amdntstr

It has been said by Nasrallah and other terrorist leaders, that they support Jewish immigration to Israel. It saves them the trouble of having to travel abroad to kill the Jews. Make no mistake, their plans are to annihilate Israel and the remaining Jews worldwide. Agreed!! This quote here from the New York Times is just one example of America's left wing media's stance on Israel HUH?? Are they really talking about a religion that believes in their core that everyone but Muslims are "infidels"? Or that Christians are now having to leave the Muslims countries out of fear for their lives? http://contenderministries.org/islam/interview.php I found this link very informative: http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsourc...ory/jewref.html

Yes actually they do!! Here are some links that contains their own words concerning the "Zionist mindset" http://conservechristian.blogspot.com/2006...stening-to.html

Well for Christians what is our sacrifice to God? and what is our altar? Hebrews 13: 10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle. 11 For the bodies of those beasts, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned without the camp. 12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate. 13 Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach. 14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come. 15 By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name. 16 But to do good and to communicate forget not: for with such sacrifices God is well pleased. 17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you. Altar (from strong's biblical concordence) the altar for slaying and burning of victims used of the altar of whole burnt offerings which stood in the court of the priests in the temple at Jerusalem the altar of incense which stood in the sanctuary or the Holy Place any other altar metaph., the cross on which Christ suffered an expiatory death: to eat of this altar i.e. to appropriate to one's self the fruits of Christ's expiatory death Hope this helps.

OK!! What do you do??? Depends on what your goal is. Is your goal to make her do what you want by keeping her family from her? This is only going to push her further away from Christ. Is your intention to being her into knowlege of Christ? and the freedom we have in Christ? See, it is not our job to either convict or convince others, that is the job of the HS. Our responsiblity is to know when to speak the Word and when to keep silent. Don't forget the power of prayer. Quite a few exwitches will tell you that it was so and so praying and loving them is what brought them out of witchcraft and to Christ. It is what brought me back to Christ. That and the Word I was force fed when I was younger. Truth of the matter was, it wasn't until I decided that I wasn't gonig to be anything!! Not a Christian, not a pagan, and not active as an exChristian, that the Truth finally stuck with me. Most of the gentiles in the OT were pagan (or what you would consider witches). They worshipped the same gods and goddesses (most do not even believe in satan, much less know that they are actually worshipping him and his co horts). They do not believe that they are doing something wrong, they believe that it is truth. We know differently, but they do not. Paul was sent to minister to them. Remember, God loves them and so should we. He wants her to come to Him and know Him. Christ died for her as well. My advice? Pray, speak the Word, and as the HS to guide you.

I am one of those who have a horrible mother, and that is being nice about it. Forgiveness is needed, true, I do not argue that. But it wasn't until the HS took in hand and worked with me on this that I was able to let go of the anger, hurt, and bitterness. This is my mother: http://sonandthemoon.10.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=542 So you see I am not saying lightly that I have a horrible mother. One of the biggest things I had against her was the fact that she gave birth to me. I just could not (and still can't) understand why she planned me and had me just to put me through hell. I hated her for that. Before I was able to forgive her, as far as I was concerned she was dead. She was dead to me, I never wanted to hear her name or to ever have anything to do with her. I used to fantasize about literally danceing on her grave. I told you I was bitter and so very hurt. Mothers day was a day for mothers and since I considered that I no longer had one, she was ignored. Once the HS taught me how to forgive her, I respect her as my mother, a person that God loves, and as my elder. I still do not buy her a mother's day card (no particular reason why, I just do not think about it), but I will call her and wish her a mother's day. We have a relationship that is controled by me. I believe that just because I forgive her does NOT in anyway mean that I have to forget or put myself into a position where she can ever hurt me again, either mentally or physically or in anyother way.

{{{HUGS}}} and God Bless you as well!

end admnstr quote So are you saying that it is okay for Christians to entertain any dealings with the deceiver in this manner? And what supports your reasoning here? If we are told by God not to give satan a foothold into our lives and this could be a route in, why would anyone even consider supporting it? God's word IS black and white, there is no grey area. Especially where satan is concerned. No not at all!!! Sorry you misunderstood me. No I do not allow yugio(sp), harry potter, or even Narnia and LOTR, in my house!! I totally agree with you. I was simply dispelling the myths that witches manipulate people and that they know that they are playing with demons. Let me explain a little about myself and then maybe you might understand where I am coming from. I am an ex-witch. I co run a site for exwitches, I run my own site for exwitches, I am also a moderator on another board moderating the occult section of that board. Never would I ever say that doing this or being a witch is anything but against God. I am simple stating that witches need salvation as well. They are decieved and do not understand the danger and evil that they are dealing with. I am also against those who claim to be "christian witches". You can not be both. Remember, I was talking about a witches point of view in my post, NOT a christians. Considering that I stated that the demons do not show their true colors to the witches until they convert and try to get rid of the demons, this is when the witches/pagans really understand what they are dealing with. The persons quote that said that witches don't call them demons in public. I was simply saying that do not not believe that they are dealing with demons. I am still confused about what part of my post make you think that I believe that this glorifies God??? Just because I quote someone who is against yugio(sp) and show him where he was wrong on his belief on what witches believe, does not in any way mean that I do not agree that these things are evil. Where in the world did you get the idea that I think that this is a good thing?????? Here, these should help you to understand where I do stand on this: http://sonandthemoon.10.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=823 http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=20...211486237029951 (from my blog http://amdntstr.blogspot.com) http://sonandthemoon.10.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=418

