CBE1 Posted January 31, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 59 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/21/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2010 I guess the common term of backsliding could be used, but it is not scriptural, just a label someone came up with. Scripture reads "if anyone among you wanders from the truth", which to me means that someone, another christian, has wondered from the truth, not fallen from grace. Nice post. "Wondering from the truth" is much more accurate and does not sound so accusing as "Backsliding". As sheep we do all tend to wonder away from the voice of the Lord. He of course is the truth, because what He says is truth. "Backsliding" sounds more intentionally rebelious, and does not really accurately depect what is usually happening. Those that know the Lord, often get side tracked and busy with other things like Martha, instead of sitting at the feet of Jesus. In those cases we just kind of wonder off spiritually instead of intentionally turning our back on the Lord. Not that someone might get mad at Him for whatever and do that also. But I do think that more accurate term is "Wondering from the truth". Again, nice post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted January 31, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 31, 2010 Turning one for doing what is wrong is different then not resisting a person as they slap you in the face. I read in Matthew 5:38-39 that Christ is telling us not to hit them back, but in love, offer them the other cheek also, showing that they can not have power over you through terror or physical pain. Turning someone from their sin is talking too them, bringing scripture to them, in His love. Discussing what ti is that is driving them to want to commit such sin and point them to Christ, encouraging them to turn away from sin.. Oh, you're talking about bringing those who do not know Jesus to Him? Not necessarily bringing someone who has known Jesus, but has turned back; what is often called back-sliding? If you mean the unsaved, yes, I've spoken with a number of atheists who have come to believe. The lost too have been given the hope of Christ. Lives have been changed... wonderful to witness as well as to watch their growth in Christ. Praise God! I guess the common term of backsliding could be used, but it is not scriptural, just a label someone came up with. Scripture reads "if anyone among you wanders from the truth", which to me means that someone, another christian, has wondered from the truth, not fallen from grace. I just did a quick New Testament search using the words: wanders truth, and didn't find anything. Hmmm, let me check another version. Still nothing. What version do you use? I recall a verse that says: Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. James 5:20. Is that the one you are referring to? Yes, it is James 5:19-20 (NJKV) Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted January 31, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 31, 2010 Ha! Said I was tired! That's the verse you quoted earlier in the thread! (Was that before or after I went to bed?) Anyway you had asked: Yes, we are to constantly be in check, but what do you do if you see a brother or sister sin? Are we to ignore them because we are not perfect or are we to show them love and tell them that what they are doing is wrong? There's sin as we have discussed: intentional, then there's errors, and then there's ignorance. Generally, I would place error and ignorance in the same category. We cannot fault ignorance. We have all been ignorant at one point or another about something. So, yes, we would show them love. Telling people that they are wrong, in those words, I have found not to be helpful. Patience and love is the route to go. Plus, those other virtues I posted earlier about which against there is no law are required in our efforts. (That post would then stand in it's entirety.) That is what I said, in love, not thumping them with scripture. If you are talking about Galatians 5:22-23, then I agree, they are the fruit of the Spirit. If that is not what you are referring to, which post are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Permie Posted January 31, 2010 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 213 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/14/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/12/1958 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Ha! Said I was tired! That's the verse you quoted earlier in the thread! (Was that before or after I went to bed?) Anyway you had asked: Yes, we are to constantly be in check, but what do you do if you see a brother or sister sin? Are we to ignore them because we are not perfect or are we to show them love and tell them that what they are doing is wrong? There's sin as we have discussed: intentional, then there's errors, and then there's ignorance. Generally, I would place error and ignorance in the same category. We cannot fault ignorance. We have all been ignorant at one point or another about something. So, yes, we would show them love. Telling people that they are wrong, in those words, I have found not to be helpful. Patience and love is the route to go. Plus, those other virtues I posted earlier about which against there is no law are required in our efforts. (That post would then stand in it's entirety.) That is what I said, in love, not thumping them with scripture. If you are talking about Galatians 5:22-23, then I agree, they are the fruit of the Spirit. If that is not what you are referring to, which post are you talking about? I am referring to Post #128, wherein the verses from Galatians were posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted January 31, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 31, 2010 Ha! Said I was tired! That's the verse you quoted earlier in the thread! (Was that before or after I went to bed?) Anyway you had asked: Yes, we are to constantly be in check, but what do you do if you see a brother or sister sin? Are we to ignore them because we are not perfect or are we to show them love and tell them that what they are doing is wrong? There's sin as we have discussed: intentional, then there's errors, and then there's ignorance. Generally, I would place error and ignorance in the same category. We cannot fault ignorance. We have all been ignorant at one point or another about something. So, yes, we would show them love. Telling people that they are wrong, in those words, I have found not to be helpful. Patience and love is the route to go. Plus, those other virtues I posted earlier about which against there is no law are required in our efforts. (That post would then stand in it's entirety.) That is what I said, in love, not thumping them with scripture. If you are talking about Galatians 5:22-23, then I agree, they are the fruit of the Spirit. If that is not what you are referring to, which post are you talking about? I am referring to Post #128, wherein the verses from Galatians were posted. I am not sure I follow completely. I see that the only thing there is no law against is the fruit of the Spirit. Galatians 5:22-23 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. Is there something else you are talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Permie Posted February 1, 2010 