Can every Believer be rich/blessed/favored/speak-in-tongues/be healed?

[NeedYouLord]

Much love again, Shiloh...Nope not doing what you are saying I'm doing...or maybe I am...Judgment should begin In The House of God...1Peter4:4...You are entitled to your opinion...period...

and I respect your beliefs...you can believe what you believe...I believe good can come from anything...and anybody...

 

I think testifying is a very powerful tool...but maybe I did leave out something...I've been helped by the ministries in question...at different times over the years...sometimes just a word given on television...sometimes action taken...also I've been to see 2 of them in person...

 

I learned a long time ago that my testimony can not be argued with...So I just state what I have lived through...

 

Concerning what all the fuss is about...That others don't spend their money as they should...or as some think they should...

 

Again..."I am going to make this crystal clear to you"...With everything that is in me...

 

I am not The One True God of Whom They Will Stand Before...and answer to...As will we all...

 

I'm not God...you aren't God...I'm not pretending to be God...Before I was saved: I was my own god...meeting all my needs and wants under my own power...

 

The Pastors of discussion: will answer to God for their actions...It's my job to love them...and bring the Truth to them if so led...and to learn and be led into God's Truths to the best of my ability...and don't tell me I can't bring The Truth to them...I have contacted 2 in this Whole Country that I was led to contact...In High Offices...with God's Truth...so...if you are so led to help lead them in the right direction...I say get to it!!! Do something instead of fussing!!! Contact them immediately!!! Because in my opinion, the wells are getting stopped up with intolerance and unforgiveness...

 

So all this fussing is just about saying someone (our brothers and sisters) are just all wrong and are to be judged, juried and executed while they are still here on earth? I don't participate in that any more...I don't know how well that sets with God from where I sit either...He created them too...See it goes a lot deeper cause I know scripture that talks about this as well...and it ain't pretty...Not a good idea to judge, jury and execute anybody...That is what I did without God...I could look at someone and judge them...Whew...Was I wrong...

 

Anyway...Want to know the scripture? Here it is...and it's what you are doing...and it's deep...and I Love You!!! Father...Thank You For Your Word...Thank You That It Teaches me...some things to do and some not to do...Father...all this I see as not moving forward In Your Love and Power...Help us...We need You! Thank you!!! In The Name above Every Name...

 

And specifically I know your gift and talent is knowledge about when all this happened and the circumstances etc. etc. and I respect your knowledge...and need it at times...

 

But I will say this...This verse is for right now!!! And can change our lives...right now!!! Romans 2:1 Therefore you are inexcusable, O man, whoever you are who judge, for in whatever you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things...

 

And don't tell me God's Word isn't as sharp as a two-edged sword...because when we get totally honest with ourselves this verse is true...It was for me...and it hurt me to the core to finally see when I judge I'm doing the same thing in my life that I'm seeing them do...It hurts!!! Much love and I didn't even post the verse that says: don't meddle in other people's affairs...Look...I just want to be loved by people that have Jesus in them...that's all...

[Sevenseas]

 

 

SS,

Much love to you In Him,

 

 

Thank you NeedYou and also to you in Christ and thank you for praying for Marti ~ she also has a very difficult relationship with her daughter and has asked for prayer concerning that also...I know you pray.

 

Not ignoring...Just don't have a lot of time everyday...Christian Homeschool my daughter...And my lens is so different now...

 

and fully did not expect all this...Yep...Another lesson...Should be sewing and instead...oh dear...what a mess...I get dizzy trying to keep up with all this...I think I'm supposed to stay real simple...

 

LOL!...ok....I actually like research and difficult subjects, so...but we do have the same Savior and that is what counts.

 

I think somewhere somehow we (no...I think I went off the original posting path...) My interpretation of posting is giving what God and His Word says about it...Building up...Encouraging...Putting down what I'm led to post...instead of all this...We could have gone the Way of: "Yes...God Provides...and given my life story of how I've been raised up from nothingness...after working at a steady job for years and years...and the complete and total education (not formal education) that God can give and brings just from prayer and leading and guiding to The Truth of it all...totally living within our means with no credit...and then God (from years of prayer) bringing into fruition what I've waited so long for...and look what can be done...or getting ideas what others are doing to Grow The Kingdom...anyway...It just went into bashing the beliefs of others...Everything can be looked at with 2 lenses...and sometimes The Spirit is shut down in me...so anyway...

