Covenants

[DeighAnn]

2 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Just discussing, but maybe we could consider that while it doesn't matter in one sense, it does matter in the sense of understanding HOW the Lord has fulfilled these prophecies of His.   And WHY...God making the nations one with Israel in a literal sense...?  could that be in order to demonstrate literally to the Jews and all of us that He is not just the God of the Jews but of the whole world...?

I agree with you.  God is the GOD of everyone who wants Him to be their GOD.  If we really think about it, it doesn't matter WHO your mom and dad were or their blood line.  WE will ALL be in spiritual bodies, there will be NO BLOOD.  That alone tells us God uses us and divides us and brings us back together for HIS PURPOSES, to get His Plan done.  

There is so much stuff going on all at once it is hard to ever point to one thing and say this is what it is about.  But here is what I believe it all comes down to.  

We were created for HIS PLEASURE.  

God loved us first and wants us all to come to love Him and to come to love HIS WAYS.  

To truly 'LOVE' another being REQUIRES that being have choices.

The words of the LORD are pure words as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

God created all people.  He chose a man, Abram, and used that bloodline to prove HE IS GOD by using them to get HIS LAWS written, prophecy given and fulfilled, and bring about His BIRTH. 

We have those who heard the Truth of Gods words,  and chose.  Those who chose life,  live on,  those who chose death die.  Those who never had a chance to choose, will be resurrected for the Lords Day,  so they can choose.  

Those who chose life will rule and reign with Him, those who chose death will be delivered up at the GWTJ after those resurrected (the never chose) will stand in judgment and be of the 2nd resurrection or 2nd death   


 

[DeighAnn]

4 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Also want to hopefully contribute a little something about covenant....that it's not just contractual, but relational.  Being in covenant with someone is a relationship that is walked out together, the two parties together.  It's not just the contractual details, but entering into a relationship together.  'Me being with you' and 'you being with me' over the course of a lifetime.  God wasn't entering into a business arrangement but into a personal love relationship...which the bible likens to a spousal relationship.  That is the wonderful amazing aspect of covenant with the Almighty God...what is man that He is mindful of us?  Amazing LOVE.

Genesis 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.

Genesis 15:2 And Abram said, LORD God, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?

Genesis 15:3 And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir.

Genesis 15:4 And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.

Genesis 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.

Genesis 15:6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

Genesis 15:7 And he said unto him, I am the LORD that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees, to give thee this land to inherit it.

Genesis 15:8 And he said, LORD God, whereby shall I know that I shall inherit it?

Genesis 15:9 And he said unto him, Take me an heifer of three years old, and a she goat of three years old, and a ram of three years old, and a turtledove, and a young pigeon.

Genesis 15:10 And he took unto him all these, and divided them in the midst, and laid each piece one against another: but the birds divided he not.

Genesis 15:11 And when the fowls came down upon the carcases, Abram drove them away.


Genesis 15:12 And when the sun was going down, a deep sleep fell upon Abram; and, lo, an horror of great darkness fell upon him.
 

Genesis 15:13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not their's, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;

Genesis 15:14 And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance.

Genesis 15:15 And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age.

Genesis 15:16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

Genesis 15:17 And it came to pass, that, when the sun went down, and it was dark, behold a smoking furnace, and a burning lamp that passed between those pieces.

Genesis 15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

Just pointing to him sleeping. Food for thought. 

[Anne2]

1 hour ago, tim_from_pa said:

Makes perfect sense.  I am far more specific about nations and Kings, but what you stated is precious because you came to a biblical conclusion and the end result is the same. In other words, what you stated is how the prophetic history of Israel would play out if we take the covenants and prophecies at face value and not just spiritualize everything.  Think of Father Joseph in Egypt.  He was not recognized by his brethren and became as a Gentile and with much power, too. These same peoples from him as Hosea stated would be known as "not my people" (thus appear as Gentiles) and yet becoming "sons of the Living God".  Meanwhile, Judah, the Jews, would be known and troubled throughout their history.  Since we are talking about the Kingdom here, it's worthy to note that we are not merely interested in personal salvation, but setting up an ultimate Kingdom as an extension to what Israel was in the bible. The physical promises work with the spiritual (grace).  This is why the promises to Israel are still good yet... all of it.  If it were not, Jews would not be here, Christians would not be here, nothing would be here nor would God be obligated to grant anything to anyone.

