Anne2

Yes, I do believe that is what the new covenant is. The New testament/covenant scripture is the teaching of this for grace through faith.

Thanks. Eschatology does not really matter that much to me when it comes to the two covenants. But grace and faith.

I don't know, as I tend to amillennialism myself. But What I do believe at this point is two covenants made with Abraham. Gen 15 and Gen 17. Gen 15 the First is earthly, this world this life, natural seed. But focusing on Genesis 15 for a moment, notice what is said to Abraham. The WORD of the Lord (john's gospel) 1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward. 2 And Abram said, Lord GOD, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus? 3 And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir. 4 And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir. Two things.. (possibly 3) but for now focus on two.... 1. Abraham will die (Heb.Heb 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 2. The promise concerns the 4th generation of his seed. Who is the seed here? Worldly, natural, this world.......this life I believe the seed here is Jacob (who is later called Israel by his faith) 4th generation from Jacob is from Levi. As Hebrews says Levi was yet in the loins of Abraham when Melchizedek met him, could be said Levi paid the tithe in Abraham. Abe, Isaac, Jacob, and the generation of the patriarchs will be dead as well? Ex 1:5 And all the souls that came out of the loins of Jacob were seventy souls: for Joseph was in Egypt already. Ex 1:6 And Joseph died, and all his brethren, and all that generation. 13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years; 14 And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge: and afterward shall they come out with great substance. 15 And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age. 16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full. Joseph knew he would be dead..... Ex 13:19 And Moses took the bones of Joseph with him: for he had straitly sworn the children of Israel, saying, God will surely visit you; and ye shall carry up my bones away hence with you. Genesis 17 establishes the promises In Isaac. This covenant made later, is in operation first. Or as Hebrews puts it, is in force first. God swore an oath when Abraham was tested, in offering up Isaac. That oath made the promises Immutable... until that time could be added to or repented of. Once God swore the oath, No additions, nor subtractions to it. Gen 22:16 And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son: 17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies; 18 And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. Heb 6:17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: Ga 3:15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man’s covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. Ga 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. In Christ....The Annointed one. The seed promised in Gen 17? Kings are anointed Ge 17:6 And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee. Ge 17:16 And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of people shall be of her. Jacob.....Heir with Abraham of the same promise Heb Ge 35:11 And God said unto him, I am God Almighty: be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall be of thee, and kings shall come out of thy loins; Heb 11:9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: The blessing of the oath is established in Isaac Is a repeat,( james says a fulfillment of) Ge 12:2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: Ge 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. Two fold inheritance from Abraham, the firstborn having a double portion above his brethren. Who is the Israel that is all Israel? Ex 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:

I messed it up so bad I deleted the whole thing LOL. I will leave this as it relates to what enoob said. bolding some points Acts 7:2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in Charran, 3 And said unto him, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and come into the land which I shall shew thee. 4 Then came he out of the land of the Chaldaeans, and dwelt in Charran: and from thence, when his father was dead, he removed him into this land, wherein ye now dwell. 5 And he gave him none inheritance in it, no, not so much as to set his foot on: yet he promised that he would give it to him for a possession, and to his seed after him, when as yet he had no child. 6 And God spake on this wise, That his seed should sojourn in a strange land; and that they should bring them into bondage, and entreat them evil four hundred years. 7 And the nation to whom they shall be in bondage will I judge, said God: and after that shall they come forth, and serve me in this place.

I don't know. I doubt it. I guess It is not thay important to me.

Oh, interesting. I always thought you were some kind of smurf.

A shofar is what I always thought it was. edit to add I found this online. A rams horn

At first I thought censorship? I had no idea I was bungling things up by trying to open Worthy. Sorry George. Thanks for all you do, and you do alot. Some of us do not even think about how much. It is appreciated.

Thanks Farouk, but I must not have been clear in my post. Or you misunderstood my intent I have said nothing in opposition to Hebrews. So, here is another Hebrews is not speaking about the "rest" of the 4th commandment concerning the "rest of Joshua". Joshua fulfilling the Rest of their inheritance is a shadow of our Sabbath in our eternal inheritance in Christ . Joshua took on leadership across the Jordon, Moses could not go. In the desert/wilderness they had not been given the "rest" of their inheritance (a rest in connection with the land. I would go so far as to suggest they could not have this rest until they entered and conquered the land per the Abrahamic promise. This the rest spoken of in Hebrews...... De 12:9 For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you. De 12:10 But when ye go over Jordan, and dwell in the land which the LORD your God giveth you to inherit, and when he giveth you rest from all your enemies round about, so that ye dwell in safety; De 25:19 Therefore it shall be, when the LORD thy God hath given thee rest from all thine enemies round about, in the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance to possess it, that thou shalt blot out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven; thou shalt not forget it. Here we are again Jos 1:13 Remember the word which Moses the servant of the LORD commanded you, saying, The LORD your God hath given you rest, and hath given you this land. Jos 1:15 Until the LORD have given your brethren rest, as he hath given you, and they also have possessed the land which the LORD your God giveth them: then ye shall return unto the land of your possession, and enjoy it, which Moses the LORD’S servant gave you on this side Jordan toward the sunrising. I think some interesting things are going on here. 2 1/2 tribes received land on the other side of the Jordon, but could not rest in it until the rest of Israel (all Israel) also received theirs. Jos 21:44 And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand. Jos 22:4 And now the LORD your God hath given rest unto your brethren, as he promised them: therefore now return ye, and get you unto your tents, and unto the land of your possession, which Moses the servant of the LORD gave you on the other side Jordan. Soloman's blessing 55 And he stood, and blessed all the congregation of Israel with a loud voice, saying, 56 Blessed be the LORD, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by the hand of Moses his servant.

