tsth Posted September 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 We can receive revelation from God through any means, but the center is the most briliant! As one moves from the center out, the light of God's revelation is increasingly filtered by the sin and selfishness of humankind. Ultimately we are dependent upon God to reveal Himself to us individually and corporately. Agreed And how does the above translate into a real live application? How is the above, Truth, rather than humanism and man's ideas? It sounds good though. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherman Posted September 20, 2007 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 278 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/21/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1962 Share Posted September 20, 2007 We can receive revelation from God through any means, but the center is the most briliant! As one moves from the center out, the light of God's revelation is increasingly filtered by the sin and selfishness of humankind. Ultimately we are dependent upon God to reveal Himself to us individually and corporately. Agreed And how does the above translate into a real live application? How is the above, Truth, rather than humanism and man's ideas? It sounds good though. In His Love, Suzanne A personal relationship with Jesus is of central importance. Beyond that, studying the scriptures is of tremendous value and importance. And we must not forget the community of faith, the church, the universal Body of Christ; the more interaction we have with these primary means of revelation, the more we can grow in our understanding of God. It's an openness to Truth however God choses to reveal it too us, even if it comes through a donkey. It's also a diligence in prayer and study to verify what is true no matter what "source" it comes from. We need to be like the Bereans, both open minded (eager to learn new stuff that might even contradict what we already think we know) and not gullible but diligent to study and search out the primary sources (Jesus, Scripture, etc.). It comes down to attitude. We need to be poor in spirit (humble, realizing that we don't have a corner market on the truth and very well likely wrong in some of our core beliefs), and hungry for righteousness (great desire to grow in our revelation of God)! Thank God that salvation is based on His goodness and mercy, and not on my doctrinal correctness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted September 20, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 But hasn't the revelation of Truth always been shown to be in the acknowledgement that a group of people LEFT the Word of God? Isn't that what the prophets have always proclaimed? That the people need to return to the Truth of God in what He has said? Not that they need to hear something new, but return to the Old, and stop the hypocrisy. Isn't that why The Word became Flesh? John 1:1 In the beginning, was the Word. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 Revelation 22 6 The angel said to me, "These words are trustworthy and true. The Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent his angel to show his servants the things that must soon take place." 7 "Behold, I am coming soon! Blessed is he who keeps the words of the prophecy in this book." 8 I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I had heard and seen them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who had been showing them to me. 9 But he said to me, "Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers the prophets and of all who keep the words of this book. Worship God!" 10 Then he told me, "Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, because the time is near. 11 Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile; let him who does right continue to do right; and let him who is holy continue to be holy." 12 "Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie B Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 119 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/17/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/03/1951 Share Posted September 21, 2007 The only way I can know right from wrong, true from false or wise from foolish today, is by what God has said in his written word for us today. What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree as is proven over and over by the many different doctrinal positions expressed throughout the postings on this forum, as well intended they may all seem to be. 2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be perfected, thoroughly furnished to every good work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherman Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 278 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/21/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1962 Share Posted September 21, 2007 But hasn't the revelation of Truth always been shown to be in the acknowledgement that a group of people LEFT the Word of God? Isn't that what the prophets have always proclaimed? That the people need to return to the Truth of God in what He has said? Not that they need to hear something new, but return to the Old, and stop the hypocrisy. Isn't that why The Word became Flesh? John 1:1 In the beginning, was the Word. In His Love, Suzanne It's likely that I'm splitting a hair here, but I think it depends on what people understand by the word "Truth" - the person of Jesus or a set of doctrines? The Bible is full of examples and statements about people turning their hearts from God and God calling them back to Himself. If, in our hearts, we seek God, He will increasingly lead us into truth which will primarily come through scripture if we are open to Him correcting us. However, if what we mean by "truth" is a certain set of doctrines that we've been taught are true, then that assume we have all the "truth". I don't think you mean this, but many people do. As I've sought the Lord, I've come to realize that many of the things, doctines that I've been taught since childhood are in error and based on a misinterpretation of scripture. Just this summer, I've been challenged in my traditional understanding of patriarchy. I've always assumed that patriarchy is both biblically descriptive (the way things were) and prescriptive (the way things should be). However, as I've prayerfully restudied this issue, I'm increasingly coming to believe that patriarchy was biblically descriptive, but not biblically prescriptive. Rather, an egalitarian model is much more the way things "should be." But that's a seperate issue; my point is that we need to seek the Lord, be diligent to study His Word, and He will increasingly lead us into Truth, for ultimately He is Truth. But like I said, I'm probably just splitting hairs. seeking Truth with you, Sherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherman Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 278 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/21/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1962 