Cntrysner

Do you believe the comforter (Joh 16:7) is the Spirit of Christ Who indwells the members of His Body? You said…..“So going to the cross meant redemption; then going through the cross (in resurrection) meant His life-giving Spirit is now available to come live in us and be our life!” Paul said now the Lord is that Spirit yet Christ after resurrection said He wasn’t spirit (Luk 24:39) but flesh and bone thus Jesus was transfigured (glorified) at ascension. When the veil …His physical body… is removed He returns to His glorified being at ascension before he became flesh. Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; 2Co 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. Jesus made it clear with this statement.. Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Christ had to return to the life giving Spirit before He could indwell believers, it was certainly impossible for Him to indwell in physical form.

Christ ascended forty days after His resurrection and it was not possible for His Spirit to indwell man until after His ascension. Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Christ’s ascension is our gateway to the Father in glory. Christ had to ascend to send His omnipresent Spirit to indwell us giving us the wisdom and revelation of His earthly ministry and the fullness of being in Christ, the Hope of Glory in ascension (Eph 1:17-20, Col 1:26-27). He left the earthly realm ending His earthly ministry and transformed to began His heavenly -omnipresent Spirit reign. His has and is creating a new man (2Co 5:16-17) for a new creation (Rev 21:1) in a Spirit realm which encompasses both heaven and earth. Christ’s transformation from terrestrial to celestial (1 Co 15:45-49) displayed His divinity as The Creator God Who is now one with the Father in one Spirit. His resurrection defeated death and we are now in the likeness and a witness of His resurrection but His ascension made an eternal victory in His Spirit Body. The death and resurrection of Christ was glorious for we died with Him and were raised to walk in newness of life yet still in resurrected flesh ( Rom 6:4-11). But we need more than just resurrection because flesh and our natural desire to please it causes us to sin and the flesh wars against Christ’s Spirit in us (Rom 8:3) (Gal 5: 16-17). The ascension is the launching pad to the heavenly realm, it is a literal and spiritual transfiguring event which removes the body of sin (1Co 15:44) and is for all believers that continue to follow Christ by faith after being spiritually resurrected in a natural body of flesh (Rom 6:4). This transformation or metamorphosis (Mat 17:2) occurs at death or rapture when we leave our natural body (2Co 5:1-9) that will eventually return to dust from which it came (Gen 3:19). God’s eternal plan was to make man in His express image (Heb 1:3) (2Co 3: 16-18). He created the earthly realm and formed man from the dust. God told Adam… “for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return“. Christ was born in the flesh, born of a women, yet He was the only begotten of the Father’s seed Who became The Spirit when He ascended… “Now the Lord is that Spirit“...the express image of God. God’s plan to make man in the image of God was fulfilled in the glorious transfiguration of Christ when He ascended to the Father and returned as “that Spirit“ that indwells us (Col 1:27). The resurrected Christ could not physically indwell believers thus the transfiguration of Christ from flesh to the omnipresent Spirit was extremely important. Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness What is the express image of God the Father? Is He not light and Spirit? He certainly is not flesh, not man or woman. Seed when fully matured produces likeness after it’s kind and the seed of God is Spirit which will produce a spirit body in the image of God not of flesh from the earth. Man was not created or born in the image of God and that is why we must be born again of the Spirit… That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit (Joh 3:6). Image is a visual representation not just a set of attributes, we have our morals but they stem from the flesh (Rom 8:8), we can only express God’s attributes by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Gal 5:16-17), Paul spoke of this when he said..For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not (Rom 7:18). There is an assumption that Adam was created not only in God’s image which is glorious but was also created immortal in the flesh, why then was the tree of life needed in the garden? Resurrected or reconstituted flesh will not be glorified (1 Co 1:29) and it is not the glorious Spirit image of God. After Christ was resurrected in the flesh He said …Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have (Luk 24:39), yet Paul writes after the ascension…“the vail which is His flesh shall be taken away (Heb 10-20), " now " the Lord is that Spirit, But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord” (2Co 3:16-18). Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Adam was created in man’s own image an earthly creature formed from the dust of the earth with a sinful nature that desired to please his flesh (Rom 8:8). It was desire of the flesh that caused Adam to disobey God. Man’s image was in the likeness of God but it was an “illusion, resemblance; hence a representative figure, especially an idol: - image, vain shew“ -H5764. Jesus was born in the flesh but had power over sin being the only begotten of the Father via the Father’s Holy seed, a supernatural birth. We can only overcome sin by His seed in our body of dirt, He is the Conqueror yet we wait for His Seed in us (Eph 1:13) to reach maturity with a literal transfiguring rebirth as we rise from the earth and follow Christ. Christ transfigured and ascended to the Father in glory, by faith if we continue to follow Him we will receive our spirit’s desire and be with our Father face to face in glory. Heb 2:10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings. The ascension is often overlooked leaving the resurrection as the ultimate completion of God’s plan to make man in His own image. Christ incarnate descended from His glory in heaven (Joh 6:51) where He was One Spirit with God. He became flesh so that His flesh body could be sacrificed to give us eternal life (Heb 10:5, 20). We pass through the veil, that is His flesh, into the presence of God who is a consuming fire. The glorious image of God was hidden behind the flesh image of the man Jesus. What does it mean to be in the Spirit body of Christ? It is an operation of God by the Spirit of Christ (1Co 12:13) wherein we become one with Him in one Spirit body (Joh 17:21). Flesh must be removed to become a member of the one Spirit body of Christ, Paul explained it…In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ (Col 2:11). God counts this operation as a done deal yet we wait for it’s literal manifestation as a son of God transformed into His Spirit image (Rom 8) (Gen 1:26). As a member of His body all Christ achieved is credited to us, His death, burial, resurrection, ascension and literal transfiguration into the Image of the ascended Christ. We, as members of His body are not of this earth. We are sealed by the Spirit (Eph 1:13-14) and will ascend to the Father’s right hand (Eph 2:6, Col 3:2-4, Heb 1:3).

The main and most important message is His eternal purpose when He said... "Let us make man in our image"... Gen 1:26 2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

More on God's fire, please excuse it's randomness. 2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. 2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: 2Co 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious? 2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. 2Co 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. 2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious. 2Co 3:12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: 2Co 3:13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: 2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 2Co 3:15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 2Co 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord. The veil of Moses and the temple veil represent the flesh of Jesus, born of a women, under the law given to Moses. The law and the veil separate us from the glory of God, they are a covering when removed enables us to enter the presence of God and see Him face to face. Jesus was made in the likeness of sinful flesh under the law yet the law was not effective because of the flesh (Rom 8:3) (Gal 4:4) (Gal 5:4-5). Jesus had to pay our sin debt in the flesh under the law because we are weak in the flesh. His righteous blood gives us boldness and access to pass through the earthly veil (2Co 5:8) and ascend to the presence of God in His heavenly temple, where the eternal Spirit, purifies and transforms us into His express image (Heb 1:3) (2Co 3:18). The veil of Moses covered the glory of God that the people feared and Moses removed the veil which was symbolic of the law (Joh 1:17) when he entered God’s presence (Ex 34:29-35), it was a type to the temple veil which represented the body of Jesus (Heb 10:20), when the veil is removed we see the glory of the Father in Christ the glorified Spirit (1Tim 3:16). The veil must be completely removed not just torn (2 Co 3:16). God was not in Herod’s temple thus the torn veil did not give access to His presence nor did it represent Christ at that time, it signified that God rejected temple worship and sacrifices and pointed to Christ, the temple would be destroyed (Mat 24:2) leaving Jesus the only way to God (Joh 14:6). When Jesus drove out the money changers it could have been a protest against animal sacrifices but Jesus did not cleanse Herod’s temple, according to God‘s law it required the application of sacrificial blood (Heb 9:21-24). In the temple God’s glory was on the Ark of the covenant, the ark represented Christ and His glory to come and God removed the Ark during the Babylonian exile thus God’s glory and presence has not been in the temple since 587 years before Christ. The temple and it’s rituals became worthless symbols and would be replaced with the heavenly (Heb 8:5). God’s presence can only be accessed through Christ (Joh 14:6) who is the Spirit (2Co 3: 16-17) and the spirit members of His body whom Christ indwells (1Co 12:13) (Joh 14:2-3). Ezekiel described God’s glory (shekinah) leaving Solomon’s temple and resting on the Mount of Olives and then ascending. His glory represented His presence which was not in Herod’s temple. Christ’s transfiguration (Mat 17, Mar 9, Luk 9:28) was a vision of His ascension and glorification (His face became bright as the sun and His clothing white as light) on the Mount of Olives which is the location where He will return in glorified Spirit (Act 1:11). The deity and glory Christ had with the Father before the world began was veiled by His flesh and now the veil was being removed as he was transfiguring and returning to the Father in glory. Christ ascended in a cloud as He was transfiguring (Act 1:9) as did the ascending cloud of the burning incense covered God’s glory (Lev 16:13). Transfigure or metamorphoo means a change of the outward form into a completely new form by supernatural means. This new form was Christ receiving the express image of God (Heb 1:3) not a reflection or likeness but a emanation from within which burned bright as the sun (Mat 17:2), not veiled by the flesh but the unveiled Spirit (2Co 3:17), we will also experience this metamorphosis (2Co3:18). The perpetual burning of the incense represented the sweet aroma of the burnt offering (Lev 1:13) ( Exo 30:7) that ascended to the Father, they were instructed to never let the fire of the burnt offering go out which represented the consuming fire of the eternal Spirit (Deu 4:24) (Lev 9:24). The incense and burnt offering where symbolic of the flesh body of Christ who is our sacrifice. The smoke from the burning incense was a sweet savor as it ascended and represented the ascension of Christ (2 Co 2:15). The temple, sacrifices, and furnishings prefigured Christ, His divinity, life, ministry and sacrifice. Spices were used on the altar of incense, they were also a gift at the birth of Jesus signifying His coming kingship and divinity, they were also used to anoint His body at death, though they may have been different, they signified His divine essence. Eternal fire from the burnt offering ignited the spices creating the aromatic smoke. Fire like the Spirit transforms and purifies resulting in the ascending smoke that not only filled the tabernacle but ascended to the heavens as Christ did. The golden altar of incense (Ex 30) represented the perfection and holiness of Christ, His shed blood consecrating the heavenly altar, the offering of His body and ascension to glory. Sacrifice and offerings by man were never eternally accepted and not holy or pure, they were but mere shadows of God’s sacrifice in His heavenly sanctuary. And Abraham said, "My son, God will provide Himself a lamb for a burnt offering." (Genesis 22:7-8) Exo 30:6 And thou shalt put it before the vail that is by the ark of the testimony, before the mercy seat that is over the testimony, where I will meet with thee. Exo 30:7 And Aaron shall burn thereon sweet incense every morning: when he dresseth the lamps, he shall burn incense upon it. Exo 30:8 And when Aaron lighteth the lamps at even, he shall burn incense upon it, a perpetual incense before the LORD throughout your generations. Lev 1:9 But his inwards and his legs shall he wash in water: and the priest shall burn all on the altar, to be a burnt sacrifice, an offering made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the LORD. Lev 6:12 And the fire upon the altar shall be burning in it; it shall not be put out: and the priest shall burn wood on it every morning, and lay the burnt offering in order upon it; and he shall burn thereon the fat of the peace offerings. Lev 6:13 The fire shall ever be burning upon the altar; it shall never go out. Burning of the body for purification after the sacrificial blood for remission is applied was required under God’s law and Christ fulfilled the law to it’s fullest so that we can by Christ’s faith and power be literally transformed into His express image when we leave this world. Luk 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

Heb 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; It think the flesh separates us from the presence of God. Christ descended to take on flesh and when the veil is remove one can see the glory of God.

