None Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,513 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/05/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/01/1908 Share Posted August 10, 2007 I don't have the time or the inclinations to correct the crass inaccuracies of this post # 36 but I do want to address the false accusations against a very renowned Jewish leader of the OT, Judge Deborah. And further, since the quoted is an example of the type of poor scholarship of that website, I would not recommend anyone take heed to anything else this person should write about on the subject of Christian women. We will not even begin to consider the theological implications here, rather, the point is that Deborah was by all indication not a great leader or a great woman but a usurper who did that which was right in her own eyes. The other argument given in support of women preachers is that Deborah was called a "prophetess" Judges 4:4 And Deborah, a prophetess, the wife of Lapidoth, she judged Israel at that time. However, a simple visit to the back of Strong's Concordance will eradicate this argument. The Hebrew word translated "prophetess" in our KJV is the word "nebiyah" which means "a prophets wife." Strongs Number 05031. So Deborah was neither a God called preacher, a God called judge, or a woman of greater than ordinary faith (remember that Barak is the one, not Deborah, accounted by God to have been the vessel of faith in Hebrews 11). Further, her being called a "prophetess" meant nothing more than that she was married to a prophet. Regarding nabi and nebiyah, nebiyah is simply the feminine, meaning a female prophet, which can be found in any good Hebrew dictionary. Strongs BTW is the least accurate place to look for Hebrew or Greek word meanings. The above person also misquoted Strongs quite well. In the additional notes Strongs shows that it can also mean an inspired woman (inspired speech) and if used by association it could mean a prophets wife. But nowhere is Lapidoth named as a prophet and history also excludes him from being a prophet. Further, if Deborah were a false prophet or a false Judge she would be so named in both the Bible and Jewish history. In short Deborah was a bona fide Prophet of Israel who was the God appointed Judge of Israel of that era who ruled Israel for 40 years, an exceptionally long rulership, and brought the peace of God to the land (Judges 6:31). In Jewish History she is remembered with honor as one of the praiseworthy seven prophetesses including Miriam, Sarah, Huldah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OopsMartin Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 829 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/26/1943 Share Posted August 10, 2007 I checked out VickyLynn's website. There are many women I know who teach Scripture and I have to say not one of them would ever show such poor scholarship as the person on that website. I'm sure she is well entended. But people who teach others need to learn how to properly research and exegete Scripture and be able to properly defend their stances. I am incredibly disappointed..... especially so because I support women teaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emily~Anne Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 146 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,308 Content Per Day: 0.36 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 I would not recommend anyone take heed to anything else this person should write about on the subject of Christian women. Funny, that is exactly how I feel about your posts. According to your way of thinking, left is right, up is down, light is dark and etc. I am sorry, but you make NO sense, and your posts totally contradict God's word which could not be clearer. As a woman, I find your posts offensive. I pity anyone who takes any heed to your posts. The bible has all the answers. If it doesnt fit with what you feel, then you are wrong and need to ask God to help you understand his word better, which is CLEAR and not lacking. Proverbs 3:5-6 5Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 6In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Greg Davies Posted August 10, 2007 Share Posted August 10, 2007 Read Acts18:24-26. It indicates a woman part of a marrital team teaching a man. Again, where did the virgin daughters of Philip prophecy? Obviously not at home, not being married and all. Prophecy is for the edification of the church. Yes? We have to open to an understanding where all scripture fits together and agrees. God is not the author of confusion. Bless you. Remember Peter's warning that Paul's teachings are not easily understood at times. We have to let scripture interpret scripture. Love ya all! Shalom Keilan, However, that passage says nothing about women SPEAKING in the assembly. There is no law, no mandate, nothing that says a woman cannot learn at the feet of Jesus! However, Paul says clearly that a woman should not teach men, should not have authority over men and should be silent in the assembly. Let's not confuse the 2 issues of learning (silently) and speaking in church. And we must go by Scripture, not men's opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 Shalom Keilan, However, that passage says nothing about women SPEAKING in the assembly. There is no law, no mandate, nothing that says a woman cannot learn at the feet of Jesus! However, Paul says clearly that a woman should not teach men, should not have authority over men and should be silent in the assembly. Let's not confuse the 2 issues of learning (silently) and speaking in church. And we must go by Scripture, not men's opinions. Uhhmmm, Vicki -- Did you read the previous postings or just jump in head first, unprepared? Some very respected folks have made some very good Biblical arguments *against* your assertion that Paul clearly states that a woman