rollinTHUNDER Posted May 27, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,986 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 433 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/23/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted May 27, 2003 And let me see if I understand what you are saying also.... Are you equating the "Times of the Gentiles" mentioned in Luke 21:24 to be the same thing as "the church age?" Hi yod, I believe this will be the end of God's focus on the church (rapture), and a beginning of Daniel's 70th week (7 yr tribulation). A remnant of Jews will be saved (one third) and divinely protected thru the tribulation. This doesn't mean that God is finished with the church. The martyrs that die for their testimonies and refusing the mark during this time will also be part of the church. These are the ones whose souls will be under the altar. The martyrs will return with Christ at the second coming, along with those who were previously raptured. The remnant of Jews will remain in their mortal bodies and re-populate the earth in the millennium. God will save Israel by protecting this remnant. I hope that makes it a little clearer. Cheers!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted May 27, 2003 Share Posted May 27, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad Ernie Posted May 27, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,802 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 46 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/29/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/01/1945 Share Posted May 27, 2003 Greetings All, Regarding: Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. These verses refer to the same event: 2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 2 Timothy 4:3-4 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. Once the Kingdom of God was taken from Israel and given to the Gentiles, that was the beginning of the ushering in of the gentiles into the Kingdom of God which will continue until the 3 verses above occur. DR LUKE: All Jews have NOT been precluded from entering into the Kingdom of God because as you say there have been Jews being saved since the cross, but the number in comparison to the whole of Israel remains to this day to be only a remnant. I believe I have posted current statistics on this before. The Lord said that while we are in this world we would suffer tribulation, but in the very last days, there shall be GREAT tribulation, so much that if the Lord didn't cut those days short, even the elect would not survive. The regathering of Israel to the land was and is currently being added to by man. This was foretold by Jesus in Matthew 24 when telling us of the fig tree. But it NEVER produces any FRUIT (for the Kingdom). Please read Deut 4:26-31 for an overview of what will happen with the Jews in the Last Days. God Himself will deliver His people to the Land, and that happens when Christ alights on this earth once again "with all His Saints" to reign for 1,000 years. Blessings, Dad Ernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsower Posted May 28, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,545 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1968 Share Posted May 28, 2003 Yod, I think we are on the same page--sort of. I also believe that the fullness of the gentiles is the completion of our purpose. I believe that the rapture will provoke the Jews to jealousy because of the parable of the lost son when the younger son went into the feast the older son was jealous and told his father that he had kept His commandments from the beginning, so why was this disobedient younger son going into the feast? The father pleaded for him to go in and told him that all He had was his fromt he beginning but they should make merry for the lost that was found. Sounds like the marriage feast of the Lamb to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted May 28, 2003 Share Posted May 28, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adstar Posted May 28, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,399 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,307 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2003 Hi Yod From my point of view the gentiles are still trampling their feet on Jerusalem. For if the Jews had control of Jerusalem then the mosque that is currently on the temple mount would have been removed by now and we would see a rebuilt temple today. Your view states that 1967 was a black and white thing I only see it as the start of a transition period that has not yet achieved full transfer. This is just my observation on Jerusalem. I still believe the fullness of the gentiles refers to the reaching of the number of Gentiles who would/will be saved has been reached. After the fullness of the gentiles is reached the salvation through the Messiah shall end for the Gentiles. So if you are correct in your belief that 1967 marks the time of the fulfillment of the Gentiles then I would not now be a believer in the Messiah Jesus. All praise The Ancient Of Days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollinTHUNDER Posted May 29, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,986 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 433 Days Won: 2 Joined: 04/23/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted May 29, 2003 And still no one wants to answer my question about Jerusalem coming under the control of Israel in 1967 for the first time since 586 BC. This has no significance at all in your opinion? Hi yod, Israel really doesn't control Jerusalem. I think they only have East Jerusalem, but the Palestinians control the temple mount. With the Dome of the Rock standing, they will never allow Israel to rebuild the temple. So Jerusalem will remain a burdensome stone. There are three religions that have roots in Jerusalem. Not only the Jews, but also Islam and christianity as well. I had an interesting thought last night. I was pondering how Jacob worked for seven years to get his first love, Rachel. But instead of getting Rachel, he was mistreated and received Leah. He had to work seven more years to get his first choice. Jesus came and worked for 3 1/2 years for His first love, Israel. Then He was mistreated, cut off and received the Gentile believers. He chose 12 disciples to multiply His seed in times of the Gentiles. After the fulness of the Gentiles is complete, Israel's blindness and punishment will be finished and He will go back to finish His work for His first love, Israel. He will choose 12 tribes (144,000) to multiply His seed in Israel for 3 1/2 years. Then anti-christ will break the covenant and turn against them, but God will protect a remnant until the second coming. Oh well, it was just a thought. Cheers!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsower Posted May 29, 2003 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,545 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1968 Share Posted May 29, 2003 I had an interesting thought last night. I was pondering how Jacob worked for seven years to get his first love, Rachel. But instead of getting Rachel, he was mistreated and received Leah. He had to work seven more years to get his first choice. Also, we are raptured first and then 7 years later He gets His true love Israel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted May 29, 2003 Share Posted May 29, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted May 29, 2003 Share Posted May 29, 2003 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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