Guest HIS girl Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Well I'm thinking of the tree of the "knowledge" of good and evil. It is WE who activated evil through the disobedience of Adam and Eve via the eating of the fruit. One bite and their "eyes were opened". I will admit it is very hard to unite the idea of God and evil. I don't really know much on the subject - if anyone knows more, can you please expand on it. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HIS girl Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 I just had a thought - was it originally "activated" through the rebellion of Lucifer? So, once it's all said and done - and we are in the presence of God - evil will be where it belongs - in Hell with satan for eternity. Isn't satan the embodiment of evil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botz Posted February 16, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 76 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,492 Content Per Day: 0.61 Reputation: 191 Days Won: 18 Joined: 03/29/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 16, 2009 Without trying to cop out...I have learnt that with some things it is sheer futility to try and understand the heart of G-d on a matter when we are not given enough evidence to make a sound judgment...when that happens it becomes a question of trust...knowing that His purposes are beyond finding out. You don't have to fully understand all He does to be able to trust Him. I am sure we could go around finding all sorts of tactical questions to pose, and demand a solid answer to our own cleverness at coming up with such things...but it is vanity...nothing but vanity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted February 16, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.09 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted February 16, 2009 My point would be that I cannot be satisfied trying to justify the story with an explanation that seems intellectually flawed. Nor can I seek no answer at all. Were they real trees? Are they allegory? The questions just multiply and as you point out there are few good answers. There is one though. All would be explained if the story was myth. Why do bad things happen to good people? Why is there suffering in the world? Why is there misery? It even explains why there is pain associated with childbirth. The story gives the answer. The Greeks have their own answer with Pandora, and I am sure other peoples have myths that explain the presence of evil in the world. It fits. It is the one explanation that to my thinking makes sense. Nice try, Hitchey. But....no cigar for you. As if a mere mortal could reduce Scripture to a myth. It's understandable that you try to take the Bible apart and examine it then try to rearrange it so it will make sense to you. It's not going to make sense to one who doesn't have the Lord within him. One of the best verifiers for the story of Adam and Eve is that the same scenario appears in the Qu'ran. And, since we know that book is the work of Behelzebub, the story is cooberated by one who was there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HIS girl Posted February 16, 2009 Share Posted February 16, 2009 Without trying to cop out...I have learnt that with some things it is sheer futility to try and understand the heart of G-d on a matter when we are not given enough evidence to make a sound judgment...when that happens it becomes a question of trust...knowing that His purposes are beyond finding out. You don't have to fully understand all He does to be able to trust Him. I am sure we could go around finding all sorts of tactical questions to pose, and demand a solid answer to our own cleverness at coming up with such things...but it is vanity...nothing but vanity. Absolutely Botz! Hitchey, I meant the presence of God as in FACE to Face.....in Paradise.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahDavid Posted February 16, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 320 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 3,166 Content Per Day: 0.45 Reputation: 23 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 16, 2009 blessings, your questions and assumptions are a little off Hitchey. no where in scripture does it say that the tree was easily accesable or that God wanted them to eat of the tree. lets look at this if God had "wanted them to eat the from the tree" why then just not hand them the fruit and say eat? or better yet create them with the knowledge of both good and evil why warn them about the fruit? it comes to this a matter of believing and obeying God through choice. satan was created for a different purpose than what he chose. so we do have scripture that shows choice comes into play. love your sister in Christ, Rebekah David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botz Posted February 17, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 76 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,492 Content Per Day: 0.61 Reputation: 191 Days Won: 18 Joined: 03/29/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2009 Without trying to cop out...I have learnt that with some things it is sheer futility to try and understand the heart of G-d on a matter when we are not given enough evidence to make a sound judgment...when that happens it becomes a question of trust...knowing that His purposes are beyond finding out. You don't have to fully understand all He does to be able to trust Him. I am sure we could go around finding all sorts of tactical questions to pose, and demand a solid answer to our own cleverness at coming up with such things...but it is vanity...nothing but vanity.Thank you Botz for your comments. I think you are admitting that the questions I pose have no easy answer for anyone who wishes to take the story of Adam and Eve as an accurate retelling of events. My question was serious and has been taken very seriously in the past. When I first realized that on the face of things it didn't seem to make sense to place the trees where there was easy access to the fruit, I thought I had hit on something that no one had noticed before. God must have known Eve would taste the fruit and expected her to do it. Why else put those trees in the center of the garden. One day I discovered that 2000 years ago the same question had been addressed in a work that is one of the Gnostic Gospels. The author of that work thought they were real trees and made, what I think is a wild assumption, that a baser god had been responsible for creating the world and that a higher god ruled over him. My point would be that I cannot be satisfied trying to justify the story with an explanation that seems intellectually flawed. Nor can I seek no answer at all. Were they real trees? Are they allegory? The questions just multiply and as you point out there are few good answers. There is one though. All would be explained if the story was myth. Why do bad things happen to good people? Why is there suffering in the world? Why is there misery? It even explains why there is pain associated with childbirth. The story gives the answer. The Greeks have their own answer with Pandora, and I am sure other peoples have myths that explain the presence of evil in the world. It fits. It is the one explanation that to my thinking makes sense. Hitchey in this instance I am sure you are mostly convinced by your own conclusions. If I ever thought the Genesis account was pure myth, I would have packed my bags and headed for the hills many moons ago...but having encountered the Author I am utterly convinced the account is historical and accurate. It is also very brief...a divine synopsis that encapsulates the act of creation and the beginning of humanity without filling in all the blanks. Fascinating, awe inspiring, marvellous, encouraging....even frustrating at times,(due to the limitations of our human intellect and weak grasp of G-d's purposes) but it all demostrates something of the plan of G-d, and fits in beautifully with the rest of the historical accounts found in the Scriptures. G-d shows us many things...some hard to grasp, but He does not reveal everything...at least not just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germanJoy Posted February 20, 2009 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 97 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted February 20, 2009 (edited) The tree of the knowledge of good and evil was an access to becoming like God, knowing good and evil and having the ability to choose between the two which made their freewill sinful. God placed the tree at the Garden to test Adam and Eve. Scripture tells us that God tests the righteous which was the position of man before the fall. There is a high probability that Lucifer was also in a similar condition before his fall. Edited February 20, 2009 by germanJoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HIS girl Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Is this a common thought - that God put the trees there to test the first human beings? Lucifer's downfall was pride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HIS girl Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 ='Preachbill' Yes, I believe that God put those trees to test ADAM and EVE, Hmmm...I have to mull this over for a while.... The trees were there before the serpent (satan) rocked up? Yes? So I'm thinking - everything was fine with Adam/Eve AND the trees UNTIL satan turned up..... I'm still mulling this over.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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