will never get any of them (even though they are all legally yours to begin with and God is waiting on you to take possession of them and use them).

 

Surely we can all agree that God is VERY SPECIFIC with EXACTLY what He wants done in any situation. Always has been, always will be. Just look at the Law for a great example of just how easily God gets His points across and how clear they are.

 

THAT BEING SAID, there is NO CAP or SPENDING LIMIT on how preachers spend their money or the money of their ministry. If you think otherwise, let's see the Scripture where God lays out what that cap is; because He is God and VERY specific, and if He wanted a cap, there would BE one. The cap that certain Believers insist on is only mere human opinion from a poverty mentality, because search the Bible, front to back, God never mentioned any limits on preacher's finances (on what they get paid (for Jesus said the worker is worth His wage, but didn't specify how high that wage could go, and so it is limitless) or what they do with the ministry finances).

 

Now, with that being said, some ministries ARE a crock and there are hucksters looking to make a living on preaching the Gospel, and you shall know them by their fruits. Some ministries are better ground than others for sowing seeds. But the Holy Spirit can lead you to know where you should be sowing, so that you DO reap your harvests.

 

Let the stones fly.

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheCurseOfTheRodain