Church of Christ: Cult,sect or true

[OnetrueGod]

The COC was formed in the 1830's from people who wanted to do throw off the differences of the denominations and unify under the simple message of the Bible. This, I believe, was a noble cause and something we should all try to do if we are ever to unify under Jesus Christ. Sometimes they are called Campbellites because of the the work that Thomas and Alexander Campbell did during the founding of this group. However, they do not hold to that name and actually resent it, because they do not follow the Campbells, merely agree with their wish to unify and break down the beariers of denominationalism...they wish to be non-denominational.

However, just as in most of our beliefs, many in the COC began to become dogmatic and legalistic in thier views, and the COC began to splinter into several "off shoots" based on differences...In essence, began to build barriers, rather than break them down. Some COC groups condemn other COC groups based on ridiculous legalistic arguments such as how many cups they use during the observance of the Lord's Supper, or whether or not more than one congregation can work together to support orphanages or benevolent enterprizes. These off-shoots can be very "pharisaical" binding the most insignificant issues and personal convictions on everyone else requiring them as a requirement for salvation. If you happen to talk with one of these groups...watch out! They can be quite insulting and self righteous.

On the other hand there are many COC groups who are not this way. Most of the COC I know are kind, loving, seekers of God. They believe in having Biblical Authority for everything they do, thus tend to not disregard any scripture as "insignificant" However, they recognize that they practice some things that are not specifically authorized as a means of expedience (church buildings, etc.) therein is the problem in the COC. Their ideas of what is expedient, and what is not authorized and therefore prohibited varies from COC congregation to congregation.

Each COC follows the NT example of Autotonomous leadership and therefore each COC is a "self-governing" entity based basically on the belief system of their elders. So...just because you may have a problem in one community with legalistic and "cult-like" behavior, you may go to the next COC and find a congregation of loving Christians who would have no problem with worshipping with you or accepting you as their brother/sister in Christ. While many COC's do not have instruments in their worship (they all have "music" ... a cappella) there are some that are called "Instrumental Church of Christ" The Christian church broke away from the COC in 1906 over the Instrument question...but because COC's are autonomous, some decided to keep instruments and the COC name.

So...to end this novel. You really can't say the COC believes this...or The COC believes that. They are a group of a very wide and various beliefs. There really is no website that speaks for all COC's, so beware of quoting such...the COC next door may not believe that way at all. I hope this helps dispell any confusion. There is no creed in the COC like there is in our churches...they are definetly not in total agreement about all of their lines of argument...especialy in the "onlt ones going to heaven" none of my COC friends believe that...though I'm sure you can find some that do.

It was actually formed in 1800 with the signing of the Cane Ridge agreement between the movements of Alexander Campbell and Barton W. Stone.

Thanks Rufus, I'm not that up on COC history...kinda shootin' from the hip there on the date. I am basically parroting a very good friend of mine who is COC. He and all the COC people I'm aquainted with are nothing like the stereotype I was taught that the COC is. Again, I wouldn't want to be stereotyped by some of the people in my own stripe of religion. Stereotyping any religious group is a dangerous and un-Christ like thing to do...IMHO

Otherwise, Did I do justice to the COC and there belief structure? I'd like to hear your point of view on all this as a COC Christian.

[Bold Believer]

I happened across one of their people at a local gas station a day or so ago. This guy sounded like a total stoned cultist with a canned answer for everything. These people don't even allow music in their services because there are no examples of music in the New Testament. Is anyone here familiar with the meatier portions of their teachings?

You could make it a little clearer that your thread refers to a rather peculiar sect with hang ups about musical instruments, rather than The Church of Christ in general.

I'm familiar with the International Church of Christ (Boston). This gent was from the older and more established Church of Christ, which after a little study I found also is called the "Campbellite movement." It has been around for a very long time.

1. The man told me that they did NOT believe in baptismal regeneration (baptism in order to be saved) but obedience baptism. When I asked what would happen if someone were to believe, then die before they could be baptized, he launched into this spurious argument that God would not allow such a thing to happen. When I inquired about the thief on the cross, his answer was that Christ had not died yet, so the thief was still under the Law.

