Blood Bought 1953

3 minutes ago, Walter Goraj jr said:

?

Not really worth expanding on......

The Actual one and only GOSPEL of 1 Cor15:1-4 is seldom preached and most people NEVER hear the things that are a part of it.......such as if you add to it with works , you are “ Fallen From Grace” and if you do not REST in it , you are guilty of Disobedience and Unbelief. People are never told that Paul’s Gospel , given to him by Jesus Personally, is what God  is going  to ask you about when you stand before Him on Judgement Day......God  is going to ask you- “ What did you do with My Gospel?”

Here is the problem with the True Gospel.....even those that consider themselves to be “ Christians”. That first part of the Gospel ? ......That part that says “ Jesus died for your sins? .....they don’t really believe it. They have heard it said so many times it doesn’t mean a thing.....they proclaim it, but it has never “ hit home” with them......any Tare can say “ Jesus died for my sins” because it is the “ Christian” thing to say. If people really believed what the claimed to believe, we would not see the obsessions with “ living the good life”, making sure one’s Performance is Worthy,  making sure we “ask for forgiveness for sins”-lest they still be on our record, or the Grand-Daddy of all Gospel “ Add-Ons”......We must Repent of All Sins Before we die or we go to Hell. We must Rest in the Gospel Of Grace. If you ain’t “ resting”— you are “working.” Some say God  will save all those “ trusting” to be saved—- not those “ trying” to be saved. Jesus died for my sins. I believe that. I Rest in that fact.So would others if they really Believed the Gospel......

On 4/13/2020 at 8:41 AM, Walter Goraj jr said:

" be anxious  for nothing"

Take a  tight-rope trip across Niagara Falls with no Safety Wire......I must insist that you put on a Heart Monitor...

10 minutes ago, Gideon said:

All who love the Lord in truth are, but it will profit is  not unless we  believe it. remaining where we are gives satan opportunity to keep us bound, even though we have been offered free indeed. Are we not tired of sin still capturibg us, of the world still tantalizibg us, of self refusing to climb down off the throne of our hearts.c

God gave the Israelites the land of promise. That is why they left Egypt.  But the 600,000 souls who left Egypt refused to believe it was possible to take the land because of the strength of those who inhabited it.  How many of those 600,000 entered in? Two. 

Being given rhe land and taking it by faith are two completely different things. The fact that so many get sidetracked by rhe OSAS discussion is satan's attempt to blind us to the truth of what God offers us if we will only believe. 

If we started well by faith, should we not want to grow in faith, to become established  in it, to earnestly contend for it? Why  is there hesitancy when God promises to plant our feet in complete victory? 

blessings, dear brother

Gids

Being given rhe land and taking it by faith are two completely different things. 

This is the the reason I keep going on about “ Resting in the Gospel.” If one will study Hebrews , ch. 3 and 4 , they will see that this “ rest” is analogous to the to the Test given to the Jews in the desert .God gives a Promise .....a Promise Of an obtainable Rest and all one has to do is take God at His Word .The Jews lacked the Faith to enter God’s Rest.God has recreated the same scenario for the“ Believers” Of today. God has given a Promise——Believe that Jesus died for your sins and rose from the dead.....Believe it to the point that This Gospel Plus Nothing will Save you with no “ buts” attached , such as “Sure , Believing the Gospel Saves , BUT after you realize that Essential Truth, you have to repent of all your sins before you die or you will be damned”......or “the Gospel  surely saves and Paul warned us not to add to it but we must find a way to “ throw off the Old Man and make sure we Endure to the End.”Nope. Those lacking Faith to Trust the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-4 which offers Rest on the other side of that Trust will be charged by God with disobedience and in a state of UNBELIEF.If one seeks to NOT spend a lifetime “wandering in the  desert” of disobedience and Unbelief, they had best get with the New Plan and pass the New Test Of Faith— RESTING in the Gospel Of Grace.

btw.....as a kind reminder....you have yet to give an explanation for the iron- clad OSAS verses I gave you.....what’s up with that? Please respond or admit that you can’t.....thank you..

1 hour ago, Gideon said:

Brother, if you will read my answer, I fully addressed your points. Salvation is the end of our faith, which we receive at the end. Faith is not a one time thing, but a walk. If we continue in the faith, continue to look to Him as an all-sufficient savior, our end will be Heaven, guaranteed. 

However, some see it as a one time prayer and that is all that is needed. I have taken time in my andwer to refute that, with what Jesus Himself said in Matthew 24.

I will be honest here. I have tried to keep this discussion  respectful, looking at the issues and not taking personal swipes at any who may disagree. You have not. If you feel like I am a wolf in sheep's clothing, which you certainly have alluded to, your opinion is yours to have. But that is not allowed by the rules of the forum to level such accusations. 

