Knowing God

[Phil.b]

I never thought these questions would come up but It came up in our Bible study, two questions.

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Looking forward to answers

Thanks.

[Guest shiloh357]

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

Jesus death on the cross was not the product of an arbitrary decision by God. This question assumes that God had a long list of other ways or methods He could have used to achieve the same results and that is simply not true. God's omniscience is only aspect of God's nature and omniscience does not really have anything to do with the number of choices God had at His disposal to save mankind.

Adam, our federal head in the Garden of Eden essentically committed treason agasint God and in his disobedience brought the curse of sin and spiritual death (separation from God) to his desciendents. We inherited this spiritual condition of spiritual death since from God's perspective, we were "in" Adam. When Adam fell, we all fell.

It is the nature of man's condition and what brought about this condition that determines what the remedy must be. Think of it like this: A doctor must first diagnose what a sickness is in order to know the proper program of treatment to administer. He does not just arbitrarily choose one of many programs at his disposal. Only one program of treatment will heal a particular illness.

So, it is not true that God has this endless list of possible salvation plans. God's justice against man's sin had to be satisified. Death was the only remedy for the penalty of sin, and since sinful man's death would not satisfy God's justice, Jesus stood in our place and paid the penalty for us.

The effects of disobedience had to be reversed. Just as Adam stood as our federal head in the Garden, Jesus was our federal head on the cross. Jesus' sinless death on the cross paid fully satisified the penalty for sin and God's justice. God offers man a full pardon and complete reconciliation on that basis and that basis alone. Man is now able to be justified and placed back into right-standing through the imputation of Christ's righteousness by faith.

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Well, the best answer I can think of is that God has an eternal perspective. He already had a plan in place to redeem man and He looked to the future when that redemption would be fully realized. It was in His Grace and Love for us that He allowed us to live and even though He knew we would fall, He had already provided a means of rescuing us.

I realize that this example is exactly tight, but when a man and wife decide to have a child, they do so knowing that it is possible this child will turn against them and hurt them, but they choose to have the child anyway.

Nothing takes God by surprise. He knew we would sin and in His foreknowledge provided a loving plan of redemption and gives us the choice to accept Him or reject Him.

[~candice~]

I think Shiloh answered well .

I don't believe that God needs to weigh up or measure which option is best. Thus, I don't think He considered many different ways to redeem man and eventually settled on the death of Christ. God knows all, He does not need to assess something before knowing what is best. He does not choose, He just acts in perfect knowledge.

Can you tell I'm not a molinist?

So, why did He do it that way? We can't really know the mind of God, we just know that He acted in love towards us, acted in mercy, and that He is good.

[Guest]

I believe that all of "this" was allowed to occur was so that God could be glorified in His redeeming grace and love. Who else but a loving and just God would leave Heaven to come to Earth, become human - having the same temptations and feelings as His creation yet sinless - to pay the price that He required for sin? After all it was He, in the Person of Jesus Christ, who came.

[Guest]

I believe that all of "this" was allowed to occur was so that God could be glorified in His redeeming grace and love. Who else but a loving and just God would leave Heaven to come to Earth, become human - having the same temptations and feelings as His creation yet sinless - to pay the price that He required for sin? After all it was He, in the Person of Jesus Christ, who came.

Amen~!

Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.

For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.

Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Hebrews 4:14-16 (NASB)

Amen~!

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus,

who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.

For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,

so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,

and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Philippians 2:5-11

Amen~!

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. Hebrews 12:2 (KJV)

Amen~!

Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:

That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Thessalonians 1:6-12

Believe And Be Blessed Beloved

The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:35-36

Or Not

Love, Joe

[Guest]

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

Jesus

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. Hebrews 12:2

Is The Reason

For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. Mark 10:45

And Love Is Still Open Season

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16

God, The Son Choose To Come Down From Heaven Above To Be Born Forever Our Kinsman Redeemer By Giving His Life As The Only Acceptable And Holy Sacrifice That Whosoever Will May Be Saved

Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father. John 10:17-18

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Knowing That Jesus Is The Reason

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11

His Family Rejoices

For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. Romans 8:15

In His Life

Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: John 11:25

See

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Romans 3:21-27

[Hawkins]

I never thought these questions would come up but It came up in our Bible study, two questions.