 

I understand better now what you have posted....BUT please understand that this is not about bashing people at all...I can assure you with the deepest part of my heart that is not my intention...I do have a concern

for people caught up in deception and unsound doctrine...stemming, no doubt, from my own experiences in that genre.  Of course there are 2 sides ...or as you say 2 lenses...but I am reminded of the expression

there are 3 sides to the story...yours, mine and the truth.  The truth in this case, being scripture.  See, it alarms me greatly to read the unsound teaching of WOF doctrine that is so far from what scripture actually states.  

I'm not sure about the Holy Spirit being shut down (if I understand you  correctly here)...in my experience, we can only take so much when we have lived a certain way that we thought was the ultimate truth and come to

find out, it was deception.

 

It is a process to unlearn things and understand that your world is about to change.

 

I am not saying you are deceived...I'm saying there is an awful lot to take in here.  And, the surface has barely been scratched.

 

God gives me New Life...And I'm having a hard time seeing "Life" sometimes in what the human parts of us spit out...its always been the human part of us that has just torn me apart...I'm sorry there has been a lot of hurt in your life...There has been a fair share in mine too...That's why Jesus is my best friend...

 

Oh yeah...I understand that about you...and now I have shared some of mine...but as scripture states, Indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted.  II Tim 3:12...and that comes in different forms, so it is 

something that is unavoidable it seems and God does try our faith...He does not tempt us...he tries us to purify us.

 

But I will say it again: I have not looked up any "doctrines" to see what they believe...I have mainly as instructed "heard" the Word preached and have gone into prayer for hours at a time...Read The Word...Let It Permeate My Whole Self-To The Very Best That Is Possible and Have Waited on God for Many Things on The Inside of me To Be Changed...Working out my salvation with fear and trembling...And "experiencing" My God at times-miraculously...supernaturally...just as in The Bible...amazing...but true...and trying my best to not forsake assembling myself together...with fellow believers...but it sure is hard sometimes...Lord, Thank You...For Everything...

 

False teaching can destroy peoples lives.  I believe in your heart you want to honor God and you want to know the truth.  It is the same for me. 

 

I only started paying real attention when the effects of error and deception wrecked havoc in my life and the life of my family.  It was all I could do to try and understand how or why God had let me down but of course

He had never let me down.  It took effort and God's hand on me, as I kept wandering off into sin and using the excuse that I could not trust God anyway, to unravel the mess and start to put the truth into its place

 

Thank you so much for answering me.  

 

7seas, did you notice the post where Kathy said her hands were healed instantly? God doesn't listen to the unrighteous, and she was healed. Absolutely she is going after God with more than her words

 

 

 

 

 

Yet that is not what you find, you hear thousands upon thousands of testimonies of people who have followed what they are being taught from the Bible and they DO reap. I and my wife are NOT in ministry and are not selling millions of CDs and such, and yet we are prospering as we have been learning to sow and reap according what the Holy Spirit has led us to do. Gal 6:6-7 Do not be deceived, God is NOT mocked, for whatsoever a man sows, THAT shall HE reap.

 

 

Rodain can you tell us where your money rewards from  "sowing" have come from ? 

 

 

 

Yes, so long as this is not for some mockery or desecration: the Lord has led me into my harvests and they have come in the form of selling things, or reselling things, new clients, new ideas that have resulted in monetary benefit, debt forgiveness, people just spontaneously (as the harvest at the direction of the Lord of course) GIVING me money (yes it is not just preachers who have had this happen) or things which are worth a particular amount of money. There may be more ways I have not thought of at this moment, but I hope that helps.

 

The system of sowing and reaping both physically and spiritually will not cease until the Earth remaineth not (somewhere around Genesis 8).

 

 

 

Oh.. I see.  In that case, I can claim the same thing.  Only I call it working for a living....God certainly sparks my creativity all the time.  It's not a miracle.  It is normal.

 

People love my photos...my short stories using my dogs as the characters (children especially but even the adults enjoy it)...and my artwork.

 

I appreciate the gifts God has given to me and I pray  and seek God concerning these things regularly.  

 

 

 

However, that is not what those verses are even talking about.   Let's have a look at those verses IN context...for the 2nd time in this thread.