Heb 9:11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building; Heb 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us. Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. Heb 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. Heb 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth. Heb 9:24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: Before Christ ascended no man could ascend to the Holy of Holies where the Father resides, Christ had to shed His blood for remission of sin and present His body as a burnt offering for purification of sin (Heb 10:5-12) thus paving the way for members of His body. By His sacrifice ..death.. we have His will and testament and will receive the inheritance of eternal life. His testament had no power until after His death and ascension to the Holy of Hollies where prior to entry His flesh body, the body that God required (Heb 10:5), was consumed by fire (Heb 12:29 (Lev 1) to release His Spirit to indwell man (Joh 16:7), upon the indwelling we are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise and all of Christ’s sacrificial work is credited to us and we become a son of God and receive His inheritance. Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; Heb 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. The Spirit of Christ (Holy Spirit) is the power that purifies and transforms us to the image of the ascended Christ (2Th 2:13,14). This is a done deal for God has sealed us in Christ yet we wait in this body of flesh to receive our eternal body in heaven (2 Co 5:1-2). Christ’s blood was shed at His death and it enabled Him to pass through the veil, that is to say His flesh, into the Father’s presence (Heb 10:19-20). His body of flesh contained our sins (1Pet 2:24) and as we see in 2 Ch 7:1-3 and 1Kings 18:38-39, God totally consumes the sacrificial body and it symbolized complete purification from sin which is in the flesh (Rom 7). Christ presented His body as a burnt offering to the Father at ascension as Abraham presented Isaac. Before the body is burned the blood must be shed (Lev 1) thus Abraham had the knife and the fire at ready to sacrifice Isaac. God provided the substitute and the ram’s body was consumed by fire. See Got Questions…what is a burnt offering…The Hebrew word for “burnt offering” actually means to “ascend,“ literally to “go up in smoke”… the “olah offering“. Christ’s body of flesh was the burnt offering at His ascension. Gen 8:20 And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar. Gen 8:21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done. Gen 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. Gen 22:6 And Abraham took the wood of the burnt offering, and laid it upon Isaac his son; and he took the fire in his hand, and a knife; and they went both of them together. Gen 22:8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a "lamb" for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together. Gen 22:10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. Lev 1:9 But his inwards and his legs shall he wash in water: and the priest shall burn all on the altar, to be a burnt sacrifice, an offering made by fire, of a sweet savour unto the LORD. Lev 1:10 And if his offering be of the flocks, namely, of the sheep, or of the goats, for a burnt sacrifice; he shall bring it a male without blemish. Lev 1:11 And he shall kill it on the side of the altar northward before the LORD: and the priests, Aaron's sons, shall sprinkle his blood round about upon the altar. Lev 5:7 And if he be not able to bring a lamb, then he shall bring for his trespass, which he hath committed, two turtledoves, or two young pigeons, unto the LORD; one for a sin offering, and the other for a burnt offering. The dove represents the Spirit and twice the Spirit descended on Jesus, once at His water baptism and once at the transfiguration which was a vision of His ascension, God spoke these words… Mat 3:17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Mat 17:5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. Representation of the two doves is one for a sin offering as seen in the death and shed blood of the sacrifice was for forgiveness of sins but purification is still needed, the literal removal of sin is represented in the second dove as a burnt offering. The baptism of Jesus set the stage for His rejection and ultimately the cross where He was slain and shed His blood for remission of sins. His ascension was the burnt offering of His flesh body and it made it possible for His Spirit to indwell and purify the spirit of man. The old testament burnt offering had to be fulfilled in Christ, the shed blood of the cross and the burnt offering of His ascension to the presence of the Father who is a consuming fire (Heb 12:29). Christ had to rise from the dead and as High Priest presented His body as the burnt offering for purification. The flesh must be reduced to ashes (Lev 6) thus the spirit/soul is purified and ascends to the Father’s kingdom to receive our eternal body (2 Co 5:1-3). Rom 11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen. Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. The fire of God is two fold it can either purify to make us eternally acceptable which happens in the twinkling of an eye or it can condemn in everlasting fire.

Amen, we can only go before the Father by humbling our selves in the presence of the perfect humanity of Christ with the knowledge we are nothing, only Christ can give glory to the Father (the Father does not glory in flesh), and we give glory to the Son who took our sin upon Himself. We can only receive eternal life through Christ, there is no other way, His perfect life. I see the ultimate will of the Father is that we must go through Christ to enter His heavenly Kingdom, it is all Christ and nothing of ourselves. The Father will only receive a perfect Son without sin and those that completely surrendered their sinful life and died with Christ and became inseparable from Christ by the gift of Christ will the Father receive. Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Amen....

Excerpts from John Piper on "what is the will of God and how do we know it".... I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. (Romans 12:1–2) The term “the will of God” has at least two and possibly three biblical meanings. First, there is the sovereign will of God, that always comes to pass without fail. Second, there is the revealed will of God in the Bible — do not steal, do not lie, do not kill, do not covet — and this will of God often does not come to pass. And third, there is the path of wisdom and spontaneous godliness — wisdom where we consciously apply the word of God with our renewed minds to complex moral circumstances, and spontaneous godliness where we live most of our lives without conscious reflection on the hundreds of things we say and do all day. Next week we need to sort this out and ask what Paul is referring to in Romans 12:2. But today I want to focus on the phrase in Romans 12:2, “by the renewal of your mind.” Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.” We are perfectly useless as Christ-exalting Christians if all we do is conform to the world around us. And the key to not wasting our lives with this kind of success and prosperity, Paul says, is being transformed. “Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed.” That word is used one time in all the gospels, namely, about Jesus on the mountain of transfiguration (the mountain of “transformation” — same word, metemorphōthē): “And he was transfigured before them, and his face shone like the sun, and his clothes became white as light” (Matthew 17:2; Mark 9:2). I point this out for one reason: to make the point that the nonconformity to the world does not primarily mean the external avoidance of worldly behaviors. That’s included. But you can avoid all kinds of worldly behaviors and not be transformed. “His face shown like the sun, and his clothes became white as light!” Something like that happens to us spiritually and morally. Mentally, first on the inside, and then, later at the resurrection on the outside. So Jesus says of us, at the resurrection: “Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father” (Matthew 13:43). Transformation is not switching from the to-do list of the flesh to the to-do list of the law. When Paul replaces the list — the works — of the flesh, he does not replace it with the works of the law, but the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:19–22). The Christian alternative to immoral behaviors is not a new list of moral behaviors. It is the triumphant power and transformation of the Holy Spirit through faith in Jesus Christ — our Savior, our Lord, our Treasure. “[God] has made us sufficient to be ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life” (2 Corinthians 3:6). So transformation is a profound, blood-bought, Spirit-wrought change from the inside out. If you long to break loose from conformity to the world, If you long to be transformed and new from the inside out, If you long to be free from mere duty-driven Christianity and do what you love to do because what you love to do is what you ought to do, If you long to offer up your body as a living sacrifice so that your whole life becomes a spiritual act of worship and displays the worth of Christ above the worth of the world, then give yourself with all your might to pursuing this — the renewal of your mind. Because the Bible says, this is the key to transformation. “Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind.” The problem with our minds is not merely that we are finite, and don’t have all the information. The problem is that our minds are fallen. They have a spirit, a bent, a mindset that is hostile to the absolute supremacy of God. Our minds are bent on not seeing God as infinitely more worthy of praise than we are, or the things we make or achieve. The Bible says we have “exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man” (Romans 1:23). And the image in the mirror is the mortal image we worship most. Here is the deepest disease, infecting everything else. Our mental suppression of liberating truth is rooted in our hardness of heart. Our hard hearts will not submit to the supremacy of Christ, and therefore our blind minds cannot see the supremacy of Christ (see John 7:17). This brings us finally to the remedy and how we obey Romans 12:2, “Be transformed in the renewal of your mind.” First, before we can do anything, a double action of the Holy Spirit is required. And then we join him in these two actions. The reason I say the Holy Spirit is required is because this word “renewal” in Romans 12:2 is only used one other place in all the Greek Bible, namely, Titus 3:5 where Paul says this: “[God] saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit.” There’s the word “renewal” which we’ve seen is so necessary. And it is renewal “of the Holy Spirit.” The Spirit renews the mind. It is first and decisively his work. We are radically dependent on him. Our efforts follow his initiatives and enablings. Now, what is the double work that he must do to renew our minds so that all of life becomes worship? 2 Corinthians 3:18 sets the stage for the answer: What does the Spirit do to “transform” us into the image of the God-exalting Son of God? He enables us to “behold the glory of the Lord.” This is how the mind is renewed — by steadfastly gazing at the glories of Christ for what they really are. But to enable us to do that, the Spirit must do a double work. He must work in two directions: from the outside in and from the inside out. He must work from the outside in by exposing the mind to Christ-exalting truth. That is, he must lead us to hear the gospel, to read the Bible, to study Christ-exalting writings of great, spiritual men, and to meditate on the perfections of Christ. This is exactly what our great enemy does not want us to do according to 2 Corinthians 4:4, “The god of this world [Satan] has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ.” Because to see that for what it really is, Paul says, will renew the mind and transform the life and produce unending worship. And the Spirit must work from the inside out, breaking the hard heart that blinds and corrupts the mind. The Spirit must work from the outside in, through Christ-exalting truth, and from the inside out, through truth-embracing humility. If he only worked from the outside in, by presenting Christ-exalting truth to our minds but not breaking the hard heart and making it humble, then the truth would be despised and rejected. And if he only humbled the hard heart, but put no Christ-exalting truth before the mind, there would be no Christ to embrace and no worship would happen. What then do we do in obedience to Romans 12:2, “Be transformed in the renewal of your mind”? We join the Holy Spirit in his precious and all-important work. We pursue Christ-exalting truth and we pray for truth-embracing humility.