It was the Levites inheritance. They were not heirs with the Children of Israel Nu 18:24 But the tithes of the children of Israel, which they offer as an heave offering unto the LORD, I have given to the Levites to inherit: therefore I have said unto them, Among the children of Israel they shall have no inheritance. Jos 18:7 But the Levites have no part among you; for the priesthood of the LORD is their inheritance: The Church isn't copying that, it was a copy of the Church

I am

Put them on planes, trains, buses, ships, container trucks, and send ALL OF THEM to the Liberal cities all, including D.C.

This is likening the Sabbath in Christ to the rest of their inheritance under Joshua. 2 1/2 tribes were given land under Moses on the other side of the Jordon And I commanded you at that time, saying, The LORD your God hath given you this land to possess it: ye shall pass over armed before your brethren the children of Israel, all that are meet for the war. 19 But your wives, and your little ones, and your cattle, (for I know that ye have much cattle,) shall abide in your cities which I have given you; 20 Until the LORD have given rest unto your brethren, as well as unto you, and until they also possess the land which the LORD your God hath given them beyond Jordan: and then shall ye return every man unto his possession, which I have given you. They had not come to that rest..... De 12:9 For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you. De 12:10 But when ye go over Jordan, and dwell in the land which the LORD your God giveth you to inherit, and when he giveth you rest from all your enemies round about, so that ye dwell in safety; 13 Remember the word which Moses the servant of the LORD commanded you, saying, The LORD your God hath given you rest, and hath given you this land. 14 Your wives, your little ones, and your cattle, shall remain in the land which Moses gave you on this side Jordan; but ye shall pass before your brethren armed, all the mighty men of valour, and help them; 15 Until the LORD have given your brethren rest, as he hath given you, and they also have possessed the land which the LORD your God giveth them: then ye shall return unto the land of your possession, and enjoy it, which Moses the LORD’S servant gave you on this side Jordan toward the sunrising. Jos 21:44 And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand. Jos 22:4 And now the LORD your God hath given rest unto your brethren, as he promised them: therefore now return ye, and get you unto your tents, and unto the land of your possession, which Moses the servant of the LORD gave you on the other side Jordan.

De 8:18 But thou shalt remember the LORD thy God: for it is he that giveth thee power to get wealth, that he may establish his covenant which he sware unto thy fathers, as it is this day.

I agree :-)

Yes, it is determined by nature. Good heart, vs bad heart. The world is watching and listening here. And that world is full of natural law. The blurring of it is not good. Judge a just judgement.

Why is religion involved here? It is the Palestinain authority vs the Israeli's. Neither are Christian, nor the "Church". Scripture tells us men know right from wrong naturally. It is natural law. Some men are "just" (righteous) minded by nature, some are not. These are watching and hearing you. It is not a good look to defend rapists and murderers. Nor a good judgment in their eyes (nor can it be)_to look at the historical events. There is in the law of Moses, judgements between men an men, and judgements between men and God. the day of Atonement distiguished the two, God's judgement on Israel as a nation, was distinct. His and his alone to avenge, as it is sin against God alone. Look at this in the law itself. God always judged the nations based on natural law. Announcing "peace" to those nations they were to war with. In short they gave them no cause to attack their fellow man. But they attacked them none the less, for just passing through. Natural law between MEN vs MEN.

No. I am saying you are not applying natural law to judge between two in a dispute? For a just judgement. The Palestinian authority and Muslim brotherhood are not Christian anymore than Israel is. Natual law is all you have for a just judgement.

Natural law. So, Christians rape, torture? Or Christians support those who do? Armies use women and children for shields, do you support this? Men naturally know right from wrong, where is that in all this?

I believe he does defend Israel, and he does so through judgement of those who mistreat Israel with no just cause. It is how he judges the world. Deut 2:26 And I sent messengers out of the wilderness of Kedemoth unto Sihon king of Heshbon with words of peace, saying, 27 Let me pass through thy land: I will go along by the high way, I will neither turn unto the right hand nor to the left. 28 Thou shalt sell me meat for money, that I may eat; and give me water for money, that I may drink: only I will pass through on my feet; 30 But Sihon king of Heshbon would not let us pass by him: for the LORD thy God hardened his spirit, and made his heart obstinate, that he might deliver him into thy hand, as appeareth this day. Is God hardening men's hearts today with Israel? Did it begin with in 1967? 31 And the LORD said unto me, Behold, I have begun to give Sihon and his land before thee: begin to possess, that thou mayest inherit his land. 32 Then Sihon came out against us, he and all his people, to fight at Jahaz. The same thing with pharaoh. Moses did not demand to leave and never return to serve Pharaoh. Just three days journey, To hold a feast..... Ex 5:1 And afterward Moses and Aaron went in, and told Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Let my people go, that they may hold a feast unto me in the wilderness. Just three days to prevent God's wrath...... 3 And they said, The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go, we pray thee, three days’ journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword. Announce peace to fight the enemy. Giving them no just cause for ill treatment or behavior.... Deut 20:10 ¶ When thou comest nigh unto a city to fight against it, then proclaim peace unto it. 11 And it shall be, if it make thee answer of peace, and open unto thee, then it shall be, that all the people that is found therein shall be tributaries unto thee, and they shall serve thee. 12 And if it will make no peace with thee, but will make war against thee, then thou shalt besiege it: 13 And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword:

Yep it does. After a real person Saint Nicholas. His story is kind of nice. But so over the top in modern Christmas lore.

Ah we are both old, lol. Heels might be dangerous at this point.

I did not know that. Nice to know as Christmas for me is a very special time. Not in the way some celebrate however. I think there is something very special about going to evening services to contemplate it. I haven't anyplace where the service is at midnight which to me is super special. But a 9:00 pm service will still do. Just personal I quess.

The Gospel of John Jn 1: 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. Jn 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.