cjrose

Well you have shown this by example. Now, if morality is based on the indivitual heart, then that means, that morality can be bent and twisted, so there for if ones moral standard murder, or adultery is ok, then by that ones moral standard is it made right? Now, lets look at morality in General, Jesus is the way to morality, not only on a social level, but he edifies the heart. You do not know Jesus, so you have no clue what it means to be refined. I honestly think Ghandi was cast into outer darkness, if he didn't accept the Lord, It is possible in my understanding that he was forgiven if he accepted Jesus in his heart, I don;t concider Ghandi an acception to the rule, God is God, he doesn't change, he provided one way to heaven, Not 2 not 3 , not a thousand, just one. Define righteous in your own words? and more of a righteous martyr then Jesus? well if you knew jesus then you would change your opinion, Jesus didn't let himself die so he can be worshiped, he let himself die to prepare the way for our salvation, and also fulfilled countless prophecies about how he died. Now, whats more righteous? preparing the way for salvation, or putting your life on the line to save many? it comes down to save many, or save all eternaly. I woul dhave to say, saved all eternaly was more righteous, and Honestly we do not go to heaven by our own works, cause God has given us all over to disobedience, so he may have mercy on all, and bring life to all who accept it. Now as far as Ghandi's religion, Now your perception is very limited to your understanding, You see Jesus as a historical figure, I see Jesus work in my life every day, and he still strongly is just as a active today as he was, Now, Ghandi isn't in the same realm of Jesus, Now, what you don't understand, Jesus didn't die on the cross to be worshiped, he died on the cross to set us free. Look at this passage This was written 700 years before Jesus walked the earth, and it is an extreemly accurate prophecy. Isaiah 53 1 Who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? 2 For He shall grow up before Him as a tender plant, And as a root out of dry ground. He has no form or comeliness; And when we see Him, There is no beauty that we should desire Him. 3 He is despised and rejected by men, A Man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. And we hid, as it were, our faces from Him; He was despised, and we did not esteem Him. 4 Surely He has borne our griefs And carried our sorrows; Yet we esteemed Him stricken, Smitten by God, and afflicted. 5 But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed. 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; We have turned, every one, to his own way; And the LORD has laid on Him the iniquity of us all. 7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted, Yet He opened not His mouth; He was led as a lamb to the slaughter, And as a sheep before its shearers is silent, So He opened not His mouth. 8 He was taken from prison and from judgment, And who will declare His generation? For He was cut off from the land of the living; For the transgressions of My people He was stricken. 9 And they made His grave with the wicked

I strayed for too many years , that I truely need Instruction from God DAILY. I can relate and most definately resemble that statement back at ya

Oh I'm not worried

I strayed for too many years , that I truely need Instruction from God DAILY. I can relate and most definately resemble that statement

What mortal man percieves as contradictory, mighty man who has come into the light of the Lord by his own invitation in taking the first step to soar beyond the worldly understanding which causes doubt that leads to disbelief and ultimately denying themselves of the gifts God so generously gives to believers. One is faith. Faith in what we cannot see transforms us for starters. It may be a profoundly moving experience in a physical manifestation when the gift of the Holy Spirit awakens mans dead spirit and brings him out of the darkness and into the light. The light of Jesus whom we have surrendered our hearts, minds, soul, spirit, to His control. You see the word "control" and most likely narrow the eyes... shake of the head and shrug it off because mortal man is in control of his destiny. This control is not like a worldly control of the person such as a parent or spouse. It is a divine intervention offered to all mankind out of an infinite love. God's love. By choosing to believe that the Word of God is truth, that Jesus paid a precious price for our eternal salvation in His death on the cross, that He was then resurrected and ascended into Heaven and through a personal relationship we inherit citizenship in the Kingdom eternal. This spiritual re-birth is the begining of a journey of awareness, miracles, the building of character through obedience and complete trust. This mortal man who became mighty man is given the understanding of Gods Word. Not just understanding but comprehension beyond what mortal man can even fathom. Our surrender by believing is observable evidence in mighty man, awakened in Spirit results in ways that mortal man who does not understand nor comprehend, is a truly humbling experience. Now, if you read this again you will find what may appear as a contradiction. How can mighty man be humble when the word "mighty" creates an imagery of power and strength so how can man be mighty and humble at the same time. As "humble" may be associated with weakness. Soooo strength and weakness can be percieved in contradiction. This is where it becomes murky. Hmmm why give up all worldly things to become weak in our humbleness? This is the moment we weigh our benefits on the proverbial scale as to what is required of us to believe and is the scale tipping in God's favor or our own. In complete trust our faith grows as does our understanding of God's Word, our daily bread, our nourishment, lacking nothing in that the Bible speaks to us. Instructs us. Guides us. Comforts us. We, meaning a non believer and a true believer, can read the same words but see them in the light of knowledge because His Spirit is within us where those who use the Bible as a means of research simply to plant the seeds of doubt where the Lord's seeds are planted out of love and goodness. So many use "contradiction" as an acceptable means to what they do not understand. Those see and comprehend not in goodness but to ridicule Christianity. It is a simple matter of taking the first step in that you are puzzled. Why are you puzzled? Is it because you faintly hear the knock but are not yet ready to relinquish life as you know it and welcome a life of discovery, acceptance of evidence within, change? The very fact you are puzzled raises questions though you are somewhat vague in your statements such as what are your questions, specifically other than you acknowledge that even intelligent people believe and why do we believe? And what is it specifically that you find contradictory. Post a list and Worthy will respond. Read Worthy's statement of faith that Christians live by.