Signed, sealed, and delivered... I’m His. Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you. Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: 1Co 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

You tell me, it is described as a shout, the trump of God and the voice of the archangel. I prefer strings….

The trump of God (1Co 15:52, 1 Th 4:16) is a singular trump and is a call to believers for a group or personal event in time to ascend and be with the Lord overcoming death, yet in Revelation the 7th trumpet is a series of trumps and is for judgment and God‘s wrath. 1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 1Th 5:10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. In 1Co 15:52 and 1Th 4:16, both trumps are a high calling to the body of Christ resulting in ascension to be with the Lord (Joh 14:3)and a transfiguration into a body eternal in the heavens. The personal event is every man in his own order at death and is the trump of God, and the group event is they that are Christ’s at His coming in the air and is the last trump for those that remain (1Co 15:23). In context Paul is speaking of those that God will bring with Christ (1Th 4:14) and then those that are alive and remain will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air and (2Co 15:52). Paul spoke of the death of believers who have the high calling (Php 3:14-21) as being absent from the physical body and present with the Lord in glory with the Father (2Co 5: 1-8), this transfiguration happens in the twinkling of an eye (1Co 15:52), meaning we will never see death (Joh 8:51, 11:26). The physical body dies and is left behind and we will receive a spiritual body eternal in the heavens (2Co 5:1). This new body has always been in heaven eternally and it is part of the mystery Paul revealed in 1Co 15:51, resurrection of the flesh was certainly not a mystery at that time. The mystery is a rising or ascension leaving the corrupt physical body behind. It will be as Job said… All flesh shall perish together, and man shall turn again unto dust (34:15). 1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Corruption is in sinful flesh through Adam and it will not inherit incorruption or glorification (1Co 15:44-45). 1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. The sleeping Paul referred to (1Th 4:14) who are absent from the physical body and present with the Lord received their new eternal body in the heavens (2Co 5:1-8). 1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. 1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words. The sequence of events… those that die in Christ rise first in their own order and are the ones that God will send with Christ when He leaves glory then those that are alive and remain will be caught up leaving their physical body behind to meet them in the clouds. Paul is consistent with His teaching, when the physical body of the earth is put off, those in His Body as members, receive their glorified body that is eternal in the heavens (2Co 5:1) . 1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. 1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 1Co 15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly. 1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

Some try to tear Christ asunder saying… paraphrasing---"""His body was dead in the grave, His spirit returned to God, and His soul descended into hell""". His divinity would disallow such a thing, Christ was not merely a man and became the life giving Spirit (1 Co 15:45). Christ took our sins into His flesh body and died in the flesh but not in His spirit or soul. Christ was never a damned disembodied spiritless soul and neither will we be if we are members of His ascended Body. God the Father was in Christ on the cross (2 Co 5:19) via the Holy Spirit and He never left Him. I also edited the original post.