Joseph is quite interesting. His vision/prophecy foretold to his family.

Josephs doubled dream/s As Pharaoh's doubled dream.

Gen 41: 32  And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass. {established … : or, prepared of God }

1. His brothers: hatred spurred...

Reign and dominion over brothers put in  obeisance

Gen 37: 5   And Joseph dreamed a dream, and he told it his brethren: and they hated him yet the more.
6  And he said unto them, Hear, I pray you, this dream which I have dreamed:
7  For, behold, we were binding sheaves in the field, and, lo, my sheaf arose, and also stood upright; and, behold, your sheaves stood round about, and made obeisance to my sheaf.
8  And his brethren said to him, Shalt thou indeed reign over us? or shalt thou indeed have dominion over us? And they hated him yet the more for his dreams, and for his words.

A second time.....
2. Fathers rebuke is spurred

11 stars do obeyance, along with the sun and the moon. bow down to him

Ge 37:9  And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.
10  And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?

Obeisance and bowed to Joseph...
Gen 48:29  And the time drew nigh that Israel must die: and he called his son Joseph, and said unto him, If now I have found grace in thy sight, put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh, and deal kindly and truly with me; bury me not, I pray thee, in Egypt:
30  But I will lie with my fathers, and thou shalt carry me out of Egypt, and bury me in their buryingplace. And he said, I will do as thou hast said.
31  And he said, Swear unto me. And he sware unto him. And Israel bowed himself upon the bed’s head.
 

This all come about to Joseph in his ascent among All Egypt.....(Gentiles)

To the saving of many lives....among all nations

[Heleadethme]

On 4/21/2022 at 12:51 PM, tim_from_pa said:

Makes perfect sense.  I am far more specific about nations and Kings, but what you stated is precious because you came to a biblical conclusion and the end result is the same. In other words, what you stated is how the prophetic history of Israel would play out if we take the covenants and prophecies at face value and not just spiritualize everything.  Think of Father Joseph in Egypt.  He was not recognized by his brethren and became as a Gentile and with much power, too. These same peoples from him as Hosea stated would be known as "not my people" (thus appear as Gentiles) and yet becoming "sons of the Living God".  Meanwhile, Judah, the Jews, would be known and troubled throughout their history.  Since we are talking about the Kingdom here, it's worthy to note that we are not merely interested in personal salvation, but setting up an ultimate Kingdom as an extension to what Israel was in the bible. The physical promises work with the spiritual (grace).  This is why the promises to Israel are still good yet... all of it.  If it were not, Jews would not be here, Christians would not be here, nothing would be here nor would God be obligated to grant anything to anyone.

I find these are hard things to get my head around.  That there is much allegory in scripture is an important key to understanding though.  Scripture itself talks about similitudes/allegories/parables/ensamples.  Here, I'll post the ones that have come to my notice:

The Word made flesh, Jesus/Yeshua speaks in parables:

Mat 13:34-35

All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

Hos 12:10

I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

Eze 20:49

Then said I, Ah Lord GOD! they say of me, Doth he not speak parables?

Gal 4:24-26

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

 

The land of promise is an allegory for the Holy Spirit and eternal life through Him, it speaks to a heavenly inheritance.  And what the Lord made clear to me the last few days is that where we see the scripture talking about "GATHERING" Israel back to the land is a beautiful allegory for being gathered in Christ/Messiah, the gospel.  (Being scattered is an allegory for being lost, dead in sins and separated from God and His kingdom.)  There is a biblical principle of first the natural, then the spiritual.  I am wondering if Israel being re-gathered and restored to the land in our time is a sign in the natural realm for what will happen spiritually....that she will be re-gathered in Christ/Messiah, or at least a significant harvest of souls in Israel.  (But I expect there will be some serious times to get through before that happens.)