me too!! Me three! Proverbs 10:17 He who keeps instruction is in the way of life, But he who refuses correction goes astray.

If you're repeating what this Dr. Muncaster has written, then I would seriously question his qualifications, formal or informal, to lend insight to these matters. From the little information I have found on the web, it appears he's an intelligent guy, yet apparently his religious convictions must be seriously clouding his scientific judgment. For he is a vehement young-earth creationist and anti-evolutionist who can't seem to make up his mind whether to follow atheism or Christianity, two wholly illogical and unscientific worldviews. It's easy to be mislead by folks who pass off misinformation as generally-accepted facts, especially when you haven't much relatively unbiased information available to you. However, I do not want to let this post go unanswered. I do not know of any "recent breakthroughs in science" which have changed the way the scholarly community appraises the truth or error of any Biblical passages. I would therefore remain skeptical of any such claims without citation of specific examples. Also, even if the statement is accurate, and there have been such breakthroughs, that is by no means evidence of the universal truth of the Bible as a whole. What individual scientists think is of value, but, being people, they must be listened to in the context of the consensus, majority, or controversy. At this time, however, the majority agrees that the Bible contains no scientific truths not already understood by humans at the time of its writing. Now, when you say that "evolutionists" are attacking the Bible, that is technically true but somewhat misleading. There have been attempts in peer-reviewed literature to discredit certain claims in the Bible, but this is done in a search for the truth, not with venomous anti-Christian spirit. Outside of the scholarly community, of course, there is much zealous rhetoric on both sides. Creationism is often defended by attacking the opposing view--usually beginning with macroevolution. Often the claim is made that there is no proof for the scientific conclusions on the matter. This accusation, of course, is patently untrue. The proof that macroevolution did indeed occur is abundant, clear, and well-established. Objections are made, of course, that there is still room for doubt; indeed, if the proof were so obvious, why would not everyone accept it? Unfortunately, this line of reasoning stems from a misinterpretation of "proof" to mean "absolute proof," of which there is no single example in all the world. Non-absolute proof, therefore, the sort with which we are sadly forced to deal, can be defined borrowing legal terminology: that which is beyond reasonable doubt. So sure, one can reject the overwhelming body of evidence in support of macroevolution (which on the internet is probably best discovered through the talk.origins archive, if anyone demands to see it), but it would not be sensible or logical--that is, reasonable--to do so. Another claim which is often batted around is that the Bible has been "confirmed" by archaeology and other scientific pursuits. Nothing could be further from the truth. While many specific passages have been accepted by historians as accurate, many others fly in the face of established scientific conclusions. The creation story is a great example of this; the deluge is another. In the mean time, the Bible even contradicts itself (1Ch 3/Mt 1/Lk 3, e.g.)--not absolutely, of course (cf. the previous paragraph), but clearly enough to prove itself errant. Moreover, a great bulk of the Bible remains historically uninvestigated for lack of additional evidence. I expect you to repeat these opinions again, despite my disapproval thereof, but I hope at the very least you stop calling them "facts" when they are most certainly no such thing. Why is it that my resources "this" Muncaster... are not valid and yours are? The world, so tiny when viewed from oh, say a space shuttle, and compared to such endless dark space, with that thought, a tiny planet called earth, looks less powerful in context. You don't see the homeless, the poor, those who are struggling, the humble, the sorrow or pain, violence, abuse, that tarnishes a seemingly successful decent life and filling it with whatever fills a want often mistaken as a need. But seeing earth with a design where the mountains are, streams and rivers, oceans and lush green pastures woven together with a purpose in His design down to the tiniest insect. These are for our rejuvination and enjoyment. You speak many words and well written. Impressive perhaps to some. I am with your composition and style that is. With all your knowledge and resources, science mans attempt to explain the unexplainable so to further the arguement, all of the worlds mysteries must have a critical purpose, a purpose that rejects Creation and Higher Power, God, and labels what is unexplainable with "mythology" or our coming into being as flesh and bone, not to mention our unique and individual blueprint, just happened through an explosion. Atomic Structure, Nuclear Chemistry, Atomic Quantum numbers and orbitals, Thermodynamics and so on is a discovery of how intricate our makeup is down to the last hair on our heads and how precise the elements are in that a shift one way could throw off the balance of oxygen, gravity, etc.. Your statement that a great bulk of the Bible remains historically uninvestigated is because all of mankind, the earth, the universe is a work in progress and it is the mystery in what non believers percieve as lacking or false, mythological, a series of fairy tales, are not capable of understanding, comprehension, that what is being investigated and has been for centuries, is hope, believing in God's promises. Faith is a powerful gift. I'll stop using the word "facts" if you do We don't put our faith in what we can see, feel, touch or smell and the worlds so called "facts" are truths to believers. The word "facts" even is so lacking any sense of human emotion and sounds rather sterile. But "Truth and Wisdom" is our evidence through our own transformation. See it as you will. Label your point of view as the only point of view if you must. But these attempts to tackle the challenge of how we came into "life" is already answered for us where those who deny continue to search for answers when it's all right there in huge numbers of languages, transcending over time, a Bestsellar that is timeless. Despite your "disapproval" we are not here to succumb to "disapproval" and in our humble spirit appear to be weak or ignorant... now that is a myth indeed! Your disapproval is not new or unigue to Christians. Despite your disapproval, we will continue to stand firm in our Faith. Peace