 

 

Brothers and sisters, if someone is caught in a sin, you who live by the Spirit should restore that person gently. But watch yourselves, or you also may be tempted. 2Carry each other’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. 3If anyone thinks they are something when they are not, they deceive themselves. 4Each one should test their own actions. Then they can take pride in themselves alone, without comparing themselves to someone else, 5for each one should carry their own load.6Nevertheless, the one who receives instruction in the word should share all good things with their instructor.

7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers.

 

The passage is actually referring to sin, not some sort of monetary gain.  What you sow in your sinful flesh, you will reap.  It's as plain as day.  

 

And, here is the rest of the chapter:

 

See what large letters I use as I write to you with my own hand!

12Those who want to impress people by means of the flesh are trying to compel you to be circumcised. The only reason they do this is to avoid being persecuted for the cross of Christ. 13Not even those who are circumcised keep the law, yet they want you to be circumcised that they may boast about your circumcision in the flesh. 14May I never boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through which^a the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world. 15Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is the new creation. 16Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule—to^b the Israel of God.

17From now on, let no one cause me trouble, for I bear on my body the marks of Jesus.

 

18The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit, brothers and sisters. Amen.

 

Now, even though circumcision is mentioned, the actual sin seems to be avoidance of the cross...and reading the first portion of Gal 6, it speaks of sin in general and the biblical

injunction to AVOID sin or you will reap the consequences.  NOWHERE is any sort of monetary gain or lost spoken of.  The grace of God and the blessings of God are not performance

based.

 

Jesus tells the story of the prodigal son....did that young man who squandered his fortune have to make it up somehow to his father.  No.  We cannot make up our sin to God....we can

only accept forgiveness of those sins through the blood of Christ.  HOWEVER, we still may reap the consequences of our sins depending on the effects on our own bodies as well as

the effects upon others.   

 

Verse 14 is in direct contrast to WOF doctrine.  WOF doctrine wants it all NOW; while Paul writes he has been crucified to the world...with all its lusts, desires and false systems.

Further, Paul does not want to boast about ANYTHING....except the cross of Christ.

 

14May I never boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through which^a the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world. 

 

The stark reality of the unbelievable contrast of this verse against WOF beliefs is one of the most striking in scripture.  Really, there is no excuse for following after such false

teachings.  Of course, the Bible does explain it:

 

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to

say what their itching ears want to hear.  II Tim. 4:3

 

 

If that is what you want to think 7seas, I will not change your mind. We'll leave it at that. Further discussion after all that has been so far is pointless.

 

 

 

 

Actually, you could not refute what I said, right?  I asked you to support your premise that Spirit was referring to a man's spirit and not God.  I could not find one translation from the Greek that agreed with you and I did look up at least 5.

 

Don't pin the blame on me ...  any time you find your proof, just post and we'll have a discussion that is honest instead of you hiding behind 'you don't like what I said.'

 

 

 

 

 

7seas, did you notice the post where Kathy said her hands were healed instantly? God doesn't listen to the unrighteous, and she was healed. Absolutely she is going after God with more than her words.

 

You know, Kathy and I had a very nice exchange and your insertion into that exchange is...well, IMO, really kind of insensitive.  But I'll address it.

 

God makes the sun shine on the righteous and the unrighteous.

 

Did anyone here call you unrighteous?  Your insinuations are not kind.  If Kathy's hands are better, are you taking credit for that by inserting into our exchange, cause honestly?  I have prayed for healing and various things and God has healed...I have experienced what even WOF would call an answer to prayer.  However, I don't make sure everyone within hearing knows about it.

 

How did Jesus handle most miracles?  He told the one He healed not to say anything in many cases.....there is a reason for that.  WOF does not have the market cornered on the Holy Spirit....I would say more about healings...but I don't want the innocent to be hurt.

 

Kathy has a heart after God.  Why are you taking credit for that?  I have a heart after God...God gave me that heart as He has with Kathy.

 

Kathy was on these boards LONG before you came on here and her posts have always shown she loves God and wants His will.  

 

You see, WOF followers take credit for what God does.  It's shameful.

 

Paul states he would not boast about anything EXCEPT the cross.  But it seems the Bible is just another handbook as WOF'ers create new

doctrine and follow after that instead.

[Guest shiloh357]

 I think testifying is a very powerful tool...but maybe I did leave out something...I've been helped by the ministries in question...at different times over the years...sometimes just a word given on television...sometimes action taken...also I've been to see 2 of them in person...