2. The whole 'no music' thing was because there is no specific example of there having been music in the NT. I asked him if they believed in the Old testament, and right away (very reminiscent of a cultist) he gave me the answer that after Christ died, the mode of worship changed and that we were to make melody in our hearts and not on instruments. When I asked if I make a melody in my heart, why can't I accompany it with an instrument, he brought up Nadab and Abihu who offered strange fire to the LORD and were killed by God for it.

3. The Church of Christ name argument is specious, the local churches are also called:

a. by their cities in Revelation

b. the churches of God by Paul in Romans

4. The whole idea of targeting people who are already Believers seems to be a tactic of theirs. The first question I was asked was "Are you a Bible student?"

5. They do not believe that people are born sinners (Pelegianism if I recall my heresies.)

6. Their salvation is very man-dependent, and can be lost. Apparently their Christ's blood is not sufficient to wash away ALL our sins, just the ones before baptism.

While the CoC may not be cultic, it certainly has some aspects of cultism. Not my cup of tea.

[Believer1997]

I happened across one of their people at a local gas station a day or so ago. This guy sounded like a total stoned cultist with a canned answer for everything. These people don't even allow music in their services because there are no examples of music in the New Testament. Is anyone here familiar with the meatier portions of their teachings?

You could make it a little clearer that your thread refers to a rather peculiar sect with hang ups about musical instruments, rather than The Church of Christ in general.

I'm familiar with the International Church of Christ (Boston). This gent was from the older and more established Church of Christ, which after a little study I found also is called the "Campbellite movement." It has been around for a very long time.

1. The man told me that they did NOT believe in baptismal regeneration (baptism in order to be saved) but obedience baptism. When I asked what would happen if someone were to believe, then die before they could be baptized, he launched into this spurious argument that God would not allow such a thing to happen. When I inquired about the thief on the cross, his answer was that Christ had not died yet, so the thief was still under the Law.

2. The whole 'no music' thing was because there is no specific example of there having been music in the NT. I asked him if they believed in the Old testament, and right away (very reminiscent of a cultist) he gave me the answer that after Christ died, the mode of worship changed and that we were to make melody in our hearts and not on instruments. When I asked if I make a melody in my heart, why can't I accompany it with an instrument, he brought up Nadab and Abihu who offered strange fire to the LORD and were killed by God for it.

3. The Church of Christ name argument is specious, the local churches are also called:

a. by their cities in Revelation

b. the churches of God by Paul in Romans

4. The whole idea of targeting people who are already Believers seems to be a tactic of theirs. The first question I was asked was "Are you a Bible student?"

5. They do not believe that people are born sinners (Pelegianism if I recall my heresies.)

6. Their salvation is very man-dependent, and can be lost. Apparently their Christ's blood is not sufficient to wash away ALL our sins, just the ones before baptism.

While the CoC may not be cultic, it certainly has some aspects of cultism. Not my cup of tea.

I believe that if you read back in this thread, you will see posts from those belonging to the CofC, who explained that there are some branches of this church which are not in keeping with the original doctrine and they do not recognize some of these offshoots. I don't think this man's beliefs in his branch of the church are consistent for the whole denomination.

[Scarletprayers]

I happened across one of their people at a local gas station a day or so ago. This guy sounded like a total stoned cultist with a canned answer for everything. These people don't even allow music in their services because there are no examples of music in the New Testament. Is anyone here familiar with the meatier portions of their teachings?

You could make it a little clearer that your thread refers to a rather peculiar sect with hang ups about musical instruments, rather than The Church of Christ in general.

I'm familiar with the International Church of Christ (Boston). This gent was from the older and more established Church of Christ, which after a little study I found also is called the "Campbellite movement." It has been around for a very long time.

1. The man told me that they did NOT believe in baptismal regeneration (baptism in order to be saved) but obedience baptism. When I asked what would happen if someone were to believe, then die before they could be baptized, he launched into this spurious argument that God would not allow such a thing to happen. When I inquired about the thief on the cross, his answer was that Christ had not died yet, so the thief was still under the Law.