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

That almost has nothing to do with His all-knowing. It's all about our freewill to sin. We sinned to our own death. And thus by Law we are the dead already. Now the problem is how will you be able to legally save someone who is sentenced to death? So just think over this question seriously,

how will you be able to legally save someone who is sentenced to death?

You can change the Law by lowering its standard such no one will be subject to the death penalty. But that doesn't seem to be God's choice. What God offers is Jesus Christ's death such that everyone's sin is atoned for. And I think that by God's Law itself only God's sacrifice will be able to atone for human sin. That left the only solution is that Jesus Christ offered Himself for such a sacrifice.

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Looking forward to answers

Thanks.

Foreknowing makes a difference from interfering. When you know for sure that tomorrow is a raining day, it by no means says that you need to do anything to stop it. You may well choose to let things go. And what God did is just to let things go in accordance to our freewill.

If you want to dig deeper, actually freewill means humans will divide in front of choices. If none of us chooses to sin by our own will, then it only means that either we don't have freewill or that we don't have true choices. In front of real choices, humans with freewill will certainly divide. Earth is a middle ground, a right place, for such a division to occur. So God just let go the division and to finally bring His sheep with Him.

[joi]

I never thought these questions would come up but It came up in our Bible study, two questions.

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Looking forward to answers

Thanks.

As I see it the fall of mankind in the Garden was to settle the dispute between God and Satan.

In the book of Job, and other places we read that God spoke to Satan in heaven. (Job 1:6,7, 2:2)

[joi]

Oops! I hit the post button before I was ready.

As I see it the fall of mankind in the Garden was to settle the dispute between God and Satan; the angelic conflict.

In the book of Job, and other places we read that God spoke to Satan in heaven. (Job 1:6,7, and Job 2:1,2)

We read that Satan spoke with God about Job, and we know that he accuses those of us who follow Christ.

As I see it, when the sons of God presented themselves before God, Satan was there to argue his case and that is when he

challenged God to let him do harm to Job. He thought that if God let him (Satan) have his way with Job that he would sin

against God. In other words Satan was representing himself in court, before God, pleading his own case, as it were.

In order to resolve the angelic conflict, (Satan and 1/3 of the angels) God brought forth humans with free will. He wanted to demonstrate to Satan that when left to our own decisions, through free will, that we would choose to follow Him. We are now

in the process of proving God to be correct, or not, depending on our decision. This does not negate the fact that Satan was

sentenced already and that he will have to suffer the consequece of his sinful actions, as indicated in Revelations and other places

in the Bible.

Since sin required a blood sacrifice God brought forth His uniquely born Son, who gave His life to pay our sin debt.

The sin debt for all humans, for all time was paid when Jesus died for us. Sin will never more be judged again, because that

work was finished on the cross. A sacrifice of this nature required sinless blood.

Jesus was born of the virgin Mary, who was overshadowed by God's Holy Spirit, so He had no human blood from His Father.

No blood passes from the mother to her child in utero, so no sin nature transferred to Him through Mary.

I think that when Adam chose to sin and a curse was put on everything that sin was passed from Adam to each child from that point and forward until today. I am not sure that it is a genetic thing, but somehow it was/is passed on, and I think it is through the male.

So my answer to question one is no. He chose as He did because He had something He wanted to accomplish for His human creation.

My answer to q.2 is because He wanted to resolve the angelic conflict started by Satan.

[Shiloh62]

I never thought these questions would come up but It came up in our Bible study, two questions.

1. God being all knowing why did He choose his Son to die on the the cross, that is could He have chosen any other way because He is God knowing all things.

2. From God's view, Knowing all things, he knew that man would fall, that is, Adam and Eve, So why did he choose to put man on earth when he knew they would sin against Him?

Looking forward to answers

Thanks.

Because He loves us, and wanted to give us a second chance.