It is slow but not as slow as me....

Let me be clear, I believe Christ died in the flesh for our sins and His flesh body did not see corruption. I have said nothing to the contrary.

Spirit to spirit is how God communicates to the inner man (soul) by His spirit breath or words which gives life. This connection is complete via the Spirit entering us and transforming our spirit, it is a new birth by the Fathers seed who is Christ in us the Hope of Glory. The same Spirit seed in us when we leave our flesh body at death will transform us into the image of the ascended Christ which is a spiritual body.

I thought it was you thus no quote...what denomination are you? Did not say that, I said some say Some try to tear Christ asunder saying… His body was dead in the grave, When I said "His divinity would disallow such a thing" refered to the whole statement "His body was dead in the grave, His spirit returned to God, and His soul descended into hell". We do know His flesh did not see corruption (Act 2:31). Christ was not merely a man. Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. Christ was forsaken in His flesh not His Spirit.

Yes, that is the problem “this vile flesh” and it must be put off, it is the body of sin and it must be destroyed (Rom 6:6) and dissolved (2Co 5:6). Phil 3:31 tells us we will receive a body like His glorious body. This glorious body is the body Christ received after He was transfigured and ascended back to the Father. Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. Before creation Christ was one with the Father in one Spirit Body not a body of flesh and bone and definitely not a reconstituted body. It is said that no flesh will glory in God’s presence (1Co 1:29). Christ described the one Spirit body that we have faith in and Paul verifies the oneness as one Spirit body. Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. John described Christ’s glorified body as a light bright as the sun. Rev 1:13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. Rev 1:14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; Rev 1:15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. Rev 1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. Rev 1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. Paul was struck blind by Christ’s ascended glorious transfigured image and it was definitely not the visual image of Christ resurrected. Act 9:3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven: Act 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? Act 9:8 And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus. Act 9:9 And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink. Christ did not receive His glorified body until he returned to the Father and received the glory He had before the world began and before He took on flesh. Whatever form His resurrected body was it was not His glorified body after ascension. Joh 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.) Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. Paul differs with you about the body at death …(2 Co 5:1-6)..when he is absent from the body he will not be found naked but clothed upon with a glorified body from heaven and if you are alive and believe in Christ you will never die (Joh 11:26). 2Co 5:4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened….the burden is the vile flesh and it wars against the spirit. It is as Paul said in Gal 5:17... For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. The new body…Php 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself. “Made in heaven” means not of earth’s elements. 1Co 15:37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be… Christ has already come into this world in the form of the Holy Spirit and we that have faith in Christ were raised to walk in newness of life. The Lord is that Spirit….Our body is changed into Christ’s same image and it is not your old body of flesh reconstituted. 2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord. 1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. As far as death is concerned… Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him… Hath everlasting life means never die (Joh 11:26). Paul said there is One body for those in Christ, just as the Father and the Son are One in one spiritual body before the world began we also shall be one with Them, no flesh body needed. A believer at the moment of death is transfigured in the twinkling of an eye, they are never found naked but are clothed with a body that is eternal in heaven (2 Co 5:1) and present with the Lord. This heavenly body has been in heaven eternally and again it is not one’s reconstituted flesh. We worship God with our spirit and Christ the Hope of Glory (Col 1:27) is in us with His Spirit, it is spirit to Spirit, the same spirit that God breathed into Adam and he became a living soul. John was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day (Rev 1:10) and that is how he was able to witness and worship the Glorified Christ. At death those that do not have faith in the higher calling (Php 3:14) which is ascension, not the grave, will descended in death. We that believe have eternal life and will be present with the Lord when death comes knocking. He will be present the Lord in the eternal body from heaven (2 Co 5:1-2). No rebuilt flesh body for the body of Christ, flesh is dirt and of the earth and it shall return to dirt. Never heard that one before…“we need to go to Hades so we can have unhindered fellowship with the Lord“. Hades is part of this world, we are not of this world and the captives were set free from that bondage when Christ descended. Christ’s is in us and will never leave us, no need to go to Hades for a unhindered fellowship. God is God of the living not the dead (Mat 22:32-31). No waiting…2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Changed into Christ’s image (2 Co 3:18)…transfigured as Christ was to receive the eternal heavenly body. Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:…a body is required to be sacrificed for sin. Joh 8:51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. Joh 8:52 Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. Believe in Christ and you will never die.

