There are 2 separate tribulations, the first is to the Jew

[Stewardofthemystery]

2 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

I never stated such, that would be your claim and it's false

Once Again, 66-70AD Jerusalems destruction had absolutely "Nothing" to do with fulfillment of Matthew Chapter 24, Mark Chapter 13, or Luke Chapter 21

That is false. 

[Anne2]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

God has no favor towards a a specific nation or ethnic people on this earth as you suggest Israel/Jews?

God has one covenant with man, the shed blood upon Calvary, he has one favor towards man, his "Church" the saved righteous 

God had a specific purpose for Israel. I believe still does. IIt how he judges the world (not those in Christ)

As for the world and his wrath and judgement, I spoke about judgement on those not in the new covenant. Jew and Gentile both escape Gods wrath in Christ, the Israel of God. So I suppose we will agree to disagree. It isn't a salvation issue between us.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Anne2

[truth7t7]

1 hour ago, Anne2 said:

God had a specific purpose for Israel. I believe still does. IIt how he judges the world (not those in Christ)

As for the world and his wrath and judgement, I spoke about judgement on those not in the new covenant. Jew and Gentile both escape Gods wrath in Christ, the Israel of God. So I suppose we will agree to disagree. It isn't a salvation issue between us.

God's Divine Protection Of The Church During The Tribulation

The Two Witnesses Will Dominate The Entire Tribulation, Something Many Disregard As Non-Existent

Try Reading Exodus And The Plagues Upon Pharaoh And Egypt, It's Going To Be A Complete Replay

God's Divine Protection, "Open Your Ears"

(Revelation) 13:9-10KJV

9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

God's Divine Protection During The Final Hour Of Earth's Temptation, Just Like The Passover In Egypt, "Open Your Ears"

Isaiah 26:20-21KJV

20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.

21 For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

The Great Trib Will Be Upon The Antichrist And Wicked, The Church Is Protected, Dont Be Deceived

There's Going To Be An End Times Persecution, The Beast And His Kingdom Are The Target Of God's Empowered (Two Witnesses)

The Great Tribulation Will Come Upon The Wicked World, While The (Sealed Church) Is Protected

The (Sealed Church) will be present on earth and protected, when wicked men are tormented 5 months, desiring to die as death flees

All saved believers are (Sealed) by God, Eph 1:13, 4:30

Ephesians 1:13KJV

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:30KJV

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

It Was Commanded, Only Those Without God's Seal Will Be Tormented, The Sealed Church Is Protected

Revelation 9:3-6KJV

3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.

6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

Plagues upon The Beast and his Kingdom, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Revelation 11:3-6

3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Revelation 16:1-11KJV

1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.

2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.

4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.

5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.

6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.

7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.

8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.

9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, Anne2 said:

God had a specific purpose for Israel. I believe still does.

What would God's plan be for a National Israel, that doesn't apply to all Nations in the world today?

Edited June 19, 2023 by truth7t7

[Anne2]

3 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

What would God's plan be for a National Israel, that doesn't apply to all Nations in the world today?

I do not know how that is going to happen. But I think they are still called in Isaac right now. 

1  What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2  Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3  For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
4  God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
5  But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
6  God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
 

I think it is possible for this

Israel and Judah became a divided kingdom. They were still divided at the time of Christ

Look at the way this is worded

First it speaks of both houses.....

8  For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9  Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

Then it speaks specifically to the house of Israel when he takes away their sin.

10  For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
 

Just like both were judged and exiled as separate kingdoms (or houses) to Babylon, that happened at different times.

The first shall be last and the last shall be first.

[truth7t7]

58 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

I do not know how that is going to happen. But I think they are still called in Isaac right now. 

1  What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2  Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3  For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
4  God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
5  But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
6  God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
 

I think it is possible for this

Israel and Judah became a divided kingdom. They were still divided at the time of Christ

Look at the way this is worded

First it speaks of both houses.....

8  For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9  Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

Then it speaks specifically to the house of Israel when he takes away their sin.

10  For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
 

Just like both were judged and exiled as separate kingdoms (or houses) to Babylon, that happened at different times.

The first shall be last and the last shall be first.

God doesn't have an elect Nation in the middle east called Israel as you suggest

Only the remnant elect Jew will be saved by God's forekowledge and added to (The Church) on earth, "National Israel Is Blinded"

"Israel Hath Not Obtained"

"The Election Hath Obtained" The Church

Romans 11:2-8KJV

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.