You have a ted like what I share will ruin Christians, yet you teach that such a thing is actually impossible, and nothing I or anyone else can say will affect rheir walk with the Lord. If you feel like you do, to the point  you want to lash out, why not simply avoid my posts altogether. 

Christians disagree about a lot of issues.... pre-trib vs.  post trib, free will vs. predestination, OSAS vs.  enduring in faith to the end. . You act like anyone who does not see as you do is a false teacher. Yet, the very Word we have been given  counsels us to love those who disagree with us and try to restore them in a spirit of meekness. Up til now, this is not the path you have chosen. 

We all, to one extent or another, see through a glass darkly. It is commendable when someone firmly believes how they see the truth, but if that truth is not working in them the basics of patience and kindness and longsuffering, something is off. 

I welcome your input on my threads. I simply  ask that the attitude you have taken towards any who may disagree with you be tempered by love. In case you are unaware, a large portion of the body of Christ does not believe in the doctrine of OSAS. And they come armed as well with many compelling verses to back up their belief. 

Personal attacks are not permitted on this site, and I would ask that you keep your answers respectful and oriented toward the message and why you may believe it is in error. rather than attacking the one who brings it forth. Is that acceptable?

blessings, 

Gideon

It’s  a debate....I have absolutely NO interest in attacking you.....I am sure you are a great guy...The only thing I want to “ attack” is your Doctrine .....I don’t want to see Newbies lectured about the very thing that saves them — GRACE— by somebody that I think  does not Understand it or Trust in it ALONE to save them. You can’t perceive of  a person being set free by Grace who would not turn that Grace into an excuse to do all the Sinning that he secretly wants to do in his heart.That is untrue and I know it because I LIVE it.When I say you paint a false portrait of Grace Living....That is not an attack— it is a fact.It is an essential part of your Doctrine.......I have to mention facts of your beliefs to attack your Doctrine—— NOT YOU! I think you are in error, I do not think you are an unsaved devil! It is not easy to “ let go and let God”. That is what real  Christianity is about.Trust. TOTAL TRUST.Evidenced by Resting in the Gospel Of Grace. God says in Hebrews 3 and 4 that if one does not Rest in the Gospel , they are guilty of “ UNBELIEF”. I have always attacked any Doctrine that says “Jesus Saves, BUT” and I will continue to attack any and all Doctrines that have this Poison in it......

I apologize for any “ spill over” from my Doctrine Attacks That would falsely appear to be an attack on an individual......some people are better than I am at “ veiling” there insults than I am .I suffer “veiled insults” all the time in here— little digs by those opposed to Grace Plus Nothing imbedded in their post that can sometimes be overlooked  by those not on the look-out for them......insults are imbedded that are said matter-Of-factly and they are missed by most people. Well.....I don’t “ miss” them and I will not let them go.I will call them out.I need to work on “ gaming” my posts......some here know how to say anything and couch it in a way where they never get called out.....

I suffered the biggest insult  I have ever witnessed in here.....The PersonalAccusation That There was something wrong with my God-Given New Heart.......me and all the other  adherents to OSAS......A new low for any debate. Any thing I may have said had to be innocuous by comparison . I hope I am not too “ unloving” if I say it might be an example of “ the pot calling the kettle black.” 

The truth is we are all passionate in our beliefs and we all our guilty of getting carried away.Debating facts will be mistakenly carried over as personal attacks and it is the very nature of this type of communication that everything that is said comes across as harsh unless special care is taken. In the real world , I am the-kindest, sweetest , humor-filled man you could ever meet......Perhaps you are the same. I hope so. I get more and more like Will Rogers as my life goes on... “ I never met a man I didn’t like.” I can’t say the same about Doctrines......if they go an inch beyond “ Nothing But The Blood”.....I do not like them and I will attack them. If I ever veer off the path and appear to attack an individual....it is not my true intention.....God bless ...

The Old songs say it all....... “ ......without one plea, except that thy Blood was Shed for me.....”    Anybody That goes beyond that is an Accursed Wolf......run, don’t walk from any preacher that differs with this.....

 Here’s another one..... “ Nothing of myself I bring— only to the Cross I Cling”

 Perhaps the best of All.... “ Nothing But The Blood”.....

Jesus said that the way to identify a bad tree or a Wolf in Sheep’s Clothing was to look at the Fruit they produce.......Preaching a False Gospel is VERY bad Fruit......Anything that differs from THE WAY of Salvation ( 1Cor15:1-4 ) is a False Gospel being promoted by a deceiving Wolf ....  

