Mystery Babylon

[Guest charlie]

She is the false church. But she claims to be the true religion. She has many harlot daughters.

For the sake of argument let's say the "whore" is the RCC. That would have to mean that the harlot daughters are the protestant churches. I see no other way around this; the protestant churches are branches off of the Roman Catholic Church. You can try and deny it all you want but let's be frank, it's true. -- So, if this senario is correct it does not bode well for any of Christendom...equally.

If it is just a false religion then perhaps it is "new age" religions, revived "pagan" religions, the muslim religion and christian apostacy rolled into one world religion. If you look at the atrocities that have taken place in the *name of* Christian and Muslim religions alone over the centuries the secular world could at some point "demand" world peace, which would demand a one world religion to accomodate all peoples. This could be how satan is gonna bring "it" in.

I don't think the U.S. is mystery babylon. I think when "that time" comes we'll no longer be a powerful force in the world; perhaps there will be resistance from us though, I would sure like to think so. Of course we won't know unless we're here when the end of the age arrives.

Edited September 1, 2004 by charlie

[JesusisGod2]

Hi Charlie,

I don't think the U.S. is mystery babylon. I think when "that time" comes we'll no longer be a powerful force in the world; perhaps there will be resistance from us though, I would sure like to think so. Of course we won't know unless we're here when the end of the age arrives.

I agree with this as well, I dont think we will be gone but I dont think we will be the power in the sense we are today either.

[John3;16]

Babylon is not Jerusalem, there is a book that I believe has solid evidence and understanding of end time prophesy, the name of the book is: The Coming World Leader, the Author is David Hocking, here are some excerpts;

a beast comes out of the Mediterranean Sea and has seven heads and ten horns. One of its heads received a deadly wound and was brought back to life. We believe this sixth head is the one that received the fatal blow. It came back to Life as a ten-nation (ten horns) confederacy, making it the seventh head, out of which will come a world dictator.

Chapter 17 introduces us to a woman who sits on the beast with seven heads and ten horns. She is called "the great harlot, " and the name on her forehead is: "Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots and of the Abominations of the Earth. "

In chapter 18 we see the fall of Babylon the Great. It appears this chapter is a detailed account of what is described in the closing verses of chapter 17. Many Bible teachers see the destruction of the woman as a removal of the world religious order, and the destruction of the city called " Babylon the Great " as the end of the political system that controls the entire world. That is difficult to prove. A simple reading of the text suggests that the fall of Babylon the Great is the destruction of the woman; she is Babylon the Great.

The beast is destroyed by the return of Jesus Christ (19:11-21). The beast and false prophet are cast into the lake of fire (19:20) The woman is destroyed by the ten kings (horns) who form the political alliance through which the beast ascends to power.

The woman pictures a false religion that will dominate the world in the tribulation period, whereas the beast symbolizes the world government of the last half of the tribulation period. Both symbols illustrate the past as well as the present. Past history has demonstrated the awful reality of both systems-religious and political-as the have been corrupted by human depravity and moral degradation. The religious system of the end times will be led by the false prophet (13:11-18) whereas the political system will be led by the beast we know as the antichrist (13:1-10).

The Woman On The Beast (17:1-18)

(1) Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and talked with me, saying to me, " Come, I will show you the judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters, (2) with whom the kings of the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fernication. " (3) so he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness. And I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast which was full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns, (4) The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication. (5) And on her forehead a name was written:

Mystery, Babylon the Great, The Mother of Harlots and of the Abominations Of the Earth.

(6) And I saw the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus. And when I saw her, I marveled with great amazement.

(7) But the angel said to me, Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, which has the seven heads and the ten horns. The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will assend out of the bottomless pit and go into perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

(9) Here is the mind which has wisdom: The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits.

(10) There are also seven kings, Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. and when he comes, he must continue a short time.

(11) And the beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eigth, and is of the seven, and is going into perdition.

(12) And the ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have recieved no kingdom as yet, but they recieve authority for one hour as kings with the beast.

(13) These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast.

(14) These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for he is Lord of lords and king of kings; and those who are with him are called, chosen, and faithful.

(15) And he said to me, " The waters which you saw, where the harlot sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues.

(16) And the ten horns which you saw on the beast, these will hat the harlot, make her desolate and naked, eat her flesh and burn her with fire.

(17) For God hath put it into their hearts to fulfill his purpose, to be of one mind, and to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled.

(18) And the woman whom you saw is that great city which reigns over the kings of the earth"

The Definition of the Woman (17:1-6, 15)

The announcement of judgment. When John is invited to see this great harlot who sits on many waters, he is told he will be viewing her judgment. The description of her as the "great harlot" emphasizes the all-pervasive influence of this woman throughout history and the seriousness of that influence in the eyes of God. This is not to be taken lightly.