2. The whole 'no music' thing was because there is no specific example of there having been music in the NT. I asked him if they believed in the Old testament, and right away (very reminiscent of a cultist) he gave me the answer that after Christ died, the mode of worship changed and that we were to make melody in our hearts and not on instruments. When I asked if I make a melody in my heart, why can't I accompany it with an instrument, he brought up Nadab and Abihu who offered strange fire to the LORD and were killed by God for it.

3. The Church of Christ name argument is specious, the local churches are also called:

a. by their cities in Revelation

b. the churches of God by Paul in Romans

4. The whole idea of targeting people who are already Believers seems to be a tactic of theirs. The first question I was asked was "Are you a Bible student?"

5. They do not believe that people are born sinners (Pelegianism if I recall my heresies.)

6. Their salvation is very man-dependent, and can be lost. Apparently their Christ's blood is not sufficient to wash away ALL our sins, just the ones before baptism.

While the CoC may not be cultic, it certainly has some aspects of cultism. Not my cup of tea.

Why bother to ask questions if you already have your mind made up. Talk about cultic, closed minded and hypocritical. This is why I don't bother to answer threads here much any more. Most people aren't really asking to find out the truth or read things with an open mind, they ask so then can then turn around and tell you what their opinion was in the first place. One person told you something, and that finishes it in your mind. Blinders! At least I'm honest enough to admit that the CoC has things I disagree with, you can't even be honest with your questions.

[hillsong_girl]

When I first got saved, I did attend a Church of Christ for a brief period and honestly their practices and beliefs negatively affected me. A little legalistic and un-biblical. I would not ever go back to one nor would I ever suggest it to anyone.

[damo1]

the church of christ pastor i am geting to know has just taken on the role as pastor of the church i got saved in and he is realy on fire for god he plays in a band plays the drums and guitar

he was a church of christ pastor for 15yrs from sydney and what i am sencing in him ther is nothing i could say that the church of christ is a cult

i also got to know some church of christ members from the farming community i had just moved from they use to come to the youth center and help out with the daily activities our center was the only one that had the troubled aborigonal kids

we asked the other youth pastors to come behind us and they refused but the church of christ put the hand up the drop in center was run by young life young life is based in america and we took on ther teachings for our drop in center young life sent staff from america to come and help set up the drop in center we had up to 100 troubled aborigonal young people comming every day we would feed them we sat down and played card games we had pool tables and two buses to take them home and the pastor of the church of christ drove the second van very giving man very caring man

i hold great respect for the church of christ in armidale new south wales

they were the only ones that put the hand up the other church youth pastors we asked were from the unitting church anglican church aog church and sevral other denominations what our goal was to target the young aborigonal youth into ther youth groups and by asking the youth pastors to come and help out at the center would have given them a chance to get to know the troubled young aborigonal boys and girls who were still in school and some were high school drop outs

this is what puzled us when we aproached them they said no but in the combined prayer meetings you would hear all the prayers they would pray and we thought they were serious

i sort of come behind the church of christ in armidale and support them when i can

at least they had the guts to step out and help and took on some of the young aborigonal youth

damo1

[OnetrueGod]

When I first got saved, I did attend a Church of Christ for a brief period and honestly their practices and beliefs negatively affected me. A little legalistic and un-biblical. I would not ever go back to one nor would I ever suggest it to anyone.

Hillsong Girl, How sad. It sounds like you had a very negative experience with the COC. My close friend, who is COC, has told me that some of the COC's are even negative toward all other COC's...very contentious, pious, legalistic, and self-righteous. I suppose not having a central organization or creed to "standardize" their belief system might breed that.

There are also legalistic "pushy" people from every other religious stripe...be honest...all of us can think of such people in our own groups that are opinionated and dead set in their ways and consider everyone else to be just plain wrong...period! I can imagine if some of these people are in positions of leadership in a congregation with no central leadership to soften them...Well, I can see where it could be a problem.

I have worshipped with the COC my friend attends (and he also worships at my church on accasion) and I have found him and the others at the COC to be sincere, loving, seekers of God. I have had more problems with a few legalists in my own religion than anybody at the COC. They have also treated me with respect. They do hold strongly to their own convictions as directed in Romans 14, but they also are kind and respectful of mine. I respect those who are confident in their beliefs. I don't believe they are a cult at all...although apparently some COC's are extremely self-righteous and judgemental (as are some in all religions!)

