Permie

wow, I have to admit your inner voice has given you a totally different meaning for that passage than I have ever heard before. LOL, and I like your sense of humor.

We are told by the bible that we will know the spirit by the fruits. As it is for you. The same hold true for both of us. Thank you. I did see the beginning of this conversation and was not able to join in due to other activities that I needed to attend to even though I had wanted to. That we may have different understandings of scripture doesn't mean that we cannot disagree agreeably. I believe as Proverbs says: Iron sharpens iron,So one man sharpens another. Proverbs 27:17 And also, even better, is that when we reason together and leave whatever it is that motivates someone to not "consider another better than ourselves" out of conversations, Jesus will join us: And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. Luke 24:15 As for who I shall or shall not defend will be my decision. Like you, I defend the truth as I see it and was taught to me by Christ.

nope I saw it. it made no sense at all, I have no clue what you were trying to say or what the passage was supposed to show. The scriptures that were provided was for the purpose of showing who it is that does the will of God. Not those who just say yes, but those who do... even if they said no. The last scripture was Jesus saying who it was that was His family... those who do the will of His and Our Father.

Okay then, with your added statements, yes. I agree. The bible is 100% inspired word of God. No question about it.

no, scripture is not fulfilled by acting in the manner shown in I Cor 13:4-8. It is possible to love like this and not have Jesus in your heart, it is possible to love like this and deny the very existance of God. Yes, it is possible to know how to love like that without the Bible, with the execption of verse 6, as we cant know evil or truth without God. Hi, Did you miss my post in post #278?

MorningGlory, There are "seeming" contradictions in the bible. This presents a possible problem. Then, the verse that popped into my head when I read that question was: If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. Luke 14:26 There would first have to be agreement as to what a particular scripture meant first. LOL, so much for that idea! She had requested nothing other than a yes or no answer and since I could not answer it truthfully without our first coming to agreement on what certain scriptures meant, I did not answer. That is why I did not answer.

Lady C, You have yet to answer my question here: What does it mean then? And also: If we do that in the manner as shown in 1 Corinthians 13:4-8, then is not scripture fulfilled? Any voice that would influence us to do anything other than those things are not of God. Satan came to kill, steal and destroy. If we do not love, as those scriptures instruct, Satan wins. This is how we can tell if the voice we hear is from God or not. Do you think it is possible to know how to love like that, as shown in 1 Corinthians 13:4-8, without the bible? Would someone who knew love and loved like that, would they follow another voice?

Please follow these quotes regarding the bible. I do not wish to be misrepresented in this area. I hold firm to the bible, as well as to Jesus, my Lord, Savior and High Priest. Your welcome. I guess most people want to know if you have studied the bible. Which came first: the chicken or the egg? So? The chicken is the bible? Jesus is the word. has been since before creation. God didn't lay any eggs. but He did inspire men to record what He said so that it would be in written form. Lady kept asking for scriptural proof, but then in the last quote, changes the emphasis to Jesus from the bible. Now, I believe it is possible to know Jesus without knowing anything about the bible. Oftentimes when this occurs, the bible is then studied. In this case, Jesus is known better than the bible. Which is preferable? I believe both are important, but I'd have to side with knowing Jesus as being the more important.

so then, really the rest of the Bible is just wasted words? all we need is those 4 verses? how can you discount the importance of the Bible while in the same post quote from it? I don't discount the bible. I already said it was very valuable to me. My point, however, was missed, but your second post leads nicely into what my point is. Jesus' parable: 28

