Mark777 Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 I do not think my comment demeaned anyone's faith - it is the lack of faith in the power of God to keep you that is the problem. I know you need to demonize the opposition but I am not going to play with you. I just made the observation that it is OSAS that leans on the complete power of God to sustain and deliver us. While it is people like you that are arrogant enough to think you can move your own salvation by your own efforts and whims. All of the supposed warnings you keep harping about have been explained - you hold on to them because they are your only theological hope in a sea of Scripture that clearly says otherwise. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark777 Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 No, I love this, what is diminished is you faith in the power of the Holy Spirit to keep you. And what you so willfully forget to include in your thinking is that we have repeatedly answer all of this and you never respond further. You just repeat the same thing. No matter how many times people tell you that OSAS believes that believers can fall into sin and be punished by God - even to death, it never enters your efforts when battling the doctrine. Try respecting others enough to listen and at least change your questioning to reflect that you have considered their thoughts. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark777 Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 Sin is completely paid for and applied to those that accept Christ. It is God's work to sanctify the believer and he does to His satisfaction. And I would like it if you would quit your infantile insistence that I don't answer your questions - like I am shivering in my boots at having to answer you! I answer you - you just don't like my answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark777 Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 Horizion: "Does the Bible anywhere teach that is it possible for a man to be saved if he dies in his sin..." No, His sin is paid for already. All Christians have sin. If it were like you say all Christians would die unsaved, I guess. This sentence was a little strange - maybe I misunderstood what you want here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark777 Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 Horizion, Sorry for being irritated at you. Instead, let me ask you frankly: When you asked me the questions you have asked in you last few posts have you forgotten that I have answered them before? It is ok to not like my answers but your comments should relect that you thought about what i have said and move on from there. If you just repeat yourself, there isn't much use for that. I would like this conversation to move forward. There are places yet to go to. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Durnan Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,782 Content Per Day: 0.36 Reputation: 49 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/14/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 Suppose it were true that a person once saved could be "re-lost," a term never found once in the Holy Bible. Suppose such a person, to gain heaven, would then have to be "re-saved" - another term foreign to Holy Writ - all over again. Maybe even "re-lost" and "re-saved" dozens if not hundreds of times. But suppose further the person in question never did get "saved a second time," an expression nowhere in either Testament. Then he died a lost man and went directly to the lake of fire (a destination reserved for the unsaved) - after having once been saved. In what sense, then, was he first saved? What was this particular "saved today but lost tomorrow" man - another expression not found in any of the Bible's 66 Books - saved from? Was he saved from the PENALTY of sin? No, for he didn't escape the lake of fire. Was he saved from the POWER of sin? No, for he "became unsaved" (another phrase unknown to God's Word) & fell back into sin and died a lost man. And most assuredly he was not saved from the PRESENCE of sin. John tells us that none this side of heaven have yet been saved from that! "If we say we have no sin, we deceived ourselves....." What was he saved from then? The answer is: NOTHING at all! He may have thot he was saved. He may have felt saved. He may have acted as tho he were saved. His friends may have thot he was saved but, in the final analysis, he was SAVED from NOTHING! God's EVERLASTING salvation (John 3:16; 5:24), to anything more than a mere meaningless term, must indeed be EVERLASTING. Besides, this is the ONLY salvation Jesus gives, never a "temporal everlasting life." Any person who is saved has been everlastingly saved. No one is saved until he is eternally saved for time & eternity. Anyone who dies in a lost or a "re-lost" condition never was saved at all. Does this mean we must wait until life is over to find out? Absolutely not. We can be saved NOW and KNOW it. The Bible is quite clear. In 1 Corinthians 1:18, the Apostle refers to "us which ARE SAVED." How can we be eternally saved? See John 3:36, "He that believeth on the Son." That's the doorway to everlasting salvation, the ONLY type of salvation God offers. "HATH" - that WHEN you receive it. "EVERLASTING life" - that's HOW LONG it lasts! Praise God! Hallelujah! It happened to me! Thank You, Lord Jesus for Your wonderful EVERLASTING salvation so full & so free! AMEN & AMEN! http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 AD quote: "Suppose it were true that a person once saved could be "re-lost," a term never found once in the Holy Bible. " SW: Statements like this of course are the last refuge for bad interpreters of God's Word. The same worthless argument is used by those such as the Arians who deny the deity of Jesus Christ. After all, they say, the term Trinity is never once found in the Bible. Next ... . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 quote: Trying to lump us in with heretics? SW: Not really. Just pointing out this is a bad principle for interpreting Scripture. You disagree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 quote: New Pilgrim, Sometime, the people that oppose OSAS, are going to have to acknowledge that the adherents to OSAS believe the most in the power of God instead of the power of the individual to "carry on". SW: This thread has reached a new low. Now the OSAS group is claiming spiritual "superiority" and think they are better believers. What a sad commentary. The theology of glory is alive and well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted June 17, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 17, 2006 quote: And I showed you why your particular "trinity" analogy was faulty. That's a bad principle for interpreting scripture. But the sad fact remains that CS continually ignores the reams of scriptures we have used to support OSAS. No one can possibly solve the dilemma I posed in my other post about the necessity of throwing out the Holy Spirit before you can choose to be lost. It's impossible. SW: No you didn't. The poster used the principle without qualification and I rejected it. And apparently its not impossible to reject the Holy Spirit that brings salvation if our sinful nature decides to reject God's grace. And it is you who chooses to reject and not believe the "reams of Scripture" that clearly warn against falling away. We are assured of salvation only if we have faith in Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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