enoob57

It is clear you do not understand the pretrib position by this statement... let me encourage you to understand a subject before you critique it...

whew! That was close I almost said their name

you mean like

Matthew 25:40 (KJV) [40] And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

I don't see Romans 7 in this at all? I see no proclamation of war in this flesh as we are in!

How long now since you first came to Jesus?

It would very much fall in line with this Scripture taught thought Colossians 3:1 (KJV) [3:1] If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. [2] Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. [3] For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. [4] When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

The basic begin in life with God Hebrews 11:6-10 (KJV) [6] But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. [7] By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith. [8] By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. [9] By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: [10] For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

no brother of mine... what I am saying if none of this is being kept not even in memory... What do we have but that of promise without conclusion of what we know! Matthew 19:14 (KJV) [14] But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven. In reality it is absence of self in the perfection of God that will be... but as yet is not known! 1 John 3:2 (KJV) [2] Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

The deepest consideration of my heart in this is 1 Corinthians 8:2 (KJV) [2] And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know. The desperation of right thinking lays only upon the gift of God to do so...

I think this is evident 'not going anywhere' we'll just have to agree to disagree!

Kind of snarky response and a poor judgment on your part but I will respond with grace... John 14:6 (KJV) [6] Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. With God you have the way, the truth, and the life... so if separated from God by Sin as all the verses I quoted you will have not the way, lies, death... seems simple enough... You support annihilationism and that is what it teaches... Just as the Bible teaches eternal separation from life which is God... above Jn 14:6

NO it's the teaching of God's Word Isaiah 59:2 (KJV) [2] But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear. Jeremiah 6:8 (KJV) [8] Be thou instructed, O Jerusalem, lest my soul depart from thee; lest I make thee desolate, a land not inhabited. Ezekiel 14:7 (KJV) [7] For every one of the house of Israel, or of the stranger that sojourneth in Israel, which separateth himself from me, and setteth up his idols in his heart, and putteth the stumblingblock of his iniquity before his face, and cometh to a prophet to inquire of him concerning me; I the LORD will answer him by myself: 2 Thessalonians 1:9 (KJV) [9] Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; nice dodge... if death according to you is cessation of existence how can there be a second one.

The Bible teaches life is found with God and death is separation from God ... John 14:6 (KJV) [6] Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. man was made in the image of God and therefore everlasting existence... Genesis 1:27 (KJV) [27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. The rich man has now been in the place of suffering 2000 plus years now Luke 16:24 (KJV) [24] And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. And he will be emptied out from his present hell to finale judgment at the Great White Throne of judgment Revelation 20:13 (KJV) [13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. conscious torment is directly taught us by Jesus and if death is cessation of existence, it is not found in the Bible! If death was as you say then how could you have a second one? Revelation 20:14 (KJV) [14] And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

I hope this is not saying you can't know if you are saved or not... God says Romans 8:15 (KJV) [15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. [16] The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: I would say that if you do not have this witness within you ... you better work it out 'why'!

In reality it's war!

This is a direct denial of Jesus' account of Lazarus and the rich man... and we know John 17:14 (KJV) [14] I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. [15] I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. [16] They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. [17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

verse please

then you are a works based salvation and the Bible does not teach that!

necessary as toward salvation NO... Titus 3:5 (KJV) [5] Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; As we observed the thief on the cross He had only belief and we know that was enough... I am sure there will be a great many that thought they had tomorrow and find that tomorrow would not come like the thief turn to Christ in belief... necessary as toward reality of change within YES... Matthew 12:33 (KJV) [33] Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. What do you think? Are they making themselves real by self-effort? Matthew 7:21 (KJV) [21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Anyone born from above would 'NOT' think that there is anything here that God finds worth keeping... 2 Peter 3:10 (KJV) [10] But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. [11] Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, [12] Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? [13] Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. so how could the manipulation of that which is being burnt up and totally forgotten be of eternal substance? It is only God Who knows the heart and each individual will be responsible to know if God 'IS' truly within themselves Romans 8:16 (KJV) [16] The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: The Lord Lord people above were never born from above for they thought by what they did saved them... that is why we are to examine ourselves by God's Word for it only reveals truth and used by The Holy Spirit to testify of His Presence within... We begin in our salvation working it out with fear and trembling the reality of His Word revealing light or darkness within... should be always drawing to the light and denying the darkness of flesh and world it's in Matthew 6:23 (KJV) [23] But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! [24] No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