[Anne2]

6 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

God doesn't have an elect Nation in the middle east called Israel as you suggest

Only the remnant elect Jew will be saved by God's forekowledge and added to (The Church) on earth, "National Israel Is Blinded"

"Israel Hath Not Obtained"

"The Election Hath Obtained" The Church

Romans 11:2-8KJV

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.

The nation in the middle east is not in exile. Has Israel ever ceased to be a nation?

Many of the prophesies of Moses were spoken when they were in exile. Never the less I believe the nations will be judged by How Israel was treated. What cause was there for those things? None, similarly as they were in the wilderness, passing through.

[DeighAnn]

On 6/15/2023 at 8:16 AM, Stewardofthemystery said:

Many speak of the tribulation to come, and there is in fact a Great Tribulation to come upon the entire world by way of God’s wrath being poured out on the inhabitants of the world.
But many do not understand that there are actually 2 tribulation periods mentioned in scripture.

In Romans 2:9 we read; "Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that does evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile."

In this we see the mention of 2 different tribulation periods determined, with the first one which pertained to the Jews, and the last one, which is to be upon all the Nations of the entire Gentile world. 

This first tribulation to the Jews was announced to begin by Jesus right after the abomination of desolation and destruction of the Temple mount in Jerusalem occurred in 70 ad. (Luke 21:20-24)

This is referred to in scripture as the tribulation of “those days” which was determined to run “many days” (Daniel 11:33) even all the way to "the fullness of the Gentiles", which I believe is marked by the 6th seal events. 

Then at the point of the 6th seal being loosed, this would begin the time of trouble such as the world has never seen, (Daniel 12:1); or the wrath of the Lamb/God beginning to be poured out on the Gentile Nations. (Rev. 6:17)

Many confuse these 2 separate events as one single short tribulation event, but a careful study of scripture will show these 2 events are indeed shown as separate in time.

Also I would like to add there is no such thing as a 7 year tribulation, that is just the doctrines of men, as a 7 year tribulation is not mentioned anywhere in scripture, neither is a "pre-tribulation rapture."

So in a nut shell you have the begin point of the tribulation of “those days” (days of vengeance and wrath upon the Jews) starting at 70 ad. as Jesus said and then running-------------->>>all the way to “after the tribulations of those days” confirmed by the 6th seal signs in scripture (sun, moon, stars) And then the beginning of God’s wrath being poured out on the entire Gentile world, or a time of trouble such as the world has never seen. All these things can be confirmed by a careful study of scripture.

The first tribulation period to the Jews was announced by Jesus and would start right after the fall of Jerusalem in 70 a.d. Luke confirms the start point in Luke 21:20-22“And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter there into.22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.” 

Also in John 12:31 Jesus said; "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out."
 

This event would take place after Christ was crucified, as seen with the man child Jesus being caught to God in Revelation 12:5. Also at this point in time the red Dragon, or the Devil would persecute the woman (spiritual Israel) after he was cast down unto the earth as seen in Revelation 12:13.

Many try to place all these events future forward concerning the last days, but these events were set into motion long ago with the judgment announced by Jesus.

The end of this first tribulation period for the Jews is shown in Matthew 24:29 with the words "after the tribulation of those days." If you notice in Matthew 24:29 there is a pause after verse 28. Then Jesus says; "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken." =(6th seal sign)

Compare to Mark 13:24 were we see the same pause in the verse, and notice the description. Mark 13:24;"But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken."

This sounds just like what the Matthew account has said; but it is the testimony in Luke that shall confirm the end point of this first tribulation period for the Jews, referring to “after those days.”

In Luke 21:25 we see the same pause in the verse, and the same signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. But if you will notice the verse before it we are shown when this first tribulation of those days would end, and then the signs in the heavens would begin. 

Luke 21:24;"And they (the Jews) shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled."

This prophecy in Luke 21:24 was shown in Daniel 11:33 “And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.”

Notice “many days” does not suggest a short 3 and a half year, 42 month, or 7 year tribulation period for the Jews. History also confirms this, the Jews have been scattered to the nations and have suffered persecution ever since the fall of Jerusalem in 70 a.d.

When you are given understanding you will come to conclude that the time of 42 months is symbolic of time when you put all the pieces together comparing all scriptures on this matter.