You misunderstood what I was saying: It doesn't matter what Josephus thought. He was in no position to decide whether or not the book was authentic. At any rate, it appears he did no such thing. Also, doubt you're correct about there being as many Christian as non-Christian scholars. I would suspect there are many more of the latter. Are you just guessing, or did you actually hear that from some reputable source? I do have hard evidence: remarks in the text describing events from c.164 BC. Also, there are linguistic similarities between the Aramaic of Daniel and the Aramaic of other second-century BC authors. It is debunked by the observed laws of nature and the precedent set by other so-called prophets. Never in all of history has anyone accurately and consistently foretold events of the future. If I were to, say, find a old manuscript bearing the name of Nostradamus, which claimed to predict the events of Waterloo, I would conclude that it had not been written by Nostradamus, but instead an anonymous forger living after 1815. It all comes down to what we call the "best explanation." Which is more likely: that an anonymous author falsely attributed retro-active predictions to the prophet Daniel, or that Daniel actually predicted the future so precisely? In the opinion of most, the answer to that question is clear as a bell. Linguistic and external evidence (which also supports a late date, by the way) is just icing on the cake. Why does it matter? Well, if this is what it takes to satisfy you, then check out W. Sibley Towner. Again, you seem to have missed my point. Your quote from Harvardhouse innanely proclaimed, "liberal scholars acknowledge that the textual style and linguistics for the book of Daniel supports that it was written centuries before the Dead Sea Scrolls community came to exist." That is just completely untrue, unless it refers to the first six chapters only, in which case it is misleading if not intentionally deceptive. Hence my request that you give a supporting example. You would say? Based on what? In my experience, the majority of literature on the subject which has passed peer review has been non-Christian. Why must a second-century BC Jewish text be written in Greek, especially if it was meant to masquerade as a sixth-century-BC text? Josh, I understand your concerns, but you really need to understand that most non-Christians do not have a vehement anti-Christian bias, especially in the realm of academia. Despite the volume of press coverage given to public personalities such as Richard Dawkins, the majority of scholars are highly successful in their strivings for an unbiased approach to historical inquiry. The community has a reliable system of peer review which keeps in check the opinions of extremists on either side of a given field. I urge you to reconsider its conclusions. hatsoff, you have a firm grasp on human knowledge, you are eloquent in your writing and I must applaud your effort in research. However, I must ask this burning question: why do you and many others who visit these forums for a time, seek so determinedly to present your views of opposition, very detailed perspective indeed, and not see the infinite wisdom in the Word? I suppose a more accurate question would be, why? Why do go to such great lengths to oppose? Seriously, what does it benefit you? Do you feel satisfaction, pride? What need does taking the time to state your case fulfill? I have been in the Word nearly all day today and discovering new messages that speak to me daily that are profoundly connected to a conversation I may have had yesterday or some motherly wisdom for my children that has a direct link to whatever book I may open it to. An example of this would be... my son is always grumpy through this last year of junior high. I picked him up from school and he grumbled and knitted his brows together, slumped in the seat and crossed his arms over his chest. After several attempts to lighten the mood, suddenly, this burst of wisdom came in rapid fire and it was the Lord speaking to my son through me, giving me the words to say to reach inside his hard little shell. I spoke to him of seeing his predicament from a different perspective. Experience through trauma is a lesson. In every lesson is a truth and in every negative there is a positive. Our character is developed through our experiences. Seek what is freely given as truth and shift your perspective to find the message and how can I apply this as a positive in life. This was a couple of days ago. During the last 48 hours or so, I've seen countless messages in music, worship, fellowship, and what do ya know? I opened my Bible today with no real agenda, allowing the pages to lead me to His Word which not only connects each confirmation of my window of wisdom to my son, and what do I find but numerous passages directly related to the conversation we had (mostly one sided) My point is, and I do have one, is if you listen with your heart not your mind as so many are mislead with mans knowledge when all is said and done, the effort you have given to disprove and "correct" us, could very well enlighten and disprove what solid facts are from where? Mankind's limited definitions published specifically for non believers as yourself as "facts" to oppose the Truth and deny, deny, deny out of who knows why, what gives the billions of like minded believers in Christ, a peace and joy that transcends beyond what we think we know as mortal man, spiritually dead. This explains why you research the Bible from a worldly perspective through the arrogance of a worldly view. But do you ever try looking beyond the words to find a message of truth that applies to your life? Because, I must say, if you want evidence that Jesus lives, do hang around a while. I am evidence as our Worthy family is evidence. These messages I receive from the Word of God happen often, sometimes in rapid fire. Is it coincidental? No Way! Can you set your pride aside and see the true meaning of what you are reading for a purpose not of an adversary but one of a deeper awareness that just might give life to your spirit and find true knowledge. I could go through and quote passages but my own personal lessons may influence what it is you need to know. I know, Iknow, very presumptious of your character aren't I? This isn't a personal attack. Many of you come and go here at Worthy and start out as you have only to either come to find a mutual respect or show their true colors with sarcasm and witty, but not humorous retorts until they either disappear or are banned. As a non believer on a Christian forum with an agenda, I am truly not making this personal. With that, I will just say that you are here for a reason. Your counter replies are not going to sway a mature and obedient believer but may cause doubts for new believers. So, this reply to your many responses in this thread comes in peace to do as I am commanded to do and that is simply to plant a seed. It is now for you, today, tomorrow, 10 years from now, find yourself amazed and transformed by a tiny seed. Actually many seeds are scattered here. Where they fall is in the Lord's hands and His timing. Prov. 16:9; A man's heart plans his way; but the Lord leads his steps. Peace