Share Posted September 21, 2007 The only way I can know right from wrong, true from false or wise from foolish today, is by what God has said in his written word for us today. What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree as is proven over and over by the many different doctrinal positions expressed throughout the postings on this forum, as well intended they may all seem to be. 2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be perfected, thoroughly furnished to every good work. Scripture is God-breathed, but scripture was also written by man. And as you said, "What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree..." So then, is scripture tainted by sin in some degree? Not only that, but when Paul wrote 2 Tim.3.16-17, the "Scripture" he referred to was the Old Testament, so what about the New Testament as we know it. Furthermore, what about continued progressive Revelation from God? For example, we accept as truth today that "slavery" is evil; and yet, the Bible does not say that slavery is evil. In fact, scripture instructs slaves to be obedient to their masters and Paul even sent an escaped slave back to his master. I just bring this up to instigate discussion and cause people to think. I believe that Scripture is God-breated and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, etc. In fact, this is one of my favorite verses. Blessings, Sherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 However, if what we mean by "truth" is a certain set of doctrines that we've been taught are true, then that assume we have all the "truth". I don't think you mean this, but many people do. As I've sought the Lord, I've come to realize that many of the things, doctines that I've been taught since childhood are in error and based on a misinterpretation of scripture. But that's a seperate issue; my point is that we need to seek the Lord, be diligent to study His Word, and He will increasingly lead us into Truth, for ultimately He is Truth. But like I said, I'm probably just splitting hairs. seeking Truth with you, Sherman Dear Sherman, On these 2 points I wholeheartedly agree with you. As far as the other, I don't know the jargon/terminology, i.e. "egalitarian model", so I can't say whether I agree or disagree on it......... In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 The only way I can know right from wrong, true from false or wise from foolish today, is by what God has said in his written word for us today. What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree as is proven over and over by the many different doctrinal positions expressed throughout the postings on this forum, as well intended they may all seem to be. 2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be perfected, thoroughly furnished to every good work. Scripture is God-breathed, but scripture was also written by man. And as you said, "What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree..." So then, is scripture tainted by sin in some degree? Not only that, but when Paul wrote 2 Tim.3.16-17, the "Scripture" he referred to was the Old Testament, so what about the New Testament as we know it. Furthermore, what about continued progressive Revelation from God? For example, we accept as truth today that "slavery" is evil; and yet, the Bible does not say that slavery is evil. In fact, scripture instructs slaves to be obedient to their masters and Paul even sent an escaped slave back to his master. I just bring this up to instigate discussion and cause people to think. I believe that Scripture is God-breated and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, etc. In fact, this is one of my favorite verses. Blessings, Sherman Shoot, well, don't agree with you here Sherman. Are you implying that Paul, (being inspired by the Holy Spirit) wrote something that was tainted? With regard to progressive revelation, it's not that the TRUTH changes with time, but merely that we have been given understanding of it as "time" progresses. The Truth of the Word is NEVER subject to change, and I believe ALL Scripture, IS profitable. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherman Posted September 21, 2007 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 278 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/21/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1962 Share Posted September 21, 2007 The only way I can know right from wrong, true from false or wise from foolish today, is by what God has said in his written word for us today. What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree as is proven over and over by the many different doctrinal positions expressed throughout the postings on this forum, as well intended they may all seem to be. 2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be perfected, thoroughly furnished to every good work. Scripture is God-breathed, but scripture was also written by man. And as you said, "What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree..." So then, is scripture tainted by sin in some degree? Not only that, but when Paul wrote 2 Tim.3.16-17, the "Scripture" he referred to was the Old Testament, so what about the New Testament as we know it. Furthermore, what about continued progressive Revelation from God? For example, we accept as truth today that "slavery" is evil; and yet, the Bible does not say that slavery is evil. In fact, scripture instructs slaves to be obedient to their masters and Paul even sent an escaped slave back to his master. I just bring this up to instigate discussion and cause people to think. I believe that Scripture is God-breated and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, etc. In fact, this is one of my favorite verses. Blessings, Sherman Shoot, well, don't agree with you here Sherman. Are you implying that Paul, (being inspired by the Holy Spirit) wrote something that was tainted? With regard to progressive revelation, it's not that the TRUTH changes with time, but merely that we have been given understanding of it as "time" progresses. The Truth of the Word is NEVER subject to change, and I believe ALL Scripture, IS profitable. In His Love, Suzanne I too believe that "ALL Scripture IS profitable"! And I agree fully that the Truth of the Word is NEVER subject to change." And I agree that progressive revelation means that we are progressively given increasing understanding of Truth as time progresses. Is scripture "tainted"? Could various aspects of scripture be in error or not reflect clearly the Truth? I don't know; I'm wrestling through this myself. I do know that my and your understanding / interpretation of scripture can certainly be wrong. Thankfully we have the Holy Spirit to lead us into and teach us all Truth; and salvation is not dependent upon having perfect theology, but upon the goodness and forgiveness of God in Christ Jesus! Blessings, Sherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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