FJK Posted February 8 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 43 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,349 Content Per Day: 7.92 Reputation: 1,305 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/01/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8 13 minutes ago, Sparks said: The rules of Hermeneutics and allowing the Bible to speak to a person through the what the original authors meant to say (exegesis) will allow a person to arrive at the correct answer. Most of all, it is the Holy Spirit within a person who has accepted the Gift of Salvation that helps a person to understand what they are reading. People who are still unsaved would struggle to understand the Bible (those without the Holy Spirit indwelling them), and Earthy interpretations. That is where the difference in interpretations come in. Notice this scripture about those born again an saved, understanding: 1 John 2:27 (NLT) But you have received the Holy Spirit, and he lives within you, so you don't need anyone to teach you what is true. For the Spirit teaches you everything you need to know, and what he teaches is true--it is not a lie. So just as he has taught you, remain in fellowship with Christ. Are you implying that those who disagree with you are wrong and they must come to your way of thinking, come to you, to be right? I think that is a dangerous thing to be doing if that is what you are meaning. Correct me if I am wrong about what you are meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted February 8 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.04 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Online Share Posted February 8 27 minutes ago, FJK said: Are you implying that those who disagree with you are wrong and they must come to your way of thinking, come to you, to be right? I think that is a dangerous thing to be doing if that is what you are meaning. Correct me if I am wrong about what you are meaning. Nope, that is not what I am saying, at all. But I am saying there is a correct way to interpret the Bible, and I will add that it is not 'my way' of thinking. I am also saying that those who are born again and saved who are indwelled by the Holy Spirit have a helper in understanding the Bible. (ESV) John 14:26 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJK Posted February 8 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 43 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,349 Content Per Day: 7.92 Reputation: 1,305 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/01/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8 1 minute ago, Sparks said: But I am saying there is a correct way to interpret the Bible, and I will add that it is not 'my way' of thinking. What would that "correct" way be and who determined that it is the correct way? What did Jesus say about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted February 8 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.04 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Online Share Posted February 8 7 hours ago, FJK said: What would that "correct" way be and who determined that it is the correct way? What did Jesus say about it? I have already told you, and demonstrated it. Think of Hermeneutics as a tool kit; a set of rules for interpretation that helps you to understand what the original authors of the Bible were saying. Part of it are rules for reading narratives, versus prophecy, versus poetic form, versus legal material, and so on, and part is understanding the times, and the culture back then. What does it mean when a Jew, of ancient times, tore his garment? It had specific meaning, but what meaning? To a Jew of those times, it needed no explanation. Genesis 37:29 Then Reuben returned to the pit, and indeed Joseph was not in the pit; and he tore his clothes. It is puzzling in our times that a person would tear their clothes, and if we went back in time, and spoke perfect Hebrew, my guess is that those people would not understand a 'mosh pit' even if we played a video of it, because it is something unique to our culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJK Posted February 8 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 43 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,349 Content Per Day: 7.92 Reputation: 1,305 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/01/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8 12 minutes ago, Sparks said: I have already told you, and demonstrated it. Think of Hermeneutics as a tool kit; a set of rules for interpretation that helps you to understand what the original authors of the Bible were saying. Part of it are rules for reading narratives, versus prophecy, versus poetic form, versus legal material, and so on, and part is understanding the times, and the culture back then. What does it mean when a Jew, of ancient times, tore his garment? It had specific meaning, but what meaning? To a Jew of those times, it needed no explanation. Genesis 37:29 Then Reuben returned to the pit, and indeed Joseph was not in the pit; and he tore his clothes. It is puzzling in our times that a person would tear their clothes, and if we went back and time, and spoke perfect Hebrew, my guess is that those people would not understand a 'mosh pit' even if we played a video of it, because it is something unique to our culture. Which of the four major types of hermeneutics (moral, anagogical, literal. allegorical) should be used and when? Should only one be used or should all of them be used and compared every time or should one be used sometimes and others at other times? How do we use this to help us to develop a closer and more effective relationship with Christ and practice it in our daily lives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted February 8 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.04 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Online Share Posted February 8 36 minutes ago, FJK said: Which of the four major types of hermeneutics (moral, anagogical, literal. allegorical) should be used and when? Hermeneutics is a tool kit, with tools. Not a single tool. 36 minutes ago, FJK said: Should only one be used or should all of them be used and compared every time or should one be used sometimes and others at other times? When you study Hermeneutics, you will know what to apply to what type of reading. 36 minutes ago, FJK said: How do we use this to help us to develop a closer and more effective relationship with Christ and practice it in our daily lives? A person who has accepted the Gift of Salvation has their own personal relationship with their savior, Jesus Christ. If you want to know more about Jesus, that is what the Bible is about from cover to cover. If you want to know more about how to understand the Bible, then Hermeneutics helps you to understand the Bible. What did John mean by "The Word?" It has a deeper meaning to people of those ancient times, for both the Jews and Gentiles, but suffice it say he is describing Jesus, himself. "The Word" = Jesus. Knowing that, what does this scripture say? John 1:1 (KJV) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:14 (KJV) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. If a person didn't know what John meant by 'the Word,' would they arrive at the right translation that Jesus is God in these scriptures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJK Posted February 8 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 43 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,349 Content Per Day: 7.92 Reputation: 1,305 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/01/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8 6 minutes ago, Sparks said: When you study Hermeneutics, you will know what to apply to what type of reading. When I study the Bible I find asking Holy Spirit to be my guide in understanding is far more desirable than using any man invented method to try to do so. Otherwise it is to easy to fall into the trap of trying to make it what I want it to say instead understanding of what it truly says. This is the way I believe, and nothing in this discussion has changed that in any way. I put my trust in the guidance of the Holy Spirit to direct me above all else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted February 8 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.04 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Online Share Posted February 8 23 minutes ago, FJK said: When I study the Bible I find asking Holy Spirit to be my guide in understanding is far more desirable than using any man invented method to try to do so. Otherwise it is to easy to fall into the trap of trying to make it what I want it to say instead understanding of what it truly says. This is the way I believe, and nothing in this discussion has changed that in any way. I put my trust in the guidance of the Holy Spirit to direct me above all else. Do you disagree with what I have written, and my reasoning? I have already told you, it's not 'my way.' Would you say that a person who was not saved would even know what that passage meant, describing Jesus being God? The text is clear when you know what John meant. For what it is worth, the Holy Spirit won't disagree with Himself, and for that matter neither will the Bible which was written by man, but which was Holy Spirit inspired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJK Posted February 8 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 43 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 3,349 Content Per Day: 7.92 Reputation: 1,305 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/01/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8 1 minute ago, Sparks said: Do you disagree with what I have written, and my reasoning? Not really, I just find no use for it myself since it seems to be trying to understand the spiritual nature of things with knowledge produced by the intellect. I tend to believe, as did Tesla, that "But instinct is something which transcends knowledge.". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks Posted February 8 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 28 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,159 Content Per Day: 2.04 Reputation: 2,513 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/20/2016 Status: Online Share Posted February 8 2 hours ago, FJK said: Not really, I just find no use for it myself since it seems to be trying to understand the spiritual nature of things with knowledge produced by the intellect. I tend to believe, as did Tesla, that "But instinct is something which transcends knowledge.". So, do you believe the 24 hour day described in Genesis is trillions of years, or something like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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