awwe

My Real name is Christopher_John Yeah, suuuure it is! See...it works like a champ...use your real first name and middle name and people think it's a phony name... Buck is buying it hook, line and sinker... Peace CJ hey, we have the same initials Claudia Jane

John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: Amen!!!

me too!!

I think this is the first time I've actually seen George reply to any post on these boards. I was beginning to think he was a bot himself, with his tactic of 'hit and run' posting in the news section yous a funny one!!

My Real name is Christopher_John Yeah, suuuure it is! buckthesystem, you crack me up!

I guess that accusation could cut both ways I was thinkin' that very thing!

What are flaws to non believers are solid truths to believers. The more time you ( general ) attempt to find an answer to our "flawed" belief, the further from the truth you grow when the truth is right before you. JA, welcome back and great OP

You say that you are not saying it's true or isn't yet you laugh. What purpose would it serve for this to be an untruth? God does not lie. Much of science is all based on man's falliable theories, logic, thought etc... Prophecy is still in the process so claiming it to be false is false in itself. We haven't seen the end yet and it is finished when "It is done." So sayeth the Lord.

((((((((((((((((((brother Joe))))))))))))))))))))))

God Bless you. I have lost nearly all my family over the years, grandparents, parents, aunts, uncles, cousins, tragic and unexpected deaths of friends in their youth including my brother who was 17 and brutally and premeditatedly murdered by what I can only describe as animals without remorse over the years, but it has been over 30 years since Marty's death and I have long since forgiven those who commited his murder. We were very close. He was my hero, my protector, friend and disciplinarian with a sense of humor and though he was involved in some things that were considered against the law, I know that during the three hours he lay there riddled with shotgun bullets before death that the Lord enveloped him and have faith we will meet again. The grief and mourning of his loss was the greatest trial I had to endure in life and though I do miss him still, the pain of loss has now become the hope of a joyful reunion and that God allowed this to happen for a reason. I accept that, let go of resentment, anger and revenge associated with such a tragedy and it has given me strength in the surrender of destructive emotions we tend to bury and hang on to for some reason like a child with a blanket but eventually grow and have to give it up or become "stuck" in fear and anxiety. Marty, not a day goes by I don't think of you. CJ I can so identify, having lost my brother suddenly too! We were very close too! I'm so sorry sis mayhaps you could tell us about it or PM me if you are willing to share. I have not once come across paths of anyone who has lost a brother and would love to know your story.

Like you, I did some study of other religions, self help type "empowering yourself for success, be your own god, you're in control" type thing which led to more study regarding some of the more highly visible "religions" and do I dare name them, not at this time. That is a whole new topic for discussion in itself. Suffice it to say, some truly believe they are following Jesus when in the upper eschalon of senior members, what goes on behind closed doors is a completely different, cultish behavior so in essence, they preach to the congregation they call the church when really it is a huge lie and no, not going to mention this particular, renown, man made, world wide "religion." I would say I wanted to be ready should I cross paths with an individual and having some knowledge of what they are about. I have tons of books on cults, world religions and such. But that was when I was a baby in Christ. They have since gathered dust since the only truth I need is God's Word. I'm surprised too but I may have read something and from what I am reading about them is such nonsense that it was a fleeting thought, discarded out of sheer insanity. Wow... firstly, a red flag when talk of aliens from another planet claiming their ownership of the origin of life, secondly, I would imagine the Japanese would find