Riverwalker

I agree that the disconnect his how and why Either we choose to be saved or be damned Or God chooses who is to be saved or be damned I cannot reconcile the latter with either the nature of of God or 2 Peter 3 I also agree this is turning into a hamster wheel. A lot of action going no where. So I will stop responding to the conversation (on this point) I said what I needed to say

Okay I found your link and did a little more searching. The definitions are rather squish but I think we are talking about the physical appearance of two genders. Now I must wonder why you chose to comment on my post which seems completely unconnected to the matter at hand. Physical variances are not gender dysphoria

It only matters as you brought it up in counterpoint to my post. Its all evil but murder a hundred million of Babies on the Altar of self centeredness rises to a level of evil not often seen. I would love to see the post, can you link it?

The context of Romans 9 is about Israel's rejection of Christ, God's Purpose will and Jsutice. And why the gospel was opened to the gentiles Romans 9:30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith; 31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law [d]of righteousness. 32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, [e]by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone Because they did not seek the faith...a choice Yes Mercy and Grace are the soul province of God, but how do we access it? Now if Romans ended at Chapter 9 you might be able to make the case. But it does not , It goes on to Chapter Ten Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for [a]Israel is that they may be saved. 2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. 5 For Moses writes about the righteousness which is of the law, “The man who does those things shall live by them.” 6 But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down from above) 7 or, “ ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.” We cannot take parts of the bible to support our beliefs we must use the whole bible Including 2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward [c]us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance

And that is the disconnect between Calvinism and what would considered Arminianism. I cannot see God willfully allowing anyone to perish, without a chance, without hope, without a way. Some born to be saved, some born to be damned. Not by their action, but by the desire of God? If God sovereignly choose who will be saved, then likewise does he not choose who will be damned? Again this seems contrary to scripture. 2 peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Hmm I missed that. When you say Many.....are we walking in the millions like abortion. Can you please post a link to that thread?

Again I agree God does all the work for salvation but in the end, softened heart an all...WE make the choice. And until we make that choice, we are still dead in sin and need to be born again

I would have to disagree. the format is simple. If you do this, this will happen If you call on the name of the Lord you will be saved If you believe you will be saved If you Confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and Believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead you will be saved IF These are choices WE make. John3:18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. if God's will is the only determining factor of salvation, then everyone would be saved. 2 Peter 3:. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

He can, but he will not, unless We believe. For this humble submission that brings to our knees before the Lord is what separates the saint and the sinner. God knows IF we will believe and choose to serve him and predestines (Orders our life) to bring us to that point of acceptance, but we MUST believe John 3:18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. All of this is predicated on our willingness. to believe John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life

We do not disagree about the regenerative nature of Salvation and that God accomplishes it. We are only at odds as to how this comes about. The bible is repleat with instances that state IF we believe and do....we will be saved Romans 10: 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Romans 10:13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.” And Jesus sums up his statement to Nicodemus on being born again (John 3) with John 3: 16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. 18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God IF you Believe, IF you Confess, IF you Call On the name of the Lord, you will be saved

I would suggest a two part answer. Self Loathing and Narcissism. Two sides of the same coin. People have been dehumanized. We live in a land where we kill our off spring in the womb if they are inconvenient.We are no longer treated as individuals, but as members of a hive, Strip of our own self worth stripped of right and wrong, Until nothing is right and nothing is wrong, and in order to establish oneself as an individual, to be special (a basic human need), the last thing you want to be is "normal". Negative attention is better than no attention. 2nd Timothy 3:1But know this, that in the last days [a]perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!

Perhaps Paul did not do that, because He has already done it in Chapter 8 Romans 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. Predestination, conformation, calling, Justification and glorification are all predicated on "whom He foreknew"

IF we believe.

I do not accept the teachings of Calvinism. Our choice Our action is an integral part of Our Salvation As with any gift it is laid before us, but it is not forved on us, we can take it, or leave it

Congratulations! I am very happy for you. Now go be the best you can be!

God does not need a very big opening to come into our lives, we just have to open the door a crack

I don't know about making a deal with himself, But yes we have our freewill and God will not force his love mercy and grace upon us, unless He is asked.

You live in an amazing world my friend

Its all good. And I will try and keep the larger picture in mind.

I do feel for here, but I was responding to a specific question she asked. What is the offense here?

I mean you said it all perfectly and there is nothing more I could add to it, so I dropped the proverbial microphone

Okay its time to stir the pot again but I am going to put forth an idea about Job, that I see in the scriptures that flies in the face of traditional teaching. It is just an idea and I am more than willing to be wrong about it...but it just makes me go hmmm Yes God does point out Job to satan, 9 So Satan answered the Lord and said, “Does Job fear God for nothing? 10 Have You not made a hedge around him, around his household, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. 11 But now, stretch out Your hand and touch all that he has, and he will surely curse You to Your face!” But when God says 12 And the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power; only do not lay a hand on his person.” Is he tearing down that hedge of protection, or is he revealing a breach in it? A breach that Job Created by fear. When Job says in chapter 3: 25 For the thing I greatly feared has come upon me, And what I dreaded has happened to me. Has he given place to the devil? The case can be made that fear and faith are complete opposites and that one is ceding power to God and one is giving it to satan. I am interesting in any and all thoughts.

Well then that is the defining point isn't it? What makes a Christian and what does not No he cannot. the ONLY power satan has is the power we give him. He can tempt us to doubt and unbelieve but it only effects a person should they choose to heed it 1 Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. Unless we open ourselves up to His wiles, he has no power over us.

Part of the omniscience of God is knowing everything that has happened and will happen. I like to say God is everywhen, that is the definition of eternal. He knows it all because he sees it all, past present and future