Some lovely scriptures about being gathered:

Gen 49:10

The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Jhn 11:52

And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

Eph 1:10

That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him

The new testament language of “gathering” is not accidental....it is taken from the old testament scriptures and reveals what the gathering of Israel in the old testament was talking about.

 

Gen 29:7-8

And he said, Lo, it is yet high day, neither is it time that the cattle should be gathered together: water ye the sheep, and go and feed them.

And they said, We cannot, until all the flocks be gathered together, and till they roll the stone from the well's mouth; then we water the sheep.

(Beautiful allegory for the stone rolled away from Messiah’s grave and the resurrection...only in God’s time, the fulness of times, and only then could the sheep be gathered to Him and in Him.)

Gen 41:49

And Joseph gathered corn as the sand of the sea, very much, until he left numbering; for it was without number. (and where else have we heard about being as innumerable as the sand of the sea?)

Hos 1:11

Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

 

So many lovely references to Israel being gathered in the bible, I could go on and on all day!  😊

 

Oops nearly forgot this one!

Deu 30:3-6

That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.

If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:

And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.

And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

\o/

Edited April 25, 2022 by Heleadethme

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Heleadethme said:

I am wondering if Israel being re-gathered and restored to the land in our time is a sign in the natural realm for what will happen spiritually....that she will be re-gathered in Christ/Messiah, or at least a significant harvest of souls in Israel.  (But I expect there will be some serious times to get through before that happens.)

I believe, The Lord Jesus Christ has been gathering 'the lost sheep/Israel' since He brought us the GOOD NEWS and set us up under the New Covenant Church.  They/we had been scattered through out the world 500 plus years before Jesus was born, and had become 'the nations',  no longer knowing who we once were.  We populated the world, as dust of the earth and sands of the sea and stars of the sky and as we heard the Gospel, spread it to each other and to the world, and that is how Christ has been/still is gathering 'CHRIST's men' back to Himself and not losing one.  Those who are His (sheep) hear His voice and follow.  When we realize the reality of this, it is easy to understand why two people can hear the words of God at the same time,  and one of them be CHANGED instantly,  while the other may or may not be.  

It is spiritual.  It is literal.  It is past, present and future.  It is here on earth and it is in heaven at the same time.  We JUST don't presently 'see' it.   

Matthew 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Matthew 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in My name, there am I in the midst of them.

BOUND IN HEAVEN.  Made me wait forever before I started discussing the words of God.  

The earth will be what it would have been had Christ been accepted 2000 years ago.  

Matthew 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Matthew 3:3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Heaven on earth.  


I personally don't believe there will be a physical gathering to Israel of the 'House of Israel/the church' until His return.  I believe that is why Judah was blinded to Christ because they had the job of keeping Gods laws and would be going back to Israel to become the Nation again at the end of the punishment and to be a sign for the 'end times'.  But the 'two sticks' aren't brought together as one until Christ returns.  Till then the 'church' is/was to spread the good news and gather the sheep and the whomsoever 'woulds' so they would not 'see death' and return with Him and to be here for the tribulation for Gods work.  
 

Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Matthew 24:31 And He shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Notice it is 'from one end of heaven to the other' because EARTH and Heaven are become one.  What was SEEN IN HEAVEN?  

Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and He shall reign for ever and ever.

Revelation 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,

Revelation 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.

Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and Thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

(AND THE DEAD SHALL RISE - THE JUST AND THE UNJUST -  BUT WILL STILL REMAIN 'SPIRITUALLY DEAD' FOR THE 1000 YEARS AND THEN THEY WILL STAND IN JUDGMENT  (THESE ARE WHO WE WILL REIGN OVER)-  BUT THERE WILL BE SOME DEAD THAT DON'T RISE AT ALL AT THAT TIME)

(AND THOSE WHO HAVE ENDURED TO THE END - THE ALIVE AND REMAINING -  SHALL RECEIVE THEIR REWARDS AND BE GATHERED TOGETHER WITH THOSE WHO RETURNED TO THE EARTH WITH CHRIST TO BEGIN THE LORDS DAY)

(THE DEAD WHO DON'T RISE WILL 'BE DELIVERED UP' AT THE END OF THE LORDS DAY FOR 2ND DEATH)

 

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in His temple the ark of His testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

 

[tim_from_pa]

9 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

I find these are hard things to get my head around.  That there is much allegory in scripture is an important key to understanding though.  Scripture itself talks about similitudes/allegories/parables/ensamples.  Here, I'll post the ones that have come to my notice:

The Word made flesh, Jesus/Yeshua speaks in parables:

Mat 13:34-35

All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

Hos 12:10

I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

Eze 20:49

Then said I, Ah Lord GOD! they say of me, Doth he not speak parables?

