Karen C. Posted August 9, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 34 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 662 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/15/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/01/1960 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Sue~ As a thief in the night, they will not be caught off guard. Those who are looking are those who will be going. Not AFTER the trib starts then they would KNOW to be looking. This will be for His Church. Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation A second time is not the Second Coming. Deception is the reason. If you are unsettled in what you say is a "non- consequental issue", you will be easy prey to more harmful deception. Our church does not take a stance on this. It is up to the individuals to decide that for themselves. Your Pastor doesn't teach on 1/3 of the Word of God? Blessings, Karen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trust & Obey Posted August 9, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,091 Content Per Day: 0.16 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 9, 2005 I have a question I've asked several times now and I don't think anyone has answered this. Why is it so important for pre-trib people to convince others that there will be a pre-trib rapture? I can understand post-tribbers wanting to tell people so that people will be ready to suffer for Christ, but why try to convince people of a pre-trib rapture? What is your reasoning? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So you will be ready for the return of Christ at any moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ's Free Servant Posted August 10, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 197 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,461 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/18/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1949 Author Share Posted August 10, 2005 Your Pastor doesn't teach on 1/3 of the Word of God? Blessings, Karen <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Our church teaches End Times and the return of Christ, etc., we just don't force a particular view on pre-trib, post-trib, etc. upon our people. We explain to them our views, but we don't believe it is that clear one way or the other to the point to where we can say this is the only way possible it could happen. We believe the important thing is to teach them that Jesus is coming again and they need to be ready for his return, but we also believe we should teach them to be ready to suffer for Christ, if need be. I believe God has called us to raise up an army for him for these last days, so that is what we are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eponine Posted August 11, 2005 Share Posted August 11, 2005 Sue~ As a thief in the night, they will not be caught off guard. Those who are looking are those who will be going. Not AFTER the trib starts then they would KNOW to be looking. This will be for His Church. Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation A second time is not the Second Coming. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Are you saying that someone who is not looking will not be going? It seems that a post-trib view can take the command to look more literally. If the rapture comes at any moment, you have to say that the command is figurative. You, personally, are not standing on your front lawn watching the sky all day. When the Bible says "look" does it really mean, "make sure there is not sin in your life and you are working for God so that when Christ comes and surprises you, you will not be caught doing something you shoudn't"? On the contrary, the command is very literal. After the 7 years, we will have a good idea of when Jesus will come. We won't know the exact day or hour, but we will be able to stand outside and actually watch the sky. Why does second time not mean second coming? He does not say there is a third one. Can you prove this point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halifaxchristian Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 722 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 11, 2005 If you are around for the tribulation...I should hope you will be dead by the end of it. You are going to reject the mark, aren't you??? God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ's Free Servant Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 197 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,461 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/18/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1949 Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 If you are around for the tribulation...I should hope you will be dead by the end of it. You are going to reject the mark, aren't you??? God bless. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I believe there will be Christian survivors of the tribulation. They will have to form independently run communities where they use a bartyr system in order to support themselves, but it can be done. And, God can protect them. Many will die, but I believe there will be survivors. I also believe the "watching" is both figurative and literal. I believe we are all to be watching in the sense of making sure our hearts are right with God so that we are not overcome with sin when he returns, but I also believe we will know when his return is near by the signs, as the Bible teaches, and that we will be looking to the sky anxiously awaiting his return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest anotherchristiangirl Posted August 11, 2005 Share Posted August 11, 2005 (edited) I have been studying this from the bible diligently.. along with some bible studies.. I'm am studying out both views.. I never heard of no pre tribulation rapture ever in my life.. and I'm 39+ until just a few months ago i was watching someone of TV that was teaching Christians will go through the tribulation.. I emailed him a question.. which I ask below, but I never did get an answer from his ministry.... anyway.. I want to know the TRUTH.... if the pre trib rapture is true .. then I want to KNOW it so I don't miss it by not being ready when the bridegroom comes ... If its not true then I think I need to start digging