Eddie B

Ac

Maybe the problem is their are to many pastors teaching saved by grace but live by the Law, and to many Christians doing the same. If you teach and preach saved by grace and live by grace maybe we won't have a problem to give by grace.

I agree that we are by the Holy Spirit only able to overcome the world, the flesh and the Devil. But here in Rev. hes talking about overcoming what was taking place in the body of belivers within "Christianity"(in Church). Its a warning to us today, is it not? It is, but what was happening in the church was not from God; therefore, it was either from the flesh or from the encouragement from Satan. As I see it, anything leading us away from the will of God, no matter where it is found in the Bible, as being influenced by our fleshly desires or the Evil one. Sure thats true but I was thinking of the warnings to the Church to beware of false teachers who come to you, to decieve you. Its a lot easier to recognize those outward obvious sins of the flesh and the world, but more difficult to see how subtle Satan is in working through false teachers or teachings, even if they don't see they are decieved by Satan.Its more difficult to overcome the lies of religious good works for justification or santification. Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Gal 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? Is He not warning us to beware of false teachers or teaching in the "Church". 1Ti 1:3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine, 1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do. 1Ti 1:5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned: 1Ti 1:6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling; 1Ti 1:7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. 2Co 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 2Co 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 2Co 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. ough false leaders to draw us away from loving Christ.

In reading your post my heart and prayer goes out to you in your time of need. I have suffered on and off over the years from chronic faiteg and that brings on depression, and you loose your will to live. At those times I would rather die and be with Jesus but then I think of my love ones I would leave behind and I would rather stay for their sake. Also I have come to realize that these afflictions are sent by God to be able to learn how to love Him more. God has a purpose for our afflictions.

Good post, I had to learn that wrong anger is a choice and to not let it rule over me by the grace God provides in faith in Jesus. Iam glad i read this post its very timely for me and my wife this week . We are watching our 5 grandkids for 4 days. Most of the time they are little darlings(ages 2,3,6,7,9)but when that sin-nature kicks in you want to ring their little necks. You can go from calm to angry in a secound. So what my wife and I do is we play tag team aganist each others anger, when she looses it I come to her rescue and when I loose it she comes to my rescue.

He's death, burial and resurection began my salvation in Christ and continues through this life into eternity.

I agree that we are by the Holy Spirit only able to overcome the world, the flesh and the Devil. But here in Rev. hes talking about overcoming what was taking place in the body of belivers within "Christianity"(in Church). Its a warning to us today, is it not?