Revelation 19:2 is the response of a great multitude in heaven over the fall of the harlot, Babylon the Great. This praise honors God because " He has judged the great harlot, " avenging the blood of His servants which the harlot has shed throughout history. The authority of the woman. the influence of this harlot is quite extensive; a\she "sits on many waters," representing "peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues" (vv.1,15). Her influence has invaded all nations of the world.

John saw the woman "sitting on a scarlet beast which was full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns" (17:3). It was in a desolate place that John viewed this woman on the beast, reminding us that death not life is the environment in which the harlot and the beast thrive. The woman sits on the beast, exercising authority and influence over it. Whatever the woman represents, she has dominated all the great empires of the world and will be prominent in the tribulation as well. Perhaps the most fascinating statement of all concerning her authority and influence is the statement of verse 2: "With whom the kings of the earth committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication." Fornication is sexual immorality. Symbolically, this harlot has used sex and drunkenness to entice and seduce world leaders and the inhabitants of the world. (cf 18:3, 9, 23; 19:2).what a graphic picture of deception, manipulation, and seduction. Throughout history, the story has been repeated. This harlot has affected all nations, and God will judge her for it and destroy her once for all.

The appearance of the woman,. It is tempting to relate the appearance of this woman with the lavish wealth of the Roman Catholic church. That view point was the strong opinion of the Reformers, as we might expect. It was also the view of Tertullian, Jerome, Augustine, and most Bible commentators throughout medieval church history. Protestant Bible scholars have been strongly influenced to identify this woman as the Roman Church. That may be the case / time will tell. However, it is important to see that the woman sits on the beast whose heads represent the empires of past and future world history. The Roman Catholic Church is a part of the problem, but cannot be the only problem in the prophetic puzzle. False religion is found among protestants as well as Catholics. False religion has permeated all the cultures of the world and has produced a variety of beliefs and practices incompatible with orthodox Christianity. Organized religion has never been a friend to true believers in the One True God and his Messiah, Jesus Christ, Our Lord. Devotion to our God has often been set aside by those who prefer pomp and lavish display. Spiritual commitment has never been the "bottom line" for those dedicated to power and wealth.

[Guest charlie]

Here is a Catholic response to the charges of Dave Hunt (whose book I read several yrs ago) I think it's a good rebuttal and I thought you might be interested in reading it for another perspective; it applies to the topic of this thread.

http://www.catholic.com/library/Hunting_th..._of_Babylon.asp

Hunting the Whore of Babylon

Some anti-Catholics claim the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon of Revelation 17 and 18. Fundamentalist author Dave Hunt, in his 1994 book, A Woman Rides the Beast, presents nine arguments to try to prove this. His claims are a useful summary of those commonly used by Fundamentalists, and an examination of them shows why they don

Edited September 5, 2004 by charlie

[Guest charlie]

Here's another good one, on topic:

http://www.catholic.com/library/Whore_of_Babylon.asp

The Whore of Babylon

In another tract, Hunting the Whore of Babylon, we looked at nine arguments given by fundamentalist Dave Hunt for his claim that the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon from Revelation 17

Edited September 5, 2004 by charlie

[Old Timer]

Charlie, from where did you copy thses articles? Post a link.

[Guest charlie]

oophs sorry, I'll see if I can find it again...it's from a Catholic website.

[edited to add] Got it. I went back and posted the link at the top of each article.

Edited September 5, 2004 by charlie

[georgesbluegirl]

Mobile21, the Church will disappear, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye.

It is the "Blessed Hope."

Wow. Rarely have I run into such blind intolerance among Christians. We all believe that Jesus is Lord. We have the same basic beliefs. Why must you insist on calling my religion fraudulous and evil? As far as I can see, it just engenders ever more hatred against fellow God-loving Christians.

[georgesbluegirl]

PS: The Church has been around 2000 years. It's not going to disappear in the blink of an eye.

[John3;16]

The harlot that rides on the beast would not be the catholic church alone, that is why there are seven mountains, that is why she is called Mystery Babylon, and the mother of harlots, false religon has suduced kingdoms throughout history, during the dark ages they had power to cause the death of any who opposed the church, even for saying that the world was round, the early christians who founded this nation were fleeing religious persacution, if you look honestly at the past history of the Catholic church she does fulfill many of the descriptions, the seduction of kings and kingdoms, the deaths of millions of christians because they disagreed with the Catholic church, the ten nations which destroy the harlot, is a ten nation confedercy, which is the seventh head from which will rise the eighth. the seven heads are kingdoms, the one that is that the Apostle John wrote about was the Roman empire the five that had already fallen were past kingdoms, Babylon, Egypt, Greece. Medo-persian ect.

put your trust in the bible not in a religion, compare what your religion requires for salvation to what the bible requires, this is the most critical point, your eternal existance depends on it.