that statement about an alien walking down a street in Japan and not being noticed, an insult to their integrity and intellect. I lived in Nagoya Japan for a little over three months. I lived and worked among them and why Japanese? Everywhere there are people of different cultures that immigrated from other countries from Japan to Africa, Vietnam, Europe, Mexico... you name it, we got it. I have dark hair and almond shaped eyes but the Japanese most definately noticed me thirdly and I repeat myself, even satan can disguise himself as an angel of light, walk in harmony and peace to lure many towards himself. Another red flag here is that the guy used his own name for himself, I mean really, Rael, Rael-eins? This has got to be the top of desperation to gain power and be his own god in a sense by establishing his following. It is so nonsensical it's funny. This guy had to be on some serious LSD or something. Thanks for info

Oh, I just noticed this part unless you were editing while I was taking forever to post my rambling replies yes, EST very scary but not at the time of being involved. At first it was empowering but like any untruth not of God, will eventually lose the power, the emptiness will return because it is a man made organization started with the idea of one man and developing it, refining it, and teaching his underlings to go out and get more people, somehow planting the notion that yes, it is costly for the seminar but do what you have to do to get the money to pay and then one continues to pay and pay and pay and not only with $$ but a false sense of self control. Seriously deceptive. It's really par for the course with cults. The most successful ones seem to be those that that give the greatest sense of empowerment or purpose. I studied such things a bit when I took psychology, and it's downright scary how people can be manipulated. I'm surprised you never heard of the Raelians, as they were all over the news a few years back. They were pretty big in Quebec a few years ago, and they claim to have 60,000 members worldwide. Here's their statement of belief from their site: They basically think Mankind's destiny is to use human cloning to seed other planets, and therefore become Gods ourselves. No, I don't understand it either. I added the bit in my edit there because I had a similar discussion before, and an overly sensitive type read things into what I said that weren't really there. Just figured I'd head any potential problems off at the pass This is funny. "We were the ones who designed all life on earth" - Really? So couldn't you have done without making us DIE? What a crappy design. My God tells me its my fault I die, but you're telling me its YOUR FAULT. So explain your crappy designs or fess up that you made a mistake. "You mistook us for gods" - It would've been a good idea for you not to pine yourself off as Gods. The simple statement "We're not gods" would've been sufficient. Duh. "We were at the origin of your main religions" Really? So you're creating multiple belief systems? Only thing can be the truth at at time. Thanks for all the chaos and confusion. "Now that you're mature enough..." Yeah? So why didn't you help us mature by telling us that a) you're not gods, and b) not creating a bunch of belief systems, and c) why the heck did you abandon us in the first place? You might also wanted to have warned us about the dangers of uranium enrichment and nuclear weapons. You know what? You're full of crap. Maybe on your planet someone came to you and tried to peddle this crap, and you fell for it, but here on earth, we actually have something called logic. Go Home ET. Wait, hold on a sec and take a breath before you reply with ugly insults along with the choice of verbage. Saturn wasn't claiming that he adopted the Raeliens insanely ridiculous ( maybe drug induced the creativity of "Rael" like Hmmm Alice in Wonderland ) tale of such an experience and to actually have such a large and must say, lost, number of followers is baffling. I believe Saturn was answering my question on who are Raeliens. If your your reply is directly at him, I'd say an apology might be the mature thing to do. If your post is directed to these "Raeliens" then disregard. I would appreciate it though if you could clear it up either way with a pretty please to boot