This fullness of time of the Gentiles is the key to putting this time frame in its proper order of events.

In Revelation 11:2 we see this time period mentioned to John. Revelation 11:2;"But the court that is without the Temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 

I believe what throws most people off in this verse is the mention of 42 months, and discerning that time to be a literal 3 and half years. But this time, like most of the symbolisms in book of Revelation should not be taken at face value, but is rather spiritually discerned.

To prove this point, in scripture we see the millennium or thousand year reign of Christ is shown as "a season and a time" in Daniel 7:12. So if "a season and a time" is shown as "a thousand years", then a time, times and half a time would suggest an even longer period of time; not a short period of time like a short 42 month period. Scriptures also confirm this is cannot be the case as shown in Daniel 12:11-13.


I believe the 6th seal signs confirms the fullness of the Gentile age, but also begins the Great tribulation and wrath of the Lamb upon the entire world, or the time of God’s wrath and the day of vengeance as written. Isaiah 63:4 “For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.”

The start time of the Gentiles ingathering period began at Pentecost (7x7 days) right after Christ was crucified, and with the start of the New Covenant period to all Nations.

This start of the Gentile period is shown in the law as the "new meat offering" after the 7x7 days is complete. This treading down of the holy city (God’s people also shown as the “holy city”) also started long ago in 70 a.d., and has been ongoing ever since, and will continue till the time of the end.

This time of the Gentiles was also symbolized by a 42 month period, but it is only a sign of time. This sign of time is also shown to us in Matthew 1:17 with the 3 separate 14 generations periods, or 42 total generations leading up to the birth of Jesus. ( the law and prophets prophesied during these 42 generations)

This sign of time of 42 months can also be symbolically shown like the 7 priests first circling Jericho for 6 days, or 7x6=42. During these 42 generations leading up to Jesus’ birth the law and prophets prophesied as Jesus said in Matthew 11:13 Just as God’s 2 witnesses (Word and Spirit) were also forecast to prophesy for 42 months in all his saints in Revelation 11:3.
 

Keep in mind the Lord refers to his saints as the “holy city” and as “Jerusalem” in scripture.

Paul also spoke of this fullness of time for the Gentiles here in Romans 11:25;“For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.” Romans 11:26;“And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:”

This removal of blindness and ungodliness from Jacob "after the tribulation of those days" is confirmed here in Jeremiah 31:33“But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.”

This is the point in time of deliverance for God’s saints from the time of trouble that comes after ‘those days” is shown in Daniel 12:1-2 “And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

Notice, the first “days of vengeance” Jesus proclaimed upon the Jews, starting with the destruction of the Temple in 70 ad; is not the same time as is shown in Daniel 12:1-2 because the Jews were not delivered from that period of persecution, which scripture and history confirms lasted “many days” as is written.

But this time of persecution is symbolically shown as, time, times and a half, or symbolically 42 
months, or 1260 days.

But the “time of trouble” shown in Daniel 12:1-2 is speaking of a time of deliverance for God’s people and also shows the resurrection of the dead in Christ, which is after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

So this we know by scripture, and also by history, that these 2 separate tribulation events cannot be the same.

Peace and God bless

Which JEW?  SINCE there are more than one JEW, and if THEY ARE NOT KEPT separate, then everything gets very confusing very fast. 

2453. Ioudaios 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaios: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Original Word: Ἰουδαῖος, αία, αῖον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: Ioudaios
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah'-yos)
Definition: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Usage: Jewish.

a. joined to nouns, belonging to the Jewish race: 
b. without a noun, substantively, Jewish as respects birth, race, religion; a Jew:
Jewess, of Judaea.

From Iouda (in the sense of Ioudas as a country); Judaean, i.e. Belonging to Jehudah -- Jew(-ess), of Judaea.

OR

 2454. Ioudaismos 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaismos: Judaism
Original Word: Ἰουδαϊσμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Ioudaismos
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah-is-mos')
Definition: Judaism
Usage: the Jewish religion, Judaism.

Jewish Faith
From Ioudaizo; "Judaism", i.e. The Jewish faith and usages -- Jews' religion.

or 

THE EVIL FIGS/never in bondage/synagogue of Satan/mixed seed/of their father

9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.


because THAT JEW is way different than
A GOOD FIG 'JEW' and the PROPHECIES for both are very different.  

5Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel; Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge them that are carried away captive of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans for their good.