36 minutes ago, Gideon said:

You mentioned that those who come to Him by faith are already saved. 

Yet here is what Jesus Himself  tells us:

"Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."

Matthew 24:9-13 

when Jesus tells us that the love of many shall wax cold, that word is 'agape'..... God love. Lost people cannot exercise agape love.  He tells us that it is those who endure to the end, whose agape love does not grow cold, who WILL BE saved.  This lines up with where we are told  by Peter:

"That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:

Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls."

1 Peter 1:7-9 

 When is salvation received? At the end. It is the future reward for remaining in the faith  now.  What connects us to that end? Our continued faith.  Thus, we who believe are on the road to being saved. We. an have total confidence in that future as long as we remain in Christ by faith. 

 We are not yet saved. However, if we continue on that road, if our faith remains fixed on Christ, we are totally assured of our salvation.  But.... our faith is to be tried so it can come forth as pute gold. We all have a good fight of faith to wage, so that we become established in the faith. Our faith must grow in God's ability to save us to the uttermost. 

Paul brought this point home in very clear fashion:

"Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith.

Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, IF thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off."

Romans 11:19-22 

Our faith is our lifeline to God through faith in Christ's work on the cross. It is not a static one time prayer. It is a life of abiding deeper and deeper  in Him, being transformed by Him,  growing up into Him in all things. We are yoked together with the Lord and He offers us the privilege of walking with Him. Is this not what every saint of God should want?  

The author of Hebrews offers us some of the most compelling scriptures as to whether a man can start out in faith, "saved" as some  term it, and yet be rejected in the end. The first two scriptures would seem to mightily strengthen the case for  OSAS. However, let's read rhe ones that follow, so that we get the full picture....

"By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all."

Hebrews 10:10

"For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified." 

Hebrews 10:14

Wow. Pretty darned clear, right?  Yet listen to his next words:

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries."

Hebrews 10:26

 

Yes, the OSAS proponent will say, but it technically does not say he was saved. Well, let's read further.....

 

"He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God,

and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?"

Hebrews 27-29

 

Sanctified people are children of God. And the author tells us  willful sin must not be in the heart of a true child of God. Can one repent? Absolutely, and with that, faith is restored. But that faith connection is the key. Not a one time prayer of faith. A life of faith is the defining characteristic of one who WILL BE saved.  

I pray this helps. 

blessings to you, dear brother

Gideon

"

 

Nice post.....now if you would be kind enough.....would you explain your take on the verses that I showed to you and an on- looking World? Then, as promised, I will respond to any verse that you deem relevant in this debate.....if you can’t respond to the clear and simple verses I put forth , I will understand.....some simple Truths are hard to argue with.....such as “ Anybody that asks to be saved , WILL  BE SAVED.” I thank my God I don’t have to argue agaist the clearest verse in the Bible.....I left that verse out the last time......your take on that verse would be nice also, but it’s up yo you 

1 hour ago, johnthebaptist said:

Yes, that word "interpretation" is scary as can be. Some take it to mean they can do whatever they want.

In the end , Everybody does what They want to do.......Rest in the Gospel and get your “Wants” changed.....that “ Inside Of the Cup” That Jesus referred to......I am a New Creation.....I find my “wants” lining up with God’s......it does not happen overnight ......

25 minutes ago, HAZARD said:

Ananias and Sapphira were both killed by the power of God because of covetousness and lying to the Holy Ghost (acts 5:1-14). That they were once saved is clear from Acts 4:32-5:1, for Ananias and his wife were classed with "the multitude of them that believed" and "were of one heart and one soul . . . as many as were posessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold, and laid them down at the apostles feet . . . But a certain man [of those who believed and were of one heart andsoul] named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a posession." If these two were believers and had been saved and were in the church, then it cannot be disputed with any degree of honesty that they were once saved and then lost. To deny they were once saved is to deny thruth and it is not worth the price to pay.

Many galatians who were once saved and had "recieved the Spirit" who had "begun in the Spirit" who were "redeemed and justified by faith," and who were "sons" of God by being made free from sin (Gal. 3:2-4; 3:13; 24; 4:4-7; 5:1-26), FELL "from grace" and Christ became "OF NO EFFECT" unto them (Gal. 5:4, 5). They were "removed from Him" and "from grace," so once in grace always in grace is not biblical unless one stays in grace (Gal. 1:6; 3:1-5; 5:1-9). They were plainly told that to go back under the law and into sins of the flesh, meant to "frustrate [cause to fail, nullify, make void] the grace of God" and that in such case they were not in grace and would reap corruption (Gal. 2:21; 5:1-9; 6:7, 8). They were told that if they built again the things of sin that were "once destroyed" they were transgressors and sinners (Gal. 2:17-18). They were taught that true eternal security was by walking in the spirit and not fulfilling the works of the flesh (Gal. 5:16-26; 6:7, 8). Paul did not tell then that if they got in grace their responsibility as to sin was over. He accused them of falling from grace (Gal. 5:4), so such must be possible.