the homosexual feels love for someone of the same sex. the pedophile feels love for a child. the adulteress feels love when she slips in bed with someone other than her husband. the teenage boy feels love when his hormones are racing. not all love is of God. this thread has nothing to do with being made in God's image. but being made in His image does not mean that He dwells inside an unbeliever. He doesn't. Love is not necessarily about feelings. Feelings, emotions, can lead astray. I posted earlier what the bible said was love, which was: 4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; 5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; 6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; 7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. 8 Love never fails. 1 Corinthians 13:4-7 and part of 8 "Suffers long" doesn't feel good. Being kind in the face of hate doesn't feel good. Envy may feel fun or enticing, but it is not good. Parading self is pride as is being puffed up; this is putting ourselves more important than another and is not love. It may feel good to be rude, but it is not love. Skipping over a few, because I know you know all this, right? Endures all things... this cannot possibly "feel" good. God's love is not about how we feel. What does it mean then? Reason I was asking is because you were putting so much emphasis on proving statements by scripture. Jesus gave us one new commandment and that was to Love One Another. If we do that in the manner as shown in 1 Corinthians 13:4-8, then is not scripture fulfilled? Any voice that would influence us to do anything other than those things are not of God. Satan came to kill, steal and destroy. If we do not love, as those scriptures instruct, Satan wins. This is how we can tell if the voice we hear is from God or not. Do you think it is possible to know how to love like that, as shown in 1 Corinthians 13:4-8, without the bible? Would someone who knew love and loved like that, would they follow another voice?

The bible tells us that we are made in God's image. The bible also tells us what God is... Light and Love. That we as individuals may be in the dark and have not love does not change that we are made in God's image. We are just banished from communion with God as long as we prefer the darkness and evil over that which He made us to be: Light and Love. Return to whom we are, and we return to communion with God. This is the purpose of religion... to rejoin that which was separated.

So? The chicken is the bible? Jesus is the word. has been since before creation. God didn't lay any eggs. but He did inspire men to record what He said so that it would be in written form. Okay. I agree. Then... how come the emphasis is on the bible so much? Now, don't get me wrong... the bible is very valuable to me. However, I do agree that we need the Holy Spirit to guide us in understanding the bible to know it's truth as it is supposed to be known. And, also, that this same truth can be known without the bible... if that is God's will for us. Just studying the scriptures will not allow us to know God's truth. We can believe we do though. God continues to inspire people and allows us to know the hidden truths, the mysteries hidden throughout the ages... as scripture states. Due to this inspiration occurring still, it stands to reason that some have not yet received the inspired Word as completely as the apostles did.

So? The chicken is the bible? That looks differently than I meant it, with the question mark after the so. Was just showing my inquiry too soon.

Your welcome. I guess most people want to know if you have studied the bible. Which came first: the chicken or the egg?

sadly, I dont think he will ever be able to give us an answer to this question. He is stuck without an answer, if he says from the written Word, then his whole stance is shot down. if he says from his "inner voice" then he cant say what she did was wrong. Didn't Seeker say that God's inner voice is love, and is drowning children love? Very good point. Seeker as much as said this when he said: if you wanted to talk about ladies drowning children or homosexuality, start another thread. THAT is clearly not what Seeker is speaking of. That's what I saw too. Agreed.

How do you know it is against God? where do you get that understanding? yes! where does one get that understanding? after all, the inner voice in her heart told her to do it, and she did it because she LOVED her children and wanted to save them from hell. how come she was wrong? she heard the voice and responded out of love, and that is how we are to know something is really God's voice, according to all you have written. Scripture tells us that Satan comes to kill, steal and destroy. To me it seems to be obvious that any voice telling a person to do something that would result in those outcomes is clearly not hearing from God. The love that is God would be exemplified by the following verses: 4 Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; 5 does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; 6 does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; 7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. 8 Love never fails.... 1 Corinthians 13:4-7 and part of 8 Any actions with these results would be God's love.

That is easy, God is love. The voice of love is God. We all know but some surpress it. so what makes us certain that the voice we're hearing is "love"? your "easy answer" is not definitive at all. it's very subjective. it sounds like "if it feels good it's of God". heck, pedophiles think their inappropriate feelings for a child feel good. homosexuals think their sinful lust for another member of the same sex is the voice of love. teenage girls who give into their boyfriends think that the voice they're hearing is love. teenage boys who are obsessed with the cute little cheerleader think the voice they're hearing is love. the mistress who is sneaking to a hotel room with her married lover thinks that she's hearing the voice of love. so i ask you again. how do we know the inner voice we are hearing is of GOD? Don't surpress God. God is true love and we all know what that is. That is what one should listen to. you're still not answering. still sounds like "if it feels good it must be God". The right thing to do is often not easy, and when we first start on the path to avoid sin that also does not feel good for the carnal man is being denied it's wants.