6For I will set mine eyes upon them for good, and I will bring them again to this land: and I will build them, and not pull them down; and I will plant them, and not pluck them up.

7And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be My people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto Me with their whole heart.

8And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the LORD, So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:

9And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.

10And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers.


So, to which JEWS are you referring to in this post for TRIB and ANGUISH?
the Christian Jews
or House of Judah Jews
or 'Jews' living in the country but not of the bloodline,
or 'Jews' practicing the religion living anywhere
or THE JEWS WHO CALL themselves JEWS but are synagogue of Satan...


How were 'all things written fulfilled' in the past?  Obviously, the whole world wasn't worshipping 'as God' someone who was producing lying signs and wonders.  There was no 'image' set up that was able to speak, was there?   How could there have been 'angels' walking the earth, taking and giving in marriage from that time to this?  Was the 'time of the gentiles' just a few years?   Do you think the 'blindness' has come off?  Have the two sticks become one? 


You wrote "In Luke 21:25 we see the same pause in the verse, and the same signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. But if you will notice the verse before it we are shown when this first tribulation of those days would end, and then the signs in the heavens would begin."


BUT what is written "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:" Acts 2:20 KJV

How does that fit?  When there are signs both BEFORE and again WHEN He does return. 


You wrote, "Also I would like to add there is no such thing as a 7 year tribulation, that is just the doctrines of men, as a 7 year tribulation is not mentioned anywhere in scripture, neither is a "pre-tribulation rapture.""


But there is the last 'week' from Daniel, or do you believe that to have taken place also?


You brought up so many points that seem like they work but we would have to throw out quite a few things of what is written for them to fit with the timeline set forth.  What do you do with all the stuff that DIDN'T happen?  


You wrote "Also in John 12:31 Jesus said; "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out.""

We see Satan 'possessing' Judas for the betrayal of Jesus after that, so my question is was Satan cast out of heaven at that time, or was he cast out of earth?  And if 'out of heaven', then WHAT was the WAR about?  The New Covenant hadn't come into play so 'Death' hadn't been defeated, the 'penalty' and ransom had not been paid, the 'captives and those bound' hadn't been cleansed and redeemed and freed from the bondage, so what was the war in heaven about?

And if it was out of heaven, the war having ended SO cast out with the angels, where are the geber today?  And who has been 'accusing' day and night? 


 PLEASE just skip everything that has already been asked and answered in the first 5 pages, I am about to read them now. 


 

[DeighAnn]

Just now, DeighAnn said:

Which JEW?  SINCE there are more than one JEW, and if THEY ARE NOT KEPT separate, then everything gets very confusing very fast. 

2453. Ioudaios 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaios: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Original Word: Ἰουδαῖος, αία, αῖον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: Ioudaios
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah'-yos)
Definition: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Usage: Jewish.

a. joined to nouns, belonging to the Jewish race: 
b. without a noun, substantively, Jewish as respects birth, race, religion; a Jew:
Jewess, of Judaea.

From Iouda (in the sense of Ioudas as a country); Judaean, i.e. Belonging to Jehudah -- Jew(-ess), of Judaea.

OR

 2454. Ioudaismos 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaismos: Judaism
Original Word: Ἰουδαϊσμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Ioudaismos
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah-is-mos')
Definition: Judaism
Usage: the Jewish religion, Judaism.

Jewish Faith
From Ioudaizo; "Judaism", i.e. The Jewish faith and usages -- Jews' religion.

or 

THE EVIL FIGS/never in bondage/synagogue of Satan/mixed seed/of their father

9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.


because THAT JEW is way different than
A GOOD FIG 'JEW' and the PROPHECIES for both are very different.  

5Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel; Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge them that are carried away captive of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans for their good.

6For I will set mine eyes upon them for good, and I will bring them again to this land: and I will build them, and not pull them down; and I will plant them, and not pluck them up.

7And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be My people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto Me with their whole heart.

8And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the LORD, So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:

9And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.

10And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers.


So, to which JEWS are you referring to in this post for TRIB and ANGUISH?
the Christian Jews
or House of Judah Jews
or 'Jews' living in the country but not of the bloodline,
or 'Jews' practicing the religion living anywhere
or THE JEWS WHO CALL themselves JEWS but are synagogue of Satan...


