There are 2 separate tribulations, the first is to the Jew

[Anne2]

15 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

God has no favor towards a a specific nation or ethnic people on this earth as you suggest Israel/Jews?

God has one covenant with man, the shed blood upon Calvary, he has one favor towards man, his "Church" the saved righteous 

Your post here does not reflect what I said, rather it distorts it. What I said was All in the new covenant Jew and Gentile escape the wrath. Each in their own time....Those not in the new covenant do not, both Jew and Gentile. 

The covenant promises to Abraham are not disannulled in the law, nor certainly the new covenant. I believe, it is a matter of timing.

[truth7t7]

9 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

The covenant promises to Abraham are not disannulled in the law, nor certainly the new covenant. I believe, it is a matter of timing.

The promises made to Abraham have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ

Jesus Christ is the promised seed, and his children are the Church

Galatians 3:16-29KJV

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

[Anne2]

38 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

The promises made to Abraham have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ

No, Gentiles as Gentiles have received promise to Abraham.

It will be full when Abraham, comes into the eternal kingdom in the resurrection from the dead. We like him walk as strangers and pilgrims on this earth.

13  These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
14  For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
15  And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
16  But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
 

I do not want to appear to be taking this subject off track. But It should be mentioned here because of these kinds of discussions. I believe this about Israel

Israel when they came out of Egypt were boldly called God's first born. The two covenants gave Heirs and corresponding inheritance,(covenants) in Abraham Gen 15 and Gen 17. One earthly worldly, natural. The second covenant was a second portion of inheritance which was Heavenly and never ending (eternal). this is through the resurrection from the dead in Christ Jesus. That is the hope which we are saved by. 

Those that are truly ISRAEL are those that have both. They both inherited the earthly, but also in faithfulness received a second portion as the heavenly.

The church of the firstborn, is a affirmation of the true Israel of God. As not all Israel is Israel. Some of the circumcision, just like Gentiles who reject Christ, this world and this life is all they have. They have no part in the second portion in promise of resurrection to Abraham neither one.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Anne2

[DeighAnn]

20 minutes ago, Stewardofthemystery said:

The first tribulation “of those days” was to the flesh and blood Jews who had done evil.  Salvation was first offered to the Jewish people, but they would also be the first to suffer tribulation for rejecting God and Christ.

Notice WHAT JESUS SAYS

1Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

11But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

12And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

13But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

14Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

15Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

16Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!

17Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

18And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.

19Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

20Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.

21And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.

22And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.

23Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

29Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,

30And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.

31Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.

32Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

34Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon


this generation.


37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

38Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.

2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

THAT HAPPENED TO THAT GENERATION IN 70AD, JUST LIKE JESUS SAID IT WOULD. 

But those were THE EVIL FIGS, who SAID they were Jews but were not....



and Just like DANIEL said it would happen 

26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.


BUT like in Rev 12 THERE IS MORE to the story
 

27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

How far is the Mount from the temple?  20-25 min?  Not really the same conversation is it?

3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,

4Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?

5And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:

MANY FALSE CHRISTS, MEANING there have to be MANY people who KNOW the words of God
 

wars and rumours of wars, nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom

wasn't ROMAN EMPIRE large and in charge for the 40 years after Christ crucified?
how many nations and kingdoms were going against each other?

what earthquakes in divers places COULD THEY HAVE KNOWN OF?

WHAT famines took place in those 40 years?

WAS THE gospel published among all nations?  

Was ANYONE on Pentacost day 'delivered up' to anyone when the Holy Spirit spoke through them?  

 

WHERE was this taking place?  the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

ALL WHAT MEN hated them for the name of Christ?  Wasn't it just the 'synagogue of Satan'?   Romans had many gods.  They didn't even want to kill Jesus. 

How and by what were Gods elect being deceived?  How were the days shortened?



And if that was, then WHAT happened to the rest?

24But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

25And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

26And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

27And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

28Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:

29So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.

30Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

31Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

32But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

33Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

34For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

35Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:

36Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

37And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

[truth7t7]

31 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

No, Gentiles as Gentiles have received promise to Abraham.

The promise made to Abraham was the "Seed" Jesus Christ, the gentiles by faith have received Jesus Christ the promised seed

Yes I agree, the Church is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed

Edited June 19, 2023 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

30 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

No, Gentiles as Gentiles have received promise to Abraham.

It will be full when Abraham, comes into the eternal kingdom in the resurrection from the dead. We like him walk as strangers and pilgrims on this earth.

13  These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
14  For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
15  And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
16  But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
 

I do not want to appear to be taking this subject off track. But It should be mentioned here because of these kinds of discussions. I believe this about Israel

Israel when they came out of Egypt were boldly called God's first born. The two covenants gave Heirs and corresponding inheritance,(covenants) in Abraham Gen 15 and Gen 17. One earthly worldly, natural. The second covenant was a second portion of inheritance which was Heavenly and never ending (eternal). this is through the resurrection from the dead in Christ Jesus. That is the hope which we are saved by. 

Those that are truly ISRAEL are those that have both. They both inherited the earthly, but also in faithfulness received a second portion as the heavenly.

The church of the firstborn, is a affirmation of the true Israel of God. As not all Israel is Israel.

This is what I believe about National Israel, they are no different than Africa, China, Australia, Mexico, or any other nation, no further promise or covenant exist with a National Israel

The only covenant God has with man upon this earth is the shed blood upon Calvary, and salvation

God has predestined and chosen by his foreknowledge humans from all races and nations upon this earth for salvation, and the ethnic race "Jews" has no favor with God

In Love, Jesus Is The Lord

Edited June 19, 2023 by truth7t7

[Anne2]

18 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

The promise made to Abraham was the "Seed" Jesus Christ, the gentiles by faith have been received Jesus Christ the promised seed

If he is not raised, we are all still dead in our sin?