Many other men who were formerly saved have gone back into sin and have bee lost. This fact is clear from such statements as these: "some having put away concerning the faith have MADE SHIPWRECK. . . . he hath DENIED THE FAITH. . . . when they begin to wax wanton against Christ, they will marry; HAVING DAMNATION, BECAUSE they have CAST OFF THEIR FIRST FAITH . . . and TURNED ASIDE AFTER SATAN . . . But they that will FALL INTO TEMPTATION AND A SNARE, and INTO MANY FOOLISH AND HURTFUL LUSTS, WHICH DROWN MEN IN DESTRUCTION AND PERDITION. . . . they HAVE ERRED FROM THE FAITH. . . . and OVERTHRONE the FAITH OF SOME. . . . If God will preadventure give them REPENTANCE. . . . that they may RECOVER THEMSELVES OUT OF THE SNARE OF THE DEVIL" (1 Tim. 1"19, 20; 5:8; 5:11-15, 20; 6:1, 10, 21; 2 Tim. 2:18-16).

Each one of the statements above would disprove that doctrin of once in grace and faith always in grace and faith and once saved always saved, but here in 1 and 2 Timothy are many such statements in only two small books of the Bible. False security believers go to any lengthin trying to explain away these simple passages because they so clearly contradict their theory. Some of them go so far as to deliberately mistranslate the Greek and quote self made translations of men to prove that such simple statements do not mean what they say. For example, they mistranslate "they have cast off their first faith" to "they have broken their former promises" as if this proves a person cannot be lost. The Greek word "pistin" from "pistis" is never translated promises out of hundreds of times it is used in the New Testament. It is translated "faith" 222 times and is refered to as having faith in Christ in Rom. 1:5,16, 17; 3:25; 4:5-20; 5:1, 2; 10:17; Gal. 2:20; 3:24-29; Eph. 2:9; 4:5; etc. Thus the "faith" that they made shipwreck" of, "denied," "cast off," "erred from," and did "overthrow" is the true saving faith and has no reference to some promise that the people made themselves. They could not cast off, deny, and make shipwreck of, this saving faith if they had not once had it. They could not get into a snare of the devil AGAIN unless they had once been delivered from him. They could not have "turned aside" AGAIN after Satan, if they had not been following Christ. They could not have ERRED FROM the faith through hurtful lusts and "drowned in destruction and purdition" if they had not been once in the faith and free from such lusts. They could not have their faith OVERTHROWN if they had none to overthrow.

“If we are unfaithful , He is Yet faithful.God can not deny Himself” If one has had Saving Faith.....” Nothing in the Future can take us out of His Grip”...... That also covers those that maintain the false notion that “ He won’t let go of us, but we can let go of Him”. Nope.  “ Nothing” actually means Nothing and anything that happened after you Believed the Gospel That Saved you would be in the future.The most ardent of Believers can fall into error .It is my personal opinion that God restores those errant Children  but that is just my opinion....

1 hour ago, Gideon said:

Kwik, I am getting to like you more and more, lol. As to my being best up, as I am the OP, I can pull the plug any time. However, I think the subject is important enough that a bit of surface bruising is worth it. I have shared the message God gave me of our need for putting on our new nature by faith for 13 years now, so I fully realize some will either misunderstand what I am sharing or misjudge my intent in sharing it. However, with that said, I very much appreciate tour tone and concern. Thank you. 

Now, with that out of the way, I read what you shared and the truth is I agree with you.  What you are saying is that there will be some who start out well, but will not heed the warnings the Word offers us nor the chastening of the Spirit to correct their path. 
 

They will let the cares of this life capture their hearts. They will let sin continue until it hardens their heart. if I am understanding you correctly, you are saying they were never saved to begin with, correct? In truth, this is what I  have always believed

Why did I not clarify better?  Because the beatings would have simply come from a different angle, lol. If what you are presenting is correct, the issue of eternal security is done away, but it is replaced with a brand new one. 

Did those people who fell away and did not continue at one time run well think they were saved? ? If you asked them of they were saved, would they have emphatically said "Yes!"? Had they prayed the prayer declaring they believed Jesus died for their sins? I suspect they did. However, because they did not continue in the faith, they fell away and did not endure to the end, correct? Thus, the fact they fell away proved they were never saved to begin with, right? 