The Pilgrims, who came to America to escape religious persecution, weren't they Quakers? (Not that you're American... , but you wish to be a Pilgrim... just a a correlation I noticed.)

I saw that! You know what they say about great minds~ hehehe

Sorry, but I'm confused by the wording of your sentence. Are you saying Jesus is not "Christ"? ("Jesus . . . but would instead say Christ i.e the Spirit") When I read this, the impression I get is that he is speaking and referring to Christians, not non-Christians. Just a couple of thoughts, if I may. The Scriptures explain that the Spirit of God is everywhere, even in the depths of Sheol. So He must be in us in some sense, for this to be true. Also the Scriptures explain that all things are held together by Him. This also seems to give the impression that in some sense He is everywhere and actively involved. Also it is written that He stands at the door and knocks and if anyone will hear His voice He will come into them and eat with them. If this is so, then anyone as in everyone must be able to hear His voice. It seems to me that believer's (that is Christians in the true since of the word) are those that because they believe that He is there, listen to Him. A non-believer would then be someone that does not believe in an omni-present being called God, so even though He maybe talking to them, they are not aware of it because of there disbelief. So Christian's are those that hear the word of God spoken to them and believe it is God. Isn't this why Abraham was considered righteous? It was not only that he hear the word of the Lord, but also believed that it was the Lord. Also another comment: Another poster felt that we could not see Christ in unbelievers. This is not what I have experienced. There have been times in my life when someone I know doesn't believe in the Lord has suddenly said something in which I recognized as the voice of the Lord. In the same way, there have been times when those I know are believer's suddenly say something I know is evil. Remember that Jesus recongized the voice of Satan coming through Peter. Also, consider what happen when the lady told Jesus that even a dog eats the scraps from the masters table. God teaches us in parables, so where did this lady get that little parable? I think Jesus clearly recongized the voice of the Spirit of God coming through this Samaritain lady. When Christ spoke to Peter, He knew the spirit behind Peters word. That did not mean that Peter had the devil in him. When someone who is an unbeliever speaks something you believe is Christ like, that does not mean that Christ is in that person. You are adding New Age beliefs to scripture. This is very dangerous. The only why a person can have the Spirit of God in them is if they have accepted Christ as their Savior. There is no other way. Isn't it interesting? Peter had just had a revelation from Our Father. Immediately thereafter Jesus calls him Satan. Not all who have the Holy Spirit have yet overcome Satan, nor have they the mind of Christ yet either. When Jesus spoke this to Peter, he did not have the Holy Spirit yet. Nobody received the Holy Spirit until Jesus went to the Father. You can read this in John 15 - 15 and Acts 2. When Christ sent the 12 out, all He did was give them power to do His work. No comment about the second paragraph?

