Guest yod Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted August 15, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted August 15, 2003 yod, I sent you a PM, but I keep getting an error. Let me know if you got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted August 15, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted August 15, 2003 yod, Still there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 Munari, I had to leave to go to work. I realize that at much as I've been posting lately, ya'll must think I do nothiing but sit around the house...and give myself to this addiction of Worthy Boards... Well...ok...you're right but I appreciate so much that you sent me that private message. Your genuine concern is touching. I wish all of us could be that considerate of others. Including myself... But the sad face is because I fear that I could ever blaspheme His name. I fear bringing reproach on the Lord through my sin....yet I don't seem to have control over my flesh nearly as much as I should after 13 years of walking this faith out. Sometimes I "think" I do...then I blow it and have to start over a little humbler. I would prefer to think that it's impossible to turn away. I know He can hold me so I'm going to believe He will. But it might be a long way to the finish line...so I've got to keep pressing on. That I way I won't have to worry about turning back. In the meantime, I'm going to leave the possibitlity open that those verses are about someone much worse than me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted August 15, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted August 15, 2003 yod, I can empathize with you. Paul does too: Romans 7:14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am carnal, sold into slavery to sin. 15 What I do, I do not understand. For I do not do what I want, but I do what I hate. 16 Now if I do what I do not want, I concur that the law is good. 17 So now it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that good does not dwell in me, that is, in my flesh. The willing is ready at hand, but doing the good is not. 19 For I do not do the good I want, but I do the evil I do not want. 20 Now if (I) do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 21 So, then, I discover the principle that when I want to do right, evil is at hand. 22 For I take delight in the law of God, in my inner self, 23 but I see in my members another principle at war with the law of my mind, taking me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. 24 Miserable one that I am! Who will deliver me from this mortal body? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord. Therefore, I myself, with my mind, serve the law of God but, with my flesh, the law of sin. I've heard the stories of people who have thrown off the terrors of drug abuse and turned from a life of fornication and other attrocities. But I believe they are more the exception than the rule. Here, we have Paul, an apostle of the Lord, telling us that he does the things he does not want to do. I do like you. I make amends to stop sinning, do good for a while, and then find myself doing the EXACT same thing again! Now, can this sin be terrible enough to cut me off from God? Yes, it can. What do I do? I pray, everyday, asking God to allow me to use the grace and strength that He has already given me. I used to pray for strength, but I stopped doing that. Why? Because, I realized, it is not God that is failing, it is me. He has already given me all of the strength that I need. It is I that fail in using that strength, I'm the weak one, not God. So, now I pray that He will give me grace in order to give me courage to do what He wants and so I can use His strength. I, being Catholic, also take advantage of Confession. I tell you my non-Catholic brothers and sisters, don't knock it 'til you've tried it. I stayed away from it for YEARS, and I felt bad. I went to Confession finally, by the grace of God, and confessed my sins. Afterwards, when I heard Christ speak to me through the priest, "I absolve you from you sins, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit", a weight was lifted. I felt my sins leave me. But how quickly we forget because I committed those same sins again. Not because I wanted to, but because I'm weak. So, what do I do. I go to Confession again and confess to the priest the SAME SINS! How humbling and humiliating. But, I keep trying, and keep humbling myself, and I allow myself to go because I need to be humbled and humiliated until I step in line with God's will for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsmeow Posted August 15, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 439 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 7,315 Content Per Day: 0.93 Reputation: 356 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/21/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted August 15, 2003 Hi, Munari..good to see you at WBs again. I hear what you're saying. Both of you, in fact. It's a struggle...and real daily struggle. I kinda see it as a "walk" with the Lord, though. I ask myself how I would respond as a parent towards my child, when they do wrong. That gives me some limited perspective. I sense the Lord's kindness more now than ever, though...despite myself! I also think how I treat others or love others seems to really play a part. Jesus said that those who show mercy will receive mercy...and also, by the measure we measure it will be measured likewise... That seems to be more the litmus test for me. In first John he says that we know when we've "passed from death into life because we love the brethren."... I know I do love the brethren, *although there's always a couple that can really "tax" that love, if you get my meaning...Still, we are commanded to love. If someone is acting really badly, we can just walk away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted August 15, 2003 Share Posted August 15, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted August 16, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted August 16, 2003 "blaspheming of the Holy Spirit" would have to be a conscience effort to mock God. For the most part I would agree with that. It would either be a conscience effort or, like I said before, someone telling God that He can't forgive them of their sins because their sins are too great. That is denying God His ability to forgive sin and is denying His love. It is taking God's very power (in one sense) away from Him. But, I also believe that this is not the only way one can lose their salvation. Catholic theology, as I'm sure you're at least aware of on a surface level, has what is known as mortal sin. These are sins that if a person dies with on their soul, they will go to hell. But, there are three conditions for a sin to be mortal, and they must all be met. In order for a sin to be mortal, it must: 1. Consist of grave matter (the sin must be profound enough, ie. murder, fornication, even contraception) 2. The person must be aware that what they have done IS grave matter (someone who has an abortion but does not know it is grave matter would not be guilty of a mortal sin). 3. The person must have the freedom of will. Fear (in the case of abortion) or habit (fornication, masterbation) can lessen the degree of the sin if not completely remove the guilt of the sin. I mention all of this so you understand where I'm coming from. For my beliefs, it does not have to be an effort to mock God, but just a hardness of heart could do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted August 16, 2003 Share Posted August 16, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest idolsmasher Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Jumping in here, didn't read the full discourse between Yod and Munari. I'll just give my way of looking at it. The only unpardonable sin is the one that sends people to hell, not receiving the gospel, the good news of salvation through Jesus. That's the only thing that will send you to hell because everything else God will forgive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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