So then, are you saying that demons as described in the bible are fantasy? Or that people who God loved enough to die for are actually the demons? The above examples are not demons as much as choices that we as humans make using what we know and the filter of our life experiences.

Demons can decieve and make things look good when they are bad, they can not control a believer. Witches do NOT manipulate people into becoming witches. Actually most do not believe in evangelizing or phophetizing. So many become witches for the same reason some become christians. In order to fill this hole inside of them or to escape those who are christians in name only. They stay because of the power. Understood and agree. I am attempting to dispell some of the myths that are associated with this because it does cause a panic and instead of drawing these witches/pagans to God it serves to push them further away. Remember we are to preach and save the lost, this includes pagans. The Romans and Gentiles in the NT were pagans/witches, Jesus died for them too. Actually, other than a small sect (really tiny) most pagans and witches do not believe that Satan or demons exist. Remember, Satan can show up as an angel of light. These people are decieved into believeing that these demons are gods and goddesses. They do not show themselves to be what we think demons should look like. Most do not realize what they really are until they convert to Christianity, this is when they really show themselves for what they are. They do not believe that they have to have ANYTHING to do their bidding. They believe that it is nature itself that is doing this, nature and them manipulating energies. (Yes they call it energy just like when they heal they call it energy) They believe that it is inate in this world. This is one of the biggest lures of the paths. They believe that THEY are doing this. They look to the "divine" for advice and guidence. And yes they do invite them into themselves. Yu Gi Oh is a slim surface of witchcraft but is one of many things to open doors of the occult. One of the things witches use to get people involved is certian key words like....open minded, closed minded, narrow minded..........also enlightenment. Agreed!!

As the church is obedient to God we must be obedient to our husbands. But lets not stop there, as Jesus loves the church husbands are to love their wives as they love themselves. This does not mean that he is to lord over us as if we are slaves. God and His Word comes first before the husband.

I don't think the reference to "the old religion" is specific to Gardnerian Wicca but to witchcraft and paganism in general. There is no "right way" within Wicca (each does as they prefer) so to even imply that there was a right way would be misleading. there were common practices that were passed down largely through families and Gardner may have formalized everything and modernized it, but I wouldn't really use the terms "made up". Ecceltic Wicca maybe a hodgepog of whatever works, but not true wicca. Most pagans will tell you the same thing that it was made up from pieces of others such as crowley. Yes, Wicca is and was "made up" by Gardner. I on't know many pagans that believe differently and I speak to them on a daily basis both on my sites as well as interfaith sites. This is what they told me while I was researching wicca and paganism. There have also been many books out that prove my point further. There isn't any true "old paths" around anymore. If there were then we would still be seeing sticks turned into snakes and such things that are described in the OT. Actually it would be stronger not weaker.

I thought the left and right hand paths were unique to Satanism. Nope!! Not at all.