Sorry, but I'm confused by the wording of your sentence. Are you saying Jesus is not "Christ"? ("Jesus . . . but would instead say Christ i.e the Spirit") When I read this, the impression I get is that he is speaking and referring to Christians, not non-Christians. Just a couple of thoughts, if I may. The Scriptures explain that the Spirit of God is everywhere, even in the depths of Sheol. So He must be in us in some sense, for this to be true. Also the Scriptures explain that all things are held together by Him. This also seems to give the impression that in some sense He is everywhere and actively involved. Also it is written that He stands at the door and knocks and if anyone will hear His voice He will come into them and eat with them. If this is so, then anyone as in everyone must be able to hear His voice. It seems to me that believer's (that is Christians in the true since of the word) are those that because they believe that He is there, listen to Him. A non-believer would then be someone that does not believe in an omni-present being called God, so even though He maybe talking to them, they are not aware of it because of there disbelief. So Christian's are those that hear the word of God spoken to them and believe it is God. Isn't this why Abraham was considered righteous? It was not only that he hear the word of the Lord, but also believed that it was the Lord. Also another comment: Another poster felt that we could not see Christ in unbelievers. This is not what I have experienced. There have been times in my life when someone I know doesn't believe in the Lord has suddenly said something in which I recognized as the voice of the Lord. In the same way, there have been times when those I know are believer's suddenly say something I know is evil. Remember that Jesus recongized the voice of Satan coming through Peter. Also, consider what happen when the lady told Jesus that even a dog eats the scraps from the masters table. God teaches us in parables, so where did this lady get that little parable? I think Jesus clearly recongized the voice of the Spirit of God coming through this Samaritain lady. When Christ spoke to Peter, He knew the spirit behind Peters word. That did not mean that Peter had the devil in him. When someone who is an unbeliever speaks something you believe is Christ like, that does not mean that Christ is in that person. You are adding New Age beliefs to scripture. This is very dangerous. The only why a person can have the Spirit of God in them is if they have accepted Christ as their Savior. There is no other way. Isn't it interesting? Peter had just had a revelation from Our Father. Immediately thereafter Jesus calls him Satan. Not all who have the Holy Spirit have yet overcome Satan, nor have they the mind of Christ yet either.

Jesus intimated that not everyone would be able to accept or be able to bear His teachings. 26Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

Which is Messiah - mashiach - in Hebrew - the true origin of the word. This does not explain why you worded the sentence - that you would say "Christ" rather than "Jesus." What's the difference in saying "Christ" versus "Jesus"? None, really. I had said in that reply I mentioned to you, that to say Jesus is in everyone "to me" means that God's temple is completed within us. I was just being consistent in my postings. From the time Seeker had said/posted "Jesus is in everyone" I had said I would have used different terminology since "to me" it is also biblically consistent.

Sorry, but I'm confused by the wording of your sentence. Are you saying Jesus is not "Christ"? ("Jesus . . . but would instead say Christ i.e the Spirit") When I read this, the impression I get is that he is speaking and referring to Christians, not non-Christians. Just a couple of thoughts, if I may. The Scriptures explain that the Spirit of God is everywhere, even in the depths of Sheol. So He must be in us in some sense, for this to be true. Also the Scriptures explain that all things are held together by Him. This also seems to give the impression that in some sense He is everywhere and actively involved. Also it is written that He stands at the door and knocks and if anyone will hear His voice He will come into them and eat with them. If this is so, then anyone as in everyone must be able to hear His voice. It seems to me that believer's (that is Christians in the true since of the word) are those that because they believe that He is there, listen to Him. A non-believer would then be someone that does not believe in an omni-present being called God, so even though He maybe talking to them, they are not aware of it because of there disbelief. So Christian's are those that hear the word of God spoken to them and believe it is God. Isn't this why Abraham was considered righteous? It was not only that he hear the word of the Lord, but also believed that it was the Lord. Also another comment: Another poster felt that we could not see Christ in unbelievers. This is not what I have experienced. There have been times in my life when someone I know doesn't believe in the Lord has suddenly said something in which I recognized as the voice of the Lord. In the same way, there have been times when those I know are believer's suddenly say something I know is evil. Remember that Jesus recongized the voice of Satan coming through Peter. Also, consider what happen when the lady told Jesus that even a dog eats the scraps from the masters table. God teaches us in parables, so where did this lady get that little parable? I think Jesus clearly recongized the voice of the Spirit of God coming through this Samaritain lady. Very well said, CBE1. Couldn't agree more.

Let's pick something to describe. Oh, how about a rose. A rose has fragrance. A rose it has petals. It has thorns. All three of those qualities are true of a rose. Each in isolation is true of a rose. Christos also has qualities, one of which is as stated in those scriptures and also another quality of Christos is the anointing as said previously.