Hello, The O.T. scriptures are Gods word and the N.T. scriptures are Gods word, which should we follow, both. Start in Genisis and allow the Holy Spirit to show you His word is a progressive revelation of Himself and His will for us to learn how to love Him. Do we today follow everything that the O.T. says to do? We follow everything that Jesus Christ says to do. Jesus Christ takes the O.T. and elevates it to having a relationship with Him not just obeying a set of laws. So what does the N.T. say about tithing, it says if Christ has our heart we will give our all to Him in everything, He dosn't want anything from us but to love Him first, then we will do whatever he wants gladly and cheerfully for the benifit of others. We are just stewards of everything not owners of everything. The N. T. has a lot to say about giving our money. Here are the passages that makes that clear to me about what God says about giving not tithing. 2Co 8:1 Moreover, brethren, we do you to wit of the grace of God bestowed on the churches of Macedonia; 2Co 8:2 How that in a great trial of affliction the abundance of their joy and their deep poverty abounded unto the riches of their liberality. 2Co 8:3 For to their power, I bear record, yea, and beyond their power they were willing of themselves; 2Co 8:4 Praying us with much intreaty that we would receive the gift, and take upon us the fellowship of the ministering to the saints. 2Co 8:5 And this they did, not as we hoped, but first gave their own selves to the Lord, and unto us by the will of God. 2Co 8:6 Insomuch that we desired Titus, that as he had begun, so he would also finish in you the same grace also. 2Co 8:7 Therefore, as ye abound in every thing, in faith, and utterance, and knowledge, and in all diligence, and in your love to us, see that ye abound in this grace also. 2Co 8:8 I speak not by commandment, but by occasion of the forwardness of others, and to prove the sincerity of your love. 2Co 8:9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich. 2Co 8:10 And herein I give my advice: for this is expedient for you, who have begun before, not only to do, but also to be forward a year ago. 2Co 8:11 Now therefore perform the doing of it; that as there was a readiness to will, so there may be a performance also out of that which ye have. 2Co 8:12 For if there be first a willing mind, it is accepted according to that a man hath, and not according to that he hath not. 2Co 8:13 For I mean not that other men be eased, and ye burdened: 2Co 8:14 But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want: that there may be equality: 2Co 8:15 As it is written, He that had gathered much had nothing over; and he that had gathered little had no lack. 2Co 8:16 But thanks be to God, which put the same earnest care into the heart of Titus for you. 2Co 8:17 For indeed he accepted the exhortation; but being more forward, of his own accord he went unto you. 2Co 8:18 And we have sent with him the brother, whose praise is in the gospel throughout all the churches; 2Co 8:19 And not that only, but who was also chosen of the churches to travel with us with this grace, which is administered by us to the glory of the same Lord, and declaration of your ready mind: 2Co 8:20 Avoiding this, that no man should blame us in this abundance which is administered by us: 2Co 8:21 Providing for honest things, not only in the sight of the Lord, but also in the sight of men. 2Co 8:22 And we have sent with them our brother, whom we have oftentimes proved diligent in many things, but now much more diligent, upon the great confidence which I have in you. 2Co 8:23 Whether any do enquire of Titus, he is my partner and fellowhelper concerning you: or our brethren be enquired of, they are the messengers of the churches, and the glory of Christ. 2Co 8:24 Wherefore shew ye to them, and before the churches, the proof of your love, and of our boasting on your behalf. 2Co 9:1 For as touching the ministering to the saints, it is superfluous for me to write to you: 2Co 9:2 For I know the forwardness of your mind, for which I boast of you to them of Macedonia, that Achaia was ready a year ago; and your zeal hath provoked very many. 2Co 9:3 Yet have I sent the brethren, lest our boasting of you should be in vain in this behalf; that, as I said, ye may be ready: 2Co 9:4 Lest haply if they of Macedonia come with me, and find you unprepared, we (that we say not, ye) should be ashamed in this same confident boasting. 2Co 9:5 Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren, that they would go before unto you, and make up beforehand your bounty, whereof ye had notice before, that the same might be ready, as a matter of bounty, and not as of covetousness. 2Co 9:6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. 2Co 9:7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. 2Co 9:8 And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work: 2Co 9:9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.

Hi tsth, I don't know for sure who's saved or not, but this bunch certainly sounds lost to me. But then I think of Lot he probably didn't look saved either. I do know one thing from personal experience of backsliding so bad when I was first saved you will doubt your not saved and by the grace of God run for the Father as fast as you can, and it isn't spiritually easy coming back.

I agree, like driving 100 m.p.h. in a 25 zone and then when we crash its, God how could this happen. Of course Iam not speaking from experience.

The verses mentioned below say quite clearly that certain individuals suffered severe consequences for their disobedience to God. They were Christians and yet they still suffered for their sin. Do you think that this could only happen to Christians living in the first century, or could this happen to Christians today? Act 5:5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things. Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep 1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

The verses mentioned below say quite clearly that certain individuals suffered severe consequences for their disobedience to God. They were Christians and yet they still suffered for their sin. Do you think that this could only happen to Christians living in the first century, or could this happen to Christians today? Act 5:5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things. Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep 1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

In Rev. John writes to the 7 churches and gives some good comendations to some; and then gives some bad condemnation to them as well. To each church he mentions a group of overcomers and what they must overcome in order to recieve the promise mentioned to each church. Their are 7 promises mentioned in all. I thought it was interesting that each group of overcomers had to overcome what God said he hated going on in His Church. What do you think that means for us today? Or if you have any thoughts on the subject, like to hear them.