How were 'all things written fulfilled' in the past?  Obviously, the whole world wasn't worshipping 'as God' someone who was producing lying signs and wonders.  There was no 'image' set up that was able to speak, was there?   How could there have been 'angels' walking the earth, taking and giving in marriage from that time to this?  Was the 'time of the gentiles' just a few years?   Do you think the 'blindness' has come off?  Have the two sticks become one? 


You wrote "In Luke 21:25 we see the same pause in the verse, and the same signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. But if you will notice the verse before it we are shown when this first tribulation of those days would end, and then the signs in the heavens would begin."


BUT what is written "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:" Acts 2:20 KJV

How does that fit?  When there are signs both BEFORE and again WHEN He does return. 


You wrote, "Also I would like to add there is no such thing as a 7 year tribulation, that is just the doctrines of men, as a 7 year tribulation is not mentioned anywhere in scripture, neither is a "pre-tribulation rapture.""


But there is the last 'week' from Daniel, or do you believe that to have taken place also?


You brought up so many points that seem like they work but we would have to throw out quite a few things of what is written for them to fit with the timeline set forth.  What do you do with all the stuff that DIDN'T happen?  


You wrote "Also in John 12:31 Jesus said; "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out.""

We see Satan 'possessing' Judas for the betrayal of Jesus after that, so my question is was Satan cast out of heaven at that time, or was he cast out of earth?  And if 'out of heaven', then WHAT was the WAR about?  The New Covenant hadn't come into play so 'Death' hadn't been defeated, the 'penalty' and ransom had not been paid, the 'captives and those bound' hadn't been cleansed and redeemed and freed from the bondage, so what was the war in heaven about?

And if it was out of heaven, the war having ended SO cast out with the angels, where are the geber today?  And who has been 'accusing' day and night? 


 PLEASE just skip everything that has already been asked and answered in the first 5 pages, I am about to read them now. 


 

Make that 8 pages

[Stewardofthemystery]

14 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Which JEW?  SINCE there are more than one JEW, and if THEY ARE NOT KEPT separate, then everything gets very confusing very fast. 

2453. Ioudaios 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaios: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Original Word: Ἰουδαῖος, αία, αῖον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: Ioudaios
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah'-yos)
Definition: Jewish, a Jew, Judea
Usage: Jewish.

a. joined to nouns, belonging to the Jewish race: 
b. without a noun, substantively, Jewish as respects birth, race, religion; a Jew:
Jewess, of Judaea.

From Iouda (in the sense of Ioudas as a country); Judaean, i.e. Belonging to Jehudah -- Jew(-ess), of Judaea.

OR

 2454. Ioudaismos 
Strong's Concordance
Ioudaismos: Judaism
Original Word: Ἰουδαϊσμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Ioudaismos
Phonetic Spelling: (ee-oo-dah-is-mos')
Definition: Judaism
Usage: the Jewish religion, Judaism.

Jewish Faith
From Ioudaizo; "Judaism", i.e. The Jewish faith and usages -- Jews' religion.

or 

THE EVIL FIGS/never in bondage/synagogue of Satan/mixed seed/of their father

9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.


because THAT JEW is way different than
A GOOD FIG 'JEW' and the PROPHECIES for both are very different.  

5Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel; Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge them that are carried away captive of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans for their good.

6For I will set mine eyes upon them for good, and I will bring them again to this land: and I will build them, and not pull them down; and I will plant them, and not pluck them up.

7And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be My people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto Me with their whole heart.

8And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the LORD, So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:

9And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.

10And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers.


So, to which JEWS are you referring to in this post for TRIB and ANGUISH?
the Christian Jews
or House of Judah Jews
or 'Jews' living in the country but not of the bloodline,
or 'Jews' practicing the religion living anywhere
or THE JEWS WHO CALL themselves JEWS but are synagogue of Satan...


How were 'all things written fulfilled' in the past?  Obviously, the whole world wasn't worshipping 'as God' someone who was producing lying signs and wonders.  There was no 'image' set up that was able to speak, was there?   How could there have been 'angels' walking the earth, taking and giving in marriage from that time to this?  Was the 'time of the gentiles' just a few years?   Do you think the 'blindness' has come off?  Have the two sticks become one? 


You wrote "In Luke 21:25 we see the same pause in the verse, and the same signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. But if you will notice the verse before it we are shown when this first tribulation of those days would end, and then the signs in the heavens would begin."