My friend Look what Jesus went through to provide you salvation... the whole of it is not difficult as long as you believe the witness of God's Own Word and in that belief, you have repented of your sin and called out to Him to enter you and save you... it is that simple and has nothing to do with enough faith Matthew 13:31 (KJV) [31] Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field: [32] Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof. The least of faith even that of a mustard seed must go through the process of the Gospel Revelation 3:20 (KJV) [20] Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. Romans 10:13 (KJV) [13] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. This hear my voice is the preaching of the Gospel of the life, death and resurrection of Jesus and you opening your heart to this truth and call out to Him. He will enter you and you will sup with Him and He with you- equals an intimate personal relationship with The Lord Jesus A great many people confuse the reality of conversion between flesh verses s/Spirit... you expect your senses, sight, smell, taste, touch, hearing to verify the reality of God but God has not redeemed your body of flesh but will place within your body new s/Spiritual life ... In this new s/Spiritual placement you will begin to war with your body of flesh and it's desires verses s/Spiritual realties you unite with in God's Word. It will be as this in your day to day s/Spiritual walk Galatians 5:16 (KJV) [16] This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. [17] For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. [18] But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. [19] Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, [20] Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, [21] Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. [22] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, [23] Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. [24] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. [25] If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. As you take in the food and water of God's Word you grow in s/Spirit and in obedience you will grow deeper into The Blessed world of s/Spiritual life John 14:21 (KJV) [21] He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. You see belief is an interesting thing... you are attuned to flesh realities such as, let's say, you're on a very steep cliff like mountain trail, steep cliffs on both sides in fact and the trail is very narrow and treacherous and it's night and the flashlight goes out** how will you respond** ? That is what true belief in something is... now you have only God's Word that warns you s/Spiritually but gives the body no sense of that reality **how do you respond** ? You have correctly understood God and the situation He is in with judgment... this is why God says this 2 Peter 3:9 (KJV) [9] The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. You see this is true about God 1 John 4:8 (KJV) [8] He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love. 1 John 4:16 (KJV) [16] And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him. And as you have questions about hell and judgment in fairness- it is because you do not understand it is love to separate that which 'IS' of God from that which has no part with Him... Look at this world and the results of evil within it... how could God ever deliver His heaven with this sin and evil present? What you see or some claim it is God's intention toward this torture but what is true- God has done the absolute all to prevent that torture of His wrath to occur in each and every individual ever existing...

what= Only God and 2/3 of angels are sinless ... so righteousness must be given! why not earned= Place the price on God's Own Son given because that is what it took to give us that righteouness...

all of mankind is born into darkness and lies - here is a good treatise on this What is spiritual darkness? | GotQuestions.org So, the problem is we have to come to repentance of all that we are (darkness and lie) and receive the truth of Christ (God's Word) and call out to Him to save us from our separation from God Father, God The Son, and God The Holy Spirit... When we do this God The Holy Spirit comes into us and regenerate the dead spirit within us and we become, once again, children of God... We who have done this are renewing our minds according to God's Word and understand that God could not keep evil with Himself... for it contains nothing of Him in itself... However, God so loved the world this John 3:16 (KJV) [16] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. [17] For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. [18] He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. [19] And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [20] For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. [21] But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God. The only people in hell is those who hate God and want nothing to do with Him... yes, your soccer mom even! Light cannot be darkness and darkness cannot be light it is written 1 John 1:5 (KJV) [5] This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. Thus, eternity with God will only be that of God's righteousness, holiness, with all who love such... and evil and sin will be kept where God has made a place for such 'HELL'... Understand where you are right now- you are setting in judgment of God~ wow just wow You need to understand the cross and why God put His Son through that! For all that is in hell are those who didn't think it was anything to consider... God would also know what He, Himself, went through to prevent it... we, His children, know and that is why we repented in our hearts for it was because of our sin God did what He did on the cross...

It is the difference of hearts: that which is separated out from God and that which has been brought back into closeness with Him. God is a unity and there can only be tension of this separation with the two types of hearts... This is the living Word within you Romans 8:16 (KJV) [16] The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: Hence the grief/tension with those who are not...

yes, but the motive of the heart has changed... we are not doing in order to get something from God, as that would be law... but we are doing it because of the newness of life placed within us by the regeneration of the Holy Spirit and the motive is Love... John 14:21 (KJV) [21] He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. What born again person would not want a closer more intimate relationship with God who has loved them so?