Prophecies of the old testament

[givennewname]

Mat 13:35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden from the foundation of the world.

I am rather surprised that some christians do not belief that the Old Testament contains prophesy by the OT prophets, even to the extent of proposing two writers for the book of Isaiah. The Lord Jesus himself says that the scriptures were written about him and the fact that these prophets have their prophecy fulfilled and the Matthew writes again and again that Jesus came to fulfill many prophesies in the old testament. Why is it that some in this forum have trouble acknowledging that prophecies are written throughout the old testament? If the Bible is edited to cut off these prophecies, one might as well read Shakespeare. What is the problem with believeing prophesy? is it that it involves the supernatural? Or is it just an academic argument?

[OneLight]

Here are the prophetic books of the OT ... they can't be missed ...

Major Prophets - Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel, Daniel

Minor Prophets - Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk,

Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi.

[givennewname]

That is a sad thing. I have even met and heard of some Christians that say the OT is outdated and that once Christ came it became useless. The truth is we cannot understand the NT without it. I remember a story of a missionary that had given a translation of the book of John to the tribe he was working with. One of the men came up to the missionary and asked. "Where is the first part of the book?" He knew who Jesus and the disciples were but didnt know who Abraham and David and The others spoken of in it. This is another evidence that the OT is not useless. In fact I even say the Bible not given the division of OT or NT cause it is one continuous book. I even heard of one preacher that when a man told him the OT was useless he took his bible and asked the man to tear it out and throw it away since it was useless. The man didnt do it. I would agree with that. If you say the OT is useless and no longer applies then get rid of it. Dont buy Bibles with it in them. Also for that matter I dont want you to quote Scriptures from the NT that refer to the OT. So many about David, Abraham, Job. Adam and countless others would also be useless. The Bible is entire and whole not one part useless and another usefull.

God bless

Arikutoy

It all came from the German school of thought that rejects all notion of prophesy and miracles in the Bible. They even propose a second author for Isaiah because they think that Isaiah could not have possibly known Cyrus's name before he was even concieved, therefore they attribute the second part of Isaiah to a different author called Deutero-Isaiah who wrote history after the captivity of Babylon. All the academic rubbish to assault the word of God.

[givennewname]

That is a sad thing. I have even met and heard of some Christians that say the OT is outdated and that once Christ came it became useless. The truth is we cannot understand the NT without it. I remember a story of a missionary that had given a translation of the book of John to the tribe he was working with. One of the men came up to the missionary and asked. "Where is the first part of the book?" He knew who Jesus and the disciples were but didnt know who Abraham and David and The others spoken of in it. This is another evidence that the OT is not useless. In fact I even say the Bible not given the division of OT or NT cause it is one continuous book. I even heard of one preacher that when a man told him the OT was useless he took his bible and asked the man to tear it out and throw it away since it was useless. The man didnt do it. I would agree with that. If you say the OT is useless and no longer applies then get rid of it. Dont buy Bibles with it in them. Also for that matter I dont want you to quote Scriptures from the NT that refer to the OT. So many about David, Abraham, Job. Adam and countless others would also be useless. The Bible is entire and whole not one part useless and another usefull.

God bless

Arikutoy

It all came from the German school of thought that rejects all notion of prophesy and miracles in the Bible. They even propose a second author for Isaiah because they think that Isaiah could not have possibly known Cyrus's name before he was even concieved, therefore they attribute the second part of Isaiah to a different author called Deutero-Isaiah who wrote history after the captivity of Babylon. All the academic rubbish to assault the word of God.

....leaving us all free to spout whatever we can make up and call it "prophesy", just so long as we can proof-text it, eh?

....leaving us all free to spout whatever we can make up and call it "prophesy", just so long as we can proof-text it, eh?

You Dont have to throw the baby out with the dirty water. the bible itself tells you how to discern between the true and false prophesy:

Deu 13:1 If there arise in the midst of thee a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and he give thee a sign or a wonder,

Deu 13:2 and the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;

Deu 13:3 thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or unto that dreamer of dreams: for Jehovah your God proveth you, to know whether ye love Jehovah your God with all your heart and with all your soul.

Deu 13:4 Ye shall walk after Jehovah your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him.

Deu 13:5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death, because he hath spoken rebellion against Jehovah your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed thee out of the house of bondage, to draw thee aside out of the way which Jehovah thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put away the evil from the midst of thee.

Deu 18:20 But the prophet, that shall speak a word presumptuously in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die.

Deu 18:21 And if thou say in thy heart, How shall we know the word which Jehovah hath not spoken?