 

So what if they have done some good things?   Benny Hinn had an extra-marital affair with Paula White.   Should either one them get a pass simply because they some good things in the course of their ministry?    Why should they get a pass on their extravagent and immoral living  just because they did some good things?

 

Why would anyone want to donate to ministries whose leaders are not credible and have disqualified themselves from ministry because of their indescretions?   

 

learned a long time ago that my testimony can not be argued with...So I just state what I have lived through...

 

Concerning what all the fuss is about...That others don't spend their money as they should...or as some think they should...

 

Again..."I am going to make this crystal clear to you"...With everything that is in me...

 

I am not The One True God of Whom They Will Stand Before...and answer to...As will we all...

 

This is not about them spending money in gray areas.  We are talking about money that is donated to them under false pretenses, either that the money is going to ministry to help people or the money is given on the grounds that giving money to these preachers will result in a "financial harvest."  Both are false.   Most of the money goes to feed the lusts  of these false prophets who pervert the Word of God.

 

Yes, they will stand before God and they will give an account and so will YOU.  You will have to explain why who defend and justify their sin and support them in their sinful use of God's money.   That is the thing:  It is not their money.  The money they have in their ministry is not theirs  to spend as they see fit.  That is the problem with your thinking.   You think this is about judging people about how they spend their money.   No!!  This is about how they are spending GOD'S money;  money that is not theirs to spend according to their lusts.

 

But I will say this...This verse is for right now!!! And can change our lives...right now!!! Romans 2:1 Therefore you are inexcusable, O man, whoever you are who judge, for in whatever you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things...

 

That doesn't apply to me for the following reasons:

 

1.  I am not asking for donations. I earn a wage and I live on my earnings.  I don't live on other people's money.   I don't ask people for money telling them it will go to feed and minister to hurting people only to take their money and buy myself a new car and a new house instead of using it the way I promised.

 

2.  They have proven that they are liars, false prophets and adulterers.  I don't lie, I don't issue false prophecies and I have never been married or sexually immoral. 

 

2.  I am not asking people for money and decieving them into thinking that giving me money will make others more prosperous.  

 

So that verse doesn't apply to me as I am not doing what they are accused of doing.

 

So all this fussing is just about saying someone (our brothers and sisters) are just all wrong and are to be judged, juried and executed while they are still here on earth? I don't participate in that any more...I don't know how well that sets with God from where I sit either...He created them too...See it goes a lot deeper cause I know scripture that talks about this as well...and it ain't pretty...Not a good idea to judge, jury and execute anybody...That is what I did without God...I could look at someone and judge them...Whew...Was I wrong...

 

They lie and give false prophesies and/or cheat on their spouses.   They are already under judgment.   I am not judging them.  I am revealing the fact that they are under God's judgment and am exposing them for what they truly are.

[Sevenseas]

Rodain:

 

If that is what you want to think 7seas, I will not change your mind. We'll leave it at that. Further discussion after all that has been so far is pointless.

 

 

 

Why is it pointless?  I think it is pretty good so far.  People may actually be learning some things they did not know about WOF.  I find that a very good thing indeed.

[Sevenseas]

 

Where is it written that you do not have access to what you have stored up in Heaven? Just because it's there doesn't mean you cannot get it. And where does Jesus explain that the treasures we have in Heaven are of eternal value? Why does He use a natural example to describe this? Why doesn't He say "you are storing up things you do not understand yet and will only get them when you enter Heaven"? You are rewriting what He said by insisting that when He said treasure He didn't mean treasure. If He didn't mean treasure, why does the Holy Spirit tell Him to say the word treasure? Surely God is not an idiot and can express what things are supposed to mean...?

 

And HOW then, if that treasure that Jesus explains that we have is in Heaven and cannot be retrieved while on the Earth, is God able to say in Philippians 4:13 that He shall SUPPLY ALL YOUR NEED (or in the Greek, all you DECLARE) according to His riches in glory by Christ Jesus? Those riches in glory (and glory here means wealth) are IN Heaven. How is God getting you RICHES FROM HEAVEN if you said you can't touch riches in Heaven?....That is not adding up.

 

 

 

This is so convoluted and unbiblical as to make one give pause and wonder just how bad things will get before Jesus comes back.

 

I'm serious.