Do you realize this opens a huge can of worms? This. means no one absolutely positively knows they will be saved in rhe end. We certainly can know it for today, but tomorrow is in God's hands. (I can  hear the chickens squawking and tar bubbling as we speak,lol)

How can we be assured? We keep our eyes on Jesus and His shed blood, amen? We heed His warnings. When we get chastened or corrected, we adjust our course, repent of the problem behavior, and walk with a clean conscience towards God  again, amen? We continue in the faith.

God alone knows who the elect are who will endure and conversely, who will wilt before the end. From His point of view, OSAS is absolute. Every sheep WILL hear His voice. I agree perfectly with this. But on our end, we are told to make our calling and election sure, right? We are told that "if we Do these things, we will never fall". Why in rhe world would God include those verses in our Bibles?  There is a reason.  

Here is the issue I have with the current OSAS teaching. It sees not just today, but rhe end result before the end result is reached. Do most OSAS proponents ever talk at all about the many warnings  given in the New Testament? Why is that? Do most think getting rid of sin in our life is as important as God does?  Those strong proponents of OSAS more often than not have an attitude that they may not openly acknowledge,  but repentance and holiness is viewed as "optional" and in fact, if preached outright, is seen as a subtle form of legalism that somehow contradicts grace and will make the believer insecure. Thus, it must be heresy (and logically, rhe person preaching it mist be a heretic, lol).

The monkey wrench in the gears gets deeper. If one does not know that they will be a believer in the end, then all the insecurity comes rushing back in for it still ends up on THEIR shoulders to stay a believer and part of the elect! 

Unless I am misunderstanding what you are putting forth, we still have need of heeding the warnings, of following the corrections, of keeping our hearts close to Him, for if we do not, and let our hearts get hardened, eventually we can fall  away, proving we were never saved to begin with. The weak link in the chain is still US. 

 So..... where can a believer find true security? There is a way, and God is slowly opening our eyes to it. The old us must die, and be taken out of the equation.  And praise God, it has been! The only problem is, we have not believed it, nor armed ourselves with the truth that promises to set is free from the heart that can drift away and become enticed with the world, or hardened by repeated sin.

And because we have not believed it, it has profited us nothing. We yield ourselves to God as miserable sinners, saved by grace, and we WERE! But..... we are not that now! We are told by Paul we are no longer in the flesh, and owe it NOTHING! He tells is to yield ourselves to God, but how we do it is critical!

So how are we to do it? We are to yield ourselves to God as those who are alive from the dead, with our shields of faith held high that we have new natures and  that no weapon formed against us shall prosper. We are to count it all joy when satan comes tempting, for we know God will make the way of escape and moreover, praise God, we know as well that we will  take it! Glory! 

When we put off our old nature by faith, we put off the heart that sin can influence. We put on, by faith, a brand new nature that is kept by the power of God through faith. Not only do we run into the holy of holies, we slam the door shut behind us, and as we hold up our shield of faith, believing that it will indeed quench ALL the fiery arrows of the enemy, we find far more security than we ever felt clinging to a doctrine alone. 

i hope you pray on this and look forward to your reply. 

blessings, 

Gids

 

Here is the issue I have with the current OSAS teaching. It sees not just today, but rhe end result before the end result is reached.

One either Believes the Promises Of God or they do not. Pretending to know how things end without aPromise of God To back it up would be madness. Fortunately, for mature Believers, we have Promises from God that GUARANTEE what the “ end result” will be......it’s the very definition of what Faith is supposed to be!

I could exclude the 400 other verses that cry out that once a person is saved , they can trust God to  get them Home and just put my FAITH in the mere three following verses and be an OSAS proponent—

Perhaps some out there that think they are Saved have not even “ Started” the Way Of Salvation— Those That “ have” started by Resting in the Gospel Of Grace have a Promise from God that He will FINISH what HE started.....not me....not you.... “ HE”. Seems like “ enduring until the end” is something that God gave himself the Responsibility for....what is your take on that?

Jesus said that all of those that come to Him with Faith are ALREADY SAVED and will NEVER come under Condemnation......How do “ you” define the Words that I put in Caps?

God said that if we come to Him by Faith in His Son—- He would Save is TO THE UTTERMOST. What   Is “ your” definition of that highlighted phrase?

Please answer these questions with no side- tracking or evasions .Just answer them.Then I will happily answer any inquiries you may have if you will provide Bible Verses as I did....Thanking you in advance...

1 hour ago, George said:

I didn't see a reported post on this ... would PEOPLE simply report posts, it would make things MUCH better in a discussion whereby hundreds are reading.  The whole point of a CHRISTIAN DISCUSSION board is to DISCUSS IN LOVE differences within the body! 

