HisWordIsSufficient Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 342 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 The incredible Faith of Paul, or Martin Luther, or Katherine Kuhlman, or Oral Roberts... Great men and women of what? FAITH! Only believe. Yeah, good ole Oral! Oral "give me millions of dollars or I'll die" Roberts! Let's see, isnt' Katherine Kuhlman the one whose grave Benny Hinn visits to get anointed? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hmm, someone doesnt seem to be working in Love. You have issues. These people were used greatly by God to heal and preach. You seem very bitter... is it because you dont have as much faith as them? Are you jealous that God was able to use them and your still sitting in front of your computer complaining about it instead of leading by example? Of course money is going to follow a huge ministry. Look at how much of it, (most of it) went into holding huge healing crusades and the like. These great men and women of God are bringing MILLIONS of souls into the kingdom and all you can do is complain about them making a living from it. They have to make money somehow. There job, is Jesus. Jesus commands us to GO, so they did, and thats there job. Full time ministry. They need to live somehow. And besides, when you co operate with the Holy Spirit as Katherin did, surely your life will be abundant. Its not like these people kept all the tithes and offerings to themselves, they used it to expand the kingdom of God and the Gospel. You need a renewing of your mind. I was there once. I pray The Lord will show you truth in this, and help you to love those that God chose to do these works Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pax Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 961 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/30/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 I just wanted to say that I'm a non-christian but grew up Pentecostal. I remember reading religious tracts in church by a flaming fundy named Jack Chick telling me how Catholics were in the wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pax Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 961 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/30/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 I grew up Catholic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisWordIsSufficient Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 342 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 I just wanted to say that I'm a non-christian but grew up Pentecostal. I remember reading religious tracts in church by a flaming fundy named Jack Chick telling me how Catholics were in the wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiosh Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,663 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/20/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 I just wanted to say that I'm a non-christian but grew up Pentecostal. I remember reading religious tracts in church by a flaming fundy named Jack Chick telling me how Catholics were in the wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiosh Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,663 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/20/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 The incredible Faith of Paul, or Martin Luther, or Katherine Kuhlman, or Oral Roberts... Great men and women of what? FAITH! Only believe. Yeah, good ole Oral! Oral "give me millions of dollars or I'll die" Roberts! Let's see, isnt' Katherine Kuhlman the one whose grave Benny Hinn visits to get anointed? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hmm, someone doesnt seem to be working in Love. You have issues. These people were used greatly by God to heal and preach. You seem very bitter... is it because you dont have as much faith as them? Are you jealous that God was able to use them and your still sitting in front of your computer complaining about it instead of leading by example? Of course money is going to follow a huge ministry. Look at how much of it, (most of it) went into holding huge healing crusades and the like. These great men and women of God are bringing MILLIONS of souls into the kingdom and all you can do is complain about them making a living from it. They have to make money somehow. There job, is Jesus. Jesus commands us to GO, so they did, and thats there job. Full time ministry. They need to live somehow. And besides, when you co operate with the Holy Spirit as Katherin did, surely your life will be abundant. Its not like these people kept all the tithes and offerings to themselves, they used it to expand the kingdom of God and the Gospel. You need a renewing of your mind. I was there once. I pray The Lord will show you truth in this, and help you to love those that God chose to do these works <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just a passing comment............how much money poured into Jesus' ministry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritLedEd Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 91 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/21/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 My bible says, "And these signs will accompany those who believe". Why are you making excuses. If those signs do not accompany you, just admit it...and go find another religion. Mark 16 is actually referring to the power of belief. Your beliefs have the power to create and to destroy, they are either empowering or limiting. Have you heard about the placebo effect? People who are told a drug will have a certain effect will many times experience that effect even when given a pill without those properties. I once read about a study done on pregnant women who were experiencing morning sickness. The doctor gave the women a new miracle drug that was guaranteed to work...and it did on 7 out of 10 of them. Funny thing though, the doctor was actually giving them syrup of ipecac, which is a drug used to induce vomiting. But because they believed they would be cured, the powerful vomit inducing drug had no effect on them, and actually stopped them from vomiting. Therefore, since the mind is capable of these things, and if you believe as you claim to, those signs mentioned by Mark would be childs play. Tubal Cain, As you examine the Scripture, you might want to look at its teaching on the sovereignty of God. You seem to be confusing Christianity with the Phariseeism that Jesus stood against (and still does). Their "religion" was all show and no substance. They sought adulation from people as a sign of their "holiness". Read Matthew 4:6. When Jesus said "you shall not put the Lord your God to the test", He was saying "I am God and, therefore, I am not subject to anyone's approval or disapproval; I do not perform for your acceptance." Christianity is not a circus where magicians do miracles to wow the audience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricH Posted September 20, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 366 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,933 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 212 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/21/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2005 I grew up Catholic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritLedEd Posted September 25, 2005 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 91 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/21/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 25, 2005 R.W. Schambach also claimed to raise a man from the dead. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tubal Cain: You like to refer to Mark 16. There is a phrase in Mk 16:17 that you think means that these signs have to constitute a miracle-on-demand program - "And these signs will accompany those who believe: IN MY NAME THEY WILL......." Check out Luke 11:29 - "As the crowds increased, Jesus said, ' this is a wicked generation. It asks for a miraculous sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.' " That's another proof that no one can order up miracles like you would order a Big Mac at McDonald's. Also, in Exodus 33:19b, the Lord told Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion." It may be that someone was resurrected in one of R. W. Schambach's meetings. If it did happen, it was not because God was required to do it. Nor was it a product of some kind of spiritual assembly line. It was a voluntary, sovereign act on the part of our Creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiosh Posted September 25, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,663 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/20/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 25, 2005 R.W. Schambach also claimed to raise a man from the dead. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tubal Cain: You like to refer to Mark 16. There is a phrase in Mk 16:17 that you think means that these signs have to constitute a miracle-on-demand program - "And these signs will accompany those who believe: IN MY NAME THEY WILL......." Check out Luke 11:29 - "As the crowds increased, Jesus said, ' this is a wicked generation. It asks for a miraculous sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.' " That's another proof that no one can order up miracles like you would order a Big Mac at McDonald's. Also, in Exodus 33:19b, the Lord told Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion." It may be that someone was resurrected in one of R. W. Schambach's meetings. If it did happen, it was not because God was required to do it. Nor was it a product of some kind of spiritual assembly line. It was a voluntary, sovereign act on the part of our Creator. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, Luke 11:29 does say that there would be no signs, but you and I have both read that there were many signs. Signs accompany those with faith in God. In John 20:30 Jesus did many other miraculous signs in the presence of his disciples, which are not recorded in this book. In Acts 2:22 "Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know." It baffles me why people want to be known as christians, yet they do not want to put any effort into achieving the things that their god said they would achieve if they were true believers. You just want to pay lip service and make up excuses why the bible doesn't really mean what it clearly says. You don't want the truth, because the truth would require you to prove something...your FAITH! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have personally spoken to at least 4 people who have received or witnessed miraculous healing. I've heard of many others here in my area---but have actually talked to these 4 in person. I must admit, though, I've yet to see someone raised from the dead. TC, I appreciate your questions. We need to examine what we profess to believe. It is good to adress it here, and have time to study and pray about the answers. Jesus does say that if I had faith the size of a mustard seed I could move mountains. I believe, Lord, help my unbelief. Peace, Fiosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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