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This passage has troubled me...


KeilanS

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Here is another church and the story of their conclusions

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Here is another church and the story of their conclusions

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But I would clarify the idea that he sees no difference in gender. While I believe I understand you to be meaning within the realms of ministry, that statement is often taken erroneously to mean that someone confuses the sexes. And it is quite obvious that that church did not do that but acknowledged women as women, different but equal in value, equally able to be used in ministry by the Holy Spirit.

Yes. :)

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I agree that all lies will be made known, however, we will all see then which was the lie, and which was not. FA we've always known we've disagreed on this one, but still know that we love and respect each other, and on many things we are in full agreement.

Yep! :thumbsup:

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So questions for you..... do you believe that women will be subordinate to men in heaven. If so on what Scriptural basis. Also, what do you make of the no giving or taking in marriage in heaven.

You have asked 2 separate questions.

The subordination described in the NT relates to the church and its functioning here on earth. Whether or not there will be a cintinuation of this in heaven is really up to conjecture since it is not in any place directly addressed. SO I would say I can't know definitively

The passage regarding marriage in Matthew was Jesus' response to a scribe regarding the practive of Leverite Marriage in heaven. We are told that the intitution of marriage will not exist there. That is as far as I would want to take that. Since subordination is not caused by marriage, the fact that marriage will not exist in heaven does not mean that there will not be any subordination in heaven

Even if we were to agree that no subordination will exist in heaven, it would not be automatic to read that onto us now. We might be guilty of having an "over-realized eschatology". There are many realities that will exist in heaven, that do not exist now.

I fully agree with your last sentence.

So, just for clarity, do you believe that 1 Cor. 14:34-35 and 1 tim. 2:11-12 are Paul stating that women are subordinate to men in general, or only Christian women to Christian men, or only inside a church meeting, or only in certain types of church meetings? And how do you see that stated or implied in those Scriptures?

Do you think there are no ramifications of Christs statement that there is no giving or taking of marriage in heaven. I would think that at least it would effect the Mormon view of men having their own worlds which their wives are to be the um eternal wombs for. On what grounds do you think that it is possible that women will be eternally subordinate to men..... I.E. in heaven.

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I agree that all lies will be made known, however, we will all see then which was the lie, and which was not. FA we've always known we've disagreed on this one, but still know that we love and respect each other, and on many things we are in full agreement.

Yep! :thumbsup:

:emot-hug:

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Here is another church and the story of their conclusions

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Or how sad when women of God find out that they refused to submit to their God given role and stand in condemnation for it.

Shalom SP,

Amen and amen. This is the heart of Titus 2: 3-5. And that the Word of G-d may not be blasphemed.

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Ofcourse the lie of woman being a subordinate began in Eden when God said that he himself would put enemity between the serpent and the woman and his seed and hers. Well that's only a part of it.

Shalom Firehill,

sub

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I guess I am seeing the facts differently than you. We will all have things to confess when we stand before God. That is why I think we should approach the text and each other with humility

Well said. Humility does not come easy to humanity. Never has! But we all must make every effort to find enough humility to respect our brethren, as well as have compassion on the world at large.

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