 

 

 

Surely God is not an idiot and can express what things are supposed to mean...?

 

 

No, God is not an idiot.  He is also not a respecter of persons.  So, one should most likely entertain the thought that no one has the liberty to talk God down and call themself

a little god or believe they have somehow harnessed the power of the Almighty.

 

I pray for those caught up in this doctrine of devils (as Shiloh calls it).  There are many people who need to be set free from this false teaching.

 

Some may not understand what I write next, some perhaps will.  

 

I hurt for the purity of the Word of God to be so distorted and the holiness of God trampled on by those who misuse the gifts and pocket money that was never meant for them.  

I hurt that some people think Jesus died to make them rich as he hung on the cross with blood streaming down his face from the thorns pressing into His skull.

 

You know, His words, the words he uttered that day, pretty much still ring true.  "Father forgive them for they know not what they do."

 

I dislike how questions that deal with the wrong teaching of WOF, the twisting of what scripture states, the false doctrine, the lying prophecies, the money accumulation spent

on personal things (pasturing on the flock as the OT calls it) the false representation of the gospel DESPITE the many many scriptures that have been supplied to show how

FALSE those teachings are, are IGNORED.

 

Really?  Just ignore all the proof that shows how wrong Word of Faith doctrine is?

 

Presumption and the desire for worldly goods is not the gospel of Jesus Christ.  Feelings are not an indicator of the Holy Spirit.  Miracles are not even an indicator of the Holy Spirit

because these verses from Matthew tell us that false miracles and false spirits imitate the work of the Holy Spirit.

 

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

 

If you read that chapter, you will read where we are told to ASK.  We are not told to command.

 

There is this verse in the OT:  Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.

                                                 Isaiah 45:11

 

And I have heard that verse used as an excuse to tell God what to do, but that is not what the verse is saying.

 

This, is how it should be understood:  11. Ask … command—Instead of striving with Me in regard to My purposes, your wisdom is in prayer to ask, and even command Me, in so far as it is for My glory, and for your real good (Mr 11:24; Joh 16:23, 13, latter part of the verse; 1Jo 3:22).

 

To state that we can command God and He must do what we ask, is a corrupt understanding.  God does not put Himself UNDER a human being.  Wake up.  

 

What kind of God would allow His own creation to supercede His wisdom and knowledge?  Do you realize how presumptuous and wrong...just plain wrong....that teaching is?

 

There is nothing in scripture to support these erroneous teachings.  The teachings are based on man's desire to be like a god...remember the devil's words to Eve?

 

"You will be like gods?"  Can't you hear and see the echo of that same deception at work in the world today?

 

There is nothing new under the sun.  The devil still wants you to think you can be a god..or just like God.  Don't let him fool you.

[Guest ninhao]

But I will say this...This verse is for right now!!! And can change our lives...right now!!! Romans 2:1 Therefore you are inexcusable, O man, whoever you are who judge, for in whatever you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things...

 

 

 

Hello NeedYouLord,

 

This verse of judging is specifically concerning hypocrites. ie. people who do the same thing as they accuse another of doing.

 

 

Rom 2:1  Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

 

 

Do you suggest there should be no correction of false doctrines inside the Church ?

[Guest]

I still have that question that you haven't answered, Rodain. It's a post 145. The question was:

 

 

 

"Would you still love Jesus if you lost everything?"

 

 

 

That means all the toys are gone. No job, home, car, etc. You're on the street, the sun's going down and you're sitting on the corner watching everyone else heading home at the end of the day -- and you have nowhere to go. Sounds like a pretty ugly situation, doesn't it? It was -- because I lived it, and all I had that day was Jesus.

[TheCurseOfTheRodain]

I still have that question that you haven't answered, Rodain. It's a post 145. The question was:

 

 

 

"Would you still love Jesus if you lost everything?"

 

 

 

That means all the toys are gone. No job, home, car, etc. You're on the street, the sun's going down and you're sitting on the corner watching everyone else heading home at the end of the day -- and you have nowhere to go. Sounds like a pretty ugly situation, doesn't it? It was -- because I lived it, and all I had that day was Jesus.