The promised Seed in Gen 17, the covenant was established in Isaac. When did this occur?

Heb 11:17  By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,
18  Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:
19  Accounting that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure.

Immutable counsel confirmed with an oath 

Heb 6:17  Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:
 

Heb 9:15  And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance

1ch 16:15  Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;
16  Even of the covenant which he made with Abraham, and of his oath unto Isaac;
17  And hath confirmed the same to Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant,
18  Saying, Unto thee will I give the land of Canaan, the lot of your inheritance;
19  When ye were but few, even a few, and strangers in it.
 

I believe this 1 chr 16, (repeated in ps 105) speaks of the passover and the memorial feast. Which redemption from Egypt was by and through the covenant promises made To Abraham. The law unto Jacob was the Passover statute, of circumcision to eat of it. The festal memorial belongs to the Abrahamic covenant, and is a memorial of it's promise of redemption, through judgment on the nation that enslaved them in cruelty.

 

 

Edited June 19, 2023 by Anne2

[truth7t7]

1 minute ago, Anne2 said:

If he is not raised, we are all still dead in our sin?

The promised Seed in Gen 17, the covenant was established in Isaac. When did this occur?

Heb 11:17  By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,
18  Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:
19  Accounting that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure.

Immutable counsel confirmed with an oath 

Heb 6:17  Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:
 

Heb 9:15  And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance

1ch 16:15  Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;
16  Even of the covenant which he made with Abraham, and of his oath unto Isaac;
17  And hath confirmed the same to Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant,
18  Saying, Unto thee will I give the land of Canaan, the lot of your inheritance;
19  When ye were but few, even a few, and strangers in it.
 

Ok, nothing presented cancels the fact Jesus is the promised "Seed" fulfilling the promises made to Abraham

Perhaps you can be more "Direct" in your posting?

[Anne2]

7 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Ok, nothing presented cancels the fact Jesus is the promised "Seed" fulfilling the promises made to Abraham

Perhaps you can be more "Direct" in your posting?

I do not not know how to be more direct than to say without Christ's resurrection we are still dead in our sin?

That was not complete until Genesis 22 in the oath established through Isaac.

I do not know what more there is?

[Stewardofthemystery]

49 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Notice WHAT JESUS SAYS

1Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

11But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

12And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

13But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

14Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

15Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

16Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!

17Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

18And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.

19Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

20Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.

21And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.

22And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.

23Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

29Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,

30And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.

31Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.

32Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.

33Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

34Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

35That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

36Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon


this generation.


37O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

38Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

1And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.

2And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

THAT HAPPENED TO THAT GENERATION IN 70AD, JUST LIKE JESUS SAID IT WOULD. 

But those were THE EVIL FIGS, who SAID they were Jews but were not....



and Just like DANIEL said it would happen 

26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.


BUT like in Rev 12 THERE IS MORE to the story
 

27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

How far is the Mount from the temple?  20-25 min?  Not really the same conversation is it?

3And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,

4Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?

5And Jesus answering them began to say, Take heed lest any man deceive you:

MANY FALSE CHRISTS, MEANING there have to be MANY people who KNOW the words of God
 

wars and rumours of wars, nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom

wasn't ROMAN EMPIRE large and in charge for the 40 years after Christ crucified?
how many nations and kingdoms were going against each other?

what earthquakes in divers places COULD THEY HAVE KNOWN OF?

WHAT famines took place in those 40 years?

WAS THE gospel published among all nations?  

Was ANYONE on Pentacost day 'delivered up' to anyone when the Holy Spirit spoke through them?  

 

WHERE was this taking place?  the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

ALL WHAT MEN hated them for the name of Christ?  Wasn't it just the 'synagogue of Satan'?   Romans had many gods.  They didn't even want to kill Jesus. 

How and by what were Gods elect being deceived?  How were the days shortened?



And if that was, then WHAT happened to the rest?

24But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

25And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

26And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

27And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

28Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:

29So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.

30Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

31Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

32But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

33Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

34For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

35Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:

36Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

37And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

Again, Jesus was asked 2 separate questions about 2 separate events by the apostles.  

The first is about the destruction of the Temple and surrounding buildings they were looking at with their own eyes.

The second question was about the signs that would precede His second coming and the end of the world.

So Jesus is talking about both things, some that were shortly to come to pass, and things that were not going to happen until the end of the world.

Notice in Luke’s account Jesus says ….. “But before all these” in verse 12

 

Luke 21:5-24

 

King James Version

 

 

⁵ And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said,

⁶ As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

⁷ And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?

⁸ And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.

⁹ But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions, be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.

¹⁰ Then said he unto them, Nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom:

¹¹ And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

¹² But before all these they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.

¹³ And “it”shall turn to you for a testimony.

¹⁴ Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer:

¹⁵ For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.

¹⁶ And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death.

¹⁷ And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.

¹⁸ But there shall not an hair of your head perish.

¹⁹ In your patience possess ye your souls.

²⁰ And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.

²¹ Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.

²² For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

²³ But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.(the Jews)

²⁴ And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.”(This ends the tribulation “of those days” which was first to the Jew)

Jesus in saying “But before all these”in verse 12 was rightly divided between what was way off into the future concerning “the end of the world events”….from what was shortly to come to pass with the destruction of the Temple Mount in 70 ad.