Some try to tear Christ asunder saying… paraphrasing---"""His body was dead in the grave, His spirit returned to God, and His soul descended into hell""". His divinity would disallow such a thing, Christ was not merely a man and became the life giving Spirit (1 Co 15:45). Christ took our sins into His flesh body and died in the flesh but not in His spirit or soul. Christ was never a damned disembodied spiritless soul and neither will we be if we are members of His ascended Body. God the Father was in Christ on the cross (2 Co 5:19) via the Holy Spirit and He never left Him.

Believers when they leave the body are not dead, they received eternal life from the life giving Spirit and the Lord is that Spirit. 2Co 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 2Co 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Adam ate of the tree which gave him the knowledge of good and evil or the capacity to know he was sinful in the flesh. The act of eating the fruit did not make Adam sinful, it was disobeying God that sin entered the world. The penalty of sin is the process of physical death to all mankind, God did not say that Adam’s spirit would die but said dying you shall die (lateral translation Gen 2:17). God clarifies the meaning of what death Adam would die and the process of how he would die. Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; Gen 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. When Adam disobeyed in eating the fruit the process of physical death began. The word says sin is in the flesh (Rom 8:3), it does not say sin is in the spirit. Adam’s problem was his flesh which gave him the desire to sin (Gal 5:16-21). We know the spirit of man which came out of the Father is at war with the flesh and that the Holy Spirit communicates with our spirit at salvation (Rom 8:16). If we are born with a dead spirit it would be impossible for God to communicate with us. The spirit is God’s breath and a conduit for God’s Spirit and it can not die (Ecc 12:7). The soul is judged by the spirit or the flesh so walk in the spirit via the Holy Spirit..

Gen 1:27 So GodH430 createdH1254 (H853) manH120 in his own image,H6754 in the imageH6754 of GodH430 createdH1254 he him; maleH2145 and femaleH5347 createdH1254 he them. H6754 tselem tseh'-lem From an unused root meaning to shade; a phantom, that is, (figuratively) illusion, resemblance; hence a representative figure, especially an idol: - image, vain shew.

If you are saying the spirit is the breath of life that God placed in Adam at creation, how then can a soul live when the breath of life is dead?

I don’t believe Adam (mankind) lost the (express) image of God because he never had it. Christ was born of a woman in the image of Adam (man) and became a life giving Spirit in the image of God. Image is begotten from a seed which produces likeness. In Adam’s case the seed was God’s word (breath of life - spirit) placed in a vessel of dirt and Adam was born in the flesh in his own image… the image of man…Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image. The flesh is from the ground and is as dirt and the dirt flesh can receive a seed (Spirit) and be born again. In Christ’s case the seed was God’s Spirit not the seed of man but born of a women in man’s image, Jesus was God in a body of flesh thus did not need to be born again. Adam like all of mankind needed to be born again of the Spirit. Born again was not possible until Christ became the life giving Spirit when he returned to the Father and then descended as Spirit to indwell us giving us eternal life through the process of being born again of the Spirit. To have the image of God all mankind must be born of the Spirit not born in the flesh. When God said …let us make man in our own image it was fulfilled in Christ not Adam.