 

 

Hi Walla2009,

 

I don't think you've been my reading my posts very carefully. In at least 2 of them I informed all that I was once HOMELESS. That means I didn't have A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G. When I fell in love with Jesus it took a little while before I got ANYTHING. When I grew up I actually had a lot, then my Jesus-less life of stupidity and sin I became homeless for a while. But God gave me places to stay until He got things fixed in my life and started bringing me up. I love Jesus more today than I ever have, and I have remembered the Lord my God as I have come into my Promised Land - things have not and will not change me, I stay focused on Jesus DAILY.

 

This is why I posted my last post above my friend, because people are set on what they want to believe already in certain instances (like my encouraging others to walk in tongues, healing and prosperity), and they have a reason to talk themselves out of these things and this thread is nearly at 10 pages. For me, I believe I have qualified virtually everything if not everything. Some people are becoming upset, and going by Jesus' example, He didn't sit around spending all His time trying to convince to receive healing or anything else; the Pharisees wasted all their time talking themselves out of what Jesus was offering to follow Him, even though the Scriptures say the power of the Lord was present to heal THEM (wow! think about what God won't do for you if before the NC He was willing to do that for these evil-hearted jerks who hated Him and conspired to murder Him...). He said what God told Him to say and that is what I have done here (yes I can and do hear from God; some people seem to ignore where Jesus said His sheep hear His voice and other Scripture along the same line).

 

So again, because I am trying to teach about prosperity does not mean that is my god - Heaven forbid; prosperity is one promise, there are many others, and I would encourage ALL Believers not to leave anything on the table (I would hate to get up there and find out I left anything in Heaven that I was entitled to or should have had here on the Earth after Jesus went through all that for me and the Father prepared it all for me, I would not like to face that moment - and I encourage all to think about that and bring the matter to the Father). I truly follow Jesus everyday and am IN love with Him and the Father. I have a very personal relationship with them and am very close to them. John 14 is probably my favorite chapter in the Bible.

 

So lastly, just bring the issue of tongues, healing and prosperity to the Father - if what I have said is true you have much to gain, for your enjoyment and His glory, and if they are all lies (though NeedYouLord has already proved otherwise) then let Him tell you, but don't go by opinion or past experiences, but only the Holy Spirit and His Word.

 

All of these things I have done that I have listed in this thread and received and walked in aren't because I am more special or better than anyone else, or because I have more faith than anyone, but because simply I have believed what He said and I haven't let anyone talk me out of it, not Believers, not the Devil, not myself. Anyone can have what He says following this. And when and if, as I have, you run into walls or things didn't go the way you thought they would, don't give up or get mad or become numb, but rather seek God and find out what you missed or what is wrong, and He'll tell you if you're serious.

 

Be blessed!

Edited December 14, 2013 by TheCurseOfTheRodain

[TheCurseOfTheRodain]

7seas, you seem to be sincere in your zealous pursuit of the destruction of Word of Faith, but it is misdirected. I don't know what happened with you and someone who said they were Word of Faith, but clearly it has affected you.

 

If any person follows a so-called doctrine, especially at the expense of the Word,he/she is not doing what Jesus said. He said "Follow Me." that is our command. That is what I do daily and nightly. I do not follow a doctrine. If I had one, it would be "Believe the Word, not man's experiences or opinions." So, to recap, I follow the Bible. What I learn from Word of Faith preachers I check in the Word and I apply it in my life and get results by the favor of God. The main thing is I am teachable. I told God at the beginning I wanted Him to lead me into all the Truth and that I would be always teachable for Him. Being teachable has opened the door for everything.

 

If a preacher making a mistake is all it takes to disqualify everything they say, then I guess we should get rid of all the disciples that were present when Paul had to rebuke Peter for trampling on the finished work of the Cross that Jesus secured for us. That would be a lot of Scripture we'd have to get rid of, because these guys said and did a lot that was in contradiction to what Jesus did for us and God used Paul to set them straight.

Yet, even so, look at all the miracles and things that were being done in spite of that. Notice they were not perfect, but yet, their words are Scripture and they got results and were teachable and received correction. They didn't pipe off at Paul and say who do you think you are?...

Anyway, I am sure someone is getting something good out of this, as you have pointed out.

Edited December 14, 2013 by TheCurseOfTheRodain

[Guest shiloh357]

7seas, you seem to be sincere in your zealous pursuit of the destruction of Word of Faith, but it is misdirected. I don't know what happened with you and someone who said they were Word of Faith, but clearly it has affected you.