 Something is not right in such a heart. 

With all due respect ......God gave me a  New Heart many years ago.......to be told that something that God gifted me with in order for Him to change me from within—- that, to me is something that would be extremely Frowned Upon in a Christian Forum, devoted to discussions in Love. I thought my response was right “on-target” and very restrained considering what I and all other OSAS Believers were accused of. I have much respect for your discernment 99% of the time......I think you missed the boat on this one....of course, I might be a tad biased.....lol...

7 hours ago, Gideon said:

I am saying that if neglect so great a salvation, yes, we can lose it. 

The good seed was cast forth on good ground, on ground full of weeds, on hard soil. The good seed sprang forth to newness of life on all three soils, amen? The good soil is the saint who digs deep, allowing God to grow the seed into a tree of righteousness. 

The hard soil is rho one who does not dig deep.  He does not seek with all  his heart to have God AND His righteousness. Forgiveness is all he is after with no deep desire to run his race as if there is but one prize. 

The weedy ground is the one who lets the cares of this life choke out the life that was within him. We are warned to love not the world, neither the things that are in the world and if any man does so, the love of the Father is not in him. 

Good seed for all three. New life for all three. Only in one did the seed truly bear fruit. And what happens to all rhe branches in Him that bear no fruit? They are cast forth and burned. Now one can argue that this does not say they are not saved. That is true. Maybe they are saved, but as though by fire.

And suppose this means they will go through the tribulation while those who are good ground shall escape all these things that come upon the earth? As God writes to the church in Sardis.... to Christians....  "There are a few of you who will walk with me in white, for you are worthy." Why would God tell us to "pray that we be found worthy to escape all these things that are to come upon the earth and stand before the Son of God"?

People get upset about whether or not one can lose their salvation. Should we not rather be upset that we are willing to gamble with our souls that our disobedience and lack of hunger to obey our God will in no way affect our eternity. Something is not right in such a heart. That is the real issue I have with OSAS. 

If it turns out these who will have all their works burned up and yet, in the end are saved but as though by fire, have to endure the  tribulation, should this in itself not be motive enough to seek the face of God to set us free from our contentment solely with forgiveness , with no real heart to be made holy obedient children?

blessings,

Gideon 

On 4/13/2020 at 6:03 AM, Wesley L said:

Hi BB,

A few questions to be able to understand what you exactly mean.
- Do you belief that you should at least try to stop sinning?
- What do you mean by "when I sin, I put it on the Cross and leave it there".  What goes through your mind?
- "all I can do is thank God for His Grace", is that truly all you can do?
- "I always try to be obedient for selfish reasons.", never out of gratitude?

 

In regard to the second inquiry, When I sin, there are consequences in this life for sinning . If I am a Saved Child Of God , I can expect to be chastised for sinning......not to “ get me”, but to train me.....Just like a responsible Parent trains up a Child .....when my daughter does wrong- when she disobeys me-I discipline her......not because I get a kick out of it.....it is done for her own good, whether she understands it or not, or whether she likes it or not.God makes it clear to me ,as I make it clear to my daughter— “ you can’t do wrong and get by!”

As far as Salvation is concerned , things are  different. Good behavior did not get me saved and bad behavior won’t “ unsave” me.The only thing that saved me or anybody else that was ever saved was the Mercy , the Amazing Grace Of God.Salvation is a Free Gift —- available to all that turn to God with a Contrite  Heart and accept His manner of getting saved, which is RESTING in Paul’s Gospel, given to him by Jesus .In return for one's Faith in His Son, God has Promised to cast your sins into the deepest depths of the sea, separated as far as the East is from the West— totally forgiven and totally forgotten. Jesus was the One Time Offering for  the Sins Of the World . God took every sin that has ever been committed and every sin that ever will “Be” committed and put them on the Cross. He leaves them there and so do I.Perhaps some feel better by taking those sins off of the Cross for some reason and putting back on themselves. By doing this, they show that they not believe God and His Word. He has Promised to put them on the Cross and leave them there — FORGOTTEN  ( “ I will remember their Sins no more” ) If That Works For God it sure as heck works for me! I will always pay a Temporal price when I am stupid enough to sin, but as far as my Salvation? I was never Saved for how I behaved.......I was Saved by what I Believed. I actually believe that Jesus Saves—That is enough.Some day Satan will stand in the Court Of  Heaven and point out my enormous file of sins .God will respond with this— “ What sins? I seem to have forgotten them!” Be like Paul—- “ I don’t hold back God’s Grace”

Love.......the Engine that will drive Obedience......