Ahh. but there instead of black or white magick there is the left and right hand paths. There are HUGE differences between the two. Different teminology, but same meaning. Actually as I understand it according to Gardner Wicca is an "old religion" and pre existed BEFORE christianity. That this is what true Garnerian witches believe. This being the logic, it has nothing to do with not knowing about these other religions, but rather holding on to the old. As a pagan I know that wicca is a new religion made up by gardner and quite a bit was pieced together from others works. I do agree with the last line. It all depends on whether or not there was any intent. Just like aromatheropy is ok for a christian, because there isn't any intent to it. Ephesians 5 compares the relationship a husband and wife has to our relationship to Christ. Submitting to your husband does not equal us being "property". Everybody gets so upset over the submit that they seem to leave out the rest of the Word has to say. Look at the difference between the men of the 40's and the men of today. They were much stronger then (I do not mean physically). It seems as if each passing generation the men are getting weaker. To tell you the honest truth, I was one of the women who swore that I would never be ruled by a man, I would never submit or give over control. Yes, I am a recovering control freak. But I found that I didn't respect a man who let me control everything as well after years of what seemed one crisis after another, I found my husband. He just turned 50 and he is of a generation where men were raised stronger than those in my generation. (I am in my late 30's) We fought the first few years like cats and dogs. I was convicted by the HS about my marriage and the relationship I have with my husband. For me it came down to trust, I had to trust him. I am now an Ephesians 5 wife. Not much has changed in how the house is run and most of the decisions are still mine to make (He drives for a living and is only home 24 hours a week) but he took over some of the decisions (financial and such). To tell you the truth, it is nice for once to be able to lean on someone, to not have to be the one who has to worry about everything. I praise God that my husband is stronger than I am and that his shoulders are bigger. I am married to an unbeliever. I married him before I gave my heart back to God. He married a pagan and ended up with a Christian. Because his ex did nothing but nag him, had his children telling him he was going to hell all of the time, and it being pushed in his face all of the time, he has a very low opinion of Christians. When I told him that I was going back to God, his two comments were: 1. Don't ask me to go to church and 2. Don't talk to me about it. The bible is very clear on this and for good reason. It basically says that we should let our actions speak louder than our words. 1 Peter 3 1 In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives, 2 as they observe your chaste and respectful behavior. 3 Your adornment must not be merely external--braiding the hair, and wearing gold jewelry, or putting on dresses; 4 but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God. I think that this is how we should be with any and all unbelievers. I have kept my promise to my husband and I have not brought it up, HE HAS!! This gave the opportunity to speak what God had laid on my heart. This reminds me of a saying I remember from when I was little, don't hear it too much anymore, but I think that even though it is pretty corney it speaks the truth. You can catch more bees with honey than vinegar.

I am a liar huh??? As well as all those others I have spoken to??? HUmmmm That is my clue to exit this conversation. There is no need to insult because of differing opinions and if that is how you discuss issues, I will have no part in it. Have a blessed day. Deb

Hmm. Realy? Can you provide evidence to support this claim. Perhaps a survey that links the two together, or something? How about personal experience as well as other ex-high priests and high prietesses that will tell you the same thing?? Will that work for you? Just because you have never heard of it does not mean that it doesn't exist. Inspire what exactly?? facination in witchcraft as well as spells and such?? Great example for children. Well considering that satan's biggest lie is that he himself is nothing but fantasy?? Reality is based on the beholder. There are many out there who say that witchcraft is pure fantasy. Where is the line drawn?? But that is not what you should be telling them. Tell them it is wrong, and that "Fiction" books are just that. Fiction. Fantasy is Fantasy. Well duh!! But the fact still remains that it is full of witchcraft, what is the lesson?? That witchcraft isn't real?? Or that it is ok as long as it is termed fiction?? Actualy, these authors fruit are entertaining books that enspire creativity and show life lessons... Creativity and life lessons at any cost??? Is it really necessary to open children's eyes to this? IS this the only way to teach life lessons? Lessons? Depend on majic. Wonderful lesson In the LOTR and Potter some knowlege of witchcraft had to be known. Out of your heart your mouth speaks. So if their writings are all about witchcraft, fantasy or not, that will tell you what is in their hearts and where there mind stays. What are we suppose to think on? Php 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. The mirror? Enlighten me further. Show me some examples of these books that reflect magic in reality. Here you go: http://www.seekgod.ca/hpsymbols.htm I know. Because in LOTR the only ones to use witchraft are the wizards, who have that ability because they are devine. Just like in real life. And if you try to use magic and are not devine, you get corrupted and turn into a minion of Satan. Just like in real life. I disagree, but still you just brought up my point with the Potter books and movies. I do no understand the purpose of this. Simple, the person who said that Potter books were ok because the majic was used to do good. What is good or right in the eyes of the world doesn't make it good. Okay. This has what to do with the Fantasy genre? Also, do note that magic users who are not Wiccans exist. There are Arsutru, Satanists in their various forms, Generic Mages, Athiests, and even Christians, or those who say they are anyway. Those who are Christian and do it interpret the Bible differently, and claim to get their power from God. At any rate...yeah, Wiccans are not the only ones, and they are not even the ones anybody should care about. Really??? I know that there are many more. But I try to remember that I am not on one of my boards talking to those who know about these things. No offense to anyone, but I try to have my writing fit the audience. Just because you interchange the paths doesn't take away from the point. I know that there are some christians and some so called christian practices (contemplative prayer for one) tht are not of God, but that doesn't eliminate the wrongness of these books. Just because one thing is considered worse than another is no excuse to do it. That was the exact argument I used to keep smoking pot, it's not as bad as drinking.... Didn't make it right no matter how good that sounds. Imagination is evil? Christ must have been evil then, for putting wonderfull teachings into parable form. I don't think that Jesus used witchcraft in his parables. Besides, I didn't say that, the bible did: 2 Cor 10: 5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled. Romans 6: 19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness. 20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness. 21 What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death. 22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Gal 5: 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Romans 1: 28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; 29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. We sin in our minds before we ever take action. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/156414711...=books&v=glance http://www.greyschool.com/main.asp