BUT what is written "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:" Acts 2:20 KJV

How does that fit?  When there are signs both BEFORE and again WHEN He does return. 


You wrote, "Also I would like to add there is no such thing as a 7 year tribulation, that is just the doctrines of men, as a 7 year tribulation is not mentioned anywhere in scripture, neither is a "pre-tribulation rapture.""


But there is the last 'week' from Daniel, or do you believe that to have taken place also?


You brought up so many points that seem like they work but we would have to throw out quite a few things of what is written for them to fit with the timeline set forth.  What do you do with all the stuff that DIDN'T happen?  


You wrote "Also in John 12:31 Jesus said; "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out.""

We see Satan 'possessing' Judas for the betrayal of Jesus after that, so my question is was Satan cast out of heaven at that time, or was he cast out of earth?  And if 'out of heaven', then WHAT was the WAR about?  The New Covenant hadn't come into play so 'Death' hadn't been defeated, the 'penalty' and ransom had not been paid, the 'captives and those bound' hadn't been cleansed and redeemed and freed from the bondage, so what was the war in heaven about?

And if it was out of heaven, the war having ended SO cast out with the angels, where are the geber today?  And who has been 'accusing' day and night? 


 PLEASE just skip everything that has already been asked and answered in the first 5 pages, I am about to read them now. 


 

The first tribulation “of those days” was to the flesh and blood Jews who had done evil.  Salvation was first offered to the Jewish people, but they would also be the first to suffer tribulation for rejecting God and Christ.

Notice what Paul says…

 

Romans 2:6-10

 

King James Version

 

 

⁶ Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

⁷ To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

⁸ But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

⁹ Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

¹⁰ But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:”

So Paul is speaking about the flesh and blood Jews who were prophesied to be scattered to all the Gentile nations and be persecuted from nation to nation. 

They were first warned by God through Moses what would happen…

Deuteronomy 4:26-30

King James Version

26 I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that ye shall soon utterly perish from off the land whereunto ye go over Jordan to possess it; ye shall not prolong your days upon it, but shall utterly be destroyed.

27 And the Lord shall scatter you among the nations, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the Lord shall lead you.

28 And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell.

29 But if from thence thou shalt seek the Lord thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.

30 When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, even in the latter days, if thou turn to the Lord thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice;”

So at the “fullness of time”for the Jews Christ came to seek first the lost sheep of the house of Israel.  Forty nine days after Jesus was crucified, at Pentecost, this is when the “new meat”offering began, which is the begin point of salvation coming to the Gentiles.

The AOD being set up in 70 ad was the start point of “the first tribulation”period of the flesh and blood Jews.  
 

Jesus said 

Luke 21:23

But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. (this people is referring to the flesh and blood Jews)

This first tribulation of the flesh and blood Jews would run all the way to “the fullness of the Gentiles” or “after the tribulation of those days” (which was first to the Jew)

After the tribulation of those days, the cup of Gods wrath will be taken from the Jews and given to the Gentiles, at that point the wrath of God will begin to be poured out on the entire Gentile world.

Shown here…

Isaiah 51:17-23

King James Version

17 Awake, awake, stand up, O Jerusalem, which hast drunk at the hand of the Lord the cup of his fury; thou hast drunken the dregs of the cup of trembling, and wrung them out.

18 There is none to guide her among all the sons whom she hath brought forth; neither is there any that taketh her by the hand of all the sons that she hath brought up.

19 These two things are come unto thee; who shall be sorry for thee? desolation, and destruction, and the famine, and the sword: by whom shall I comfort thee?

20 Thy sons have fainted, they lie at the head of all the streets, as a wild bull in a net: they are full of the fury of the Lord, the rebuke of thy God.

21 Therefore hear now this, thou afflicted, and drunken, but not with wine:

22 Thus saith thy Lord the Lord, and thy God that pleadeth the cause of his people, Behold, I have taken out of thine hand the cup of trembling, even the dregs of the cup of my fury; thou shalt no more drink it again:

23 But I will put it into the hand of them that afflict thee; which have said to thy soul, Bow down, that we may go over: and thou hast laid thy body as the ground, and as the street, to them that went over.”

 

The fullness of the Gentiles, and after the tribulation “of those days”will be marked by the 6th seal signs in the sun,moon, and stars.

This event will mark the start point of “the time of trouble such as the world has never seen, or the wrath of God that is to be poured out on the entire Gentile world.