Deu 18:22 when a prophet speaketh in the name of Jehovah, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which Jehovah hath not spoken: the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously, thou shalt not be afraid of him.

the test as to whether a prophesy is sent from God is

1) it does not contradict the commandments of God ie it does not contradict the truth of the bible.

2) it comes to pass which means that the prophecy fulfills exactly what has been written.

No need for great debates as to what is true or false prophesy,

[givennewname]

If prophesy does not pass the 2 test, the prophet is a false prophet and should be put to death.

[givennewname]

If propehsy does not pass the 2 test, the prophet is a false prophet and should be put to death.

Thus the tendency to phrase prophecy in the form of a question, so that one can claim ambiguity when pressed.

In case of the afore mentioned books of the OT, the Gospel writers have affirmed their accuracy and in the case of Isaiah and the book of Psalms, even the Lord Jesus have alluded to their accuracy.

[givennewname]

Jesus came and never changed one iota of the OT. Thus saying that all of it is true. He never said that it was 2 Isaiahs, he said it is one prophet Isaiah. thus no two prophets

[Babbler]

Mat 13:35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden from the foundation of the world.

I am rather surprised that some christians do not belief that the Old Testament contains prophesy by the OT prophets, even to the extent of proposing two writers for the book of Isaiah. The Lord Jesus himself says that the scriptures were written about him and the fact that these prophets have their prophecy fulfilled and the Matthew writes again and again that Jesus came to fulfill many prophesies in the old testament. Why is it that some in this forum have trouble acknowledging that prophecies are written throughout the old testament? If the Bible is edited to cut off these prophecies, one might as well read Shakespeare. What is the problem with believeing prophesy? is it that it involves the supernatural? Or is it just an academic argument?

Oh there are many that believe in prophecy but they have ears that do not hear. It is those who lack discernmrnt and believe the errors of John Nelson Darby when it comes to Daniel, Revelation and a rapture.

[givennewname]

Mat 13:35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden from the foundation of the world.

I am rather surprised that some christians do not belief that the Old Testament contains prophesy by the OT prophets, even to the extent of proposing two writers for the book of Isaiah. The Lord Jesus himself says that the scriptures were written about him and the fact that these prophets have their prophecy fulfilled and the Matthew writes again and again that Jesus came to fulfill many prophesies in the old testament. Why is it that some in this forum have trouble acknowledging that prophecies are written throughout the old testament? If the Bible is edited to cut off these prophecies, one might as well read Shakespeare. What is the problem with believeing prophesy? is it that it involves the supernatural? Or is it just an academic argument?

Oh there are many that believe in prophecy but they have ears that do not hear. It is those who lack discernmrnt and believe the errors of John Nelson Darby when it comes to Daniel, Revelation and a rapture.

John Nelson Darby believed in prophesy-literally, thats how he came to the conclusion of a rapture. Its not in the OT, Its in the NT, not in Daniel nor Rev

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first;

1Th 4:17

then we that are alive, that are left, shall together with them be caught up in the clouds,

to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Caught up is rupturo in Latin, hence rapture

[givennewname]

Mat 13:35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things hidden from the foundation of the world.

I am rather surprised that some christians do not belief that the Old Testament contains prophesy by the OT prophets, even to the extent of proposing two writers for the book of Isaiah. The Lord Jesus himself says that the scriptures were written about him and the fact that these prophets have their prophecy fulfilled and the Matthew writes again and again that Jesus came to fulfill many prophesies in the old testament. Why is it that some in this forum have trouble acknowledging that prophecies are written throughout the old testament? If the Bible is edited to cut off these prophecies, one might as well read Shakespeare. What is the problem with believeing prophesy? is it that it involves the supernatural? Or is it just an academic argument?

Oh there are many that believe in prophecy but they have ears that do not hear. It is those who lack discernmrnt and believe the errors of John Nelson Darby when it comes to Daniel, Revelation and a rapture.

John Nelson Darby believed in prophesy-literally, thats how he came to the conclusion of a rapture. Its not in the OT, Its in the NT, not in Daniel nor Rev

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven, with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first;

1Th 4:17

then we that are alive, that are left, shall together with them be caught up in the clouds,

to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Caught up is rupturo in Latin, hence rapture

Rapture is taught by Paul in 1Thes 417, he Latin word is Rapturo hence the word rapture. If you dun like the word, call it caught up as the english word is in 1Thes 4:17.

Whether yu want to believe it is pre or post tribulation is another matter. Thats a whole different argument. Rapture is not taught by John Nelson Darby, it is taught by Paul in 1Thes4:17.