I would really love to understand these statements. Maybe it's just lack of sleep or something but I can't make any sense here at all. Can you further explain your point?

Oh, I just noticed this part unless you were editing while I was taking forever to post my rambling replies yes, EST very scary but not at the time of being involved. At first it was empowering but like any untruth not of God, will eventually lose the power, the emptiness will return because it is a man made organization started with the idea of one man and developing it, refining it, and teaching his underlings to go out and get more people, somehow planting the notion that yes, it is costly for the seminar but do what you have to do to get the money to pay and then one continues to pay and pay and pay and not only with $$ but a false sense of self control. Seriously deceptive. I never gathered that you were comparing religion to cults unless I missed some posts.

God is not just our Lord Jesus in the flesh but also the Holy Spirit so there again, one in three, the Holy Trinity. I like your verbage in reference to both God Himself and God in the flesh, fully human and fully God at the same time would be both natural and supernatural. However, though Jesus was born of a virgin birth and grew just like all human beings do, He was emodied with a sinless nature and the root purpose to come and preach the good news of salvation. He performed such miracles for a purpose and spoke of truths in parables to multitudes. His strength and endurance is beyond what any mortal man could endure not to mention the loss of blood. The blood of the Son of Man, sacraficed for all mankind. The ultimate sacrafice that paid for our sins if we seek Him and invite Him into our hearts giving over all control. The price He paid was our gain. satan is the anti christ once unleashed to take his final power over the earth and God will give him great supernatural powers already knowing that he will use them to decieve many performing miracles for the sole purpose to gain trust in those that follow him. satan is bound at this time though his spirit roams the earth like the serpent, causing doubt, confusion, anything he can do to 1, turn Christians away from God or keep those not yet believers to further turn away from God either in rejection, denial, complete disbelief in any supernatural higher power, but he is not omni omni omni as God is and not everywhere always. satan has power only because God allows it. satan will come to rule and ultimately destroy in a charming, attractive in appearance, cunning, self serving, prideful, powerful and essentially evil. In fact, look for a new post on "A Portrait of the Adversary" his character, work, all with scripture references and hopefully that will give you another perspective on satan and why God gives him such power. This is true, however, working alone, for themselves and deceiving people and now using Jesus for their own profit isn't much different in the root existence as any cult organization. They are their own power, their own source for answers where cult organizations answer to one leader usually as from what I have seen, there is one to be accountable to in following the the order of the process to the letter. Like the food chain. Essentially, working alone to decieve for profit and self serving, or involved in a large group and also being decieved for a profit. In regards to the parents of the missing boy convinced by a psychic of such a tragedy is why the Lord commands us to stay away. For our protection. Cults usually don't advertise Hey, Cult here, sign up today! What is appealing to those who seek answers for what they experience as an emptiness in their lives, are drawn into the attractive self power, self, self, self, self centeredness seeking a false teaching of our own power. Now, don't get me wrong, it is essential to come to know and love yourself as God loves you but not in the way of a self righteous, ambitious in a destructive way... I'm not explaining this very well but I hope you are with me here and I kind of sense that you are And then there are those others who are content in their successful achievements, happy in their personal relationships, believe their are gods in the elements, accumulate "things" put their trust and faith only in themselves with a pat on the back. Again, being successful and achieving goals is not wrong but admirable if along the way the prideful become the humble in the realization that their success can be used to help others instead of coveting "stuff" that will decay over time, get old, become replaceable, really insignificant. Okay I won't I can sense your aversion to it and I think that is putting it mildly What, Who are Raelians. That is one I have never heard of, ever. Peace