 

The problem with the Word of Faith movement is that it is the anti-thesis of faith.  It is one of several cults that uses and peverts the Bible.  In this case, it perverts the Bible to feed the flesh.

 

 

If any person follows a so-called doctrine, especially at the expense of the Word,he/she is not doing what Jesus said. He said "Follow Me." that is our command. That is what I do daily and nightly. I do not follow a doctrine.

 

Yes you do follow a doctrine.  You evidently don't understand the nature of doctrine.  The word, "doctrine" means "teaching."  You follow teachings, so you follow doctrine. It is false doctrine, but doctrine nonetheless.   Your view that God is here to serve you is a doctrine.  The notion that you are a little god is a doctrine.  The prosperity gospel is a doctrine.   They are all heresies from hell, but they are doctrines by definition.

 

 

 

So, to recap, I follow the Bible. What I learn from Word of Faith preachers I check in the Word and I apply it in my life and get results by the favor of God. The main thing is I am teachable. I told God at the beginning I wanted Him to lead me into all the Truth and that I would be always teachable for Him. Being teachable has opened the door for everything.If I had one,

 

The stuff you have revealed about what you believe is 100% the teachings of Copeland, Hagin, etc.  You have parroted them perfectly.  I took some of your comments and googled them and found many places where they completely agree with what Copeland and others teach. In some cases, almost word for word.  That doesn't strike me as someone who is following Copeland at an arm's length.  It reveals that you have bought into their teachings, hook line and sinker.

 

 

If a preacher making a mistake is all it takes to disqualify everything they say, then I guess we should get rid of all the disciples that were present when Paul had to rebuke Peter for trampling on the finished work of the Cross that Jesus secured for us. That would be a lot of Scripture we'd have to get rid of, because these guys said and did a lot that was in contradiction to what Jesus did for us and God used Paul to set them straight.

 

A mistake???  Really???   A mistake is when you forget to turn the oven off before leaving the house.  A mistake is locking your keys in the car.   These prosperity teachers are not guilty of mistakes.  It is not mistakes that disqualify them from ministry.  Let me give just one example of two people disqualified from ministry:

 

Benny Hinn's adulterous affair with Paula White was not a "mistake."   Neither of them made a mistake.  It was an egregious and public sin. Benny Hinn's wife divorced him over it.   They tried to blame the divorce at first on the notion that his wife was stressed out because of the ministry.   They initially lied to cover up the affair, because this was a scandal.   But pictures of Benny Hinn and Paula White began to surface and the cat was out of the bag and He finally had to admit that he had an affair.

 

 Paula White's show has been cancelled from TBN, but since Benny Hinn is their favorite son AND their money maker twice a year at their "praise-a-thons,"  TBN bent over backwards for him and he finally managed to reconcile with his wife.  Paula White was thrown under the bus because she is a lightweight and didn't have one tenth of the following that Benny Hinn had.  TBN couldn't afford to lose him, but they dropped Paula White like a bad habit. 

 

, He is also disqualifed because none of his public propheicies ever came to pass.  Benny Hinn is smart.  He knows that he can make a sensational prophecy about God destroying the homosexual community with fire, for example, but make the propecy 5 to ten years down the road and never mention it again.   In doing so, he gives himself some wiggle room and in ten years, hopefully no one will remember.  He wil have them distracted on to something else.  That is not a mistake.

 

Paul rebuked Peter for a theological error that Peter was involved in.  That in no way compares the egregious sins committed by Paula White and Benny Hinn and it also doesn't speak well for TBN who aided Benny Hinn in an attempt to lie and cover up their sin.

 

Yet, even so, look at all the miracles and things that were being done in spite of that. Notice they were not perfect, but yet, their words are Scripture and they got results and were teachable and received correction. They didn't pipe off at Paul and say who do you think you are?...

Anyway, I am sure someone is getting something good out of this, as you have pointed out.

 

Signs and wonders...  Even Satan can do signs and wonders.   Those are not the assurance that someone is a true minister of the Lord.   Paul and the other apostles were not living in wealth and prosperity.  If you read the book of Acts and Paul's own description of his ministry, there is nothing about his minstry that indicates that he was rich and living the high life.  He was a man beaten, imprisoned, who had to work for every penny he had in order to fund his ministry.  Paul never took a penny from other believers. 

 

If you want to imitate anyone in ministry, Paul is the man to imitate, not Benny HInn or Copeland.