fruitfull77 Posted January 1, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 132 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 25 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 1, 2014 1 Cor 15: 52 - In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. Notice carefully, "at the last trump". It is not trumpet, but "at the last trump". But, it is made by a trumpet. Also notice, it doesn't say "angel's trumpet". It just says, "at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound". In Revelation 8-9 and 11:15, you read about a series of seven trumpet judgments. When that seventh trumpet is blown, post-tribbers say, "Well, that's the last trumpet," when it didn't say "trumpet", it said "trump". The last trumpet is blown by an angel. The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 is not "the last trump" of 1 Cor 15: 52. In Revelation 11:15, there is the seventh angel blowing the seventh trumpet, "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord". The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 ends the Tribulation and begins the Millennium. It doesn't catch up anybody. The seventh trumpet comes after a rapture. Notice in Revelation 11:12, "Come up hither". Moses and Elijah are raptured before the last trumpet. So the seventh trumpet as nothing to do with any rapture. In 1 Thess 4:16, the trumpet that calls you up is not a trumpet blown by an angel. "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:" And in Revelation 4:1 - After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 1 Cor 15:52, 1 Thess 4:16, and Rev 4:1 as nothing to do with the seventh trumpet in Rev 11:15 I think if you look at Matt 24:31, Jesus says " He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other " This event happens at the sounding of the Seventh trumpet. In Rev 8:2 we see the 7 angels were given seven trumpets. Doesn't " trump" just mean the sounding of a trumpet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_fish Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 23 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/05/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Very interesting thread, made me check the Greek-- "trump" G4536 - noun - trumpet "trumpet" G4537 - verb - act of sounding/blowing a trumpet (both as used in context of 1 Cor 15:52) I do agree that the interpretation of 1 Cor 15:52 does depend on your understanding of Matt 24 and your understanding of the rapture Good topic VB God Bless Edited January 2, 2014 by just_fish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzel Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 514 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 62 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/01/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1989 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Does the last trump = the 7th trump ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitfull77 Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 132 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 25 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 2, 2014 Does the last trump = the 7th trump ? It's a yes from me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veryberry Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 33 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/18/1978 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 I have heard of the rapture happening around the feast of trumpets and it does seem very plausible. How ever there is also Song of Solomon 2: 8-13. 8.The voice of my beloved! behold, he cometh leaping upon the mountains, skipping upon the hills. 9. My beloved is like a roe or a young hart: behold, he standeth behind our wall, he looketh forth at the windows, shewing himself through the lattice. 10. My beloved spake, and said unto me, Rise up, my love, my fair one, and come away. 11. For, lo, the winter is past, the rain is over and gone; 12. The flowers appear on the earth; the time of the singing of birds is come, and the voice of the turtle is heard in our land; 13. The fig tree putteth forth her green figs, and the vines with the tender grape give a good smell. Arise, my love, my fair one, and come away. Which is a beautiful picture of the rapture and it indicates a possible spring time gathering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veryberry Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 33 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/18/1978 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 What is the trump of God ? Often times when God speaks, it is described as the sound of a trumpet. (Ez. 19: 16,19). I do believe it will be Christ himself calling, and it will sound like a trumpet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veryberry Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 33 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/18/1978 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 1 Cor 15: 52 - In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. Notice carefully, "at the last trump". It is not trumpet, but "at the last trump". But, it is made by a trumpet. Also notice, it doesn't say "angel's trumpet". It just says, "at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound". In Revelation 8-9 and 11:15, you read about a series of seven trumpet judgments. When that seventh trumpet is blown, post-tribbers say, "Well, that's the last trumpet," when it didn't say "trumpet", it said "trump". The last trumpet is blown by an angel. The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 is not "the last trump" of 1 Cor 15: 52. In Revelation 11:15, there is the seventh angel blowing the seventh trumpet, "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord". The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 ends the Tribulation and begins the Millennium. It doesn't catch up anybody. The seventh trumpet comes after a rapture. Notice in Revelation 11:12, "Come up hither". Moses and Elijah are raptured before the last trumpet. So the seventh trumpet as nothing to do with any rapture. In 1 Thess 4:16, the trumpet that calls you up is not a trumpet blown by an angel. "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:" And in Revelation 4:1 - After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 1 Cor 15:52, 1 Thess 4:16, and Rev 4:1 as nothing to do with the seventh trumpet in Rev 11:15 I think if you look at Matt 24:31, Jesus says " He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other " This event happens at the sounding of the Seventh trumpet. In Rev 8:2 we see the 7 angels were given seven trumpets. Doesn't " trump" just mean the sounding of a trumpet? This verse connects the second advent with the Feast of Trumpets in September. The elect that are gathered are the jews just like in Numbers 10:7, Deut 30:4 and Isaiah 27:13. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 What is the trump of God ? Trumpet call - probably a Shofar. (Jewish horn, very hard to play) Where in scripture does it say it will be a Shofar? It's And seven priests shall bear before the ark seven trumpets of rams' horns: and the seventh day ye shall compass the city seven times, and the priests shall blow with the trumpets. And it shall come to pass, that when they make a long blast with the ram's horn, and when ye hear the sound of the trumpet, all the people shall shout with a great shout; and the wall of the city shall fall down flat, and the people shall ascend up every man straight before him. Joshua 6:4-5 Still And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together. Genesis 22:7-8 All About And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. Genesis 22:13 Jesus Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people, And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; Luke 1:68-69 See Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spock Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,239 Content Per Day: 0.86 Reputation: 1,686 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/26/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 2, 2014 What is the trump of God ? Trumpet call - probably a Shofar. (Jewish horn, very hard to play) Where in scripture does it say it will be a Shofar? It's And seven priests shall bear before the ark seven trumpets of rams' horns: and the seventh day ye shall compass the city seven times, and the priests shall blow with the trumpets. And it shall come to pass, that when they make a long blast with the ram's horn, and when ye hear the sound of the trumpet, all the people shall shout with a great shout; and the wall of the city shall fall down flat, and the people shall ascend up every man straight before him. Joshua 6:4-5 Still And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together. Genesis 22:7-8 All About And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. Genesis 22:13 Jesus Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people, And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; Luke 1:68-69 See Thanks Joe for doing that leg work for me. (I'm going to the corner now for being lazy.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitfull77 Posted January 2, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 132 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 25 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 2, 2014 1 Cor 15: 52 - In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. Notice carefully, "at the last trump". It is not trumpet, but "at the last trump". But, it is made by a trumpet. Also notice, it doesn't say "angel's trumpet". It just says, "at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound". In Revelation 8-9 and 11:15, you read about a series of seven trumpet judgments. When that seventh trumpet is blown, post-tribbers say, "Well, that's the last trumpet," when it didn't say "trumpet", it said "trump". The last trumpet is blown by an angel. The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 is not "the last trump" of 1 Cor 15: 52. In Revelation 11:15, there is the seventh angel blowing the seventh trumpet, "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord". The seventh trumpet of Revelation 11:15 ends the Tribulation and begins the Millennium. It doesn't catch up anybody. The seventh trumpet comes after a rapture. Notice in Revelation 11:12, "Come up hither". Moses and Elijah are raptured before the last trumpet. So the seventh trumpet as nothing to do with any rapture. In 1 Thess 4:16, the trumpet that calls you up is not a trumpet blown by an angel. "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:" And in Revelation 4:1 - After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 1 Cor 15:52, 1 Thess 4:16, and Rev 4:1 as nothing to do with the seventh trumpet in Rev 11:15 I think if you look at Matt 24:31, Jesus says " He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other " This event happens at the sounding of the Seventh trumpet. In Rev 8:2 we see the 7 angels were given seven trumpets. Doesn't " trump" just mean the sounding of a trumpet? This verse connects the second advent with the Feast of Trumpets in September. The elect that are gathered are the jews just like in Numbers 10:7, Deut 30:4 and Isaiah 27:13. Ancient Israel used trumpets as a way of announcing special important messages and calling together their people. Matt 24 is a prophecy detailing the events leading up to the return of Jesus Christ in the end time. The 7th trumpet announces that event and the elect, that is all those living and dead in Christ, faithful Christians who kept the laws of Christ will meet Christ in the air and begin their reign with Him on earth. The rapture train of thought is not biblical. It was formulated about 1800 years after Christ. This gathering of the dead saints is the first resurrection in Revelation. The live saints at this time are transformed into spirits and made immortal and rise in the air to greet Jesus.and the other saints from the beginning of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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