Doe's God love me and accept me just the way iam.Yes! But if i disrespect God by contineually disobeying Him will i suffer the consequences.Yes! Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 1Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

Luk 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me It looks as if Jesus spoke these word primaraly to the relgious Jews who constantly followed Jesus, only to try to find fault in him. These are the enimies i think he is speaking of because later in the chapter he tells them that Jerusalem would one day be destoyed by the Romans in 70 A.D. The Jews rejected Jesus as their king. But it is a warning to all who reject Jesus as their King, become his enemy. Luk 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes. Luk 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side, Luk 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.

Well, after reading your last post I think that we substantially agree on the issue of perfection. The only point of divergence is on the rapture doctrine. Dare we go there! I've been involved briefly with the "lose your salvation" and "water baptism" debates and I certainly don't want to start one of those intractable discusions. This isn't the right forum anyway, I think. But just to satisfy your curiosity , I'll just say that in I Thes. 4:17, when we meet Him in the air, then what? Most believe that Jesus makes a U-turn and takes us back to heaven. I believe we make the U-turn and Jesus continues on back to earth and sets up His millenial reign with us . How's that for heresy? Greg. Iam glad that after all we do pretty much agree then on the teaching on perfection. As far as the rapture I believe Jesus takes us to heaven and then we come back at the end of the trib. But whatever position you have on the rapture whats most important is we are looking for Jesus to return soon, whenever that will be.

Sounds like you and your wife have it pretty good. I looked up the defination for genius and found this: genius (plural: genii (classical Roman mythology) or geniuses (colloquial)) 1. someone possessing extraordinary intelligence or skill 2. extraordinary mental capacity 3. inspiration, a mental leap, an extraordinary creative process She has great intelligence because she never says no. She has great skills, as a mentioned cooking is one of them. Then there is cleaning the house, taking care of the kids, washing the clothes, ironing,etc. She has a great mental capacity to know just what Iam thinking and say yes dear, and not Ive got a headache. Shes my inspiration because when the days over and she gets a good not sleep, I can look forward to tommorrows repeat performance.

I consider my wife a genius, she sure can cook!

Ha, is Judges the only confusing bit?. What about the bit about its ok to perform incest? LOT after Soddom sleeps with his two daughters. Must be ok Ge 19:36 Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father. Notice it says thus, or as a result of Lots previous lifestyle his daughters got their father drunk in order to commit a sin of incest. Even though in the beginning it was nessasary for a brother and sister to have relations in order to continue the human race, it was not ok to do so. God at a later time has to expressly forbid it in order to stop it. It was forbiden as we can see by Lots daughters having to get their father drunk to commit the act. The story of Lot's backsliding illustrates the seven downward steps. (1) Covetousness (Ge 13:10). Many a man has made the mistake of fixing his eyes on the wrong objects. (2) Choosing too low (Ge 13:11; 19:17). Lot chose the plain instead of the mountain. Christians are to aim high-at heavenly things (Col 3:1-3), at the most excellent things (Php 1:9-10). Christians injure their spiritual lives when they choose less than God's perfect will in areas of friendship, entertainment, literature, occupation, etc. (3) Compromise (Ge 13:12-13). Lot pitched his tent toward wicked Sodom. Christians are to flee youthful lusts (2Ti 2:22), avoid all appearance of evil (1Th 5:22), have no fellowship with evil works (Eph 5:11). (4) Captured by the enemy (Ge 14:11-12). Those who do not have on the whole armor of God will be captured by the enemy, who is walking about seeking whom he may devour (Eph 6:10-19; 1Pe 5:8). (5) Carnal (Ge 19:1,16). Lot loved Sodom and its excitement. He was a saved men, and his heart was grieved at the gross wickedness (2Pe 2:7); but still he loved Sodom. Lot had no powerful testimony because he lived primarily for the things of the world (Ge 19:14). Many Christians love the evil things of this world that God hates and is going to judge (1Jo 2:15-17; Jas 4:4). (6) Spiritual weakness (Ge 19:8). Lot was willing to give his daughters into sin. Because of his backsliding, he had no spiritual power. (7) Carousing (Ge 19:33-38). Here we find Lot drinking wine and committing immorality. His first wrong choices led him deeper and deeper into sin and farther and farther from God's fellowship.

