Which Bible is the best for a beginner?

[Guest shiloh357]

This thread isn't going South is it ? Seems like the question's been answered ? This is not a KJV only invite....thought that was made clear from the beginning ? Please....let's not go there folks. Last time we discussed Bible versions ( what, last week ? ) it ended poorly.

We know where the KJV only folks stand, they know where the not-KJV-only people stand....that's clear between everyone ?

Just doing a little preemptive interference so we don't have to lock this thread & then get pummeled for doing so when folks start calling each other names, dishonouring Jesus, etc. Y'all know what I'm talking about

Serving Him,

Bob

Right on Bob!! This is really going nowhere fast.

[Guest Called]

I find that the fruit of the KJV has been revival and spiritual outpouring.

The fruit of the newer translations has been liberalism in the church and complete apostacy of certain denominations

I will have to strongly and politely disagree (was that nice? Bob? lol! ) with this statement. My church uses various translations and we usually use the NLT. I have been at this church for over a year and I am amazed at the level of consisitency and righteousness with the majority of the church. Yes, we have some hypocrites, but I would go out on a limb and say that probably about 99% of my church is completely on fire for God and you know what the secret is, we spend time in prayer every day and we read our 1 year Bible everyday (and it ain't the KJV) We have people getting saved AND discipled every week. The Holy Spirit is moving.

Going back over my walk and growth in Jesus Christ, the first Bible I read from cover to cover was The Message. Then I read and studied the Quest Study Bible in the NIV from cover to cover a few times. Currently, I read and study God

[stevehut]

I would conjecture that, when most of the people on these boards do not speak.read greek and/or hebrew

*duh* Oh, really?

As we all know, there are plenty of Bible reference books around (in English) for those who want to go deeper into their Bible study. It's not hard to look up the Greek or Hebrew origins, if you really want to know.

[One Way]

Enough, already. If you want to read the NLT, then go ahead and enjoy the hippopatamus!

15"Take a look at the mighty hippopotamus. I made it, just as I made you. It eats grass like an ox. 16See its powerful loins and the muscles of its belly. 17Its tail is as straight as a cedar. The sinews of its thighs are tightly knit together. 18Its bones are tubes of bronze. Its limbs are bars of iron. 19It is a prime example of God's amazing handiwork. Only its Creator can threaten it. -- Job 40:15-19, NLT

Okay, since when can a hippo's tail be compared to a cedar tree? Have you ever seen a hippo's tail? It is dinky! LOL!

Anyways, this is just an example of how they water down the Word in order to bring it down to the 3rd grade level.

I know that many people enjoy the NLT. High-profile evangelists such as Billy Graham, Greg Laurie, etc. recommend this translation. Greg Laurie has even compiled "The New Believer's Bible" which is really just the NLT with his commentary in it... some correct and some incorrect. I owned it and read it.

[rockswillcryout]

Okay, since when can a hippo's tail be compared to a cedar tree? Have you ever seen a hippo's tail? It is dinky! LOL!

:LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

[stevehut]

"Take a look at the mighty hippopotamus.

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

I actually enjoy the Bible That Abraham read?????

You know the father of our Faith.

Peace,

Dave

[Guest Called]

15"Take a look at the mighty hippopotamus. I made it, just as I made you. It eats grass like an ox. 16See its powerful loins and the muscles of its belly. 17Its tail is as straight as a cedar. The sinews of its thighs are tightly knit together. 18Its bones are tubes of bronze. Its limbs are bars of iron. 19It is a prime example of God's amazing handiwork. Only its Creator can threaten it. -- Job 40:15-19, NLT

Okay, since when can a hippo's tail be compared to a cedar tree? Have you ever seen a hippo's tail? It is dinky! LOL!

You should probably do a little more research before you start pointing fingers at the NLT translation. Here is the KJV of the same verse;

Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.

Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly.

Now, um in the footnotes on this verse it says the following or, the elephant as some might think. Have you ever seen an elephants tail?

You should realize you are just splitting hairs. So the NLT says hippo, instead of behemoth and behemoth is considered an elephant. So we have an hippo vs. elephant and this is your argument for it being watered down?

[Guest LCPGUY]

Grace to you,

I actually enjoy the Bible That Abraham read?????

You know the father of our Faith.

Peace,

Dave

Whoaaaa Dave. That was GREAT

In His Love,

Bro John

[Trinity]

Look when you read the greek ill have to disagree with the 99% thing.

There are just as many problems with the KJV as there are NIV. here let me prove it to you

Translation Errors

Here is a partial listing of King James Version translation errors:

Genesis 1:2 should read "And the earth became without form . . . ." The word translated "was" is hayah, and denotes a condition different than a former condition, as in Genesis 19:26.

Genesis 10:9 should read " . . . Nimrod the mighty hunter in place of [in opposition to] the LORD." The word "before" is incorrect and gives the connotation that Nimrod was a good guy, which is false.

Leviticus 16:8, 10, 26 in the KJV is "scapegoat" which today has the connotation of someone who is unjustly blamed for other's sins. The Hebrew is Azazel, which means "one removed or separated." The Azazel goal represents Satan, who is no scapegoat. He is guilty of his part in our sins.

Deuteronomy 24:1, "then let him" should be "and he." As the Savior explained in Matthew 19, Moses did not command divorcement. This statute is regulating the permission of divorce because of the hardness of their hearts.

II Kings 2:23, should be "young men", not "little children."

Isaiah 65:17 should be "I am creating [am about to create] new heavens and new earth . . . ."

Ezekiel 20:25 should read "Wherefore I permitted them, or gave them over to, [false] statutes that are not good, and judgments whereby they should not live." God's laws are good, perfect and right. This verse shows that since Israel rejected God's laws, He allowed them to hurt themselves by following false man made customs and laws.

Daniel 8:14 is correct in the margin, which substitutes "evening morning" for "days." Too bad William Miller didn't realize this.

Malachi 4:6 should read " . . . lest I come and smite the earth with utter destruction." "Curse" doesn't give the proper sense here. Same word used in Zechariah 14:11.

Matthew 5:48 should be "Become ye therefore perfect" rather than "be ye therefore perfect." "Perfect" here means "spiritually mature." Sanctification is a process of overcoming with the aid of the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 24:22 needs an additional word to clarify the meaning. It should say "there should no flesh be saved alive."

Matthew 27:49 omits text which was in the original. Moffatt correctly adds it, while the RSV puts it in a footnote: "And another took a spear and pierced His side, and out came water and blood." The Savior's death came when a soldier pierced His side, Revelation 1:7.

Matthew 28:1, "In the end of the sabbath as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week . . ." should be translated literally, "Now late on Sabbath, as it was getting dusk toward the first day of the week . . . ." The Sabbath does not end at dawn but at dusk.

Luke 2:14 should say, "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace among men of God's good pleasure or choosing." That is, there will be peace on earth among men who have God's good will in their hearts.

Luke 14:26 has the unfortunate translation of the Greek word miseo, Strong's #3404, as "hate", when it should be rendered "love less by comparison." We are not to hate our parents and family!

John 1:31, 33 should say "baptize" or "baptizing IN water" not with water. Pouring or sprinkling with water is not the scriptural method of baptism, but only thorough immersion in water.

John 1:17 is another instance of a poor preposition. "By" should be "through": "For the law was given by [through] Moses . . . ." Moses did not proclaim his law, but God's Law.

John 13:2 should be "And during supper" (RSV) rather than "And supper being ended" (KJV).

Acts 12:4 has the inaccurate word "Easter" which should be rendered "Passover." The Greek word is pascha which is translated correctly as Passover in Matthew 26:2, etc.

I Corinthians 1:18 should be: "For the preaching of the cross is to them that are perishing foolishness; but unto us which are being saved it is the power of God", rather than "perish" and "are saved." Likewise, II Thessalonians 2:10 should be "are perishing" rather than "perish."

I Corinthians 15:29 should be: "Else what shall they do which are baptized for the hope of the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the hope of the dead?"

II Corinthians 6:2 should be "a day of salvation", instead of "the day of salvation." This is a quote from Isaiah 49:8, which is correct. The day of salvation is not the same for each individual. The firstfruits have their day of salvation during this life. The rest in the second resurrection.

I Timothy 4:8 should say, "For bodily exercise profiteth for a little time: but godliness in profitable unto all things . . . ."

I Timothy 6:10 should be, "For the love of money is a [not the] root of all evil . . . ."

Hebrews 4:8 should be "Joshua" rather than "Jesus", although these two words are Hebrew and Greek equivalents.

Hebrews 4:9 should read, "There remaineth therefore a keeping of a sabbath to the people of God."

Hebrews 9:28 is out of proper order in the King James. It should be: "So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them without sin that look for him shall he appear the second time unto salvation."

I John 5:7-8 contains additional text which was added to the original. "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one." The italicized text was added to the original manuscripts. Most modern translations agree that this was an uninspired addition to the Latin Vulgate to support the unscriptural trinity doctrine.

Revelation 14:4 should be "a firstfruits", because the 144,000 are not all the firstfruits.

Revelation 20:4-5 in the KJV is a little confusing until you realize that the sentence "This is the first resurrection." in verse five refers back to "they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years" in verse four.

Revelation 20:10, "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are [correction: should be 'were cast' because the beast and false prophet were mortal human beings who were burned up in the lake of fire 1,000 years previous to this time, Revelation 19:20], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." The point is that Satan will be cast into the same lake of fire into which the beast and false prophet were cast a thousand years previously.

Revelation 22:2 should be "health" rather than "healing."

Italics: Sometimes Helpful, Sometimes Wrong

No language can be translated word for word into another language. Hebrew and Greek idioms often do not come through clearly into literal English. Thus, beginning in 1560 with the Geneva Bible, translators initiated the practice of adding italicized clarifying words to make the original language more plain. The fifty-four King James translators did the same. Often, the added italicized words do help make the meaning clearer. At other times, the translators through their doctrinal misunderstandings added errors instead.

In Psalms 81:4, "was" is totally uncalled for and not in the original Hebrew. New Moons are still a statute of God.

We have shown how in Revelation 20:10 that the italicized "are" is incorrect and that "were cast" in italics would have been more appropriate. Another instance is John 8:28 where Jesus said (KJV), "I am he." The "he" is in italics and was not actually spoken by Jesus, completely obscuring the fact the Jesus was claiming to be the great "I AM" of the Old Testament, John 8:58 and Exodus 3:14.

In Luke 3:23-38, the italicized words "the son" are not in the original Greek. Actually, Luke gives the fleshly descent of the Savior through Mary, while Matthew gives the legal descent through Joseph.

Matthew 24:24 should not have the italicized words "it were". It IS possible for the elect to be deceived. We need to be on guard!

Romans 1:7 incorrectly has the italicized words "to be." The fact is, Christians are now saints.

I Corinthians 7:19 needs some italicized words to make the meaning clear. It should say: "Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but [the important thing is] the keeping of the commandments of God."

Colossians 2:16-17 can be properly understood only if the KJV italicized word "is" in verse 17 is left out, as it should be. The message of these verses is: don't let men judge you as doing wrong when you observe the holy days, new moons and sabbaths; let the body of Christ (the Church) do the judging.

I Timothy 3:11 has "their" in italics, which is not implied in the original.

II Peter 2:5 should not have "person, a." Noah was the eighth preacher of righteousness.

I John 2:23 has "[but] he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also" in italics. This is an addition based upon the Latin text and not in the original Greek.

Punctuation Problems

Luke 23:43 has been erroneously used by some to claim that Jesus went straight to heaven at His death. The original Greek did not have punctuation marks as we do today. The KJV states, "And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." The comma should not be after "thee", but "day." The believing malefactor would be with Christ in the paradise of the redeemed when he was resurrected far into the future.

Mark 16:9 does not say that Jesus was resurrected Sunday morning. There is a missing implied comma between "risen" and "early" and there should be no comma after week as the KJV has it: "Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene . . . ." Thus, it should say, "Now when Jesus was risen, early the first day of the week he appeared first to Mary Magdalene . . . ."

Word Differences

Another thing to keep in mind is the fact that the 1611 A.D. King James English is somewhat different than today's English language. The meaning of certain words has changed, and/or the King James sometimes uses words not familiar to most people today in their common speech. In addition, certain idioms in the original Hebrew and Greek are a little difficult to understand today. The Oxford Wide Margin KJV has excellent marginal references which often explain the correct meanings. Here is a partial listing of changed word meanings:

King James Phrase (on top)

Modern English (on bottom)

Abraham's bosom

"the Kingdom of God" in which the redeemed will have an intimate relationship with father Abraham in sharing the eternal inheritance of the earth.

adoption

"sonship", as in Romans 8:23, 9:4, Ephesians 1:5.

affections

"passions", as in Galatians 5:24, "mind" as in Colossians 3:2.

afflict soul

"fast" as in Leviticus 23:27, 32 (Psalms 35:13).

beguile

"judge against you", as in Colossians 2:18.

betimes

"early", as in Proverbs 13:24.

blains

"blisters", as in Exodus 9:9.

bosom, in his

"have an intimate relationship with", as in II Samuel 12:3, 8, John 1:18.

bruit

"report, rumor", as in Jeremiah 10:22, Nahum 3:19.

charity

"spiritual love", as in I Corinthians 13.

clean heart

"right attitude", as in Psalms 51:10, 73:1.

communicate

"share", as in Hebrews 13:16.

communications

"associations, companionships", as in I Corinthians 15:33.

conversation

"conduct", as in Philippians 2:27, I Peter 3:1, "citizenship" as in Philippians 3:20.

convince

"convict", as in Titus 1:9, James 2:9.

corn

"grain", as in Leviticus 23:14, Deuteronomy 23:25.

cover his feet

"go to the toilet", as in I Samuel 24:3.

creature

"creation", as in Romans 8:20-21, II Corinthians 5:17, Galatians 6:15.

cross

"stake"

damned

"judged", as in Mark 16:16.

devils

"demons", as in I Timothy 4:1.

dissimulation

"hypocrisy", as in Galatians 2:13.

divers

"different" places, persons or things as in Matthew 24:7 and Acts 19:9, Hebrews 1:1, James 1:2.

dividing

"expounding, dissecting", as in II Timothy 2:15.

doting

"sick", as in I Timothy 6:4.

due benevolence

"sexual dues", as in I Corinthians 7:3.

ensamples

"examples, types", as in I Corinthians 10:11.

faint

"give up" as in Luke 18:1, Galatians 6:9.

froward

"evil, wrong", as in Proverbs 2:12.

gay

"expensive, costly", as in James 2:3.

Ghost

"Holy Ghost" should be rendered "Holy Spirit."

glass

"mirror", as in I Corinthians 13:12, James 1:23.

hardness

"blindness" as in Mark 3:5.

he

In reference to the Holy Spirit, the KJV usage of "he" rather than "it" implies the false notion of the trinity. The Holy Spirit is not a separate person, but the mind of God the Father and God the Son. See John 14:16, 17, 26 and 16:7-8, 13-15.

heart

"attitude of mind", as in Jeremiah 17:9.

hell

There are three Greek words rendered "hell" in the New Testament: gehenna, hades (equivalent of Hebrew sheol used in the Old Testament), and tartaroo. Gehenna is the lake of fire, hades is the grave and tartaroo is the abyss, the place of restraint for Satan. For English speaking people during the time of King James, "hell" [hades] was a cellar to store potatoes, not a lake of burning brimstone. In Acts 2:27, "hell" is hades, meaning the grave, while in Matthew 10: 28 and Mark 9:43-48 "hell" means the lake of fire. The only place tartaroo is used is in II Peter 2:4.

husbandman

"farmer, rancher", as in James 5:7.

iniquity

"lawlessness", as in Matthew 24:12.

jealous

"zealous", as in II Corinthians 11:2.

knew

"had sexual relations with", as in Genesis 4:1.

leasing

"lying", as in Psalms 4:2, 5:6.

letteth

"restrains", as in II Thessalonians 2:7.

lusteth after

"earnestly desires" as in Deuteronomy 14:26.

mansions

"offices" as in John 14:2.

meat offering

"meal offering", as in Leviticus 23:13, etc.

meet

"fitting, proper", Matthew 3:8, Genesis 2:18.

mocked

"deceived", as in Galatians 6:7.

morning stars

"angels", as in Job 38:7.

nether

"lower", as in Deuteronomy 24:6.

outlandish

"foreign", as in Nehemiah 13:26.

perfect

"spiritually mature", as in II Timothy 3:17, or "upright or sincere" as in Genesis 17:1.

perform

"finish", as in Philippians 1:6.

him that "pisseth against the wall"

"males", as in II Kings 9:8, etc.

press, the

"the crowd", as in Luke 19:3.

prevent

"precede", Psalms 88:13, I Thessalonians 4:15.

prophesy

"inspired preaching", as in I Corinthians 14.

quicken

"make alive", as in Romans 8:11.

quit

"keep on", as in I Corinthians 16:13.

rain

"teach", as in Hosea 10:12, Isaiah 2:3.

rentest

"distort", as in Jeremiah 4:30.

requite

"offer support for", as in I Timothy 5:4.

rereward

rear guard" as in I Samuel 29:2.

rudiments

"elements", as in Colossians 2:8.

those who "seemed to be somewhat"

"boasters", as in Galatians 2:6.

servant

"slave", as in Philippians 2:7.

simple

"harmless", as in Romans 16:19.

sincerity

"with incorruption", as in Ephesians 6:24.

slept with his fathers

"died", as in II Kings 13:9, II Chronicles 16:12.

sons of God

"angels", as in Job 1:6.

spiritual wickedness

"wicked spirits", as in Ephesians 6:12.

sprinkle

"astonish, startle", as in Isaiah 52:15.

stranger

"newcomer, new convert", as in Deuteronomy 14:29.

suffer

"let, allow, permit" as in Mark 10:14, Revelation 11:9.

tarry

"wait", as in Luke 24:49, I Corinthians 16:8, which is explained in Acts 1:4.

tempted

"tried or tested", as in I Corinthians 10:13, James 1:13.

tenor

"intent or purpose", as in Exodus 34:27.

tongues

"foreign languages", Mark 16:17, I Corinthians 14.

virtue

"power" as in Mark 5:30.

visage

"appearance", as in Isaiah 52:14.

Unjustified Additions to the KJV

Derived From Latin Vulgate, Not in Greek Text

These additions should be omitted from the KJV:

Matthew 27:35

"that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots." This verse appears properly in John 19:24.

John 8:9-10

Delete: "being convicted by their own conscience . . . unto the last . . . alone . . . and saw none but the woman . . . those thine accusers."

The Greek properly reads: "But when they heard it, they went away, one by one, beginning with the eldest, and Jesus was left with the woman being before him. Jesus lifted himself up and said to her, 'Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?'"

Acts 9:5-6

"it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him . . . ."

Acts 10:6

"he shall tell thee what thou oughtest to do"

Acts 10:21

"which were sent unto him from Cornelius"

Acts 21:8

"that were of Paul's company"

Romans 13:9

"Thou shalt not bear false witness"

Romans 16:20

"Amen"

Colossians 1:14

"through his blood"

Hebrews 2:7

"and didst set him over the works of thy hands"

Hebrews 11:13

"and were persuaded of them and embraced them"

Hebrews 12:20

"or with a dart shot through"

I John 2:23

"(but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also" is placed in italics in the KJV. The Greek Text omits this portion entirely.

I John 5:7-8

"in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit: and these thee are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth" As previously explained, this is not part of the original Greek text.

Revelation 1:8

"the beginning and the ending"

Revelation 1:11

"I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and . . . which are in Asia"

Revelation 1:20

"which thou sawest"

Revelation 2:17

"to eat of"

Revelation 5:4

"and to read"

Revelation 5:14

"four and twenty . . . him that lives forever and ever"

Revelation 11:1

"and the angel stood"

Revelation 12:12

"the inhabiters of"

Revelation 14:5

"before the throne of God"

Revelation 15:2

"over his mark"

Revelation 16:7

"another out of"

Revelation 16:14

"of the earth and"

Revelation 21:3

"and be their God"

Misplaced Verses in the KJV

In Matthew 23:13-14, the proper order is: "But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretense make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in."

Romans 16:25-27 belongs after Romans 14:23, not at the end of the book.

Items Wrongly Substituted or Left Out of the KJV,

Should be Reinstated

Matthew 27:49

"And another took a spear and pierced his side and out came water and blood."

[The Orthodox Church says this was part of the Greek Text until mistakenly deleted in 511 A.D.]

Luke 9:50

". . . for his is not against you."

This verse should read: "And Jesus said to him, Forbid him not, for he is not against you. For whoever is not against you is for you."

Luke 10:22

"And having turned to the disciples, he said:"

John 1:28

"Bethany" instead of "Bethabara", which was a corrupt Egyptian reading.

Acts 9:19

Should read, "Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at the time in Damascus."

Acts 20:28

Should read, " . . . the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to feed the church of the Lord and God, which He purchased with His own blood."

Philippians 3:3

Should be "serve in (the) Spirit of God" rather than "serve God in the spirit."

Colossians 1:6

Should have added "and is growing" after "bringeth forth fruits."

Colossians 2:13

Should read, "And you--being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh--you hath He quickened together with him, having forgiven us all the trespasses . . . "

I Thess. 5:21

Should read, "Despise not prophesyings, but prove all things . . . ."

II Timothy 2:19

"of (the) Lord" rather than "of Christ."

Hebrews 8:8

"To them", not "with them."

Hebrews 13:9

"Carried away", not "carried about."

James 5:12

Should be "into hypocrisy" instead of "under judgment."

I Peter 2:2

End of verse should have added: "unto salvation."

Revelation 2:21

Should be " . . . and she wills not to repent of her fornication."

Revelation 6:12

Should be " . . . and the whole moon became blood . . . ."

Revelation 8:7

Should be " . . . and the third part of the land was burnt up, and the third part of the trees . . . ."

Revelation 8:13

"eagle" rather than "angel."

Revelation 11:18

"nations" instead of "dead."

Revelation 12:6

Should read, "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has there a place prepared of God . . . ."

Revelation 13:5

Should read, " . . . and power was given it to make war forty-two months . . . ."

Revelation 14:1

Should read, "having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads . . . ."

Revelation 15:3

"nations" instead of "saints."

Revelation 17:8

Should read, " . . . when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and shall be present . . . ."

Revelation 18:17

Should read, " . . . everyone who sails to any place . . . " instead of "and all the company in ships."

Revelation 18:20

Should read, " . . . ye holy saints and apostles and prophets."

Revelation 19:12

Should read, " . . . and on his head were many crowns, having names written, and a name written that no man knew . . . ."

Revelation 19:17

Should read, " . . . gather yourselves together unto the great supper of God . . . ", not "supper of the great God."

Revelation 21:24

Should read, "And the nations shall walk by means of its light."

Revelation 22:19

Should read, "tree of life" instead of "book of life."

Revelation 22:21

Should close with "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with all of the saints. Amen."

Conclusion

The King James Version is a word-for-word translation. Other translations, such as the New International Version (NIV), are meaning-for-meaning translations.