should be silent in the assembly. If you have something to contribute to the discussion, please do. But the use of weasal words (noted in red) won't help anybody... shalom -- shlomo ben david Shalom Ben, Ummmm, my name is Vickilynn, thanks. And MY authority comes from the Scriptures, not from people's opinion, no matter how much you respect them. Just because you may agree with their opinion, that doesn't make them correct. And, the next time you want to jump on and attack me for no reason, please know what you're talking about. For the record, I don't need your permission to enter any discussion, thank you. I see nothing in YOUR post contributing to the discussion, only a rude, unwarranted personal attack. It seems that YOU are the one who jumped in unprepared and obviously oblivious to the facts. Go back to PAGE ONE of this thread and you'll see me posting there (post #5 and others). I've been here from the beginning, contributing to the discussion and making it about the ISSUES. As for the "weasal" words (sic), that's just too ridiculous to respond to. You want to talk ISSUES, fine, but keep your nasty personal comments to yourself from now on. Thanks! Back to TOPIC and SCRIPTURES. Paul states clearly that women should be silent in the assembly. If you have a problem with that, then go to G-d. 1 Timothy 2: 11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. 1 Timothy 2: 12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 1 Timothy 2: 13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Corinthians 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. 35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church. 36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only? 37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 I checked out VickyLynn's website. There are many women I know who teach Scripture and I have to say not one of them would ever show such poor scholarship as the person on that website. I'm sure she is well entended. But people who teach others need to learn how to properly research and exegete Scripture and be able to properly defend their stances. I am incredibly disappointed..... especially so because I support women teaching. Shalom Martin, I expect nothing less that this self-glorifying rhetoric from you. Your opinion is your own and you're entitled to it, but you don't know it all, sorry . I happen to support and appreciate this teaching from Balanced Word Ministries and I agree with her teaching. It is also supported by other well-known and well-respected theologians as correct exegesis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 Vickilynn, that website looks AWESOME and I have bookmarked it and thoroughly look forward to checking out the rest of that website! Shalom Emily Anne, I found it on the Titus 2 site and I was very impressed with the teaching on this site. May it bless you and all who read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 Titus 2:3 The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; 4 That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, 5 To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed. Now some may take these scriptures and say, "Those are menial jobs that God calls women to do." First who says they are menial? Raising children, Caring for a home and making sure it run's smoothly. Is by no means MENIAL. Setting a Godly example and training young women as well is not menial. It is hard work and labour but how awesome a labour of love for us to serve our Lord this way. It's gonna take me awhile to read thorugh the whole post as I am very busy being a keeper at home, but I just wanted to give a hearty !AMEN! to this part especially! I will be reading the rest throughout the day and totally look forward to it. i would like to add thank you to her amen a very well thought out post. I will reread it as well with much thought and prayer. love your sister in Christ, Rebekah David Shalom Rebekah, Yes, this sister is a wonderful, Biblical teacher of women and her teaching is excellent. I pray you are blessed! I found it through a referral from a Titus 2 site and I have been very, very blessed by this sister's teaching of women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 I would not recommend anyone take heed to anything else this person should write about on the subject of Christian women. Funny, that is exactly how I feel about your posts. According to your way of thinking, left is right, up is down, light is dark and etc. I am sorry, but you make NO sense, and your posts totally contradict God's word which could not be clearer. As a woman, I find your posts offensive. I pity anyone who takes any heed to your posts. The bible has all the answers. If it doesnt fit with what you feel, then you are wrong and need to ask God to help you understand his word better, which is CLEAR and not lacking. Proverbs 3:5-6 5Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 6In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths. Shalom Emily Anne, Amen! You speak the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted August 10, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 10, 2007 Shalom, Regarding Deborah, let's look at Judges 4. Deborah lived in a different time and culture in Israel. She did not live in the NT church time. She was not being addressed by Paul. She is a poor argument against the truth from Scriptures that women are not to teach or usurp authority over men. That is clearly a Biblical truth. Deborah told Barak that HE and MEN should lead the attack. Verses 6-7 She sent and summoned Barak the son of Abinoam from(J) Kedesh-naphtali and said to him, "Has not the LORD, the God of Israel, commanded you, 'Go, gather your men at Mount(K) Tabor, taking 10,000 from the people of Naphtali and the people of Zebulun. 7And I will draw out Sisera, the general of Jabin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts