suzan344

The second part the holy spirit recently unveiled to me is those that drink of her wine, those that have become intoxicated by her, are those that participate mind and soul in her ways.

What does that truly mean?

God gave me an experience of her 'wine' last week.  It was quite intoxicating.  I was suddenly without debt and richer enough in assets to feel full.  All I had to do is go along with the Beast system. 

I felt full, blissful, rich in assets and so on.  Confortable.  Secure.

And disposible.

It lasted an entire week before I got canned and loss the extra income/responsibity/authority and pivileges that went with it.

For a moment I felt her, harlot bablyon.  I drank of her excess.  I worshipped at her feet.  I obeyed her dictates.

But then God ended it and I was poor and hapless again.

Suddenly I felt a real loss of power.  That 'power' was the spirit that rules over earth, ie satan.

There is more information about this mark I have recently had insights about from the holy spirit.  It has to do with the spirit of Babylonia the Bible calls Harlot Babylon.

Rev. 17 reveals she has a mark on her forehead.

" And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. 6And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration."

11 hours ago, Resurrection Priest said:

Do you believe that only the martyrs will be resurrected at the Glorious Return of Christ?  Are they the only ones who will become "priests of God and of Christ" - in your view? 

My view follows:

Rev. 11:15-19 describes what happens in heaven at the 7th (last) Trumpet. 

 Revelation 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!" 16 And the twenty-four elders who sat before God on their thrones fell on their faces and worshiped God, 17 saying: "We give You thanks, O Lord God Almighty, The One who is and who was and who is to come, Because You have taken Your great power and reigned. 18 The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come, And the time of the dead, that they should be judged, And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints, And those who fear Your name, small and great, And should destroy those who destroy the earth." 

This looks like ALL those (from those still dead) who fear the LORD, receive their reward at this time.  The reward/gift is eternal life.  

2 Timothy 4:8 [Paul speaking] "Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day-- and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing." (NIV)

Looks like everyone (raised or translated) is awarded the crown of righteousness on the same day.

    Daniel 12:1-3  “There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then.  But at that time your people – everyone whose name is found written in the book--will be delivered.  Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.” NIV 

John 14:3  “I will come again and receive you unto myself.”    
    2 Thessalonians 2:1  We are “gathered together to Him” 
                    at “the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.”

1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. (1Th 4:16 NKJ)

Sounds like ALL those who are "in Christ" will be raised when He comes again - in glory.  

I'm all for the martyrs receiving thrones and reward.  I just believe that all the dead "in Christ" will be raised at His Glorious Return.

IMO

 

Rev. 11:15-19 is still just referencing the 144,00, in my view.

It says to me "judge the dead" as in judge the martyrs and find them worthy to rule the nations on thrones given to them by God, in Jesus's name (ie. Rev. 20:4 declares this).

16 hours ago, Josheb said:

Have you got any scripture to support any of this? 

Which part?  Jesus is quoted as saying the soul sleeps until final judgement.

The information about shoal and paradise is still taught by Jews, but not western evangelicals.

Everything else is my opinion and comes from wisdom I have received directly from God.

On 7/20/2021 at 3:30 PM, Resurrection Priest said:

OK.  But I'm asking about bodies for humans.  Why do humans who are living in the heavenly/spiritual realm - since they died, need to be resurrected?  Do they need to be resurrected to receive a body?  Do they need a body to function in the physical world?

It is a valid argument.  The Bible does not exactly state why.  First off, when a human dies the Bible says they sleep until final judgement.  What part sleeps?  My answer would be the soul sleeps until final judgement.

So who is resurrected from the dead in Rev. 20:4?  That states only the martyrs (144,000) are resurrected.

Since only the soul sleeps and awaits judgement, my analysis states that their asleep soul reawakens when it is called up by the sound of God's command.  So only souls are resurrected and therefore get new bodies as their old ones are now dust.

Many or most feel their old bodies (of the 144,000) and memories come alive.

I don't feel this is the case.

Next question is about Heaven.  Is there one?  I don't see souls as going to Heaven, ever.  I see in the old Testament, pre-soul time (as I see it, not necessary others) or period, that people went to Paradise, in Heaven.  What went to Paradise?  Answer, their own spirit went there.  Jews still feel this way.

What is Paradise and what does that have to do with us?  That is a mystery.

I studied his thoughts on medicine and they are valid.  But, nothing else he says is.  He is very wrong about the past, future etc.  The way he contacts this spirit tells me he is using a demon like a shaman does to answer questions.  That is why it is accurate on medicine, but lies about anything else.  He sows seeds of discontent.

When I read Ephesians 4:8 regarding what Jesus did after his resurrection, quote:

Berean Study Bible
This is why it says: “When He ascended on high, He led captives away, and gave gifts to men.”

Cont.

I see a variety of interpretations of this verse's meaning.

I can see he led people's spirits out of Shoel, for example.  I believe the 'many gifts' references 'souls' as I feel that Jesus was the very first living soul on earth and it is only because of him, we have souls today.

Hosea 13:14 ESV

"Shall I ransom them from the power of Sheol? Shall I redeem them from Death? O Death, where are your plagues? O Sheol, where is your sting? Compassion is hidden from my eyes."

Conclusion

Where did he take these human spirits (as I believe the prophets of the old testament had none)?  To Heaven and to the Tree of Life.  Only souls go to new earth and the prophets of old had none.  The saints resurrecting in Rev. 20:4 are those that followed after Jesus's time.

On 2/3/2021 at 9:44 PM, R. Hartono said:

Prophet Daniel was promised of his inheritance (heaven) at the end of days, there is no taking of his soul by Jesus at His 3rd day resurrection, as the end of days will begin with the return of Jesus Christ far away in the future unknown to Daniel.

Daniel 12:13 "As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will RISE to receive your allotted inheritance."

When will Daniel RISE ? Its explained by Paul in 1 Thes 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will RISE first. ¹⁷ Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds

Jesus told the prisoner crucified beside Him that he shall be with Christ to enter paradise part of sheol (not heaven), the place where the poor Lazarus is comforted in Abraham's bosom.

Luke 23:43 : “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise. (greek : paradeiso)

When Lord Jesus open the scroll circa 90 AD in heaven above (not in paradise) the souls of the saints are still under the earth

Rev. 5:3 ³ But no one in heaven or on earth or UNDER THE EARTH (paradise part of Sheol) could open the scroll.....

Some take conclusion that when Jesus was resurrected He also took the souls of saints from Sheol/Paradise based on this verse :

Ephesians 4:8 This is why it says: “When He ascended on high, He led captives away, and gave gifts to men.”

But captives here means the captivity of sins being broken by the praching of Gospel by Jesus as He confirmed it in Luke 4:18 ....to preach deliverance to the CAPTIVES.......

Thats why its followed by "and gave gifts to men" for the preaching of Gospel as God gave gifts to build up His church in  1 Peter 4:10  As each one has received a special gift, employ it in serving one another as good stewards of the manifold grace of God, also 1 Cor 12:4 Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit.

The souls descended into paradeiso is no longer in captivity of sin but they have been freed and awaiting the day of the Lord with the sound of Trumpet at the end of days. Paradeiso is the place of comfort and only the souls of good people entered it and are rewarded.

Apostles and angels were only witnessing Jesus raised to heaven, not carrying the resurrected saints from paradise with Him.

Acts 1:11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen Him go into heaven.”

The holy people who were raised after Jesus resurrection were not taken with Jesus Christ otherwise it shall be written by the apostles who witnessed His ascension, they were probably be buried again after being used by God to show His power and the same with prophet Daniel they are now resting until the end of days for the sound of Trumpet to the mighty celebration of the glorious Feast of the Lamb, otherwise they wud see Abraham, Daniel, Joshua, Samuel, Elias etc departed to heaven with Jesus.

Matt 27:52 The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. ⁵³ They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people

Jesus spoke about all souls of saints in paradise whose bodies are still in their graves, they are waiting there n  will listen to His voice when the time is due in the end of days.

John 5:28 Do not be amazed at this, for the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear His voice

As Paul said it, paradise is not the destination place for captivity but of victory.                             

2 Tim 4:7  I hv fought a good fight, i hv finished the race.....             

Yet all saints must wait a little while in the beautiful paradise until Lord is revealed from heaven (the harvest) :

2 Thes 1:5... and as a result you will be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering. ....THIS WILL HAPPEN WHEN THE LORD JESUS IS REVEALED FROM HEAVEN in blazing fire with his powerful angels.              

This is about the Harvest, there is no individual soul harvested to heaven but the mass harvest taken to heaven at the end of times (1 Thes 4:16)

Matt 13:³⁰ Let both grow together until the harvest...........               

                 

The true issue here is knowing the difference between a soul and a human spirit.  A soul is a seed of God given to men by Jesus. The human spirit is a less viable construct than a soul.  It has existed since the start.  The human spirit either goes to Sheol or Paradise.  The human soul is either judged and toss into the lake of fire or ascends to New earth.

2 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Suzan, I don't think we can and should count anything out in these last days. For me, there is absolutely NO question that people have moved so far away from HIM during the past 10 years it is almost frightening. I honestly do feel the Good Lord had given us a brief reprieve in allowing Trump to defeat what I believe to be one of the worst godless human beings on the planet in Hillary Clinton...... but unfortunately, we are now right back onto this very steep and scary downslope. 

The most important comment I think I could possibly make is that all of this and more will happen but God is ALWAYS IN CONTROL, HE SEES AND KNOWS EVERYTHING AND THERE ARE NO SURPRISES FOR HIM.... HE HAS GOT THIS. 

He has told us these things must happen and they will but as He said, "I will never leave you not ever".... this is when our faith is tested.... and why He has given us HIS Holy Spirit - without the power of His Holy Spirit, we would have no power to fight..... you are in my prayers, Charlie

The trauma of losing trust in someone you depend on it horrendous, and has caused me great grief in my case.

God has requested I be patient.  The situation is in hand, he says (when I pray to him that is what I feel he is saying).

I have always prayed that God unveils the mysteries of my life to me.  I have always wanted to understand who I am and why people treat me the way that they do.

It has not been an easy journey and those closest have either accepted who I am or have rejected it wholeheartedly.

It is hard to say much more about my current dilemma here.  Thanks for understanding @Charlie744

I feel in one way it is tied to this mark in the hand.  That people are accepting satan into their lives and it darkens their entire being and outlook on life.  They go from living life, to embracing death as in the Tree of good and evil.

I havn't been sharing my own personal experiences with this mark on the hand because it seems farfetched.   But I have noticed a darkening of people's spirit ever since last March when, I feel, darkness spread over the nation when everything was closed up by the State in order to 'protect' us.

I have been closely watching friends and family, and it is like some light in them has gone dark, and now they are free to do evil at will.

One person in mind has really gone full on evil in my life and I do need prayers now to protect myself from them.  They once appeared as a bright light in my life, but over the past year they became bitter and remote.  Now they are openingly attacking me.

Is this satan's agenda?  To turn people against one another?

I feel like I am in a horror movie and there is little hope now to escape.

Sometimes, I imagine the mark on the hand in terms of a color mark.  In this case, the color black.  So a blackened hand is the sign of the mark.  Of course this is only a spiritual blackened hand image and still won't be seen with the naked eye.

I suggest a homeopathic remedy for vaccine shots called Thuja.  Take a dose before and after to help with vaccine side effects.  Been using it a while.  Seems to help.  I use Thuja 200C.  Can take it daily for a week afterwards.  High dose with Vit. C as well.

If you have not used homeopathy before it comes in a little vial with white small pellets.  Boiron is a common brand.  Do not touch the pills with your hand.  Dissolve pellets in mouth, don't swallow.  Do not eat food 30 min. before and after (nor drinks except water, which can take right before and 15 minute after.).

I have put together a list.

It took some time.

The question that begs to be answered is who receives the mark?

I've given it a lot of thought and prayer and God has given me to some insights on the matter.

First off, I am choosing people who claimed to be saved by Christ, as my subjects.  That is because anyone not a Christian is already apostate and cursed with sin.

So who receives the forehead mark?

1.  Someone who commits major sins (ie. stealing, lying, doing drugs etc.) and is unrepentant (which means they refuse to confess) gets this mark.

OK.  That was an easy one.

A Christian with a secret anti-God life.

2.  Next.

This is where it gets tougher.  People here on worthy do not like to talk about ideologies.  So I looked for the very most anti-God one there is and I'd say it was communism.

People, at least I do, think socialism is not that far behind.  It is a given Marxism is on that list.

OK.  Not so tough.  But, here is the kicker, or issue, who gets to decide what is or isn't communism in disguise?

I mean no Christian would ever go around and teach straight out Nazism, for example or teach Karl Marx.  But what if they have, but did not understand that?   Some people think the common core education curriculum falls into that category and those that attest to it have fallen under the Beast's spell.

Anyway, I think those people, people who teach Marxist beliefs, even if they don't realize it, or attest to such beliefs as their own, are in this 'forehead' marked group.

Perhaps there are objections to this.  I have left it therefore, open to interpretation.  Frame it how you will, but belief systems matter to God.

3.  Finally

This is the most questionable group, I mean the group that may or may not get a forehead mark.  What about those that just go along for the ride and get off on it?  I mean the ones that like the idea of socialism even if they do not attest to it verbally?  Do they get the mark?

I mean, for example, not a teacher of common core, but someone with children or someone in education generally who gets regularly exposed to common core teachings (my one example) who eventually succumbs to its allure and starts questing capitalism, the constitution and certain liberties?  Do they receive such a mark.  I feel they do.  It gets to a tipping point eventually with them and God. 

It is like a slow burn receiving the mark this way, but eventually, like the last kid at a Birthday party to jump into the pool with everyone else, eventually, they jump.  Not because they necessary like too but because they need to feel connected to the group structure.  They comply.  Not really Christian material are they, huh?

6 hours ago, Scott Free said:

The mark goes on the hand and forehead because these areas are always exposed and readily available for scanning and verification. The calculating power referred to with the number suggest a computer network service since it goes further in referencing instantaneous global communication and its link to a global unified banking system. The Beast is going to cleanse the Earth of all "bigoted people who hold onto the barbaric beliefs of the past". Not submitting will be considered treason to world unification. The ability to quickly and easily segregate dissenters is necessary. But first before such a universal system can be installed the current economic order must be disposed of.

I thought they were just going to kill the Christians.

Anyway, I feel what is going on on earth, that we can witness, like the chip information, is merely a reflection of what is going on in the spiritual.

But this mark seems to have more spiritual weight, in my view, that physical.  I mean it means more to God than it does to mankind.

I think satan would love to chip us like cattle, but he does things like that in order to place fear in the hearts of men.  I mean that is the only power he has, fear.

The chip or bar code tattoo won't keep you from being saved by God's grace.  But the mark will.

20 hours ago, Walter Goraj jr said:

You stated : "In other words, my final verdict is people who have a mark of the beast on their right hand, actually service to Satan.   They work for him, body and soul.

What do you think?

I agree. Even though there is the reality of tracking through chips, vaccines or whatever else comes along, I believe that God's word is concerned with the spiritual.

 "Hands"  represent what you do, and with the "forehead" what you think. To have the mark of the beast ( satans kingdom) is to serve him in thought and deed. And there is plenty of that going on!

Now buying and selling I can only speculate that it has to do with the gospel. In these last days, the false " free will " gospel has been pretty much exclusively "bought and sold".  Those who have  "the seal of God in their foreheads" are doing their best to proclaim the true gospel, but in the apostate churches no one is buying or selling it. 

I have had several insights over the years about both marks.  The forehead mark to me means they serve satan through their thoughts which turn into deeds, as you say.  But the hand mark got me more concerned.  Then it came to me these are the people who go out and actually actively work against God.  The difference between the marks is the forehead mark is easier to get.  It just means you are going along with satan's ideas and that in turn is turning you from God.

But the mark on the hand is far more instrumental to satan.  It means you actively are working for him, on purpose.

I think the forehead mark people just fall into their set of circumstances and accept it, evil and all, but the hand marked people choose their path.  They purposefully work to support satan's plans.

..............

My next big question is what happens to them after they receive this mark (either one).

So far, I get they are cursed by God, but what does that mean spiritually?

What I came up with in prayer, from God, is they are banned from his presence permanently.  If that makes sense.  So does this mean their prayers don't get answered, for example?  Yes.

That they can't get forgiveness for sins?  Yes.

Wow.  All I can say.

22 hours ago, Diaste said:

Hi,

Well, scripture says, "...that no man might buy or sell except he has mark-the name of the beast or the number of his name."

So no mark is the mark unless it's tied to buying and selling, and the prohibition sans the mark.

Yes... it means 'works for Satan'.

In the sense of the word in Rev for the acceptance of the mark it's like an aggressive taking. ' lay hold by aggressively accepting what is available  emphasizes the volition of the receiver.'

And the mark itself is 'a mark providing undeniable identification, like a symbol giving irrefutable connection between parties.'

Like a mark of ownership.

People literally will aggressively connect with the beast.

But in the end I think it's less 'working for' and more 'taking away'. I'm convinced Satan has no interest in a partnership. He just wants God to have less or none at all. We're less meaningful than vermin to Satan. 

Imo.

 

 

I went a a little further in my looking and prayed on it and I think in one way, money is involved, but loosely.  In other words, a person serving Satan directly, and receives financial gain for that work, gets this particular mark.

In other words, the vast numbers of people who have turned against God, who we call apostate, do not automatically get this mark.  They will have to choose at some point.  Either serve satan, by either taking money to do his bidding or die.

Or at the bare minimum, get the forehead mark (which I feel has to do with going along with this type of situation and not fighting against it for God.) for mentally agreeing with satan and his plans. 

You could imagine a future, a dystopia, where people who only do evil, get paid for it and anyone that does not agree, gets killed off in some manner (over worked etc.).  So turn against God or else.

I have prayed long and hard on what the phrase, "mark on the hand", means from Revelations 13:16.

Rev. 13:16 KJB

"And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:" 

I, over time, had to let go of many ideas of what this particular mark was. 

It did not feel like it was a chip in the hand.  It did not seem related to a vaccine shot.  It did not feel like a bar code or tattoo.  But I did research each of those ideas, but so far, zip.  They go no where.

I always felt is was a spiritual designation as well.  But no evidence exist of what exactly it is.  So it is open to interpretation and therefore remains a mystery.

Also, there have been many voices on this topic and each typically tries to incorporate some aspect of buying or selling into the equation.

I finally had to let that part of the scripture from Rev. 13:17, go as well.  Perhaps, I finally settled on, this mark has nothing to do with buying or selling, not because I say so, but because I can't find a way to incoporate it into any ideas we have, logically.  I mean no one is dying or being stopped from buying or selling right now.  Though you can see that might actually occur, but it hasn't.  Not in relation to any of the mark ideas I just mentioned (chip, vaccine, bar code/tattoo).

If that is so, that buying and selling are not part of this mark's features, then what now is it exactly?

That brought me full circle back to a spiritual mark designating someone has received for served Satan.

In other words, my final verdict is people who have a mark of the beast on their right hand, actually service to Satan.   They work for him, body and soul.

What do you think?

Does the term "on the right hand" mean 'works for satan'?

18 hours ago, Tristen said:

Hi Suzan,

If you really want a "private way", you could cultivate a relationship with someone who works in a molecular lab. They might be kind enough to run the test for you. Most of these kinds of tests are fairly rudimentary for someone working in the right kind of lab (usually some kind of PCR - takes about 4-or-so hours from DNA-collection to results - much of that time is waiting for machines to do their thing).

Obviously, follow the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I do not personally think anyone should be scared to get a DNA test if they have a medically "valid reason" to do so. The conspiracy theorist in me just figures - why take any unnecessary risks with your own DNA for frivolous reasons if you don't have to?

 

Thanks.  Food for thought.  Though how to find such a person probaby a lot tougher than it first appears.

I personally don't feel it is a good idea to add one's genetic DNA information to public databases.  They are forever, out of your control and who knows what can be done with the information.  Afraid to find out.

My issue is rather confined.  I need to find out if I am related to a certain relative or not.  I discovered this past year I probably am not genetically related.  This brought up worry, confusion and many doubts in myself.  Been praying my way through them because the people involved do not want me to know if they are or not.  They are invested in the current setup and me blowing it up (their version of reality) just strengthens their view that I am not a good person for even doubting them.  Been a sad year for me.  So really can't get their DNA anyway.  Have to have money, loads, to go through someone who can find out for me, privately.  All alone on this matter.  Very saddened, burdened, etc.

On 1/3/2021 at 8:51 PM, Tristen said:

Hi Missmuffet,

Just to get it out-of-the-way, there is nothing immoral or unChristian about DNA testing.

My concerns are probably more in the 'conspiracy theory' realm. Once you have given your DNA to someone, you have given them enough information to construct your personal genome (and by default, most of the genome of your close relatives – including descendants). International law is vague and variant with regards to who owns that information and what they are permitted to do with it. It is plausible that this could one day be used against you – for example, to restrict your future access to health/life insurances or career options. Technology is moving so fast – there is no way to tell how this information might be used in the future.

Also, I don't think the the claimed results are necessarily accurate; especially those based on secular models of human history and migration. Only a relative few markers are tested. So I'm not sure any pay-off is worth the money or effort (i.e. it is borderline dishonesty to claim that the result mean what they claim they do).

If it's just for curiosity, I suppose there is no real harm (so long as you do not put too much emotional stock in the results). I personally do not like the idea of my DNA sample sitting in someone's freezer, or my genome being available to whoever for whatever, or stored in hackable computer systems. But that's just me. I'd only consider getting a DNA test for medical reasons.

I guess the main question for me would be – 'Are the results worth the cost and privacy risks?'.

 

I don't have any answers but that when I prayed upon it, as I do have a valid reason to get tested (there is an issue with my family tree), I felt the pull of the holy spirit away from the idea.  I was just looking at the least costly ways on-line.

So if I ever need too, I have it done the private way only (and not the add to whoevers genetic data base, at perhaps less cost).

On 1/3/2021 at 10:09 PM, R. Hartono said:

James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered among the nations, greetings.

Apostle James has written that the twelve tribes actually scattered outside Israel and even more after the destruction of Jerusalem at 70 AD and even worst after the greatest battle against the Roman by the 3rd war of Bar Kokhba  circa 135 AD. with the majority of the Jewish population of the province killed, enslaved, or exiled, and their national existence and identity became obscured as they were dispersed into unknown nations. Which is actually another more severe punishment from God Himself after their captivity into Babylon.

However, this is the undisputable evidence that the twelve tribes of Israel are still exist and preserved until today despite of the ten lost tribes taken captive to Assyria around 740 BC and scattered among nations, as God will send angels to seal them at the four corners of the earth (not in Israel) : 

Rev 1:7 After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree. ² Then I saw another angel coming up from the east, having the seal of the living God. He called out in a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm the land and the sea: ³ “Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God.” ⁴ Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.

⁵ From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed, from the tribe of Reuben 12,000, from the tribe of Gad 12,000,

⁶ from the tribe of Asher 12,000, from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000, from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,

⁷ from the tribe of Simeon 12,000, from the tribe of Levi 12,000, from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,

⁸ from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000, from the tribe of Joseph 12,000, from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.

These twelve tribes of the Hebrew will be revealed as the servants of God in the Great Tribulation when the fullness of the gentiles is reached (their time is up) and God returns the mandate of salvation to the Hebrew and these twelve tribes shall be led by the 2 OT prophets (probably Moses and Elijah) like they did lead the ancient Hebrew from Egypt to Kanaan (battling hostile gentiles) to preach the Gospel of Jesus salvation to the world in the great tribulation as the Holy Spirit the restrainer and the Church's wise virgins (where He dwelt with) has been removed.

2 Thes 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only He who now holdeth back will hold him back, until He is taken out of the way.

These 144000 Hebrew will not be hurt by the tormenting locusts with scorpion tails which torture all mankind without exception but did not kill them : ^{Rev 9:4} They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads.

And the two witnesses will stand against antichrist and false prophet like the old time Moses and Aaron stood against Pharaoh until they were killed by the beast from the bottomless pit and then the AOD takes place as these two no longer resist the antichrist NWO.

THE 144000 HEBREW WILL CONTINUE TO BE ON EARTH UNTIL JESUS RETURN TO ARMAGEDDON BATTLE WITH THE SAINTS AND THEN JESUS WILL LAND ON THE MT.ZION PROBABLY AT THE SAME SPOT FROM WHERE HE DEPARTED.

Rev 14 1 Then I looked, and there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.

Zechariah 14:3 Then the LORD will go out to fight against those nations, as He fights in the day of battle. 4 On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half the mountain moving to the north and half to the south. 5 You will flee by My mountain valley, for it will extend to Azal. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with Him.…

The 144000 Hebrew are not christians of spiritual Israel grafted to the Olive tree because christians as spiritual Israel DO NOT BELONG TO ANY TRIBE.

 

I don't think it is that far a stretch to see that many people from that region (the middle east), including Jews, crossed over into Europe and settled that region, thousands of years ago.  They lost their Jewish identity and took identities of their region, like France, Germany etc.  I've read some articles that touched upon this topic so it has been discussed before, at length, but I don't see this idea gaining much traction in the modern Church's culture.  They like their definition of Gentile and Jew and to broach this topic with alternate definitions of 'gentile' for example broaches the topic of word changes occurring in Bible text.

Nothing that can be proved well.

It gets complicated then when you begin to see alternative viewpoints on this topic.  Doesn't make for great pulpit talk and some would feel is a divisive topic.  Thank goodness we invented the internet to overcome such stagnation.

On 12/9/2020 at 7:50 AM, douge said:

2 Corinthians 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

Paul here is not saying the church, the body of Christ, is the bride of Christ. Paul is using espousal to illustrate the faithfulness and purity of the church unto Christ Jesus.

The relationship the church has with Christ is expressed by marriage. Christ is the head of the church just as the husband is head of the wife (Ephesians 5:23).

Paul is admonishing the church for following other apostles and another gospel (2 Corinthians 11:4).

The bride of Christ is a city as seen by Revelation 21:9-10.

I feel that Rev. 21 is speaking of a mature structure that will be developed first here on earth as what we call the 3rd temple of God that will eventually be moved to New earth, wholesale.  Only that structure will exist on new earth. 

Hard to imagine, but if you think in terms of what is Heaven really like and what is God really made of and what exactly will we become once we die here and get our souls moved there, it makes a tiny bit more sense, to me at least, what Rev. 21 is referencing by bride and wife language.

It is easy to get mixed up what is being referenced here because God wanted this information to remain a mystery, in my book.  

3 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, suzan344.

I caught it; I think I'll throw it back.  No, he had the PUFF of living creatures breathed into him. Understand? It's not anything special; what the Scriptures told us is that the SAME KIND OF PUFF OF AIR was puffed into the red man that God puffed into the living creatures before the man was made.

Remember: SIBKIS. See it big; keep it simple.

Sorry, did you just say God has puffed living creatures into everyone?

OK.  Will stop giving you a bad time about this.  

If you like my opinion on what happened....

It is...

God named Adam and then later when Adam was on earth, that name became 'red (or rubby) man'.  I just don't see the color 'red' as applicable to the original Adam who I feel was not made of flesh and bone and hence had no color associated with him in the garden.

The second point, which is far fetched I understand to people but not to me, is that there are living beings (creatures) in Heaven that God uses.

Since this may be the only passage in the Bible that references them as coming from God in a 'puff' snd then going into Adam, who is already formed, I feel at this juncture in his creation, and changing him from a living being to a living soul (I suspect), I can only speculate from here on out what they really are.

I will state they make up what we call the Tree of Life and I feel that they are they are the hidden manna (Rev. 2:7 and 2:17) mentioned in Revelations too.

Rev. 2:7 speaks of 'eating' living creatures.

"Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who is victorious, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God."

Rev. 2:17 speaks of hidden manna:

Rev. 2:17

"He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who overcomes, I will give the hidden manna. I will also give him a white stone inscribed with a new name, known only to the one who receives it."

Conclusion

God used a form of power that requires he breathe out something that is within himself, that is intelligent and self alive (self aware) and can be referred to as animate (having life), into Adam.

This made Adam immortal and hence a God.

This creature came originally from the Tree of Life.  But it resided in God himself eventually.

So now we know how Heaven functions.

Hint:  What is the human spirit once it enters Paradise, per the Jew's view?

I can speculate further upon request.

The real reason people celebrate October 31st is to celebrate an ancient pagan holiday.  People tend to know this fact already.

No one ever wonders why.

Why do pagans want people to practice witchcraft on that particular day?  Why pick that one day of the year to get the entire public behind curses, basically?

The question should be, why does satan hate that one day of the year?

The second question should be why do the Catholics call the next day, Nov. 1st, All Saints Day?

What is so important about both those days that both a christian holiday (holy day) and a satanic day of devilment both occur right then?

Jesus was said, by historians, to be born in late fall.  That is just based on what the bible tells us about what was happening when Jesus arrived.  October 31st falls in that date range @FresnoJoe

On 10/23/2020 at 11:20 AM, Retrobyter said:

 

Slightly rearranging the words into English order (subject-verb-direct-object), we get ...

7 And YHWH (the LORD) God formed the red [man] of dust from the red [ground] and puffed into his nostrils a puff of living [things] and the red [man] became into a living, air-breathing creature. 

So, similar to how a person is revived by a person trained in CPR, God puffed the puff of life into the first Man. HOWEVER, He puffed the puff of life into the first MAN, not "the body of the Man!" Hebrew has words that mean "body," like "geviyah" (meaning a "lifeless corpse"), if that's what God wanted to say. He didn't say that, though!

Trying to follow your translations here, I noted that this red man had living creatures breathed into him.  Did you catch that?

The issue with prophesying, which I call giving the word of the Lord, is that it is always unpopular, what the Lords says.

I mean the Lord will bring up the unfamiliar and what people want is the familiar.

There is no reason for the Lord to rehash old truths.  That seems to bug people, that he has something new to say and add to old text.

I think it leaves them feeling incredibily vulnerable for believing in what they do, if he is attempting to straighten out something they believe, that is no longer true.

Seen this myself, incredibily.