Gal 4:24-26

Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

 

The land of promise is an allegory for the Holy Spirit and eternal life through Him, it speaks to a heavenly inheritance.  And what the Lord made clear to me the last few days is that where we see the scripture talking about "GATHERING" Israel back to the land is a beautiful allegory for being gathered in Christ/Messiah, the gospel.  (Being scattered is an allegory for being lost, dead in sins and separated from God and His kingdom.)  There is a biblical principle of first the natural, then the spiritual.  I am wondering if Israel being re-gathered and restored to the land in our time is a sign in the natural realm for what will happen spiritually....that she will be re-gathered in Christ/Messiah, or at least a significant harvest of souls in Israel.  (But I expect there will be some serious times to get through before that happens.)

Some lovely scriptures about being gathered:

Gen 49:10

The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Jhn 11:52

And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

Eph 1:10

That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him

The new testament language of “gathering” is not accidental....it is taken from the old testament scriptures and reveals what the gathering of Israel in the old testament was talking about.

 

Gen 29:7-8

And he said, Lo, it is yet high day, neither is it time that the cattle should be gathered together: water ye the sheep, and go and feed them.

And they said, We cannot, until all the flocks be gathered together, and till they roll the stone from the well's mouth; then we water the sheep.

(Beautiful allegory for the stone rolled away from Messiah’s grave and the resurrection...only in God’s time, the fulness of times, and only then could the sheep be gathered to Him and in Him.)

Gen 41:49

And Joseph gathered corn as the sand of the sea, very much, until he left numbering; for it was without number. (and where else have we heard about being as innumerable as the sand of the sea?)

Hos 1:11

Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

 

So many lovely references to Israel being gathered in the bible, I could go on and on all day!  😊

 

Oops nearly forgot this one!

Deu 30:3-6

That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.

If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:

And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.

And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

\o/

Context and textual intent.  Covenants are not allegories.  The Lord does not show physical land, promise many descendants or lineage of Kings and they are allegory any more than any of us would appreciate our title deed to our homes being allegory so that we are told we do not own what we own but it means something else.  Nevertheless, we live our lives sometimes in an allegory.  Sometimes in a literal sense.  It depends. So there's a place for each in the bible. 

[Heleadethme]

10 hours ago, tim_from_pa said:

Context and textual intent.  Covenants are not allegories.  The Lord does not show physical land, promise many descendants or lineage of Kings and they are allegory any more than any of us would appreciate our title deed to our homes being allegory so that we are told we do not own what we own but it means something else.  Nevertheless, we live our lives sometimes in an allegory.  Sometimes in a literal sense.  It depends. So there's a place for each in the bible. 

The new way of the Spirit.....not the old way of the letter.  This was the reason the truth was hid from the religious leaders.  And Jesus was seen reprimanding His disciples for taking Him literally and not having ears to hear what the SPIRIT was saying. 

I don't feel I can express this very well, so will just say that certain things may come to pass literally, yes, but that is not what we as believers are to entangle and burden ourselves with.  That is not our mandate as believers.  Eg, when the disciples asked Jesus about Israel, He essentially told them to "Mind ya business" and just get on with the gospel, it's not for you to know.

[Heleadethme]

19 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I believe, The Lord Jesus Christ has been gathering 'the lost sheep/Israel' since He brought us the GOOD NEWS and set us up under the New Covenant Church.  They/we had been scattered through out the world 500 plus years before Jesus was born, and had become 'the nations',  no longer knowing who we once were.  We populated the world, as dust of the earth and sands of the sea and stars of the sky and as we heard the Gospel, spread it to each other and to the world, and that is how Christ has been/still is gathering 'CHRIST's men' back to Himself and not losing one.  Those who are His (sheep) hear His voice and follow.  When we realize the reality of this, it is easy to understand why two people can hear the words of God at the same time,  and one of them be CHANGED instantly,  while the other may or may not be.  