8 hours ago, Wesley L said:

Hi BB,

A few questions to be able to understand what you exactly mean.
- Do you belief that you should at least try to stop sinning?
- What do you mean by "when I sin, I put it on the Cross and leave it there".  What goes through your mind?
- "all I can do is thank God for His Grace", is that truly all you can do?
- "I always try to be obedient for selfish reasons.", never out of gratitude?

 

Hi Wesley......I am very happy to elaborate on some of the things that I have posted.....it may take a while.....I may just do one or two a day

I Believe that everybody should try to stop sinning.Obedience to God is vital. A Wise man is obedient- He knows  That doing the things that please God will bring about a blessed life.When a man is obedient, he is rewarded for it.Only a Foolish man is disobedient. He will suffer in his lifetime, paying the price for displeasing God. Most of these guys, if not all, are unhappy in their lives and don’t even know why.Their punishments are not always obvious- they are kinda “ built in.” Like my old teacher used to say, “ you can’t do wrong and get by”—— I think the reverse is also true , “ being obedient is its own reward”—- you can’t do right and not be rewarded for it ....

Yes, obedience is great.....It is a sign of Wisdom.It just does  not Save.  “ Christ died to save the unjust”. Seeing that you are a  Disobedient, Hell- Deserving Sinner is the KEY to becoming a Christian. “Nobody comes to God, lest the Spirit draw him.” The Spirit “draws” by the Conviction Of Sin. The Unregenerate man must see that he is a Sinner (  conviction) and “ Turn to God with Faith in Jesus (Repentance )  to get the Holy Spirit. That Spirit , given time, will Transform a person into one that “ finds themselves” doing the things that please God.Things such as Resting in God's Grace......that “ Rest” .....That Peace If Mind ......That feeling of confidence that the Finished Work Of The Cross has put you into the Body Of Christ where your Salvation is Untouchable, Spurs a Love for God, and that Love is the Source , the Secret Of you Obedience.

In this Age Of Grace, the main obedience to concern one’s self with is being obedient to the Gospel, 1Cor15:1-4. You “ obey” it by Resting in it.That means not adding to it.That means you don’t believe “ Jesus Saves, BUT” If one is not Resting in God’s Gospel Of Grace, you are in “ Unbelief” and “DISOBEDIENCE”

Anybody that harps about “ Obedience” had better make sure they are engaged in the Obedience that counts —Resting in the Gospel Of Grace Plus Nothing.I have concentrated on THAT, and I have discovered that just about everything else takes care of itself.....

I hope that explanation has helped answer your question .I will get to the others in a  bit.......

Will Rogers famously  said, “ I never met a man I did not like”

Some people never met a “ Conspiracy Theory” they did not like.

No doubt , governments , including ours , have duped its citizens many times. Nobody likes to get fooled .It is embarrassing . I think a lot of the over-reactions and Chicken Little fears stem from the fear of being made to look like a dope .....is kind of a making sure that one “ beats the other guy to the punch”.....90% of the time these types end up looking just plain silly .It never seems to bother them.The next crises will be another Bill Gates or George Soros plot or another Liberal scheme to take away your rights......  you can count on it..

8 hours ago, Walter Goraj jr said:

 

I don't think you see the bigger picture here. The higher authorities led by Satan are progressively at work destroying Christianity. This is not about a virus this is about spiritual control.

Every plague every virus anything that's ever come upon the human race takes its natural course we develop herd immunity that's how God created us. Unfortunately there will be those that died from this it's no different than the swine flu 10 years ago. This is an attempt by the authorities to control people and once again ultimately their spiritual allegiance.

Mandatory face masks are a test ,,,, let's observe how well they follow this, and soon in another crisis of some sort let's see if we can further separate and condemn those who truly worship Christ and remove them. 

The Heathen will do anything especially those that like socialism and think it's so wonderful. Those are the same people that will and always have been persecuting Christians and you watch what happens in the end.

And by the way it's not unbiblical to take political action to try to change your circumstances in this world so you can still live... there are obviously Christians that do that in muslim countries when they can.

Mandatory face masks are a test ,,,, let's observe how well they follow this, and soon in another crisis of some sort let's see if we can further separate and condemn those who truly worship Christ and remove them. 

Some would see that type of speculation as quite a stretch .....I know that I do....

2 hours ago, Betha said:

Thank you for your reply.....so very true !

Obedience is more of OT teaching that seems to have lost favour since Grace.....people assume it even covers disobedience...NOT SO !

We must stop sinning - which is 'transgression of God's Law/Commandments/sin against God....and start again from scratch. How can we build from a firm foundation if we don't start there.....and it does mean Change = CONVERSION  Mat 18v3.

