Knight

Eph, Just a comment here. You do realize that you've gotten from point A to B by way of point Z. Oh well, at least you got there.

This is intended to be a little wacky fun. What with all the recent threads where the tension could be cut with a knife I thought it helpful to inject a little mindless fun into the mix. As to my time you're probably right but it doesn't take long to type.

Come on people. This is for science (and fun.) Lighten up a little. Not every conversation has to be about titanic spiritual issues. I'll start: Fasten-Zip Right handed male.

tjw, You're inferring a lot that I did not say nor mean. I never suggested that we should deny someone the right to ask this question. I did express an opinion that I thought this was trying to read too much into the Word. I will not apologize for that as this thread was looking for opinions and theories. I also never said that it was meaningless. I contend that I don't think there is more to this number than the fact that it IS a lot of fish. John probably expressed the exact number to provide weight to the validity of the Gospel he was writing. This is significant in that he remembered the exact number of fish approximately 70 years after the events took place. (John wrote his Gospel around 100 AD.) That fact in itself tells me that God's Holy Spirit was at work in John when he penned the Gospel. In that respect, yes, the number is significant.

tjw, Ok, after reading the text I'll concede that point. I still don't think there was anything special about the number 153 other than it was a large amount of fish and the net should not have been able to hold it. There is nothing in the text to suggest that the number represented more than this.

Hey, One more idea on this subject. Perhaps a little more mundane than some others have postulated but here goes... Perhaps 153 was the limit of the nets they were using at that time. Maybe 154 fish would have overloaded the nets causing them to tear. This would, of course, vary depending on the size and weight of the fish in question but at that time 153 was the limit with the fish that were there. I still think it's a little extreme to read too much into this but if it's a theory you want then it's a theory you'll get.

In an effort to lighten the mood on the boards these days I've decided to post the following question to all the guys and (where applicable) gals. While getting dressed in the morning you're putting your pants on. How do you do it? Do you fasten then zip or zip then fasten? Please state your gender and favored hand (right or left) as we're attempting to determine if there is a statistical significance to these factors. PS: Bonus points for anyone who can figure out where I got this question.

Tatie, I don't know if this will help or not but this verse came to mind when I read your post. (Ok, and our paster preached on this yesterday.) Hope this helps. John 14 27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

Apology accepted, Lee. Humility I have and my mind is open but not to the point that my brains fall out. Just a note for future reference. BTW. If you're obsessed with correcting grammar there are those on the boards far worse than I. To paraphrase a famous doctor: "I'm an engineer not an english teacher." PS: This is my 153rd post. Strange ain't it?

Lee, So I can't spell. So sue me. LOL I stand by what I said though. Sometimes I think humans try to figure too much out. Maybe there's something to this and maybe not. I honestly don't know. I just wonder how someone decides that there might be something to this. That's all. I meant no offense.

Because God wanted there to be 153 fish. Honestly Eph, do we have to split the hairs this fine? No offense intended. Just wondering why this is on your mind.

Biscut, i never accused you of being mormon. I simply said that that philosophy sounded much like mormon theology. That's all.

This sounds very much like what mormons believe. That was not an attack merely an observation. The only advice I can give you is to read the Bible. Start at Genesis because that sets the foundation for everything else. God created the heavens and the earth. It does not say that he landed here. When God appeared to Moses at Mt. Sinai it was just that. He manifested in a physical way to show the Israelites that He was God. He did the same for Moses at the burning bush. As for Enoch. I believe you are referring to Elijah. 2 Kings 2:11 11 As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind. This means exactly what it says. When his time was over God chose to take Elijah to heaven in the form of a firey chariot. His sucessor Elisha was standing next to him at the time as a wittness. I hope this helps. If you have any further questions I'll do my best to answer.

Ok, I guess that didn't take as long as I thought it would. I found a website which illustrates the beliefs of spiritualism. (Sorry about the long post.) Needless to say this is another works based belief system. They claim that eternal paradise can be earned by works while denying the deity of Christ. I could make a long list of the other problems with this belief but these two are the core. It sounds like this person needs a good dose of New Testament Truth. The good news is that they apparently believe in God. Or at least the concept of a supreme being. That gives you a starting point. May the Lord bless your witness to this person. His will be done.

I'm not sure what manner of "spiritualism" this person is referring to. It sounds a little like the New Age movement. I will research this and get back to you.

Sorry, I got stuck on the "giving birth out their sides" comment. Such are the problems with having a visual imagination.

Never heard of it. Sounds good Xan. If we're going to have an Apologetics board it's about time we started talking about apologetics. Most of what has been going on here is either debate or Christian living. These are important issues but apologetics is about defending the faith. We need to be talking about that on this board as well as learning about the other cults out there. If we don't have an understanding about them we will not be properly equiped to provide a defense.

I'm afraid so Xan. I know a little of what Jipsah posted but I wanted to see if anyone else knew anything. I've looked at some apologetics websites and there seems to be precious little information out there about this. I did find some stuff at: www.watchman.org (Thanks Lan. ) I do not think it is a laughing matter though. I think any cult hat teaches something other than what is in the Bible needs to be addressed by Christians so that we can give an adequate defense. I would like to post a new topic each week on a different cult for discussion. What are the thoughts on this?

Scientology is one of the new age cults that has been attracting attention in recent years. It was founded by L. Ron Hubbard renown sci-fi author and has two well known actors as members. John Travolta and Tom Cruise. But does anybody know anything about it? What do they teach? What kind of doctrine do they follow? How do Christians defend the faith against them?

I, for one, believe them. Yes, I believe that they believe that humans were created by aliens. I also believe that humans can be a gulible species. I believe that the human capacity for stupidity is far greater than we would care to believe. This is simply one more example of this. This is not unprecedented in scripture. How many times in the OT did the Israelites forget God in favor of Baal and Asheroth? I know of several both before and after the time of the Kings. If God's chosen people can be that gulible then anyone can. Or, to put it a little less elloquently. They're a bunch of fruitcakes. (These cultists, not the Israelites.)

Excellent description munari. I've never had much difficulty recognizing God in His three manifestations. The trinity takes away none of His divinity and in fact adds to it. God The Father: Creator and sovriegn Lord of all. God The Son: Savior, redeemer, and teacher. God The Holy Spirit: Counselor. These are just some of the characteristics of the trinity. There are many more. It all comes back to God. He is, was, and ever shall be. He is the I AM. It is important not to tie Him down with human limitations. I am who I am and cannot manifest myself differently. He is not so limited.