Guest shiloh357 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Revelation starts out by addressing seven churches in Asia Minor. It was a revelation of what was to occur from that time down the centuries to the end of the world. There are other churches mentioned in Revelation.No, there are not. Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. This star was a church and it was believed to the the church at Smyrna where the Bishop Edmond was.Yeah, right. Where do you derive this from? During that time the forgiveness of sins was taken from God as false religion was charging man for it. People were beaten, whipped, and killed if they did not conform. The bible was taken from the public and forced to believe in "church doctrine" as gospel. The French Revolution in April 1793 shut down every church for 3.5 years because they were tired of how corrupt the religion in their country was.What does this have to do with the book of Revelation? Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days. During the "dark ages" the church was in hiding for almost 1,300 years because of these things. There is a lot more detail, but I tried to give the short of it.Sorry, but you are trying to read history into the Bible. That is a very subjective and questionable type of interpretation. Revelation IS about the history of Jesus and the church from the the time of the last Apostle till the end of time.Wrong. It is about the final victory of the Kingdom of God. It was a letter of encouragement written to churches. It is not about the church and the church is nowhere mentioned in the book of Revelation. Trying to read something into the text is an invalid means of interpretation. That is what is keeping you from seeing what this book is all about. In the first chapter these verses lead us into what this book is about. Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: v19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; This is about the history of the church. No, it is not about the history of the church. It is about the future victory of the Kingdom of God. It was written to churches who were at that particular time undergoing intense persecution. There is NOTHING in the text that indicates that it is historical in nature. YOU are trying read something into the text that is not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdktlk Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 282 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/30/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2011 Revelation starts out by addressing seven churches in Asia Minor. It was a revelation of what was to occur from that time down the centuries to the end of the world. There are other churches mentioned in Revelation.No, there are not. Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. This star was a church and it was believed to the the church at Smyrna where the Bishop Edmond was.Yeah, right. Where do you derive this from? During that time the forgiveness of sins was taken from God as false religion was charging man for it. People were beaten, whipped, and killed if they did not conform. The bible was taken from the public and forced to believe in "church doctrine" as gospel. The French Revolution in April 1793 shut down every church for 3.5 years because they were tired of how corrupt the religion in their country was.What does this have to do with the book of Revelation? Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days. During the "dark ages" the church was in hiding for almost 1,300 years because of these things. There is a lot more detail, but I tried to give the short of it.Sorry, but you are trying to read history into the Bible. That is a very subjective and questionable type of interpretation. Revelation IS about the history of Jesus and the church from the the time of the last Apostle till the end of time.Wrong. It is about the final victory of the Kingdom of God. It was a letter of encouragement written to churches. It is not about the church and the church is nowhere mentioned in the book of Revelation. Trying to read something into the text is an invalid means of interpretation. That is what is keeping you from seeing what this book is all about. In the first chapter these verses lead us into what this book is about. Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: v19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; This is about the history of the church. No, it is not about the history of the church. It is about the future victory of the Kingdom of God. It was written to churches who were at that particular time undergoing intense persecution. There is NOTHING in the text that indicates that it is historical in nature. YOU are trying read something into the text that is not there. If the letters are simply letters to particular assemblies at the time do we not find it unusual that the Lord would say with respect to Jezebel, "I will kill her children with death" (Rev 2:23) Now I can understand the Lord causing me to perish for sins I commit but to state that He will kill my children for my transgressions does not seem like the Jesus I have come to know and love. Surely there is more to this than meets the natural eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Or maybe rather I should say - You just showed the whole world that you are not someone who knows how to rightly divide the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15). Wow! you are something. That's good. I would hate to be a nothing. Its not hard to know when the 70 weeks of Daniel began and ended without all that linear whatever you said. Its not hard to know when John the Baptist's ministry began through the Scriptures and history. All I was saying is that it isn't hard to search out things using the tools, that is the Bible and all the things that have been recorded historically. Times and dates are not nearly as difficult as you would make it sound. You were date-setting? I did not see this. All I saw was you affirming deut31:12's claims to Revelation being a historical narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdktlk Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 282 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/30/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2011 Or maybe rather I should say - You just showed the whole world that you are not someone who knows how to rightly divide the word of truth (2 Timothy 2:15). Wow! you are something. That's good. I would hate to be a nothing. Its not hard to know when the 70 weeks of Daniel began and ended without all that linear whatever you said. Its not hard to know when John the Baptist's ministry began through the Scriptures and history. All I was saying is that it isn't hard to search out things using the tools, that is the Bible and all the things that have been recorded historically. Times and dates are not nearly as difficult as you would make it sound. You were date-setting? I did not see this. All I saw was you affirming deut31:12's claims to Revelation being a historical narrative. Just saying that prophecy at some time becomes history else we would be waiting on the 490 years of Daniel to yet be fulfilled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Has the Abomination of Desolation taken place yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdktlk Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 282 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/30/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 19, 2011 Has the Abomination of Desolation taken place yet? How does that song go? I say yes, you say no... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted January 19, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Has the Abomination of Desolation taken place yet? How does that song go? I say yes, you say no... It has happened before, and happened before, and will happen again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldust59 Posted January 20, 2011 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 108 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 989 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 124 Days Won: 6 Joined: 01/08/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/13/1959 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I had to read those last couple pages twice to be sure of what was said & all I can say is WOW!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdktlk Posted January 20, 2011 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 282 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/30/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 20, 2011 (edited) I had to read those last couple pages twice to be sure of what was said & all I can say is WOW!!! Golddust, It does seem that we went to the moon somewhere here, but can't exactly figure where. So, I'm just going to ask a simple question again and we'll see where we go from here. If the letters are simply letters to particular assemblies at the time do we not find it unusual that the Lord would say with respect to Jezebel, "I will kill her children with death" (Rev 2:23) Now I can understand the Lord causing me to perish for sins I commit but to state that He will kill my children for my transgressions does not seem like the Jesus I have come to know and love. Surely there is more to this than meets the natural eye. I guess my first reaction to this verse is what is meant by "KILL her children WITH DEATH?" Is not being killed in and of itself death? Edited January 20, 2011 by sdktlk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted January 21, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,192 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,469 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Actually, it is not about the Church at all. Nope it is about Jesus Nothing drives me more insane that these TV guys and others who try to twist words to fit their own take on the book. This means America, this means he is the anti christ, this means Israel, this means the date is, this means the "A" bomb...... As far as Revelation goes, Jesus is coming, and instead of confusing things, sometimes it might be better to just get out of the way.... Fez do you think if you ever get into a pickle that the pickle would explode??? Love Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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