Christians have set out on the WRONG FOOT when they believed and followed UNgodly men who infiltrated and perverted  GOD's Church way back while still in it's INFANCY/Babes who knew no better.

We must stop sinning 

Good luck with that.To me, Sinning is like sticking my hand in a fire.....I don’t like it......I try to avoid it .I always try to be obedient for selfish reasons......it seems like when I sin —— “ I” am He one who pays the price. It sure is a great thing that obedience is not the thing that saves us. Faith in the Gospel Of Grace gets that done .

When you find the way to “ stop sinning”, please share it with it with me. Meanwhile,when I sin, I will do the same thing with it that God does — put it on the Cross and leave it there .As far as my Salvation is concerned, it stays in tact.....nobody can “ sin and get away with it, however. I will have to endure any Chastisement God sends my way . Never forgetting to thank God  for His Amazing Grace That Saved me and continues to save me....I plod on.....secure in my Belief That God will keep His Promise to Save me to “ The Uttermost” I rejoice that God put the Onus of my Salvation on Himself.......I do and would continue to ruin things everyday.Once again, all I can do is thank God for His Grace......I’ll  leave it to  Those better than me to conquer Sin While living in a Body Of Flesh.....

God is also bigger than a seatbelt.....time to unbuckle the grandkids, flush the Insulin—- you name it......I understand the commendable place you are coming from, but in the end it’s it’s just silly....it’s not too much of a stretch to say that God is not the Author Of Silliness.....He “ IS” the Author Of Common Sense.....now is a great time to use it....

7 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

Let me ask you this are we required to follow and obey the teachings of Jesus?

If I may intrude for a second........if you want to “ obey” Jesus.......do what He said to do and “ Follow Paul”...

now I can return to obscurity......thanks 

4 hours ago, Betha said:

Jesus is Lord  of the Sabbath ! can you be CHRIST-like and not respect HIS HOLY DAY ?  Heb 13v8 Jesus Christ the same  'yesterday, and  today and for ever .

I respect His Holy Day more than you do! SEVEN TIMES better, as a matter of fact. I “ Sabbath” or “REST” in the Finished Work Of The Cross Every Day— that is the only Sabbath Worship That God is interested in now that we live under Grace..... “ Let No Man judge you according to theKeeping  Of Sabbaths....” You set your sights waaaaaay too low—- your God is too small.....

If people want to Tithe in the Age Of Grace, That is fine.....it is a great way to build up Heavenly Rewards- The more you give down here, the more you get up there .People must keep in mind however that Tithing can become a curse.Tithing is Part of the Law. If one is going to live by the Law , they are under “ The Curse Of The Law.”We do not want to be Judged by the Law, because if you break one Law , you have broken them all.

If one thinks that tithing is something that you MUST do in addition to Resting in the Gospel To get saved or stay saved you are “ fallen from Grace”. Don’t fall into that type of confusion . In regard to the Tithe, Jesus said it was something we should do.  ( “these things you  ought to have done”) That was under Law, the other side of the Cross . THIS side of the Cross that SAME JESUS changed how we should think about giving.Jesus said, using Paul as His Mouthpiece, That we no longer give because we are commanded to- we give because we “ want” to— never begrudgedly, but from the Heart, never forgetting that it is still true that the more we give, the more we receive

If you insist on being lead by Rules, just remember there were three tithes and there were also “ First Fruit” offerings which today would be the equivalent of handing over your first paycheck of the year to your Church. No sense doing it half-way— The Law is Unbending— either do it exactly God’s Way ( 30% tithe) or don’t do it at all........God Bless....

47 minutes ago, Betha said:

I don't think people have to be 'named'. It is the general ATTITUDE of some Christians to DIS-associate themselves from Jews or any who show other practices than themselves. I have often been called a JUDAIZER .

If one says, “Jesus Saves......BUT you must keep the Sabbath....” they will rightly be called a “ JUDAIZER”

If the shoe fits.........

32 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

Yes, it does. If a Christian is indwelled with the Holy Spirit they can not be demon possessed. 

If you “Possess” something—-you “OWN” it.  There is no way a Demon can OWN a Christian.....Torment? Yes......Own? Not Possible...

but I don't call myself a Christian.

If you are not a Christian , you need to attend to that first and worry about the demons later.....You need to Turn To God as a lost sinner and put your faith in the Shed Blood Of Jesus Christ Plus Nothing To Save you. God will put His Holy Spirit in you and until that happens, any demons  are going to have free- reign over you. “ Turn to me and I will turn to you”..... you are in my prayers— May God give you “ eyes to see”