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 213 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/14/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/12/1958 Share Posted February 1, 2010 OneLight, What was inadequate in my original response, post #122, to your question? What more are you looking for? I obey what is instructed as a result of the prayer prayed. The result can be and most often is instantaneously life changing. Other times, however, the appropriate response does not yield such quick results, such as "being a living example" would take time. I do not wish to find out what not obeying what was instructed would yield. I can imagine though that for a person whom needs a living example to be instructed in the ways of the Lord, that if I decided I knew better than God and took a different tack and decided to speak to that person, I could totally cause that person to run. On the other hand, if I decided to not speak the words the Lord gave me to speak to someone, and thought it better to be a living example instead, what do you suppose the result of that would be? Besides, the obvious of God finding someone else whom is obedient to work through? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted February 1, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 1, 2010 OneLight, What was inadequate in my original response, post #122, to your question? What more are you looking for? I obey what is instructed as a result of the prayer prayed. The result can be and most often is instantaneously life changing. Other times, however, the appropriate response does not yield such quick results, such as "being a living example" would take time. I do not wish to find out what not obeying what was instructed would yield. I can imagine though that for a person whom needs a living example to be instructed in the ways of the Lord, that if I decided I knew better than God and took a different tack and decided to speak to that person, I could totally cause that person to run. On the other hand, if I decided to not speak the words the Lord gave me to speak to someone, and thought it better to be a living example instead, what do you suppose the result of that would be? Besides, the obvious of God finding someone else whom is obedient to work through? I am not looking for anything more then to understand what you are saying. I agree. We should never go against His leading when dealing with another. Yet, I have to wonder why it was that He allowed me to notice a sin if it were not to speak the truth to them. It may not be right then and there. He may still have more to show me, or wisdom to bestow upon me, but He never reveals anything without a purpose. One need to seek and understand what the purpose is. It may very well be that He is leading another to speak to a person who sins, and is preparing me to be the second or third witness. Only He knows the correct way to deal with any situation, and if we are paying attention, He may reveal it to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Permie Posted February 1, 2010 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 213 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/14/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/12/1958 Share Posted February 1, 2010 OneLight, What was inadequate in my original response, post #122, to your question? What more are you looking for? I obey what is instructed as a result of the prayer prayed. The result can be and most often is instantaneously life changing. Other times, however, the appropriate response does not yield such quick results, such as "being a living example" would take time. I do not wish to find out what not obeying what was instructed would yield. I can imagine though that for a person whom needs a living example to be instructed in the ways of the Lord, that if I decided I knew better than God and took a different tack and decided to speak to that person, I could totally cause that person to run. On the other hand, if I decided to not speak the words the Lord gave me to speak to someone, and thought it better to be a living example instead, what do you suppose the result of that would be? Besides, the obvious of God finding someone else whom is obedient to work through? I am not looking for anything more then to understand what you are saying. I agree. We should never go against His leading when dealing with another. Yet, I have to wonder why it was that He allowed me to notice a sin if it were not to speak the truth to them. It may not be right then and there. He may still have more to show me, or wisdom to bestow upon me, but He never reveals anything without a purpose. One need to seek and understand what the purpose is. It may very well be that He is leading another to speak to a person who sins, and is preparing me to be the second or third witness. Only He knows the correct way to deal with any situation, and if we are paying attention, He may reveal it to us. "Noticing a sin"... could that be roundabout way of saying that something in particular was "revealed"? Otherwise, I don't know how difficult it is to see sin. I too have had such revelations. If this is what you are talking about, I believe that this is done so that you are aware of what it is that is being dealt with. With this knowledge, future interactions can be geared towards that specifically while also staying within guidelines as provided by scripture, such as shown in post #128. As always, there are exceptions. There are individuals whom are sufficiently humble whom can be outright instructed: Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be yet wiser: teach a just man, and he will increase in learning. Proverbs 9:9 If you are unsure of how to proceed, I'd engage in more prayer. For myself, I can tell when God is moving me. And, perhaps this is what is to be waited on in your particular situation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted February 1, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted February 1, 2010 I am never sure when God is moving me until after the fact. Then when I study and pray and look at what has been shown me I can say yes this is what is being said to me by God. But for me I have to be very careful about what God is saying and what I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Permie Posted February 1, 2010 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 213 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/14/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/12/1958 Share Posted February 1, 2010 I am never sure when God is moving me until after the fact. Then when I study and pray and look at what has been shown me I can say yes this is what is being said to me by God. But for me I have to be very careful about what God is saying and what I want. Yes, there's that too. Seeing after the fact. I know that when I have been a bit undisciplined in watching my thoughts, and not engaging in prayer as much as possible... even to the extent of praying without ceasing... that I would indeed need to be very careful. I've come to recognize God, His power, His workings... I prefer to wait on the Lord and during that waiting, yes, He can still use and work through us, which can be seen after the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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