a hole in the ground to hide my family in.... I'm having panic attacks about this.. The tribulation is going to be the most horrible thing that every came upon the earth and Christians will be treated worse than the Hollocust..or any thing any other martyr or Christian endured in the past.. because it says in the bible it will be the worst that ever was and ever will be.... and I doubt that many will survive it.. I have two small children.. my question is .. the day they come and take me and my family away to get the mark of the beast... and they take my children from me.. and I decline the mark.. and then I am taken off to be killed or tortured or whatever horrible thing they decided to do to me before they kill me... .. what will happen to my children.. what will they do to my children??? I will tell you this right now. that I will not leave them on this earth alone without me .. what will happen to them? what will become of them? I'm not sure what I will do. I can't bear the thought of my babies being tortured in any way.. or me being killed and then someone keeps them alive while I'm not on the earth and forces them to have the mark.. or whatever.. use your imagination.. what ever happens guaranteed it will be evil... why would Jesus allow this? Especially for Christains who have hope in him? If in fact there is no rapture and no being caught up in the sky before all this horrible stuff.. then .I probably will gather my family together in our garage and turn on my car put on some Christian music .. and fall asleep forver .. and just pray that God has mercy on us. or at least mercy on my children.. for their sake.. I don't care what happens to me.. I will rot in hell .. for them to go to heaven. I proabably would choose to rot in hell so I can keep them safe on this earth.. unless they kill us all at the same time.. then that will be ok.. I just doesnt seem like Jesus to allow us to go through this.. havent we been through enough.. I know my life has been excruciating.. I don't know.. maybe I'm being selfish.. actaully that probably was selfish to ask taht.. but that is not my point.. what my point is is in the paragraphc above.. Also another thought to ponder is..I already made my decision for Christ.. why do I have to be "forced " to do it again under brutal circumstances.. I am willingly choosing him now.. and apparently that is not enough -- this doesnt make sense.. like we have to be tested in the worst possible circumstance one last time to make sure we made a decision.. if that is the case.. then what about the dead people ? When and how do they get forced to re make their decision for Christ? Edited August 11, 2005 by anotherchristiangirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trust & Obey Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,091 Content Per Day: 0.16 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 11, 2005 anotherchristiangirl, my understanding of Scripture leads me to believe that it is true. Those who say it isn't true "for this reason or another" use passages that are easily explained, but not readily understood in their context by the person espousing mid or post-trib. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ's Free Servant Posted August 12, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 197 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,461 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/18/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1949 Author Share Posted August 12, 2005 anotherchristiangirl, my understanding of Scripture leads me to believe that it is true. Those who say it isn't true "for this reason or another" use passages that are easily explained, but not readily understood in their context by the person espousing mid or post-trib. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Bottom line - be ready!!!! REPENT of your sin, turn to God, surrender your all to him, make yourself available for whatever he wants for whatever time you have remaining and obey him and seek after him with all your hearts. No one is going to win the debate about the pre-trib/post-trib thing. It will go on and on forever. The point of this post was to get people to think about their lives. Read the first article. Get past the parts about proving post-trib and see the meat of what the author is saying. He is saying that we live in an instant gratification society where we expect even Christianity to come in a nice, neat little package with a pink bow and the surprise inside is one big, huge deception. Too many people today are teaching this "instant gratification" kind of Christianity and so people no longer fear God, they don't hunger or thirst after righteousness, they don't surrender their wills to the master, they don't repent and are even told they don't have to repent, so they think the Christian life is one big joy ride that ends with Christ swooping them up in the clouds before they have to suffer anything. The false prophets in the Bible told people what their itching ears wanted to hear. They told them nice things and that nothing bad was going to happen to them, but the true prophets confronted sin, they warned of God's judgments and they taught repentance and full surrender to God. Stop spending so much energy on trying to prove one theory over the other and see what was at the root of this thread. It was not to try to prove post-trib, but rather to help people see that they are believing lies and are being deceived into thinking that Christianity is a free ride. Yes, salvation is a free gift, but to those who repent and who turn to God. Jesus said that whoever wants to save his life will lose it but whoever loses his life for his sake will find it. Let's divert our energies away from trying to win a debate and let's focus on how we can draw near to God and how we can seek him with all our hearts and how we can surrender our wills to his will and how we can tell as many as possible of his soon return. The important thing is he is coming again. God is the one who decides when. Let's just be ready. Let's be about his work when he returns. He's not going to care who won this debate. The only winners are those who fully commit their lives to Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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