You are correct. Not everyone who speaks to demons are actually possessed by them. These are not the spirits of their dead that they are talking to, but rather demon who are familiar with the dead when they were alive. Make sense?? Satan is out to decieve anybody and everybody that he can, this is just yet another way that he does so. Thing is though, until or unless SHE wants to get rid of them, there is nothing you can do. You can't tell a demon to stop talking to someone who wants to talk with it. You can however, control you house and what does or doesn't come into it. If she is determined to bring these things into your home, then you are right, do not let her in. I know that this sounds harsh, but you have to put yourself and your family first. We have free will. She has chosen these things and she has chosen to keep these things with her. My advice?? Give her the Word and let her go her own way. Let her know that if and when she ever decides to get rid of these things (because no they won't go willingly) then have her call you. Then just pray. Sometimes that is all you can do, pray. I know that when I rebelled I had to go my own way. There was nothing or nobody that was going to change my mind or stop me. Trust me many tried. It wasn't until I was ready to listen to the HS that I was able finally to reconcile to God.

As to the evidence that LOTR, Potter, or even TV shows such as charmed do not infuence kids to do such things, I must disagree!! Do you have any idea how many young people try to join covens because of these shows and books???? Hundreds and thousands. It opens the doorway to such things. Children's minds are not fully grown and they are not able to reason the way us as adults are able to. It is too easy to confuse a child. On one hand you tell him/her that witchcraft and spells and such are demonic and are against God, while on the other hand you tell them (by letting them read these books, or reading them yourself to them) that it is OK. Blurrying the issue of right and wrong?? Yes most definantly. I am surprised at some of the claims that these authors are "christians". or that this makes reading such things are ok. Just because somone makes a claim to the name DOES NOT make them a christian. Jesus says that you will know those who are His by their fruit. These authors fruit is witchcraft. Christian?? I do not think so. Even though these books are fantasy, they do have some elements of the real craft in them. The mirror is just one example. The LOTR is closer to real witchcraft than any of them. Most Wiccans are into saving the eco system. No that in itslef is not bad, but because they do something good, does it make them Godly or good in God's site?? No it doesn't, they are still witches. Wiccans believe in doing good to others, they can be seen as being good or doing good, yes that is true, but does that take away from the evil that casting a spell or worshipping ideols brings? NO All witchcraft or any idea, imagination, that puts itself above Christ is wrong and we should stay away from. anyways, thats my 2cents.

Ok, these are familar spirits and are called such because they are familar to us. When someone believes that they are speaking with the dead they are actually speaking to these spirits. Here are some biblical passages concerning these: Le 19:31 Regard not them that have familiar spirits, neither seek after wizards, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God. Le 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people. De 18:11 Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. 1Sa 28:3 Now Samuel was dead, and all Israel had lamented him, and buried him in Ramah, even in his own city. And Saul had put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of the land. 1Sa 28:9 And the woman said unto him, Behold, thou knowest what Saul hath done, how he hath cut off those that have familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of the land: wherefore then layest thou a snare for my life, to cause me to die? 2Ki 21:6 And he made his son pass through the fire, and observed times, and used enchantments, and dealt with familiar spirits and wizards: he wrought much wickedness in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger. 2Ki 23:24 Moreover the workers with familiar spirits, and the wizards, and the images, and the idols, and all the abominations that were spied in the land of Judah and in Jerusalem, did Josiah put away, that he might perform the words of the law which were written in the book that Hilkiah the priest found in the house of the LORD Isa 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead? Isa 19:3 And the spirit of Egypt shall fail in the midst thereof; and I will destroy the counsel thereof: and they shall seek to the idols, and to the charmers, and to them that have familiar spirits, and to the wizards. Strong's definition of familiar spirits: Strong's Number: 0178 Browse Lexicon Original Word Word Origin bwa from the same as (01) (apparently through the idea of prattling a father's name) Transliterated Word TDNT Entry 'owb TWOT - 37a Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech obe Noun Masculine Definition water skin bottle necromancer necromancer, one who evokes the dead ghost, spirit of a dead one practice of necromancy one that has a familiar spirit I believe that the HS will bring to our rememberance the Word that we know. Is it possible that the reason nothing came to you may have been because you don't know the verses in the Word that are speaking about this? I am not judging or assuming, only trying to help. I hope that this helps.

Agreed!! I will personally turn in illegal aliens. Only because it is right. There are ways to come into this country and there are way to not come into this country. My ancestors had to go through the system, I do know know why it would be right for anyone to disobey the law when there are alternatives. The easy way is not always the right way.