It is spiritual.  It is literal.  It is past, present and future.  It is here on earth and it is in heaven at the same time.  We JUST don't presently 'see' it.   

Matthew 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Matthew 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in My name, there am I in the midst of them.

BOUND IN HEAVEN.  Made me wait forever before I started discussing the words of God.  

The earth will be what it would have been had Christ been accepted 2000 years ago.  

Matthew 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
Matthew 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Matthew 3:3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Heaven on earth.  


I personally don't believe there will be a physical gathering to Israel of the 'House of Israel/the church' until His return.  I believe that is why Judah was blinded to Christ because they had the job of keeping Gods laws and would be going back to Israel to become the Nation again at the end of the punishment and to be a sign for the 'end times'.  But the 'two sticks' aren't brought together as one until Christ returns.  Till then the 'church' is/was to spread the good news and gather the sheep and the whomsoever 'woulds' so they would not 'see death' and return with Him and to be here for the tribulation for Gods work.  
 

Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Matthew 24:31 And He shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Notice it is 'from one end of heaven to the other' because EARTH and Heaven are become one.  What was SEEN IN HEAVEN?  

Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and He shall reign for ever and ever.

Revelation 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,

Revelation 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.

Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and Thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

(AND THE DEAD SHALL RISE - THE JUST AND THE UNJUST -  BUT WILL STILL REMAIN 'SPIRITUALLY DEAD' FOR THE 1000 YEARS AND THEN THEY WILL STAND IN JUDGMENT  (THESE ARE WHO WE WILL REIGN OVER)-  BUT THERE WILL BE SOME DEAD THAT DON'T RISE AT ALL AT THAT TIME)

(AND THOSE WHO HAVE ENDURED TO THE END - THE ALIVE AND REMAINING -  SHALL RECEIVE THEIR REWARDS AND BE GATHERED TOGETHER WITH THOSE WHO RETURNED TO THE EARTH WITH CHRIST TO BEGIN THE LORDS DAY)

(THE DEAD WHO DON'T RISE WILL 'BE DELIVERED UP' AT THE END OF THE LORDS DAY FOR 2ND DEATH)

 

Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in His temple the ark of His testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

 

Partially agree with some of what you're saying, and some I'm just not getting...my foggy brain I assume.   

His kingdom is NOT OF THIS WORLD.  But His kingdom coming to earth has to do with it coming to individual souls.  His kingdom is within us...it does NOT come with observation, lo there it is, or here it is.  We're looking for the world to come, like Abraham was...that is, an heavenly.

Still mulling this over, but I feel that maybe the connection to the lost tribes is God's way of connecting Gentiles to Israel in a general way, or in a representative number perhaps.....and COUNTING them as His people through the gospel.  Scripture says the gospel would go to the GENTILES...so it couldn't have been lying.  I consider it possible that there are Gentiles and believers who may have no drop of Israelite ancestry.   And many believers have siblings and parents who are not believers and yet their ancestry is the same among them.  Not all come to faith, whether of Israel or Gentile.  Though the number of Israelites be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved.  So where the bible talks about gathering Israel to Him, or gathering the nations to Him, we are not to assume it means every single soul among any group..it is speaking in prophetic language.  I assume similar to the references to the lost tribes of Israel....that this is prophetic language, though I'm not sure I'm grasping it yet.

[Anne2]

On 4/20/2022 at 10:23 AM, DeighAnn said:

Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

That was/is the JOB of the House of Israel, the scattered sheep, the BIRTHRIGHT tribes.  

The birthright of the firstborn? Those tribes are the one tribe of Joseph.

That is the church of the apostles. The general assembly, the Church of the firstborn. And which tribe inherited the priesthood, the lord? But did not inherit land with Israel? See the list in revelation, Levi is there in their inheritance with eleven other tribes.