I wouldn't have a problem with anyone who wanted to attend there...at least the COC I am most familier with. Just my 2 cents.

[hillsong_girl]

When I first got saved, I did attend a Church of Christ for a brief period and honestly their practices and beliefs negatively affected me. A little legalistic and un-biblical. I would not ever go back to one nor would I ever suggest it to anyone.

Hillsong Girl, How sad. It sounds like you had a very negative experience with the COC. My close friend, who is COC, has told me that some of the COC's are even negative toward all other COC's...very contentious, pious, legalistic, and self-righteous. I suppose not having a central organization or creed to "standardize" their belief system might breed that.

There are also legalistic "pushy" people from every other religious stripe...be honest...all of us can think of such people in our own groups that are opinionated and dead set in their ways and consider everyone else to be just plain wrong...period! I can imagine if some of these people are in positions of leadership in a congregation with no central leadership to soften them...Well, I can see where it could be a problem.

I have worshipped with the COC my friend attends (and he also worships at my church on accasion) and I have found him and the others at the COC to be sincere, loving, seekers of God. I have had more problems with a few legalists in my own religion than anybody at the COC. They have also treated me with respect. They do hold strongly to their own convictions as directed in Romans 14, but they also are kind and respectful of mine. I respect those who are confident in their beliefs. I don't believe they are a cult at all...although apparently some COC's are extremely self-righteous and judgemental (as are some in all religions!)

I wouldn't have a problem with anyone who wanted to attend there...at least the COC I am most familier with. Just my 2 cents.

I understand what you are saying. I didn't have any issues with the people in the congregation, just their beliefs and practices. Water baptism as necessary for salvation and saying it is only correct to sing for music (and not use instruments) are not in line with the Bible.

[Scarletprayers]

When I first got saved, I did attend a Church of Christ for a brief period and honestly their practices and beliefs negatively affected me. A little legalistic and un-biblical. I would not ever go back to one nor would I ever suggest it to anyone.

Hillsong Girl, How sad. It sounds like you had a very negative experience with the COC. My close friend, who is COC, has told me that some of the COC's are even negative toward all other COC's...very contentious, pious, legalistic, and self-righteous. I suppose not having a central organization or creed to "standardize" their belief system might breed that.

There are also legalistic "pushy" people from every other religious stripe...be honest...all of us can think of such people in our own groups that are opinionated and dead set in their ways and consider everyone else to be just plain wrong...period! I can imagine if some of these people are in positions of leadership in a congregation with no central leadership to soften them...Well, I can see where it could be a problem.

I have worshipped with the COC my friend attends (and he also worships at my church on accasion) and I have found him and the others at the COC to be sincere, loving, seekers of God. I have had more problems with a few legalists in my own religion than anybody at the COC. They have also treated me with respect. They do hold strongly to their own convictions as directed in Romans 14, but they also are kind and respectful of mine. I respect those who are confident in their beliefs. I don't believe they are a cult at all...although apparently some COC's are extremely self-righteous and judgemental (as are some in all religions!)

I wouldn't have a problem with anyone who wanted to attend there...at least the COC I am most familier with. Just my 2 cents.

I understand what you are saying. I didn't have any issues with the people in the congregation, just their beliefs and practices. Water baptism as necessary for salvation and saying it is only correct to sing for music (and not use instruments) are not in line with the Bible.

Well there are allot of Scholars that disagree with you on that (baptism). Stating your opinion as if it is a carved in stone fact, is the same thing your accusing the CoC of doing. So once again hypocrisy!

[Scarletprayers]

I happened across one of their people at a local gas station a day or so ago. This guy sounded like a total stoned cultist with a canned answer for everything. These people don't even allow music in their services because there are no examples of music in the New Testament. Is anyone here familiar with the meatier portions of their teachings?

I went to one of their churches a few years ago.

I was very uncomfortable. They preached they are the only church. They had no music, which is fine. I had a sense that something was walking around the chapel, watching me.

I sensed that something was walking around the place, moving through out the building. It was creepy.

We talked to the pastor and he was like, "we believe the bible" that was his response to us trying to understand the church, he did not really point to anything specific.

I would avoid the place.

How about reading the whole thread LV!