The verses you quoted state my position on perfection, so I'm confused by what you think being perfect means? Perhaps we don't disagree basically. It's the "never attain perfection on earth" quote I think contradicts scripture. Greg.

A couple of things, Ehrenkreuz. First, one can not see a spirit. Secondly, God's Word is final, without mistake. There are other things in the Bible that appear only once. Because you can not cross reference something, does not meant it is not true. First, None of this "God's Word is final" buisness, please. I'm sure that's fine when you're at church, but you sound rather pretentious from a non-believer's POV. Second, assuming that Jesus was only resurrected in spirit, it's still entirely possible that he appeared to the Disciples in a vision. Or a 'revelation' as Paul says in Galatians 1. And in 1 Corinthians 15, verse 44 Paul says, "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body." It may also be worth reading the verses that follow, as they cling to the same pattern. There seems to be a chance that Paul believed that Christ rose not in a flesh body, but in a spiritual body. Mt

I don't know why so many Christians have such hard time accepting the clear biblical teaching on perfection. Eph 4:13 gives us a description of perfection: the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ. I John 3:2 says we will be like Him. Rom 8:29 declares that we are to be conformed to Jesus's Image. Eph 5:27 promises us that Jesus is returning for a church that is without spot or wrinkle, a glorious church. And finally, Rev 5:10 tell us where we will rule and reign with Christ....ON THE EARTH! Glory to God! We needn't discount God's promises because they may seem impossible. With man, these things are impossible but with God all things are possible and I'm going to take Him at His word. It seems you are disagreeing with my understanding of being perfect in Christ(justification) and becoming perfect(maturing to be more and more like Christ(santification). The verses you quoted state my position on perfection, so Iam confused by what you think being perfect means?

1st ? Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. True righteousness comes from God by faith in Christ and makes us new creatures of a divine nature. It is only then as we live by faith in Christ can we from a new heart express the righteousness of God in our daily lives. Phi 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: 2nd ? Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. We never attain perfection here on earth, but we are to by faith strive towards it. To me it means to grow in maturing as a Christian more and more to have the mind of Christ. Phi 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Phi 3:13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, Phi 3:14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. Phi 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. 3rd ? Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many people profess to be Christians and yet they are not, because they have never trusted Christ alone for there salvation. Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. Then their are those who suppose themselves to be Christians because they have said a prayer, or think that some verbal expressions of acknowedgement we save them, but have know prove of Christ in their daily lives. Tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate. Jam 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

You either by faith believe Gods word is God-breathed and preserved forever or you have not faith to believe it. Ro 14:23 - `Whatsoever is not of faith is sin.' If I cannot by faith take the Bible in my hand and say this is the preserved Word of God, then it is sin. If we do not approach the study of how we got our Bible from the standpoint of faith, then it is sin. If I cannot believe what God says about the preservation of His Word, then I cannot believe what He says about its inspiration either-all is sin." Ps 12:6-7 The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O Lord, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever." Ps 100:5 For the Lord is good; his mercy is everlasting; and his truth endureth to all generations." Ps 100:5 Isa 40:8 "The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever."

Scripture is God-breathed, but scripture was also written by man. And as you said, "What man thinks, says or writes is always tainted by sin in some degree..." So then, is scripture tainted by sin in some degree? Not only that, but when Paul wrote 2 Tim.3.16-17, the "Scripture" he referred to was the Old Testament, so what about the New Testament as we know it. Furthermore, what about continued progressive Revelation from God? For example, we accept as truth today that "slavery" is evil; and yet, the Bible does not say that slavery is evil. In fact, scripture instructs slaves to be obedient to their masters and Paul even sent an escaped slave back to his master. I just bring this up to instigate discussion and cause people to think. I believe that Scripture is God-breated and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, etc. In fact, this is one of my favorite verses. Blessings, Sherman I get your point. I know that Gods word is from God only because I live by faith in what God says, and it works for me. Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. Rom 8:16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. Act 26:18 in order to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light, and from the authority of Satan to God, so that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me Rom 5:2 Through Him we also have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice on the hope of the glory of God 2Co 5:7 for we walk by faith, not by sight;